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noncentric

[FEATURE]: Use language of cache for canned NM/NA logs

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I've noticed that if a cacher uses the canned NM/NA logs from the Report a Problem link, then the log text is entered in the language of the logging cacher - even if the cache in another country that doesn't use that language as it's official language.  Often, the logging cacher writes their DNF or Found It logs in the language of the cache, even though it may not be their native language - but when they use the Report a Problem log, then the language seems to default to their native language.

 

For example, a German cacher logs a "This cacher reported that this cache might be missing" NM log on a cache in the US - and then that NM log is on the cache page in German.  This would then require the CO of the US-based cache to translate the NM log to understand what the log is saying.  Is it saying the log is full or the cache might be missing, or something else?

 

I'm not sure that there's an easy way to resolve this.  It seems like each cache would have to be linked to a 'default' language, to ensure that canned NM/NA logs use that default language. Perhaps a solution would be to allow custom text entry when someone selects "Report a Problem" - so that cachers have the option to enter whatever text they want for the NM/NA logs. Then, the German cacher in my example can enter the issue with the US-cache in English, just like how they entered their DNF/Found It log in English.

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For normal logs, I'd rather the people posting the logs use whatever languages they're comfortable with. But for canned messages like this, I think it makes sense to include the cache owner's primary language.

 

Or maybe the canned log messages could be automatically translated into the reader's primary language. The site has localized versions of these phrases already, so it should be able to display the most appropriate version for the reader.

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Is this on the app? When I write a NM or NA I write the words, but I do this on my computer. Or is this the new version, as I still MUCH prefer the old version and have continued using it. So I don't see any automatic words; it's only what I write. (And that is in English, or one trip, VERY simple French.)

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12 minutes ago, Goldenwattle said:

Is this on the app? When I write a NM or NA I write the words, but I do this on my computer. Or is this the new version, as I still MUCH prefer the old version and have continued using it. So I don't see any automatic words; it's only what I write. (And that is in English, or one trip, VERY simple French.)

I'm referring the automatic text that is entered into NM/NA logs when someone selects "Report a Problem" when submitting their logs via the website.  The canned messages are not used when selecting NM/NA logs within the app.

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13 minutes ago, Goldenwattle said:

Is this on the app? When I write a NM or NA I write the words, but I do this on my computer. Or is this the new version, as I still MUCH prefer the old version and have continued using it. So I don't see any automatic words; it's only what I write. (And that is in English, or one trip, VERY simple French.)

And yes, I still prefer to use the "old" logging page myself, or the official app, when submitting NM/NA logs. Precisely because I can enter details about the issue, rather than using a canned log.

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5 hours ago, noncentric said:

Perhaps a solution would be to allow custom text entry when someone selects "Report a Problem" - so that cachers have the option to enter whatever text they want for the NM/NA logs. Then, the German cacher in my example can enter the issue with the US-cache in English, just like how they entered their DNF/Found It log in English.

 

I would like that. Simple, most logical. COs and others with set-up notifications for NM/NA log types would stop getting "useful" messages like "The geocacher reported that there is a problem with the cache".

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Wouldn't the simplest solution be to stop creating "canned" messages ?

We see most times they don't seem to fit what you wanted to say anyway...

 

I'd bet many remember Intro app's "That's one more find for me " Found it log. 

 - Didn't mention anything about your cache, and slightly better than TFTC...

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On 12/3/2018 at 7:16 AM, cerberus1 said:

Wouldn't the simplest solution be to stop creating "canned" messages ?

We see most times they don't seem to fit what you wanted to say anyway...

Not having canned messages would be my preference, for reasons that were discussed when the new process was first released.  I use the 'old' logging page or the official app to log NM/NA for the very reason that those methods allow me to enter my own text.

 

On 12/2/2018 at 6:07 PM, niraD said:

For normal logs, I'd rather the people posting the logs use whatever languages they're comfortable with. But for canned messages like this, I think it makes sense to include the cache owner's primary language.

The examples that I've seen (caches in the USA) - the cachers wrote their DNF/Found logs in English, but then their 'canned' NM/NA logs were in another language.  I would presume that if those cachers chose to write their DNF/Found logs in English, then they would've used English when writing their NM/NA logs - but of course, that option is not available to them if they choose to use a 'canned' NM/NA message.

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Recent example:  A cache in WA state.  A German cacher that wrote their Found It log in English, then used the "Report a Problem" option to report an NM - which produces a canned message in German.  Yes, the CO could just read the corresponding Found It log for that cacher to see the details, but the point being that the CO gains nothing from the canned message, other than it setting the NM attribute.  If logging NM/NA produced a text box to enter freeform text, then I'm pretty confident this cacher's NM log would've been written in English and therefore been more helpful to the CO.

 

image.png.4966a6d7633f7069088dee425d5f5aa6.png

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On 12/3/2018 at 2:54 AM, noncentric said:

Perhaps a solution would be to allow custom text entry when someone selects "Report a Problem" - so that cachers have the option to enter whatever text they want for the NM/NA logs. 

 

This ^^^ was my first and then many times repeated feedback since the canned logs were implemented in 2017.

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13 hours ago, noncentric said:

If logging NM/NA produced a text box to enter freeform text, then I'm pretty confident this cacher's NM log would've been written in English and therefore been more helpful to the CO.

Are you forgetting that this was the original design? Before the new logging form replaced it with the NM check box, I could just pick the NM log type and fill in the log message like any other log. If you want the NM to have free form text, let's just go back to that approach. But don't hold your breath because, as far as I can tell, GS changed it to a check box because they think it's too hard to fill in a text box with an actual description of the maintenance need.

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2 hours ago, dprovan said:

But don't hold your breath because, as far as I can tell, GS changed it to a check box because they think it's too hard to fill in a text box with an actual description of the maintenance need.

 

Yet, on the official app, it is still free text ... and completely removed from the Find / DNF logging function (which is another issue).

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11 hours ago, dprovan said:

Are you forgetting that this was the original design? Before the new logging form replaced it with the NM check box, I could just pick the NM log type and fill in the log message like any other log. If you want the NM to have free form text, let's just go back to that approach. But don't hold your breath because, as far as I can tell, GS changed it to a check box because they think it's too hard to fill in a text box with an actual description of the maintenance need.

Uhm, no - I did not "forget".  The ability to use freeform text is why I still use either the 'old' logging page or the official app to submit NM/NA logs.

I mentioned my desire to have a freeform text box last year.  And when I presented my ideas in that thread,  you "laughed" at them.

 

I'm mentioning the idea of freeform text again here, because their use of them presents an 'issue' (localization) that may not have been apparent at the time it was rolled out 1.5 years ago.  I don't recall anybody mentioning the language issue in that Release Notes thread, because it hadn't yet been used enough for us to notice it.

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3 hours ago, noncentric said:

I'm mentioning the idea of freeform text again here, because their use of them presents an 'issue' (localization) that may not have been apparent at the time it was rolled out 1.5 years ago.  I don't recall anybody mentioning the language issue in that Release Notes thread, because it hadn't yet been used enough for us to notice it.

OK. However you want to spin it. But my opinion, there are only two options: either you accept the logic behind the canned NM messages and you want the canned messages to continue, or you reject the logic and you want to go back to only the non-canned NM logs for everyone.

 

Because if you accept the log that led to the canned messages, you need to accept the idea that the canned messages will be in "an appropriate" language. The way I see it, the only argument for the canned messages is that the canned message can be in the language the CO can understand even when the person filing the NM wouldn't log in that language.

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5 minutes ago, dprovan said:

OK. However you want to spin it. But my opinion, there are only two options: either you accept the logic behind the canned NM messages and you want the canned messages to continue, or you reject the logic and you want to go back to only the non-canned NM logs for everyone.

 

As I said last year:

image.png.8ffad940790893432c34ae482b560594.png

 

 

 

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52 minutes ago, Goldenwattle said:

Google translate is available.

 

Right! There is no excuse not to make canned messages translated automatically to the correct language the CO understands. The message could be a picture / icon which is understandable by all users. When you report a problem you have to select an appropriate picture / icon for your NM post.

Edited by arisoft

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57 minutes ago, arisoft said:

The message could be a picture / icon which is understandable by all users.

 

The container is damaged....

 

marine-surveyor-valencia-container-damag

 

Full log...

 

FullLog.jpg.b49887af36fe88a2fb5d48706d1b9da2.jpg

 

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