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northwildwoodnjman

Can’t see puzzle on app unless you pay for premium but free to see on website

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I’m sure this was discussed before so I just going to vent and give my two cents on this matter. I think it’s crazy that you have to pay premium on the app to see puzzle or more advanced caches even though you can see puzzles and more advanced caches for free on the website.:mad: If people want to make their caches premium that fine I can live with that, but why make people pay to see these more advanced caches on the app. What is should be is if you can see it on the website for free then it should be free to view on the app. Not free on the website not free on the app. That’s my to cents. Thanks for letting me vent 

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The app is developed separately from the website - since the content is 100% free, the decision by the app team to restrict visibility of such content is a strategic one since they now provide one single app entirely for free (a change from the confusingly free and paid apps which didn't reflect membership status), which they know could cost them users in order to translate into premium memberships.

 

If you don't want PM, there are other quality geocaching apps you can use that aren't restricted from seeing otherwise free content. Generally accepted as the best iOS app would be Cachly.  Recommend you check it out!

(it's unlikely you're going to convince HQ to provide their official app for free and still display all free content within it ;) )

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3 hours ago, northwildwoodnjman said:

I’m sure this was discussed before so I just going to vent and give my two cents on this matter. I think it’s crazy that you have to pay premium on the app to see puzzle or more advanced caches even though you can see puzzles and more advanced caches for free on the website.:mad: If people want to make their caches premium that fine I can live with that, but why make people pay to see these more advanced caches on the app. What is should be is if you can see it on the website for free then it should be free to view on the app. Not free on the website not free on the app. That’s my to cents. Thanks for letting me vent 

 

Many of us don't use The App at all, and the "Free" website is fine for us...  AND a subscription website without any "App" would also do fine, where the funds could be used for site improvements instead.

 

As mentioned, the App is available for PM, for people who want it, and are willing to pay for the premium App.  The App performs like a demo and an ad for "Geocaching", just so you can see that it works on your phone before shelling out the big bucks to support it. While you don't even need a real email address to try the Basic Member functions of the App, you must officially "sign up" to see all free caches on the web site.  I appreciate that plan, which helps keep Geocaches viable.

 

You can instead save coordinates into any App including the "free" App, any coordinates you wish, and go find caches. It's slightly inconvenient to load caches manually from the site for free, and if it was convenient, there would be a lot fewer Premium Members.

 

You may use a different "free" App, or Cachly or one of the other one-time-pay Apps.  But if any App has no continuous support $ from at least some generous source, that App goes away.  Many cool one-pay Apps are now gone, a bunch that I bought.  It pretty much requires a subscription from whoever desires an App these days.

 

If you want something, pay for it.  Or more to the point, don't require me to buy it for you.  B)

 

Edited by kunarion
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13 hours ago, thebruce0 said:

The app is developed separately from the website - since the content is 100% free, the decision by the app team to restrict visibility of such content is a strategic one since they now provide one single app entirely for free (a change from the confusingly free and paid apps which didn't reflect membership status), which they know could cost them users in order to translate into premium memberships.

 

If you don't want PM, there are other quality geocaching apps you can use that aren't restricted from seeing otherwise free content. Generally accepted as the best iOS app would be Cachly.  Recommend you check it out!

(it's unlikely you're going to convince HQ to provide their official app for free and still display all free content within it ;) )

Cachly and all other authorized API partner apps have the same visibility restrictions on premium caches for basic membership as the official app. Same with the limit on the type and number of caches that can be downloaded per day.

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4 minutes ago, SpiritGuide said:

Cachly and all other authorized API partner apps have the same visibility restrictions on premium caches for basic membership as the official app. Same with the limit on the type and number of caches that can be downloaded per day.

 

Premium Caches (PMO) are the same in Apps and the web sites, shown to Premium Members Only.  But the Official App has slightly different restrictions with non-Premium caches.  For one thing, it restricts basic members to just "easy" caches, disallowing what are called "Advanced Caches", the ones that have higher Difficulty or Terrain, or even ones with some DNFs.  It's kind of confusing when comparing the maps on other Apps.  But the idea (I guess) is that The Official App presents caches that someone with no caching experience may find.  Just to get a feel for Geocaching without having to dive right in -- no need to "verify your account" merely to try it, as you must with any other App.

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What kunarion said.  Groundspeak has chosen to limit visibility of free caches even moreso than the API's restriction. The latter applies to all API-driver apps (which properly distincguishes between paid and free users). The former is a decision made specifically for the official app, which in effect filters out some otherwise freely visible caches which can be viewed on the website (as described in the OP).

 

The downside of this practice is that some people may think they need to pay for a Premium Membership to see those otherwise free (non-premium) caches at all, when that's not true; but it does mean using a different app if you want to see all the caches you should be able to see without having a Premium Membership.

 

There are 3 classes of caches available via API:

A] Non-Premium, "Easy" caches -- visibile in all apps

B] Non-Premium, "Advanced" caches -- visible in all apps, except hidden in Groundspeak app from non-paid members

C] Premium Member Only caches -- visible in all apps for paid Premium Members only

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On ‎2‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 8:17 AM, northwildwoodnjman said:

I’m sure this was discussed before so I just going to vent and give my two cents on this matter. I think it’s crazy that you have to pay premium on the app to see puzzle or more advanced caches even though you can see puzzles and more advanced caches for free on the website.:mad: If people want to make their caches premium that fine I can live with that, but why make people pay to see these more advanced caches on the app. What is should be is if you can see it on the website for free then it should be free to view on the app. Not free on the website not free on the app. That’s my to cents. Thanks for letting me vent 

 

The site has always vowed to keep the hobby free where they can.

You're using a free app...  

Unlike the website that's pretty-much stayed the same since the hobby was created, it takes a lotta effort by a buncha people to keep an app updated. 

Basic members use the free app to find caches.  If they like the hobby and want to see more, "advanced" caches, they do one of two things...

They get a premium membership, and now they're able to expand the hobby to multiple cache types, higher difficulty and terrain, and access premium member only caches. 

They buy a handheld GPSr, and access caches on the website with no restrictions (except pmo hides), like others have done since the site was created for free.  

 

The site can remain free to those who choose to play that way because people like me still pay for premium (yet we use little of it's services).

 

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There are more apps than just "the app".

 

Only "the app" has an extra, confusing restriction, because it's designed for beginners, and for upsell.  The other apps are designed for happy customers.  Try a few.

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On 2/15/2019 at 9:17 AM, Viajero Perdido said:

There are more apps than just "the app".

 

Only "the app" has an extra, confusing restriction, because it's designed for beginners, and for upsell.  The other apps are designed for happy customers.  Try a few.

 

"Other apps" also have restrictions on Basic Members. It's part of the API agreement for authorized partners.

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On 2/16/2019 at 8:48 PM, noncentric said:

"Other apps" also have restrictions on Basic Members. It's part of the API agreement for authorized partners.

 

Isn't that just request quantity throttling? PMs can do more with the API per day. But I don't recall there being filter restrictions (like hiding 'basic' caches) apart from hiding PMO caches from basic members...  are there?

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21 minutes ago, thebruce0 said:

 

Isn't that just request quantity throttling? PMs can do more with the API per day. But I don't recall there being filter restrictions (like hiding 'basic' caches) apart from hiding PMO caches from basic members...  are there?

 

Basic members can only view 3 caches per day. Here's what Cachly notes as restrictions for a Basic member which, as far as I know, are restrictions for any authorized API partner.


You hopefully noticed when acquiring Cachly that some of the features it can offer are limited by geocaching.com. Basic geocaching.com members pay nothing to use the geocaching.com services but have certain limits on what they can do. The main limitations on Basic Members are:

A limit of 3 caches per day
Cache types viewable are just traditional and events
Caches designated premium only are not available
Sort is only by distance
Cannot award favorite points
No offline caching features
Note: Difficulty/Terrain used to be limited to 1.5/1.5 but is no longer limited

Edited by Team DEMP
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Okay, good to know. I thought it was only the DT that was of issue, limited for basic members in the official app, but I vaguely recall now the cache types being also limited in other API partners. All the API request quantity limitations would apply to each app, also basic member functionality like fav points; but the official app also restricts results by DT, which isn't an API limitation.

I think that list clears up exactly what the OP was asking.

In the case of the Unknown cache type, using another app then wouldn't be the solution. Using the website would be the only way for a basic member then.  Well for me, before the app and long before the API, when Geosphere was the iOS app, I used the in-app browser (or Safari) all the time to download GPX files and PQs. It's a little more tedious, but for a basic member, using your app-of-choice with a web browser would be the tradeoff for not buying premium membership...

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