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SuperKrypto

map of archived caches

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i would find it handy when placing a new geocache to have a map that shows archived caches - that way i can read the logs and avoid areas that are often muggled or have other issues - does this sound reasonable?

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31 minutes ago, SuperKrypto said:

i would find it handy when placing a new geocache to have a map that shows archived caches - that way i can read the logs and avoid areas that are often muggled or have other issues - does this sound reasonable?

Yes, it sounds reasonable. And if new cache owners could see the history of a location like that, then they might be able to learn from the mistakes of the owners of previously muggled caches.

 

But it's unlikely to happen here, because one of the reasons caches are archived is that geocachers don't have permission to go to the cache location. Groundspeak doesn't want to encourage people to find archived caches, or to go to the locations of archived caches.

 

But IIRC, Project GC has a feature that allows you to see archived caches that have been located somewhere. I've never used that feature myself though.

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A way to solve this could a new feature. Show just the logs of archived caches within xxx meters of a proposed location. Maybe some other basic info, like cache type. No coordinates, no description, no link to the actual cache, etc.

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28 minutes ago, niraD said:

But IIRC, Project GC has a feature that allows you to see archived caches that have been located somewhere. I've never used that feature myself though.

 

It's an option on the Map Compare from the Tools menu.

 

The easiest way to get this to work (for the OP...):

  1. Get up the map compare and get your username in the Profile Name box
  2. Leave the country/region boxes blank
  3. From the Add Filter drop down choose Centre Radius and enter the coordinates of the area you want to place a cache in and use a suitable distance (5 km for example)
  4. Then use the Add Filter again and choose Show Disabled/Archived and tick both boxes
  5. Hit the blue Filter button

 

You can't take out the active caches (there may be a way to do this if you buy a Project GC membership), so you may have to zoom in if there are caches overlapping each other. I used this yesterday to check a suspiciously blank looking area near some caches I've just adopted.

Edited by Blue Square Thing

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I think a map would be an excellent idea, coordinates and all. However, I think GC should "lock" archived caches, meaning you cannot post a "Found It" log.

 

I have always wanted to see popular, favorited caches that were archived just for fun. Maybe I can get some hiding inspiration from the cache page or redo the cache itself. If such a map would come about, I think they should make it a premium feature and show archived caches as a different color.

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37 minutes ago, Blue Square Thing said:

It's an option on the Map Compare from the Tools menu.

 

The easiest way to get this to work (for the OP...):

......

i can't get this to work, maybe because i'm not in the USA at the moment?

 

those are good points about not encouraging people to go to places that aren't safe/allowed - and not allowing people to 'armchair' caches they haven't found

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1 hour ago, SuperKrypto said:

i would find it handy when placing a new geocache to have a map that shows archived caches - that way i can read the logs and avoid areas that are often muggled or have other issues - does this sound reasonable?

 

The wet blanket in me wonders if more issues would be created than the simple (maybe innocent) reason you portray. 

Many were archived due to permission/trespassing issues, and simply asking for permission would present that to you as well.  :)

Looking on a map and seeing a large area without any caches says something.  Ask to see why, or ask a local cacher close by.

 

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24 minutes ago, TwistedCube said:

I think a map would be an excellent idea, coordinates and all. However, I think GC should "lock" archived caches, meaning you cannot post a "Found It" log.

I have always wanted to see popular, favorited caches that were archived just for fun.

 

We know a lot of people who split from their family account, and after creating their own, back-dated caches they did (with mom and dad mostly).

Some of the long-archived caches were the best we've done (and still have our FPs to show it).

 - Why would you want to keep others from logging caches they've done simply because they split from an account ?

 

We've yet to hear of someone archiving a cache "just for fun".   Does that happen often near you ?

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18 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

 

We know a lot of people who split from their family account, and after creating their own, back-dated caches they did (with mom and dad mostly).

Some of the long-archived caches were the best we've done (and still have our FPs to show it).

 - Why would you want to keep others from logging caches they've done simply because they split from an account ?

 

We've yet to hear of someone archiving a cache "just for fun".   Does that happen often near you ?

I realized my sentence structure error now that I have read my original post. What I meant was that I wanted to read cache pages of archived caches for my own enjoyment. Not because they were "archived just for fun". 

 

50 minutes ago, TwistedCube said:

I have always wanted to see popular, favorited caches that were archived just for fun.

Revised sentence: "Just for fun, I have always wanted to see popular, favorited caches that were archived."

 

Edited by TwistedCube

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5 minutes ago, TwistedCube said:

Revised sentence: "Just for fun, I have always wanted to see popular, favorited caches that were archived."

 

 

This ambiguity reminds me of a local news headline somebody pointed out a couple days ago...

 

87DB4A1E-629C-441F-9113-8E8E5D202C74.jpeg

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29 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

 

We know a lot of people who split from their family account, and after creating their own, back-dated caches they did (with mom and dad mostly).

Some of the long-archived caches were the best we've done (and still have our FPs to show it).

 - Why would you want to keep others from logging caches they've done simply because they split from an account ?

What I meant there was that "locking" archived caches would deter armchair loggers and the like. It was relating to what niraD had mentioned earlier:

 

1 hour ago, niraD said:

Groundspeak doesn't want to encourage people to find archived caches, or to go to the locations of archived caches.

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

I do agree with you though Cerberus, Logging archived caches is a useful tool I have used several times after I split off and created my solo account back in 2016. 

Edited by TwistedCube

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40 minutes ago, SuperKrypto said:

i can't get this to work, maybe because i'm not in the USA at the moment?

 

Hmm - no idea why, it worked fine for me!

 

Ah, did you tick at least one of the found it/not found boxes? That might be why?

 

I'm assuming you've linked your account to Project GC? How far is it getting before it fails? It might be worth copying the coords from a listing and pasting them in and try it that way? I just got it to work for the area within 2km of your old Watchdogs cache - and I'm very much not in the US!

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10 hours ago, SuperKrypto said:

i can't get this to work, maybe because i'm not in the USA at the moment?

Make sure to select "None found" and "One found".

 

For example:

image.png.b782d01b975fd838648eb61671e2aecc.png

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19 hours ago, cerberus1 said:

The wet blanket in me wonders if more issues would be created than the simple (maybe innocent) reason you portray. 

no nefarious reasons! - the city i'm currently in is very densely packed so there aren't a lot of free areas - muggles and homeless camps are an issue - i'm looking for a spot to hang an ammo can and i don't want to have it muggled right away or put it in an unsafe area - it'd be handy to see beforehand if the spot i pick has got a difficult history and why

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19 hours ago, Blue Square Thing said:

Ah, did you tick at least one of the found it/not found boxes? That might be why?

that's what i wasn't doing - now it works great! thanks!

 

thanks also noncentric for the visual

Edited by SuperKrypto
another thank you
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thanks HHL/Hans! - that gives even more archived caches

 

i should be able to chose a decent spot and avoid the troubled ones

 

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21 hours ago, Wet Pancake Touring Club said:

A way to solve this could a new feature. Show just the logs of archived caches within xxx meters of a proposed location. Maybe some other basic info, like cache type. No coordinates, no description, no link to the actual cache, etc.

 

Speaking of a potential new feature,  what if reviewers could mark places on the map which would integrate with the cache submission process and block a cache submission which was in an areas where a cache shouldn't be placed due to previous archived cache.  

 

 

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1 hour ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 

Speaking of a potential new feature,  what if reviewers could mark places on the map which would integrate with the cache submission process and block a cache submission which was in an areas where a cache shouldn't be placed due to previous archived cache.  

 

 

That implies more work for the reviewer to define these areas. How about...

  • A feature that will list the number of previous caches within xxx meters as part of the new cache submission process?
  • Or, have a batch process that would automatically mark an area if there are a number of archived caches in the area.

 

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15 minutes ago, Wet Pancake Touring Club said:
2 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

Speaking of a potential new feature,  what if reviewers could mark places on the map which would integrate with the cache submission process and block a cache submission which was in an areas where a cache shouldn't be placed due to previous archived cache.  

 

That implies more work for the reviewer to define these areas. How about...

  • A feature that will list the number of previous caches within xxx meters as part of the new cache submission process?
  • Or, have a batch process that would automatically mark an area if there are a number of archived caches in the area.

 

Wouldn't that all depend on WHY the archived cache was archived?

  • If someone archived their caches because they were moving, geocided, had their puzzle spoiled, or some other reason that has nothing to do with the location - then that shouldn't prevent another cache from being placed there.
  • If someone archived their cache years ago, but the area has change - then that shouldn't prevent another cache from being placed there.

 

Personally, I don't think it's worthwhile for GS to spend dev time creating such a tool - unless it's something that Reviewers specifically ask for.

 

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4 hours ago, HHL said:

Would this site show archived caches that are not shown on the PGC MapCompare?

Or does it show the same archived caches, just with the Active caches excluded?

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1 hour ago, HHL said:

The latter. 😉

Aren't the buttons "All | Archived | Active" distinct enough? 🙄

Yes, the buttons are distinct.

But I wondered if maybe I was missing something because SuperKrypto said " thanks HHL/Hans! - that gives even more archived caches ".  And since the site kept freezing up on me when I tried to run the search, then I wasn't able to see the benefit over using PGC.

 

I'm surprised you edited your reply to add the snarky second line.

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13 hours ago, noncentric said:

Wouldn't that all depend on WHY the archived cache was archived?

  • If someone archived their caches because they were moving, geocided, had their puzzle spoiled, or some other reason that has nothing to do with the location - then that shouldn't prevent another cache from being placed there.
  • If someone archived their cache years ago, but the area has change - then that shouldn't prevent another cache from being placed there.

 

 

To date I've archived four of my hides:

  • The first, called One Windy Night, was in a reserve that was severely hit a few years earlier by strong winds that felled many trees in the area, with some of the logs from those trees still at GZ. Eighteen months later, in another storm, another tree fell right on top of its hiding place.
  • The second was a fake rock hidden in plain sight amongst other rocks in a crevice on a headland at the end of the beach, but was washed away along with the real rocks in huge seas whipped up by another severe storm.
  • The third was in a sea cave but a year after I'd hidden it, part of the roof collapsed, burying the cache under several tonnes of rock.
  • The fourth was in a local park but suffered repeated muggling, usually during the school holidays. I archived it but created a new one with a similar theme in a more isolated location about a kilometre away.

So I don't know, would someone else want to hide caches in those locations? There'd be no reason for a reviewer to stop them, but given their history it mightn't be a such a good idea either.

Edited by barefootjeff

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On 2/2/2019 at 1:56 AM, barefootjeff said:

So I don't know, would someone else want to hide caches in those locations? There'd be no reason for a reviewer to stop them, but given their history it mightn't be a such a good idea either.

 

Agreed. My response that you quoted was to counter the idea that locations of previously archived caches should be 'blocked' for future placements. Specifically, the idea for a feature to "block a cache submission which was in an areas where a cache shouldn't be placed due to previous archived cache".  If those blocks are because areas are not suitable, then fine, but that would have to be based on WHY a cache was archived.  Not based on the mere fact that a cache had been archived there, because not all archivals are related to bad locations.

 

Another thing I didn't mention in my earlier post is that some locations may have been 'bad' just because of the type of hide or container that was placed there, whereas a different type of container would do just fine in that same location.  A little free library with a container attached to the supporting post, versus one with the container attached to the inside roof, for example.  It's very subjective, so I'd be averse to any feature that applied objective rules to say that a previously-used location should not be used again - unless, of course, the area is prohibited to placements because of landowner/manager-type issues.

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I've archived 170 of my own non-event caches. None of them because it was a "bad location", at least not in the sense that another cache couldn't or shouldn't go there.  I just didn't want to continue to own a cache there.  My rough estimate of total archived caches in Florida is about 75,000.  Of that, some tiny number represent trespass or violations of land owner or manager policy.   Most were archived by owner for lack of interest in continuing to maintain, or by reviewer for lack of owner interest in continuing to maintain.

 

Anyway, project gc will give you this info.  Seems like a lot of opening cache pages, for maybe gleaning some useful info. Knowing land manager local policy, which is generally going to be in the Regional Policy wiki,  and on private property either asking the owner, or at least not placing something such that owner, if they knew about it, would want it gone (cache in landscaping, climbing cache, cache in utilities, cache under security camera etc) seems easier to me. 

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8 hours ago, Isonzo Karst said:

Knowing land manager local policy, which is generally going to be in the Regional Policy wiki,  and on private property either asking the owner, or at least not placing something such that owner, if they knew about it, would want it gone (cache in landscaping, climbing cache, cache in utilities, cache under security camera etc) seems easier to me. 

I can understand why the OP is asking for this kind of feature. Private property issues aren't the only reason why it might not be a good idea to hide another cache in an area. I'm sure many of us know of that local park where someone hides a cache, it lasts a short time before going missing and getting archived, someone else sees this awesome park devoid of a cache and hides a new one, lather, rinse, repeat. I can think of a few spots in my area that have had 5 or more caches since I started caching. This is the kind of spot it would be nice to know about so people don't keep making the same mistake.

 

That being said, I also agree that it isn't worth the development effort to build this, considering both the long list of more important things that need to be developed first, as well the side-issues that could arise from making archived caches too easy to identify.

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2 hours ago, The A-Team said:

I'm sure many of us know of that local park where someone hides a cache, it lasts a short time before going missing and getting archived, someone else sees this awesome park devoid of a cache and hides a new one, lather, rinse, repeat. I can think of a few spots in my area that have had 5 or more caches since I started caching. This is the kind of spot it would be nice to know about so people don't keep making the same mistake.

The ones I can think of eventually ended up with a micro (or a puzzle micro), and that's what has survived. It turned out that the location wasn't the problem per se. Rather, it was a series of cache containers that were inappropriate to (too large for) the location.

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