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TeamRabbitRun

Tick-Proofing Permethrin

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Here comes Spring again in the Northern Hemisphere.
Directed at those of you who use permethrin to tick-proof clothing:

 

  • What brand?
  • What format? (Spray bottle, pour bottle, etc.)
  • What concentration? 
  • Do you cut it with water?
  • Where do you get it?
  • How are you applying it? (Spray, soak, etc.)
  • How often do you apply it?
  • What clothing are you treating? (Pants, sneakers, boots, socks, etc.)
  • Any clothing that you're NOT treating? 
  • Any concerns with its use?
  • Any important points I'm not asking?

 

Thanks in advance,
...Bill (TRR)
 

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55 minutes ago, TeamRabbitRun said:

Here comes Spring again in the Northern Hemisphere.
Directed at those of you who use permethrin to tick-proof clothing:

 

  • What brand?
  • What format? (Spray bottle, pour bottle, etc.)
  • What concentration? 
  • Do you cut it with water?
  • Where do you get it?
  • How are you applying it? (Spray, soak, etc.)
  • How often do you apply it?
  • What clothing are you treating? (Pants, sneakers, boots, socks, etc.)
  • Any clothing that you're NOT treating? 
  • Any concerns with its use?
  • Any important points I'm not asking?

 

Thanks in advance,
...Bill (TRR)
 

 

I have two separate Permethrin plans. I have spray, and I also sent some clothing to be professionally treated by “Insect Shield”. Spray is pretty temporary, professional treatment may last a whole season or longer. It all can wash out, so you have to be careful.  "Sheep dip" versions of Permethrin for the farm seem to be unacceptable, they have smelly petroleum oils and stuff.  You need stuff designed for clothing.

 

I've used Sawyers Spray available in walmart and sporting goods stores. It comes in a plastic spray bottle and also aerosol can. I spray hats, socks, shoes, car interior to the include seatbelt, backpacks, and various T-shirts and other clothing items. Full concentration, and I spray outdoors and let it line dry. Wet solution makes cats very sick, and of course that's the only time when my outdoor cat reliably shows up, when those clothes are dripping wet. Stupid cat. B)

 

Professionally treated clothing is not supposed to be touched up, so I keep track of how many times they've been washed, and I do not press it. “Lasts 70 washings!” … doesn't mean I can guarantee it's tickproof at 70 washings... that's the absolute upper limit in a perfect case.

 

For other T-shirts and whatever, I don't mess around. I re-spray them all before a weekend trip. The instructions say to not spray underwear. Socks are OK.

 

Yes, there are concerns. This chemical is poison. It kills certain critters, and used as directed, it's “safe for humans and most dragons”. But if you can limit exposure to it, do so. It just makes sense.

 

 

Edited by kunarion
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14 minutes ago, TeamRabbitRun said:

Here comes Spring again in the Northern Hemisphere.
Directed at those of you who use permethrin to tick-proof clothing:

 

  • What brand?
  • What format? (Spray bottle, pour bottle, etc.)
  • What concentration? 
  • Do you cut it with water?
  • Where do you get it?
  • How are you applying it? (Spray, soak, etc.)
  • How often do you apply it?
  • What clothing are you treating? (Pants, sneakers, boots, socks, etc.)
  • Any clothing that you're NOT treating? 
  • Any concerns with its use?
  • Any important points I'm not asking?

 

I've used the Sawyer Permethrin in the bottle to soak several pants, shirts, and socks.   Apparently it's poisonous to cats, but not after it's dried.  

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What country are you in?  For Canada, it's complicated because you can't just buy it labelled for such use.  Thank you, Bureaucracy Canada.

 

There are workarounds, which I've described in an older thread...

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13 minutes ago, Viajero Perdido said:

What country are you in?  For Canada, it's complicated because you can't just buy it labelled for such use.  Thank you, Bureaucracy Canada.

 

There are workarounds, which I've described in an older thread...

 

We're in the United States.

Would you happen to know what that other thread is? I've searched, but found few specifics.

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30 minutes ago, TeamRabbitRun said:

Here comes Spring again in the Northern Hemisphere.
Directed at those of you who use permethrin to tick-proof clothing:

 

There's more than a few who for some odd reason think "spring" is the time to worry.    :) 

Search "tick"  and/or "permethrin" and you're busy a while.

If the sun is melting ice/snow, ticks are out.  My first bout with Lyme was a tick in NJ during the winter (near sunfish pond).

Every deer I or any member of the family ever took had active ticks on them.  Dressing, see them crawling to you as the animal's cooling...

 

I don't believe a "brand" means anything.  If it's listed for clothing, it should be good.  It shouldn't be over 0.5%.  I use sawyer, 24oz. 

You follow directions and spray what's in the bottle.   I spray everything but briefs.  Everything includes Ts, socks, backpacks, and boot tops.

I spray everything and put 'em in the closet with all other clothes.  It doesn't "leach" onto other clothing....

I used to put them in a black bag in the closet (sunlight breaks down permethrin), but since there's no sun shining in my closet...

 

I've never worn factory-treated clothing.  We don't know about their quality control, or how accurate their "life of the garment" claim is.

 - Though the US military has been treating their clothing for years.  They have specs that must be met  (but it's all in camo).

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23 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

 

There's more than a few who for some odd reason think "spring" is the time to worry.    :) 

Search "tick"  and/or "permethrin" and you're busy a while.

If the sun is melting ice/snow, ticks are out.  My first bout with Lyme was a tick in NJ during the winter (near sunfish pond).

Every deer I or any member of the family ever took had active ticks on them.  Dressing, see them crawling to you as the animal's cooling...

 

I don't believe a "brand" means anything.  If it's listed for clothing, it should be good.  It shouldn't be over 0.5%.  I use sawyer, 24oz. 

You follow directions and spray what's in the bottle.   I spray everything but briefs.  Everything includes Ts, socks, backpacks, and boot tops.

I spray everything and put 'em in the closet with all other clothes.  It doesn't "leach" onto other clothing....

I used to put them in a black bag in the closet (sunlight breaks down permethrin), but since there's no sun shining in my closet...

 

I've never worn factory-treated clothing.  We don't know about their quality control, or how accurate their "life of the garment" claim is.

 - Though the US military has been treating their clothing for years.  They have specs that must be met  (but it's all in camo).

 

Good info from everyone so far, thanks.

The 'Spring' reference was only because I'm a hermit in Winter, so Spring means I'm out again. We're a long-time Lyme family and we know that it's not seasonal. This year, with almost no snow and a relatively warm winter we're all too aware that the threat's not abated much.

 

Why, oh WHY did I ever pick an outdoor hobby?

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1 hour ago, TeamRabbitRun said:

Would you happen to know what that other thread is?

 

Ah, here we go:

 

For Canadians reading this, I posted a number of times to that thread, including my solution right at the bottom of the first page.

 

Edited by Viajero Perdido

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2 hours ago, kunarion said:

Wet solution makes cats very sick, and of course that's the only time when my outdoor cat reliably shows up,

 

Ah, yes. The one time in my life I used a broad leafed weed killer the barn cat, ordinarily never seen anywhere near the area of application, (ordinarily never seen much at all)  followed and ROLLED in it.

 

By the way, the only place on line that I could find any info that was relevant to a very very sick cat was on a Pakistani agricultural site.  All the US sites just went on and on about how "safe" it was. Cat  did survive.

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I posted to the earlier thread.  And in the year or so since, still no problems with ticks.  They may land on my treated pants, but I just brush them off. 

 

I usually check after passing through tick-prone areas like grassy areas and fields or if I've slid through leaf litter.  On the other hand, I've found ticks on me after passing through very light overgrowth, so one has to check themselves routinely.  Last year was random - I passed through a lot of vegetation that I sure would be prime questing territory, but found no ticks.  They either dropped off or just weren't there.  It's kind of like trying to prove a negative.

 

I use Sawyer's, but that's only because it's the brand I find at Dick's.

 

Joe

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It is time to re-treat my clothing for the upcoming seasons.  While out last weekend, I found a tick on my hand - in mid-February. I suppose the groundhog was correct, and winter is almost over.

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I've been using this product for a couple years now. One bottle lasts several years. 

I spray our hiking clothes about once per month as long as temperatures are 30°F or above. This includes hats, especially the inside. I have been bitten twice by one that lodged himself just under the hat band. If you carry a pack, spray that, too. They'll hitch a ride on just about anything. Another thing to consider is spraying the carpets in your car, especially the back where my dog rides. I started doing this after finding a tick inside the car a few days after we had been out hiking. It had dropped off either me, my dog or my pack. 

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0048EY6KY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

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3 hours ago, JohnCNA said:

I've been using this product for a couple years now. One bottle lasts several years. 

I spray our hiking clothes about once per month as long as temperatures are 30°F or above. This includes hats, especially the inside. I have been bitten twice by one that lodged himself just under the hat band. If you carry a pack, spray that, too. They'll hitch a ride on just about anything. Another thing to consider is spraying the carpets in your car, especially the back where my dog rides. I started doing this after finding a tick inside the car a few days after we had been out hiking. It had dropped off either me, my dog or my pack. 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0048EY6KY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

I remember another saying they were thinking about using similar.   Notice fabrics aren't mentioned anywhere on the label.   

That 63% of other ingredients saying  "** Contains petroleum distillates"    may be why.

Curious, do you cut this down, or use it full strength like it's commercial subterranean/ground wood  application  ?     Thanks.  :)

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29 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

 

I remember another saying they were thinking about using similar.   Notice fabrics aren't mentioned anywhere on the label.   

That 63% of other ingredients saying  "** Contains petroleum distillates"    may be why.

Curious, do you cut this down, or use it full strength like it's commercial subterranean/ground wood  application  ?     Thanks.  :)

The directions are to mix it with water. One ounce per gallon. That one bottle makes something like 30 gallons. 

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2 minutes ago, JohnCNA said:

The directions are to mix it with water. One ounce per gallon. That one bottle makes something like 30 gallons. 

 

Thanks.   :)   The reason I ask is a friend tried similar once, and had "hot spots" of stinging skin, mostly on the thighs and shoulders.

We couldn't determine if they didn't cut it properly (though there were no directions on the bottle for fabrics...), and whether it was the mineral spirits or kerosene in with it, or the higher-strength of permethrin that did it.  

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4 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

 

Thanks.   :)   The reason I ask is a friend tried similar once, and had "hot spots" of stinging skin, mostly on the thighs and shoulders.

We couldn't determine if they didn't cut it properly (though there were no directions on the bottle for fabrics...), and whether it was the mineral spirits or kerosene in with it, or the higher-strength of permethrin that did it.  

 

Doesn't the "Permethrin for clothing" have special chemicals to bind the stuff to cloth?  I thought it was a kind of wax (and certainly not petroleum).  I may be mistaken.

 

Anyway, if you look into concentrated Permethrin for termites, you will read that it's absolutely not for clothing.  And that it's great for clothing.  It's both. B)

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16 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

 

Thanks.   :)   The reason I ask is a friend tried similar once, and had "hot spots" of stinging skin, mostly on the thighs and shoulders.

We couldn't determine if they didn't cut it properly (though there were no directions on the bottle for fabrics...), and whether it was the mineral spirits or kerosene in with it, or the higher-strength of permethrin that did it.  

Well, that's interesting... It had one of those peel off flaps on the back with instructions inside. Mentioned mixing with water and using a sponge to directly apply it to livestock and dogs. Use it for their bedding and blankets, etc. I don't remember if it mentioned human clothes. That booklet is long gone. Been using it for 6 years now. The wife has VERY sensitive skin and has had no problems. As far as I could tell it has the same formula as the Sawyer sprays I bought at REI. Just concentrated which is why the directions call for 1 ounce per gallon of water.

 

At any rate, I've found that Permethrin, either this way or with Sawyer, is far more effective than DEET for ticks. 

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The clothing approach is definitely the way to go with this stuff.  The effectiveness of Permethrin degrades very rapidly when applied to skin (chemical reaction breaks down the Permethrin), but lasts a long time on clothing.  Creams are available but are very short lived, and require frequent reapplication.

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On 2/20/2020 at 1:59 PM, TeamRabbitRun said:

 

Good info from everyone so far, thanks.

The 'Spring' reference was only because I'm a hermit in Winter, so Spring means I'm out again. We're a long-time Lyme family and we know that it's not seasonal. This year, with almost no snow and a relatively warm winter we're all too aware that the threat's not abated much.

 

Why, oh WHY did I ever pick an outdoor hobby?

Sadly climate change changed our way of geocaching. Our winters are warmer, Lyme disease is on the raise in our area. We now avoid bushwracking to find caches and caches with tick attributes. I won't spray chemicals on my clothes. We do use a natural spray though when camping called Buzz Away. Its also a tick repellent. Don't know how effective it is but we never found a tick on us and the mosquitoes stayed off us, just buzz around our heads. 

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13 hours ago, HunterandSamuel said:

Sadly climate change changed our way of geocaching. Our winters are warmer, Lyme disease is on the raise in our area. We now avoid bushwracking to find caches and caches with tick attributes. I won't spray chemicals on my clothes. We do use a natural spray though when camping called Buzz Away. Its also a tick repellent. Don't know how effective it is but we never found a tick on us and the mosquitoes stayed off us, just buzz around our heads. 

Citronella oil, which is the operative stuff in Buzz Away, helps with mosquitoes, but doesn't intimidate ticks for more than about 20 minutes.  EPA/FDA testing hasn't yet run across an 'essential oil' that effectively masks the CO2 that you are emitting and that the little buggers are seeking out. 

 

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2 hours ago, ecanderson said:

 EPA/FDA testing hasn't yet run across an 'essential oil' that effectively masks the CO2 that you are emitting and that the little buggers are seeking out. 

 

Stop breathing - problem solved. Nah. Flies would then be a problem.:(

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On 2/24/2020 at 7:53 PM, ecanderson said:

Citronella oil, which is the operative stuff in Buzz Away, helps with mosquitoes, but doesn't intimidate ticks for more than about 20 minutes.  EPA/FDA testing hasn't yet run across an 'essential oil' that effectively masks the CO2 that you are emitting and that the little buggers are seeking out. 

 

Thanks. I guess the solution is to not stand in the same place for more than 20 minutes. lol

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Made that mistake caching in S Carolina one time.  Stood there staring at my GPS, unaware that I'd parked myself right on top of a colony of fire ants.  Not my best move.

 

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