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Max and 99

The biggest jewel heist in history!

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I am very happy with how easy this promotion has been using the ios app. It's not my phone, but everything I've needed has been so easy to find and figure out.

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Today I "rage quit"  this promotion/event. Why did the app show the collected jewels (in the "inventory") before the clues were collected, only to poof the jewels away when clues were completed?  I'm not going to collect them again (unless it just happens during my regular caching). Goodbye promotion, not going to miss you a one bit!

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I was also expecting a puzzle, not another road trip or two or three. I had to do the levels in stages. I don't have a smartphone so I have to prepare in advance. As someone else mentioned I had to plan for caches I might not find in advance. Because of this handicap, I couldn't pick up other caches that might fulfil the requirements for the next level as soon as I had all of the evidence. I'm not happy about all this running around, especially if I end up going back to the same territory I had just been in. Also, what happens to the additional evidence caches I found helping a friend with his search? Do they count toward the 35? I haven't found all the gemstones yet, so I haven't unlocked it to find out the answer to that question.

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2 minutes ago, lynn8 said:

I was also expecting a puzzle, not another road trip or two or three. I had to do the levels in stages. I don't have a smartphone so I have to prepare in advance. As someone else mentioned I had to plan for caches I might not find in advance. Because of this handicap, I couldn't pick up other caches that might fulfil the requirements for the next level as soon as I had all of the evidence. I'm not happy about all this running around, especially if I end up going back to the same territory I had just been in. Also, what happens to the additional evidence caches I found helping a friend with his search? Do they count toward the 35? I haven't found all the gemstones yet, so I haven't unlocked it to find out the answer to that question.

They will not count towards the promotion. I was in a similar situation.

I'm 99% sure. 😁

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Well... there is a Dutch airline pilot who is finding it very easy to get all these promotional souvenirs.  He was really busy around town yesterday,  judging from the found log notifications I received for the 19th July from caches I own or watch. 

But although he  found a fairly remote cache I own, he  only logged with a fullstop (insulting!) and, checking,  he didn't find any of the other caches on the way to it?   Hang on,  why is there no log from him showing on the cache page?  Even more puzzling, his profile shows he he has no finds on 19 July...? his latest cache find was in Kuwait on the 18th July...  and then it clicked. 

Mr Dutch airline pilot was Couch Logging to get the points needed for this latest promotion. Once he got the points, he got the souvenir 19th July, then deleted all his found logs. He must have been doing it for some time, since although he got a souvenir for caching in NZ 10 June 2016, his only find on that date was in the Netherlands...  

So there you are - a simple and effective way to get all the souvenirs you want, eh?  Now if only I could log a NA (Needs to Apologise) on his profile page, the bad-mannered lout...

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10 minutes ago, daywalk said:

Well... there is a Dutch airline pilot who is finding it very easy to get all these promotional souvenirs.  He was really busy around town yesterday,  judging from the found log notifications I received for the 19th July from caches I own or watch. 

But although he  found a fairly remote cache I own, he  only logged with a fullstop (insulting!) and, checking,  he didn't find any of the other caches on the way to it?   Hang on,  why is there no log from him showing on the cache page?  Even more puzzling, his profile shows he he has no finds on 19 July...? his latest cache find was in Kuwait on the 18th July...  and then it clicked. 

Mr Dutch airline pilot was Couch Logging to get the points needed for this latest promotion. Once he got the points, he got the souvenir 19th July, then deleted all his found logs. He must have been doing it for some time, since although he got a souvenir for caching in NZ 10 June 2016, his only find on that date was in the Netherlands...  

So there you are - a simple and effective way to get all the souvenirs you want, eh?  Now if only I could log a NA (Needs to Apologise) on his profile page, the bad-mannered lout...

Unfortunately, it can be done. Shameful.

Funny, but shameful.

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6 hours ago, daywalk said:

 .. and, checking,  he didn't find any of the other caches on the way to it?  

 

Thanks.  A few have said here over the years, that they didn't feel people really noticed things like that.   :)

I took a lotta carp for some time  for passing by  "placed on the way to..."  caches,  to only log the one at the end.

For a while I even signed a couple on the way,  thinking that might shut some up  (but never logged online).

At an event I mentioned to another about "riding the coattails of a better hide"  and they finally stopped the silliness altogether.   :D

 

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Looks like there's still a bit of a lag in when the clues show up as found on the website on the https://www.geocaching.com/promos/mysteryatthemuseum page. Last night I logged (on the website) a cache with the shadow clue. On the cache page it showed I had found 1/2 shadows, but the Mystery at the Museum page still showed 0/2. The Mystery at the Museum part of the app showed 1/2. This morning, the website has updated to show 1/2, but the lag is still a bit inconvenient.

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I moved several dozen posts about the definition of "Penalty" and related off-topic thoughts to a separate thread.  Posts on that subject should go in that thread so as not to detract from the on-topic posts in this thread.  Thanks.

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 Unless I am playing a game like the Jewel Heist, I usually skip over micros in search of other caches. So, I don't think skipping other caches, by itself, means anything. However, if it is impossible to get to caches, even being a pilot...then, well...not sure what the reward is in just clicking through caches for an unearned souvenir. 

 

I have not had any problems with the functions on my laptop/phone for the game. Guess I have been lucky, but the electronic recording has been totally smooth for me. I do like this game, overall. 

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I'm happy to finally be on the last level. Picked up my last jewel today; the needed clues are fairly spread around the city so it was a bit of travel. But I have no concern I'll finish it up by the 11th - Midwest Geobash next weekend, and a big trip to Scotland Aug 1 for some road trip geocaching. :)

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1 hour ago, thebruce0 said:

I'm happy to finally be on the last level. Picked up my last jewel today; the needed clues are fairly spread around the city so it was a bit of travel. But I have no concern I'll finish it up by the 11th - Midwest Geobash next weekend, and a big trip to Scotland Aug 1 for some road trip geocaching. :)

I had a heck of a time getting enough Ruby's - I kept DNFing those!  But now I just need those last 35 - and there is a new (placed while we were traveling) Geotour in the area with 40 caches - and I 'saved' them for this level.  The harder part will be getting the wife to commit the time as she's interested in the Geotour also.

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3 hours ago, BugLuv said:

I have not had any problems with the functions on my laptop/phone for the game. Guess I have been lucky, but the electronic recording has been totally smooth for me. I do like this game, overall. 

 

2 hours ago, thebruce0 said:

I'm happy to finally be on the last level. Picked up my last jewel today

Both of the above statements apply in my case.  It's been interesting, as I'd not used the filtering much at all on my phone or the new search map.  We are currently several hundred miles south of our home area (having pretty much cleared it out already!!) so we've had adequate selection of caches to get the Detective clues and then the Jewels we needed.  We got the final jewels today, and finding 35 more caches between now and August 11 should be doable for us. I 'm lucky to have geocaching husband as a partner, who is on board with the promo and searching for select caches.

 

He didn't use the filtering options, so he was seeing all the caches, and I was only seeing those with the jewels we needed - it made for interesting conversatins as we drove!  Anyway, we'll be driving a few hundred miles back home tomorrow.  It's a drive we've made multiple times, and I think we've got all the rest stop caches on the way, but we no longer need to target specific caches.  We may just plan a caching day or two and find a bunch on a hiking trail once we get home.

 

It's been an interesting promo, different, and forced(?) me to learn map features I hadn't used before.  The souvenirs and tally functions worked smoothly - hubby logged at the cache site, I logged later on my laptop from drafts I made on the phone and it worked both ways equally well.  I'd give this a thumbs up, though I realize it's been frustrating for some.

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I was fortunate enough to start the very first one (a traditional) in my home location.  I could have easily completed it, using traditional caches but I opt to leave them alone unless they have a high FP count or high FP%, most of which I've already found.  However, the family was forutnate enough to travel to Chicago for a regional track meet and fortune favored me, as I was able to knock out souvenirs 2 and 3 thanks to a geo-art series that used LBHs and ? caches, less than 10 miles from the hotel.  Then I was able to do a nice paddle geo-art series, all of which were ? caches, yesterday (still need to log them) that should complete this particular promotion.

 

I used the website exclusively, both on my phone (due to DNFs) and on my laptop, to find the caches I needed to complete each portion.  Initially, it was a bit confusing but I figured it out.  I don't use the official app, preferring an alternate app that I believe is better.  I don't know how the interactions with the official app went, or if they managed to make things any easier than the method I used, but I'd be interested to hear from official app users, who also used the website, if it was any easier using the app over the site.

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17 minutes ago, coachstahly said:

I'd be interested to hear from official app users, who also used the website, if it was any easier using the app over the site.

Yes, app was easier for me.

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Posted (edited)
On 7/19/2019 at 8:40 PM, daywalk said:

Well... there is a Dutch airline pilot who is finding it very easy to get all these promotional souvenirs.  He was really busy around town yesterday,  judging from the found log notifications I received for the 19th July from caches I own or watch. 

But although he  found a fairly remote cache I own, he  only logged with a fullstop (insulting!) and, checking,  he didn't find any of the other caches on the way to it?   Hang on,  why is there no log from him showing on the cache page?  Even more puzzling, his profile shows he he has no finds on 19 July...? his latest cache find was in Kuwait on the 18th July...  and then it clicked. 

Mr Dutch airline pilot was Couch Logging to get the points needed for this latest promotion. Once he got the points, he got the souvenir 19th July, then deleted all his found logs. He must have been doing it for some time, since although he got a souvenir for caching in NZ 10 June 2016, his only find on that date was in the Netherlands...  

So there you are - a simple and effective way to get all the souvenirs you want, eh?  Now if only I could log a NA (Needs to Apologise) on his profile page, the bad-mannered lout...

Being a CO isn't for everyone.  It's like having teenagers that drive you crazy and there's not much you can do about it.  Just relax and have fun. 

Edited by SwineFlew

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I got started on the Mystery the weekend of the 13th/14th.  Slow going at first; easy enough to get the detective but it took a little while to get the different clues, as they were a little scattered around.  I got through the first couple tiers and started finding some jewels.

 

This past weekend I finished off finding jewels by doing a nice round of caches on some forest trails a few miles from home.  There were some detectives and clues sprinkled in with the jewels.  I suppose I could have bolstered my vault numbers by logging out of order, but I didn't really pay attention past making sure that the trail of caches would get me the jewels I needed.  (I was just happy to get all the jewels I needed - and happier still that it was a nice walk in the hills on paths with some wild raspberry bushes.  YUM.)  I returned to that area to get a few more with Mrs. hzoi and our little cacher, and to make sure that they got a chance to pick some berries as well.  After that, I now have 8 of the 35 finds I need to open the vault.

 

I like that the souvenir promotion has given a little extra value to going after caches I have been putting off finding, like suburban park and grabs.

 

Overall, I think the purpose of these souvenir promotions has always been to get folks out finding more caches.  It got me finding more caches, including ones I might not have gotten to otherwise.  So I'd say mission accomplished.

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On 7/19/2019 at 9:52 PM, Max and 99 said:

Unfortunately, it can be done. Shameful.

Funny, but shameful.

Not exactly couch logging, but we have a local, very prolific cacher and cache owner that suddenly transferred several caches to a "new owner" (profile just created) and then went on to find these caches stating they were working on the Mystery at the Museum.  Come to think of it, maybe they were couch logging.  Maybe this belongs in the Found It (Didn't Find It) topic.

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I get that some people don't like this promotion. You're entitled to your opinion. But if you are going to participate, there's no need to complain about the "stupid" promotion in every log you post for every clue you search for.

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I’m visiting relatives, and just finished. I’m happy to report complete satisfaction with solving the case. Haha. I picked a fantastic cache for my final 35/35.  Put the jewels back in the parking lot! They should put a warning on this promotion, though.  I’ve managed to totally annoy multiple friends and family members while traveling since this promotion began! Fed my addiction. 😂😂 my poor husband is probably SO glad this is over.

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On 7/21/2019 at 7:30 AM, coachstahly said:

I'd be interested to hear from official app users, who also used the website, if it was any easier using the app over the site.

I used the app for caching in the field.  The filtering definitely made caching on the fly a lot simpler - as we were in an area away from our home, we had lots of unfound caches to choose from.  Narrowing the search for just those jewels or clues we needed, and then looking at recent history, made quick work of the early clues.  We got all the jewels too, and our drive home gave us ample opportunity to find 9 random caches (7 trads and 2 EC's) towards the additional 35 needed.  Only 26 more to go!

 

We may or may not get them all - returning home to a close friend dying of cancer may derail the rest of the promo for us, but it has been enjoyable up to this point.  Focussed caching - a new experience for us!

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ok...I'm stupid...

Hope some of you get some amusement out of my weirdness.

 

I only had the detective souvenir until this weekend, but I had a big caching trip planned on sunday. There is a new geoart thingy hear and I had some time in the last weeks to solve all the puzzles. Had a good day outside, found 89 caches (most I have ever found by far), and expected to have all challenges complete. Then I started logging...I only found a new clue on cache nummer 12 of the day. Since I log each cache individually, logging takes quite a lot of time. I started looking ahead and found out I would only complete the second stage of the challenge at cache 75 of the day. Hmm...that would take me a few hours and it was already late. Since I like to have the souvenir on the correct day as I have found the caches, this would be a problem. I thought I was being smart and made a few quick logs for the level 2 caches only, get the souvenir on the correct day, and remove those few logs again and continue logging at my slow pace to have them all in order again. Did this...and everything worked as planned... I thought...

However, since I now had level 2 complete, I had unlocked level 3!!!! So all the caches I logged now gave me diamonds and saphirs and stuff, which I didn't deserve until the 75th cache of the day. So now if I would continue logging my logs I would get the level 3 souvenir in no time, while I wouldn't have had it if I done things in the order I would have found them. The next day I logged a few more caches, until I was at the point I would get the souvenir if I logged 1 more...

Although I was still tired from my bike ride the day before, looked up where the missing level 3 things where, so I could go for another bikeride after work so I would at least could continue logging the caches from the day before. Ended up doing another 30km before getting home.... Then I found out that after completing level 3 there was another task...which messed things up even more.  I first was affraid I have to do another big trip soon, but have a different solution now. I log the caches with a write note, and than change the log to a found it. It makes the logging even slower, but caches aren't counted for the challenge now, so I think this works. Still have to write a lot of logs though...

 

All this, to get a stupid useless souvenir thingy on the correct day on my digital profile page..

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2 hours ago, PnavE_81 said:

All this, to get a stupid useless souvenir thingy on the correct day on my digital profile page..

 

Feel your pain.  Though they can't be that stupid and useless if you're willing to go through all this to get them ;)

 

Technically, you're not earning these souvenirs in the intended manner if for example you find geocaches with all 58 clues in one day but log them all out of order to optimize your finds and get them all.  The intent is that you earn the level souvenirs in order. That of course isn't stopping people from being creative in their find-logging order to make their caching trips more productive for the souvenirs and minimize travel, and really there's nothing wrong with that :) but, the intent of the setup was indeed that you could end up finding any number of caches before, say, one with the Detective clue, and none of them would count towards level 2, 3, or 4, despite having the relevant clues.

 

The idea really was that anyone wanting to get the souvenirs would be focusing their cache-finding strategies and target order to "play the game" level by level. Obviously it's not a restrictive rule and nothing says one can't be creative, but that was the setup of the mechanic. So it is unfortunate that your power trail series barely pushed you forward based on your logging order - others have reported completing the souvenir series by doing a large powertrail in a day, mainly because they happened to find each level's requirements fairly early on and unlocked them as they went, not even paying attention to clues.

 

It's really no surprise that people would log out of order to complete the levels. There's certainly no rule or even a guideline implying that you shouldn't do that :) (but that relates more to logging etiquette and general geocaching habits; not many people like logging their finds out of order!)

 

In short, completing levels linearly is inferred from the basic mechanics of normal geocaching alongside the setup of this promo period's incremental souvenir unlocking requirements. But it ain't no rule.  Logging finds out of order isn't against guidelines either - only logging false finds, which if abused (eg just to get souvenirs) could get some HQ coming down on ya.

 

3 hours ago, PnavE_81 said:

ok...I'm stupid...

Hope some of you get some amusement out of my weirdness.

 

I wouldn't say stupid or weird! It's just the way your cookie crumbled :)

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29 minutes ago, thebruce0 said:

It's really no surprise that people would log out of order to complete the levels. There's certainly no rule or even a guideline implying that you shouldn't do that :) (but that relates more to logging etiquette and general geocaching habits; not many people like logging their finds out of order!)

 

 

I found 10 caches on the day the event started. Unfortunately, I forgot about the event and just did part of a local trail whilst out with the doggo. Needless to say there wasn't a Detective cache amongst them.

 

When I realised later that evening I thought about not logging the finds until later, so I can utilise the MATM clues I found. I decided against it though. I logged as normal and started the event the next day. I'm now awaiting my next day off to do a trail of 25 caches to go towards my last 35 of the event.

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4 hours ago, PnavE_81 said:

ok...I'm stupid...

Hope some of you get some amusement out of my weirdness.

Not stupid, and not weird.  We log our finds in order, even timestamp them and number them.  Logging "out of order" messes things up in our ordered world!  (And I too, log drafts on my phone, and take time in the evening or the next day to write, what I hope, are enjoyable logs for the CO and others to read, and for myself to help me remember specific caches).

 

For this promo, we did find a few jewels before we had all the evidence clues, and we did find some caches that were detective or evidence mixed in with the jewels we were finding, even knowing we needed 35 more after all the jewels were found.  We were on a road trip, and just cached pretty much as we normally would, somewhat targeting the caches that contained what we needed, but if an interesting one was along the way, we got that one too.  I just looked at our numbers, and since the promo started, we've found 37 caches, and 31 of those helped us on our way.  The other 6 were along the way, and out of order, and gave us a smilie but no "clue".  

 

You CAN easily game this one by logging so your clues are maximized.  As long as you find all the caches, it matters to no one else what order you log them in.  I like to keep my record accurate, and this promo is still very doable when I log that way.

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10 hours ago, PnavE_81 said:

ok...I'm stupid...

Hope some of you get some amusement out of my weirdness.

 

I only had the detective souvenir until this weekend, but I had a big caching trip planned on sunday. There is a new geoart thingy hear and I had some time in the last weeks to solve all the puzzles. Had a good day outside, found 89 caches (most I have ever found by far), and expected to have all challenges complete. Then I started logging...I only found a new clue on cache nummer 12 of the day. Since I log each cache individually, logging takes quite a lot of time. I started looking ahead and found out I would only complete the second stage of the challenge at cache 75 of the day. Hmm...that would take me a few hours and it was already late. Since I like to have the souvenir on the correct day as I have found the caches, this would be a problem. I thought I was being smart and made a few quick logs for the level 2 caches only, get the souvenir on the correct day, and remove those few logs again and continue logging at my slow pace to have them all in order again. Did this...and everything worked as planned... I thought...

However, since I now had level 2 complete, I had unlocked level 3!!!! So all the caches I logged now gave me diamonds and saphirs and stuff, which I didn't deserve until the 75th cache of the day. So now if I would continue logging my logs I would get the level 3 souvenir in no time, while I wouldn't have had it if I done things in the order I would have found them. The next day I logged a few more caches, until I was at the point I would get the souvenir if I logged 1 more...

Although I was still tired from my bike ride the day before, looked up where the missing level 3 things where, so I could go for another bikeride after work so I would at least could continue logging the caches from the day before. Ended up doing another 30km before getting home.... Then I found out that after completing level 3 there was another task...which messed things up even more.  I first was affraid I have to do another big trip soon, but have a different solution now. I log the caches with a write note, and than change the log to a found it. It makes the logging even slower, but caches aren't counted for the challenge now, so I think this works. Still have to write a lot of logs though...

 

All this, to get a stupid useless souvenir thingy on the correct day on my digital profile page..

With the write note to found it conversiom oF my logs I'm almost back in track. All 3 souvenirs I have thus far are awarded on the correct days and the counter for the final level now says 3/35 while it should be 1/35 if I logged them all in the correct order. So just 2 caches that I need to log with the write note trick and everything is as it should be. :)

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I am an old granny who started caching back in 2005 before smartphones and data plans.  I still use a GPS and log on.the website.  This challenge is way beyond me.  I opted completely out.  I will just try and find my One cache tomorrow when I do my drive from rural SD to a big town ( over 20 thousand).  I can't find any in my town because I am the hider.  Too bad "the powers" forgot about us "dinos".  I will just be able to get a smiley and leave all of this high tech stuff to others.

  

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17 minutes ago, Former Hawkeye said:

I am an old granny who started caching back in 2005 before smartphones and data plans.  I still use a GPS and log on.the website.  This challenge is way beyond me.  I opted completely out.  I will just try and find my One cache tomorrow when I do my drive from rural SD to a big town ( over 20 thousand).  I can't find any in my town because I am the hider.  Too bad "the powers" forgot about us "dinos".  I will just be able to get a smiley and leave all of this high tech stuff to others.

  

The few in your town that you haven't found are high D /T!  But I bet there are lots of clues hidden in the town of 20,000. Since I don't know the town I can't check. If you change your mind we can help. 

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12 hours ago, Max and 99 said:

The few in your town that you haven't found are high D /T!  But I bet there are lots of clues hidden in the town of 20,000. Since I don't know the town I can't check. If you change your mind we can help. 

Yes, the prep work is easy with the clue filter option. It would be fairly easy planning for you.

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Posted (edited)

I had fun today in Brookings finding one cache that was not where it was supposed to be...it was broken with an unsignable log.  I performed maintenance on it and it is back in play for others.  This is one of my biggest joys of caching. Be able to help the game besides HIDING caches.  You guys can just play at your game and I will enjoy mine.😊

 

Edited by Former Hawkeye
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I am re-posting this since I put it where it wasn't supposed to be.

 

From the MATM promo:

 

Get briefed on the case and find clues to track down the stolen jewels. Once all of the jewels have been found, return them to the vault using the hidden code changed by the thieves.

____________________________

 

From this sentence, I read that ONCE I have found all of the jewels, I return them to the vault using the hidden code changed by the thieves. This gives NO indication that finding another 35 caches will be required between those two steps. I find that frustrating.

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1 hour ago, Max and 99 said:

I am re-posting this since I put it where it wasn't supposed to be.

 

From the MATM promo:

 

Get briefed on the case and find clues to track down the stolen jewels. Once all of the jewels have been found, return them to the vault using the hidden code changed by the thieves.

____________________________

 

From this sentence, I read that ONCE I have found all of the jewels, I return them to the vault using the hidden code changed by the thieves. This gives NO indication that finding another 35 caches will be required between those two steps. I find that frustrating.

I wouldn't think a promo would give all the details of a game, so I'm not surprised that the 35 is not mentioned.  On the MATM page is says "find 35 cache to access the lock", then you can return the jewels using the code needed.

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On 7/29/2019 at 9:51 PM, Max and 99 said:

I am re-posting this since I put it where it wasn't supposed to be.

 

From the MATM promo:

 

Get briefed on the case and find clues to track down the stolen jewels. Once all of the jewels have been found, return them to the vault using the hidden code changed by the thieves.

____________________________

 

From this sentence, I read that ONCE I have found all of the jewels, I return them to the vault using the hidden code changed by the thieves. This gives NO indication that finding another 35 caches will be required between those two steps. I find that frustrating.

It’s a lot of caches, and kind of a tedious, momentum-sucking step. I loved the entire game except this aspect. It seemed tossed in and not associated with the flow of the other more creative elements. 

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2 hours ago, BugLuv said:

It’s a lot of caches, and kind of a tedious, momentum-sucking step. I loved the entire game except this aspect. It seemed tossed in and not associated with the flow of the other more creative elements. 

I agree. I thought the first few stages were quite creative and I enjoyed the "planning" part, but then to finish with "go find 35 caches" almost seemed like someone had run out of ideas and had to think of a final stage but ran out of time before the assignment was due to be handed in and they just fell back on the fairly tedious traditional "find a lot of caches" idea. TBH I think they could have left it a find the 6 jewels, or at least made the last stage something more creative.

 

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The last level was effectively "take the jewels to the vault."  At least they didn't require us to "visit Geocaching HQ" :laughing:

 

 

They could have done something with attributes, though those would be much easier and less visible than major cache properties for people to fudge.

They could have done something with travel distance between two caches in one day, but that would surely get people complaining who can't travel far.

They could have done maybe finding at least one of 4 different cache types in a day, but that's pushing the relevance and people might complain if they cached out a rarer type in their area for a previous level.

 

I'm not sure what fairly easily accessible and common cache property could have been used as a goal for the last level that's thematically relevant.  On the other hand, they could have just left it at find the jewels, then open the vault (which is what the initial wording seemed to imply). And if that would have seemed too short, they could have made the jewel level finding 4 or 5 of each (total 20 or 25 caches) instead of 3.

 

The jewel level was probably the least problematic, because there was a lot of good flexibility (or at least, seemed to have the least complaining about clue spread) compared to the other levels. Heck level 1 and 2 were basically technicalities to start and get to the meat of the promo which was really the jewel collection, imo.  They could have really played that up more.

 

But you know what they say about hindsight...  something witty.

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From the MATM Blog Post: (bold italics added)

Quote

How many clues do I need to find to earn each souvenir?

  1. The first souvenir, Briefed on the case, requires finding one clue in one geocache.
  2. The second souvenir, Evidence collected, requires finding six clues in six geocaches.
  3. The third souvenir, Jewels recovered, requires finding 15 clues in 15 geocaches.
  4. The fourth souvenir, Case closed, requires a bonus challenge to unlock the vault.

 

For the fourth souvenir, it doesn't say solve a puzzle or enter code word. It says there is a Bonus Challenge to unlock the vault. For many people, finding any 35 additional caches is a Challenge.

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Yes, but, is the bonus challenge finding 35 caches? Or determining the code to unlock the vault?
I think the whole point to this is that individual announcements taken separately allowed a different interpretation. Once they were put together, or the promo began, people discovered that you had to do both things to earn the last souvenir. The biggest theory before all this was that there was a puzzle to 'unlock the vault' and that was the bonus challenge.  Then someone unlocked level 4 and everyone learned of the 35 additional cache requirement. That was the can of worms. :P

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I can understand why an extension of the "clues" theme wasn't used for level 4, as it would have diluted the already sparse (for some) distribution of the other clues.

However, having something that was "in theme" with the rest of the promotion would have been cool.  So you've found the detective, found the evidence, and found the jewels... now you have to return them to the vault... At this point, there's no need for the "clues" idea.  And most cache attributes are easily modified (unless GS locked all cache page attributes for the length of the promotion).

 

Here's a couple of ideas I came up with:

  • Find caches published before the event whose initial letters spell out the word "VAULT" or "TEAGUE-ULMER MUSEUM," with all caches having their names locked for the duration of the promotion.  (This is problematic for people who live in areas where all the caches are named "Bob's Cache 1," "Bob's Cache 2," etc.)
  • A "secret" property called "distance" could have been added to each cache.  This value could be randomly generated so it is different for each user.  After finding each cache in level 4, this running total could have been updated until the player had covered the distance required to return the jewels.  (OK - you could say that each cache you find in level 4 is 1/35 of the distance required to return the jewels, I guess.  Much less interesting, imo.)  If you make this distance proportional to the number of (unfound?) caches in the user's home area, people in cache-sparse regions would need comparatively few caches to complete level 4.  (But then someone from, say, Seattle vacationing in a rural "middle of nowhere" would feel penalized, since they would be expected to find a lot of caches in a cache sparse area.)
  • Have the combination for the vault be gained by finding random caches.  This wouldn't be something you'd be able to search for, really, it would just have been "awarded" for finding some random cache.

Just some thoughts.

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1 hour ago, GO Geiger said:

I can understand why an extension of the "clues" theme wasn't used for level 4, as it would have diluted the already sparse (for some) distribution of the other clues.

However, having something that was "in theme" with the rest of the promotion would have been cool.  So you've found the detective, found the evidence, and found the jewels... now you have to return them to the vault... At this point, there's no need for the "clues" idea.  And most cache attributes are easily modified (unless GS locked all cache page attributes for the length of the promotion).

 

With the promotion called Mystery at the Museum, and mention of having to figure out the changed combination to put the jewels back in the vault, I'd imagined the final stage would have been some sort of puzzle to solve, maybe something like in Mission GC or the final step of Mary Hyde, or maybe just solve and find a Mystery cache. For a delirious moment I even pondered the possibility that it might be to find a cache with a jewel in its name, thinking my Quest for the Middle Sea Diamond and Middle Sea Pearler caches might see a bit of action. But never in my wildest dreams did I expect solving the "mystery" would be just "find another 35 caches".

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First, appreciation to the Groundspeak Lackey's who worked to create a new, unique challenge promotion for us, thank you for your work and efforts.  I know you are trying to make the "sport" (hobby) grow and give us a reason to get out and find interesting geocaches.  Thank you.  My comments below are not intended to attack you, but provide feedback to consider when you work on the next promotion. 

 

The promotion started right after I had been out of state with access to hundreds of unfound caches.  I worked on it but quickly found that living in an area with few unfound caches it was a challenge that required going at least an hour away.  Got the detective, clues and gems.  Was very disheartened to see that the final step was "find 35 caches". So this challenge is to find 57 caches, but find the first ones in a particular order, then just do a power trail. 

 

In a metro area where hundreds of unfound caches about, this is very doable, and you could go to an area and just "cache"

 

As a rural cacher who has found (or placed) most of the surrounding caches, this requires preplanning.  With the mystery aspect, where I didn't know what the next task was until I completed the previous one, planning was not an option.  If the entire promotion would have laid out from the beginning, I could have only sought the clues and gems, then saved finding other caches until later.  Of course this also means crisscrossing the land, ignoring nearby caches now only to return later.

 

The final step was unimaginative, and essentially reduces geocaching to a numbers game: meaning that powertrails, rather than going to interesting locations, or looking for unique geocaches is the best way to succeed.  I was disappointed that this was the final step.  I decided that finding 20 more caches in the final 7 days was not worth it, and voluntarily stopped the promotion

 

My suggestion is that future promotions need to consider that not everyone lives in an urban area with large quantities of unfound caches, that travel may be required, and that knowing what will be required will produce MORE interest in the promotion.  "Begin with the End in Mind" as per Covey's 7 habits.  This promotion didn't allow that.  Moreover, people cache for many different reasons, and that one reason is just as valid as another.  

 

I'm hoping the next promotion will not focus on numbers, and if travel will be required allow us to plan ahead for this travel.  The mystery is much like a surprise birthday party:

“I don't approve of surprises. The pleasure is never enhanced and the inconvenience is considerable.”-George Knightly from Emma by Jane Austen

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On 8/1/2019 at 5:34 AM, barefootjeff said:

 

With the promotion called Mystery at the Museum, and mention of having to figure out the changed combination to put the jewels back in the vault, I'd imagined the final stage would have been some sort of puzzle to solve, maybe something like in Mission GC or the final step of Mary Hyde, or maybe just solve and find a Mystery cache. For a delirious moment I even pondered the possibility that it might be to find a cache with a jewel in its name, thinking my Quest for the Middle Sea Diamond and Middle Sea Pearler caches might see a bit of action. But never in my wildest dreams did I expect solving the "mystery" would be just "find another 35 caches".

If there is a consensus, it appears that most players were very disappointed that the final step was "find another 35 caches."

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7 minutes ago, Team OPJim said:

If there is a consensus, it appears that most players were very disappointed that the final step was "find another 35 caches."

 

You mean, most players here in the forums... which represents what, 1% of the total players? And those here in the forums never leave the forums. So whatever the perceived consensus is here is not reality and for sure is not representative of a true cross-section.

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On ‎8‎/‎1‎/‎2019 at 8:34 AM, barefootjeff said:

With the promotion called Mystery at the Museum, and mention of having to figure out the changed combination to put the jewels back in the vault, I'd imagined the final stage would have been some sort of puzzle to solve, maybe something like in Mission GC or the final step of Mary Hyde, or maybe just solve and find a Mystery cache. For a delirious moment I even pondered the possibility that it might be to find a cache with a jewel in its name, thinking my Quest for the Middle Sea Diamond and Middle Sea Pearler caches might see a bit of action. But never in my wildest dreams did I expect solving the "mystery" would be just "find another 35 caches".

Agreed.   I thought maybe it might have to do with how someone started this hobby.

I was looking for unique areas and/or awesome views I haven't been to before, and pretty-much stuck with that.

The other 2/3rds, starting as a FTF monster, anything that's "a find" is okay.    :)

I might have enjoyed the puzzle/mystery end of it, but the "now go find 35 caches..." seemed anticlimactic.

Reminded me of a tough but fun puzzle that took a long time to solve,  then find the final was an lpc...

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8 hours ago, bflentje said:
8 hours ago, Team OPJim said:

If there is a consensus, it appears that most players were very disappointed that the final step was "find another 35 caches."

 

You mean, most players here in the forums... which represents what, 1% of the total players? And those here in the forums never leave the forums. So whatever the perceived consensus is here is not reality and for sure is not representative of a true cross-section.

 

I’d say the sentiment has been pretty similar on Facebook and at the event I attended a week or so ago, i.e. people have generally been disappointed at (i) the lack of imagination for the final stage and/or (ii) the sheer number of caches required to complete it.

 

I haven’t heard one person say “great, an opportunity to find another 35 caches”.  YMMV.

 

HQ are never going to be able to satisfy everyone, but I thought the first three stages were pretty good.  The last, meh!

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8 hours ago, bflentje said:

 

You mean, most players here in the forums... which represents what, 1% of the total players? And those here in the forums never leave the forums. So whatever the perceived consensus is here is not reality and for sure is not representative of a true cross-section.

 

What evidence you you have that  the consensus from those that don't participate in the forums is different from those that do?  

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10 hours ago, bflentje said:

 

You mean, most players here in the forums... which represents what, 1% of the total players? And those here in the forums never leave the forums. So whatever the perceived consensus is here is not reality and for sure is not representative of a true cross-section.

 

I left the forum for this promotion (and lots of other caches over the years) so you're certainly NOT referring to me.  I also believe that some of the regulars in here have completed the promotion, including myself.  As a few above me have mentioned, many in my area enjoyed the first three steps and the "twist" to them but found the last step a bit tedious.  Those that enjoyed the final 35 are more numbers cachers and would have completed it anyway while those who are more selective weren't fans.  I was fortunate enough to finish my last 35 on a paddle cache series but probably wouldn't have completed this promotion if that wasn't an option.

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3 hours ago, IceColdUK said:

I’d say the sentiment has been pretty similar on Facebook and at the event I attended a week or so ago, i.e. people have generally been disappointed at (i) the lack of imagination for the final stage and/or (ii) the sheer number of caches required to complete it.

People complaining about this year which had some other features need to remember last year which had nothing to it other than the sheer number of caches, and the year before which was the sheer number of caches but with a point system. I have to admit, it seemed like they ran out of ideas for the last part, but I just imagined it to be "and then there's a bunch of arbitrary legal work before you can return the jewels to the vault."

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12 hours ago, bflentje said:

 

You mean, most players here in the forums... which represents what, 1% of the total players? And those here in the forums never leave the forums. So whatever the perceived consensus is here is not reality and for sure is not representative of a true cross-section.

 

Thank you for pointing out that I didn't personally poll every geocacher on the planet earth.  I admit that I only came onto the forums when I realized that Groundspeak had locked out further comments on their blogs.  

My consensus is based on: 1 reviewing forums, 2 reviewing twitter and social media, and 3 contact with other cachers.  It also includes my own opinion.  Bottom line, is I am hoping that someone in Groundspeak will take note and never do that [find 35 caches regardless of type or quality] for future promotions.  I have likewise lobbied them via other social media.

 

Honestly, the hairsplitting over words and meaning (see the huge argument over the word "penalty" in another post about this topic that completely went sideways) is why I rarely visit the forums. A simple observation about a geocaching related issue soon breaks down into a Webster Dictionary argument. So I will return to the 99%

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6 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 

What evidence you you have that  the consensus from those that don't participate in the forums is different from those that do?  

 

Irrelevant  to my point. Purely pointing out that the forums are not representative of the total geocaching population, no matter what the issue is. If my perfectly pleasant statement is indicative to going sideways and hair splitting by some then TO may want to avoid 99% of the topics. LOL.

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