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tristan vermeesch

Maintaining other's caches

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Hello community.

 

This is my first post here, so hi everyone.

I've been geocaching for a while but I recently started with active geocaching, logging some caches each time I find some spare time.

Now I've seen some caches that are wet, with a logbook that's unreadable/un-writable or some where the container is completely broke. Am I allowed to replace the logbook with a fresh one and add a little protection around it so it is protected, or is it completely up to the cache owner to maintain it?

 

Thanks in advance for the response. 

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22 minutes ago, tristan vermeesch said:

Am I allowed to replace the logbook...

 

Yes, and everybody will appreciate.

However, greater maintenance should only be performed upon owner's notice.

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9 minutes ago, RuideAlmeida said:

 

Yes, and everybody will appreciate.

However, greater maintenance should only be performed upon owner's notice.

Thanks a lot. Now just waiting until my order of logbooks arrives :) 

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Just now, cerberus1 said:

I won't repair someone's cache unless they've asked me to before I'm heading out. 

 - Nine times outta ten I'm the first NM  on it too...

Will leave a Rite in Rain strip in a baggie until the CO can fix it themselves though.

 

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This is just me...but...if it's an active cacher's hide; I'll do what I can to help them out(they'd do the same for me). If it's someone who hasn't logged into the game in years, and their caches are just sitting there rotting; I'll just leave them as I found them, and log a NM; hoping they'll eventually get archived to open space up for someone who is actually active.

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We act on mention in logs, rather than wait for a NM.  We've found it works better for us that way.

I'd rather no one "fixes" mine, thanks.  If you think there's an issue beyond a mention in the log, I'd prefer a NM.

We had a "helper" once who "added to our full log book", to find the same calendar page strips that he uses for his own caches.

Emailed, "There you go, no need to stop a while   :)."

Not a single page in the Rite in Rain log book had signatures on the back.   Half isn't full.   Pitched his trash.   Yeah, thanks for the help...

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7 hours ago, *GeoPunx* said:

This is just me...but...if it's an active cacher's hide; I'll do what I can to help them out(they'd do the same for me). If it's someone who hasn't logged into the game in years, and their caches are just sitting there rotting; I'll just leave them as I found them, and log a NM; hoping they'll eventually get archived to open space up for someone who is actually active.

That's a good point. There are some caches around me and I checked and the owner last connection was in 2014, so I don't expect them to come and maintain them.

It all depend on the situation I suppose. If it's just the little plastic bag that is sometimes around the logbook that is broken, I could simply replace it but if the logbook is wet I prefer to ask the owner of the cache. Sometimes they just have to dry the logbook and now replacing the whole thing.

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22 hours ago, tristan vermeesch said:

Now I've seen some caches that are wet, with a logbook that's unreadable/un-writable or some where the container is completely broke. Am I allowed to replace the logbook with a fresh one and add a little protection around it so it is protected, or is it completely up to the cache owner to maintain it?

 

Replace the logbook  ? No, please don't do it . Add , and sign, a new strip in a press seal bag so it doesn't immediately become as soggy as the original. I'll only take the old log away if I know the CO and have previously established that they are happy with that. The wet log sheet can probably be dried out, and it is part of the cache as set by the C.O. so taking it away seems to me to be removing someone else's property,  not something I am happy to do.   I habitually photograph log sheets in my owned caches in the field before replacing them when I do a maintenance walk, and post the photo with my owner maintenance log. It confirms and records the recent visitors, and deters backdated armchair loggers ( strange creatures, but I've seen and deleted a few  of their logs... )

 

My approach to caches I find which are in need of some care depends on several factors : The problem is there is a fine line between helpful community maintenance,  and enabling rubbishy unmaintained trash.  If I know the CO either personally or from finding several of their hides, and they are active in the game, I will have formed an opinion on what they hold appropriate, and will act accordingly and send a personal message to them with details of the problem and what I did, as well as mentioning it in my log.   However, if they are not known to me, I'll tread carefully, administer minimal first aid to keep the cache ticking over until the CO can visit (new log in bag, wipe the container out if damp, rehide where it should be if it's not as per the hint, remove any guideline breaking or obviously leaky swaps). I'll mention any minor maintenance like that in my log.
 

If I find a plastic box with a cracked lid, or an ammo can where some fool has mangled the closure or hinge, or a hanging cache which has somehow had it's suspension damaged, or a film pot which has been nibbled by rodents and is like a pepper pot, or a cache which has been obviously muggled and opened and pillaged, again  I'll do my best to make it secure in the short term ( I carry a very small amount of duct tape, cord and thin wire in my caching kit ) , mention it in my log, and  this time post a needs maintenance too, because this sort of problem can't be sorted by a visitor.

 

Caches I'm not going to spend time and effort with are the ones where a  'never was fit for purpose' container was placed by an owner who has never bothered to do any maintenance or is long gone from the game, and that container is now in a truly awful state.  There all I'll do is add a log if the existing one is utterly unsignable, just to record my visit, and put a needs maintenance on it, and a N.A. a month or two later if (or more likely, when) there's no CO response.

 

Where you draw the line between what you feel is helpful community maintenance versus foolish perpetuating  of zombie caches is entirely up to the individual to decide, opinions here are going to vary, give it a bit of thought and make your own mind up.

 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, hal-an-tow said:

Replace the logbook  ? No, please don't do it . Add , and sign, a new strip in a press seal bag so it doesn't immediately become as soggy as the original. I'll only take the old log away if I know the CO and have previously established that they are happy with that. The wet log sheet can probably be dried out, and it is part of the cache as set by the C.O. so taking it away seems to me to be removing someone else's property,  not something I am happy to do.   I habitually photograph log sheets in my owned caches in the field before replacing them when I do a maintenance walk, and post the photo with my owner maintenance log. It confirms and records the recent visitors, and deters backdated armchair loggers ( strange creatures, but I've seen and deleted a few  of their logs... )

 

My approach to caches I find which are in need of some care depends on several factors : The problem is there is a fine line between helpful community maintenance,  and enabling rubbishy unmaintained trash.  If I know the CO either personally or from finding several of their hides, and they are active in the game, I will have formed an opinion on what they hold appropriate, and will act accordingly and send a personal message to them with details of the problem and what I did, as well as mentioning it in my log.   However, if they are not known to me, I'll tread carefully, administer minimal first aid to keep the cache ticking over until the CO can visit (new log in bag, wipe the container out if damp, rehide where it should be if it's not as per the hint, remove any guideline breaking or obviously leaky swaps). I'll mention any minor maintenance like that in my log.
 

If I find a plastic box with a cracked lid, or an ammo can where some fool has mangled the closure or hinge, or a hanging cache which has somehow had it's suspension damaged, or a film pot which has been nibbled by rodents and is like a pepper pot, or a cache which has been obviously muggled and opened and pillaged, again  I'll do my best to make it secure in the short term ( I carry a very small amount of duct tape, cord and thin wire in my caching kit ) , mention it in my log, and  this time post a needs maintenance too, because this sort of problem can't be sorted by a visitor.

 

Caches I'm not going to spend time and effort with are the ones where a  'never was fit for purpose' container was placed by an owner who has never bothered to do any maintenance or is long gone from the game, and that container is now in a truly awful state.  There all I'll do is add a log if the existing one is utterly unsignable, just to record my visit, and put a needs maintenance on it, and a N.A. a month or two later if (or more likely, when) there's no CO response.

 

Where you draw the line between what you feel is helpful community maintenance versus foolish perpetuating  of zombie caches is entirely up to the individual to decide, opinions here are going to vary, give it a bit of thought and make your own mind up.

 

 

 

Thanks a lot for the response and I totaly agree.

If I understand well in the community there is a need to clean up some caches that are inactive and poorly maintained, since you aren't the only that says that maintaining a cache with a bad CO isn't a good thing.

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I recently found a cache in a nano that was soaking. The nano was rammed full with two crumpled and mostly destroyed logs. One fell to bits as I tried to unroll it the other had congealed to a single lump. I left it as it was and left a note and Maintenance required flag. But I can see this cache has not been visited for a very long time by it's owner. I was very tempted to remove the most damaged log with a RITR strip to help. I didn't as I did not know the etiquette, Reading this thread is useful. I am not sure I am really any wiser, but I have some guidance nonetheless, thanks

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25 minutes ago, DollyJelly said:

I recently found a cache in a nano that was soaking. The nano was rammed full with two crumpled and mostly destroyed logs...

 

Old hands have a tough-enough time trying to get one strip back into a nano, two, well...one would have been left out.   :D

Caches like that I might write over other, long-faded names with a sharpie, as the condition should show the CO's commitment to maintenance.

After the repeated attempts to get the one swelled piece of paper back in, a NM goes on when I get home.   :)

We haven't carried nano strips for years, because the container is one known to require a lot more maintenance than most. 

COs who place these things should know that. 

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16 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

 

Old hands have a tough-enough time trying to get one strip back into a nano, two, well...one would have been left out.   :D

Caches like that I might write over other, long-faded names with a sharpie, as the condition should show the CO's commitment to maintenance.

After the repeated attempts to get the one swelled piece of paper back in, a NM goes on when I get home.   :)

We haven't carried nano strips for years, because the container is one known to require a lot more maintenance than most. 

COs who place these things should know that. 

I don't carry nano strips either, as nanos are usually a waste of space in my opinion. With a few exceptions, an unimaginative and lazy person's cache. Their attitude, "I'll stick a nano there; that'll do. Can't be bothered to give this cache more thought."

There are some well placed nanos; I can think of two, but most would have been better being a micro, or even a regular or large. Nanos in the bushland. Gees!!!

My only nano cache - my first when I knew no better - I archived.

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3 hours ago, tristan vermeesch said:

If I understand well in the community there is a need to clean up some caches that are inactive and poorly maintained, since you aren't the only that says that maintaining a cache with a bad CO isn't a good thing.

 

How do you know who is bad and who is good? If the CO died - a bad CO? Caches are good or bad. If you like the cache you may want to extend its life a bit whether the CO is alive or not.

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3 hours ago, Goldenwattle said:

There are some well placed nanos; I can think of two, but most would have been better being a micro, or even a regular or large. Nanos in the bushland. Gees!!!

My only nano cache - my first when I knew no better - I archived.

 

I put a fake bolt here.  Out towards the end.  

02 Dolphin.jpg

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11 hours ago, Goldenwattle said:

I don't carry nano strips either, as nanos are usually a waste of space in my opinion. With a few exceptions, an unimaginative and lazy person's cache. Their attitude, "I'll stick a nano there; that'll do. Can't be bothered to give this cache more thought."

 

I don't place a lot but the ones I place are the either the only ones that would work in that particular location without me having to replace larger containers regularly or done to make things harder than they would be if I placed a magnetic key holder.  I found a nano in Battery Park in New York City that was the ONLY thing that would work in that location.  Whenever possible, of course people should place size applicable containers (unless they want to increase the D rating) but to say that COs that place them are unimaginative and lazy goes too far.  I dislike some types of containers (pill bottles come to mind) but I'm never going to say that the cachers that place them are unimaginative and lazy.  While I would certainly prefer some other type of container, not everyone places caches in a manner that suits my preferences and I'm perfectly fine with that.  You, in essence, are bashing a CO for a container choice you don't approve of, despite the fact that they didn't hide it for your approval.  They hid it for anyone who wants to find it.

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11 minutes ago, coachstahly said:

 

I don't place a lot but the ones I place are the either the only ones that would work in that particular location without me having to replace larger containers regularly or done to make things harder than they would be if I placed a magnetic key holder.  I found a nano in Battery Park in New York City that was the ONLY thing that would work in that location.  Whenever possible, of course people should place size applicable containers (unless they want to increase the D rating) but to say that COs that place them are unimaginative and lazy goes too far.  I dislike some types of containers (pill bottles come to mind) but I'm never going to say that the cachers that place them are unimaginative and lazy.  While I would certainly prefer some other type of container, not everyone places caches in a manner that suits my preferences and I'm perfectly fine with that.  You, in essence, are bashing a CO for a container choice you don't approve of, despite the fact that they didn't hide it for your approval.  They hid it for anyone who wants to find it.

You cropped what I wrote. This bit, "

There are some well placed nanos; I can think of two, but most would have been better being a micro, or even a regular or large. Nanos in the bushland. Gees!!!

My only nano cache - my first when I knew no better - I archived."

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13 hours ago, Goldenwattle said:

There are some well placed nanos; I can think of two, but most would have been better being a micro, or even a regular or large. Nanos in the bushland. Gees!!!

My only nano cache - my first when I knew no better - I archived."

 

This still isn't an endorsement by any stretch of the imagination.  You can think of only two and you archived your only when when you "knew no better".  It's still an obvious dislike for nanos and, by extension, those who place them, as they are thoughtless and for lazy COs.  While I don't like pill bottles, I don't think of the COs who place them as thoughtless and lazy.

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On ‎4‎/‎13‎/‎2019 at 9:35 PM, *GeoPunx* said:

<...>

If it's someone who hasn't logged into the game in years,

<...>

 

Keep in mind, "logging on" is no longer any kind of indication of a players currency in the hobby.

 

You can now go for years without "logging on", because that only pertains to the website, not a phone app.

 

To get a better picture of whether someone's still in the game, hit their profile, click the GEOCACHES tab, then "All Geocache Finds". You'll see all their FIND logs, most-recent first.  If the first log you see is two years ago, then there you are.

 

Unless, of course, they really suck at this, and that's just the last FIND. There could have been tons of DNF's since then, and they don't show.

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hal-an-tow's reponse was, imo, spot on.

In the case of, say, nanos where the log is completely full, depending on the CO and my resources, I might replace the logsheet but keep the old one, and contact the CO to let them know I have it and what to do with it. (and same for larger cache similar situations) Again, that falls under the personal judgment section, typically case by case.

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Here's my order of replacement.  If the container is broken and allows moisture in, I'll find the driest possible spot on the log to sign my name and file the NM, perhaps drying it out as it will just get wet again.  If the container appears to be in good shape, I'll do my best to dry out the log that's in there (assuming I have a heat source) before returning things to how I found them.  If the log is mushy wet and stays wet (based on prior logs), then putting in a a dry log seems pointless as the wet log will turn the dry log just as wet.  In that case, I'll pull the log that was in there, replace it with a  brand new one, make a note of it in my log and then contact the CO as well.  I offer to take a photo of the log or get it to them, via mail or in person if we're close enough. I've done it a few times and I've yet to have a CO contact me about their old log.  These are small logs, not the books or booklets that are in smalls or larger caches.  I won't do much with the larger logs as I don't carry them around.  I'll toss in a smaller log if the book is soaked through.

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1 hour ago, TeamRabbitRun said:

To get a better picture of whether someone's still in the game, hit their profile, click the GEOCACHES tab, then "All Geocache Finds". You'll see all their FIND logs, most-recent first.  If the first log you see is two years ago, then there you are.

  

 Unless, of course, they really suck at this, and that's just the last FIND. There could have been tons of DNF's since then, and they don't show.

I've met a few people who are active geocachers, but never log their finds online. And some people are months (and even years) behind in posting their logs.

 

And I've met a few people who don't really go geocaching any more, but they do maintain their existing caches, and they do keep up on the state of their caches by reading the email notifications when logs are posted, and they attend events and otherwise stay involved with the local community.

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1 hour ago, niraD said:

I've met a few people who are active geocachers, but never log their finds online. And some people are months (and even years) behind in posting their logs.

 

And I've met a few people who don't really go geocaching any more, but they do maintain their existing caches, and they do keep up on the state of their caches by reading the email notifications when logs are posted, and they attend events and otherwise stay involved with the local community.

 

All good points. Goes to show that you can't make assumptions about someone else's status.

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1 hour ago, niraD said:

I've met a few people who are active geocachers, but never log their finds online. And some people are months (and even years) behind in posting their logs.

And I've met a few people who don't really go geocaching any more, but they do maintain their existing caches, and they do keep up on the state of their caches by reading the email notifications when logs are posted, and they attend events and otherwise stay involved with the local community.

 

We have a couple here who haven't cached in years, but their trackables are still in play, with  newer ones even released time-to-time.

Some of our favorite cachers haven't logged online since they started (most well-before us).  They somehow keep track what caches they've visited .

 - They're the reason we kept all our ammo can log books.  They write wordy logs, with poems, drawings, and one even had pressed flowers that they attach to their pages.   :)    One I cache with every once in a while (few want to walk these days)  prefers that they're not mentioned in the cache page. 

I'm okay with that.      "TFTC" online doesn't seem to compare...

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