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Stakmaster

Does anyone know what the ACTUAL oldest original geocache is?

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Having just found The Spot as my 100th geocache, I became curious to see what the absolute oldest, original geocache is that has never been replaced or moved. 

However, it is difficult as many, many of the top spots don't seem to be actually placed on their place date, but are to commemorate a date in time. This is not to mention that most of the top spots are in different languages, and combined with the aforementioned commemoration geocaches, it is actually pretty confusing to decipher what is the official oldest original geocache. Does anyone know?

 

I doubt it's in the United States, and that I will ever have the opportunity to find and log it, but I am still curious. 

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I'd put my money on somewhere in the Northwest U.S. if I had to guess on the oldest original container/logbook.  Probably something remote with very few visits.

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Oldest signature I've ever seen was in GC3508 "A Cedar River Picnic". That one was from January 2002. I've seen a few others from 2002, 2003 and 2004. I don't know that there's a great way of figuring out what the oldest actual container is at this point.

 

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1 hour ago, Touchstone said:

I'd put my money on somewhere in the Northwest U.S. if I had to guess on the oldest original container/logbook.  Probably something remote with very few visits.

Yeah, I seem to recall that one of the earliest Northwest US caches still has its original container (ammo can?) and logbook. I'm sure someone will be along shortly to let us know.

 

Mingo is definitely right out. That thing has been replaced dozens of times, hasn't it?

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18 minutes ago, TheLimeCat said:

Oldest signature I've ever seen was in GC3508 "A Cedar River Picnic". That one was from January 2002. I've seen a few others from 2002, 2003 and 2004. I don't know that there's a great way of figuring out what the oldest actual container is at this point.

 

 

Well The Spot is from 2000. It even has a composition notebook dated 2000 inside, but I'm sure that can't be the oldest.

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2 minutes ago, Stakmaster said:

 

Well The Spot is from 2000. It even has a composition notebook dated 2000 inside, but I'm sure that can't be the oldest.

I'm not sure wether you're aware or not, but Geocaching started in May 2000.. So if the logbook is the original one, chances are good that it is one of the oldest ones, if not the oldest

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4 hours ago, Stakmaster said:

 

Well The Spot is from 2000. It even has a composition notebook dated 2000 inside, but I'm sure that can't be the oldest.

 

I (and others) thought you were asking about the oldest cache that is still in its original state.

 

Because "the spot" is THE original geocache. Like, the very first one that started this game.

 

You could read up on it on wikipedia or similar.

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1 hour ago, Korichnovui said:

 

I (and others) thought you were asking about the oldest cache that is still in its original state.

 

Because "the spot" is THE original geocache. Like, the very first one that started this game.

 

You could read up on it on wikipedia or similar.

Oh wow, I had no idea. I knew it was very old but it's only maybe number 30 or 40 from the top when you sort by oldest geocaches. 

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Not True.

The Spot is not the first nor the oldest active geocache.

 

Dave Ulmer placed the first one in Oregon (there's a plaque there now).

 

Mingo in Kansas is the oldest active gwocache.

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19 minutes ago, K13 said:

Mingo in Kansas is the oldest active gwocache.

 

That's what I thought as well.  Went by this  bookmark for years, so I hope it's correct (in regards to active, and not original container/log).    :)

Edited by cerberus1
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1 hour ago, K13 said:

Not True.

The Spot is not the first nor the oldest active geocache.

 

Dave Ulmer placed the first one in Oregon (there's a plaque there now).

 

Mingo in Kansas is the oldest active gwocache.

 

1 hour ago, cerberus1 said:

 

That's what I thought as well.  Went by this  bookmark for years, so I hope it's correct (in regards to active, and not original container/log).    :)

I believe the OP was talking about oldest caches that are still in their original state. Those with the same container/logbook as they had when they were placed. Mingo has been replaced and Dave Ulmer's first cache certainly isn't available to be found.

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Correct, The Spot is the 4th oldest current active geocache in the world, and if the next oldest 3 have had their container replaced, then The Spot is actually the oldest original geocache [container] still in play.  The others are older listings, but not container or logbook.

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10 hours ago, Korichnovui said:

 

I (and others) thought you were asking about the oldest cache that is still in its original state.

 

Because "the spot" is THE original geocache. Like, the very first one that started this game.

 

You could read up on it on wikipedia or similar.

 

Actually, "The Spot" was originally a plastic 5 gallon bucket.  The CO replaced it after a year or so (after it was discovered that it leaked) with the 50cal ammo can that is there today.  Here's the log by the CO which mentions replacing it:  https://www.geocaching.com/seek/log.aspx?LUID=c93272d0-249e-408b-b0a9-d18b9829903e

 

However, when he replaced the container he transferred all of the contents (including the log book) into the new container.  If I recall, GC12 or GC16 may have it's original container.  

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Thanks for the link on the cache container replacement for The Spot. I've read in these forums that it's the oldest and all original, but clearly not.

 

That said, if any of those very old guys still hold the year 2000 original log , that's pretty neat.  It could be nigh impossible to know whether the original container is still there. Owner may may not have made note of container change  back in the day. 

 

I think Beverly had the original log when I found it ( not the original container)  A wet mess on our find, I suspect the old log couldn't be saved, though I don't know that for sure.

Edited by Isonzo Karst

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8 hours ago, TheLimeCat said:

 

I believe the OP was talking about oldest caches that are still in their original state. Those with the same container/logbook as they had when they were placed. Mingo has been replaced and Dave Ulmer's first cache certainly isn't available to be found.

 

Of course. 

 - But that wasn't what I responded to (if you read that far).   It wasn't in response to the OP either.  Thanks, but no correction needed.    :)

 - It was in response to a new person giving another new person an UNhelpful statement. 

Edited by cerberus1
clarification

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In terms of original containers, the oldest one I've ever found was actually GC10AE, but I think that requires a couple of asterisks.  The container and log book was from 1999, because it was originally placed as a letterbox, and then it was published as a "Geocache" in 2001, but the same container was used.  So when I found it in 2014, it had logs going back to 1999.  Unfortunately though it looks like the original container very recently disappeared.  I also realize that since it wasn't published as a Geocache until 2001 it probably doesn't count for purposes of "oldest geocache", but I thought it was still pretty cool.

Edited by ZeppelinDT

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5 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

Actually, "The Spot" was originally a plastic 5 gallon bucket.  The CO replaced it after a year or so (after it was discovered that it leaked) with the 50cal ammo can that is there today.  Here's the log by the CO which mentions replacing it:  https://www.geocaching.com/seek/log.aspx?LUID=c93272d0-249e-408b-b0a9-d18b9829903e

 

However, when he replaced the container he transferred all of the contents (including the log book) into the new container.  If I recall, GC12 or GC16 may have it's original container.  

 

huh, there was an itch in the back of my mind -'what if the container was replaced but log books kept?' Thanks for finding the log. I just assumed the prior comment was right about it being the oldest container. So if The Spot is the 4th oldest active listing, and its container was replaced April 2002, then the oldest container and/or contents rests with GC12's or GC16's latest replacement. GC12 has 3 maintenance logs (haven't looked them up) and GC16 has none - but both could have old notes describing a replacement. This could be a good trivia point :)

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2 hours ago, thebruce0 said:
7 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

Actually, "The Spot" was originally a plastic 5 gallon bucket.  The CO replaced it after a year or so (after it was discovered that it leaked) with the 50cal ammo can that is there today.  Here's the log by the CO which mentions replacing it:  https://www.geocaching.com/seek/log.aspx?LUID=c93272d0-249e-408b-b0a9-d18b9829903e

 

However, when he replaced the container he transferred all of the contents (including the log book) into the new container.  If I recall, GC12 or GC16 may have it's original container.  

 

huh, there was an itch in the back of my mind -'what if the container was replaced but log books kept?' Thanks for finding the log. I just assumed the prior comment was right about it being the oldest container. So if The Spot is the 4th oldest active listing, and its container was replaced April 2002, then the oldest container and/or contents rests with GC12's or GC16's latest replacement. GC12 has 3 maintenance logs (haven't looked them up) and GC16 has none - but both could have old notes describing a replacement. This could be a good trivia point :)

 

That first maintenance log on the Spot was posted as a note.  I have no idea when an "Owner Maintenance" log became a log type.   You might have to look at early Note logs on GC12 and GC16 to see if a note which mentioned maintenance was posted.  

 

For a cache in it's original state, how about Rift Valley (hidden 6/15/2000).   As it's a virtual cache, and thus the container/logbook  are not issues).  There *is* a virtual cache which pre-dates Rift Valley (Lane Cove, placed 5/18/2000) but it was originally a traditional cache and changed to a virtual in 2001 after physical access to the area required a fee.  

 

Another possibility for oldest cache in it's original state might be Arikee (same owner as Mingo).  It also has no OM logs, and a recent photo shows a 50cal ammo can and a baggie full of log sheets.

 

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Nope, not Arikaree.  There is a 9/9/10 photo showing the original owner's log that is likely still in the cache but on 4/9/05 RattlingCrew logged that they replaced the original container with an ammo can.

Edited by icezebra11

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GC537 Old Roy Bean's Stash at the Pecos River (placed 3/19/2001) still has the original container and the original log. I found it in February '18. (I'm sure there may be others that fit the limited list of original container with original log, but this one certainly fits the bill.)

 

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51 minutes ago, tomfuller & Quill said:

The oldest active cache in the world is Mingo (GC30) It is in Western Kansas off I-70 not far from Colby.

Yeah, but the OP asked about the "oldest, original geocache is that has never been replaced or moved", not the oldest listing.

 

On 5/17/2018 at 1:02 PM, The A-Team said:

Mingo is definitely right out. That thing has been replaced dozens of times, hasn't it?

 

22 hours ago, TheLimeCat said:

Mingo has been replaced and Dave Ulmer's first cache certainly isn't available to be found.

 

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 GC12, original 5 gallon bucket still there, new interior container, no old logbook mentioned or imaged. 

GC16  gallery shows container changes over time.  

GC17, oldest cache image is tupperware, current is ammo can, and that can looks to have been changed out (larger size can now than oldest image of ammocan). 

GC18 multiple container and some location changes

GC19 started life as a buried bucket. I don't know if it's still buried, but now it's ammo can.

GC1B - hard to say if the ammo can there is original. Don't know if the original log it in it. Seems to have started life inside a business, been moved outside fairly soon thereafter, then moved (when the business/gorilla moved presumably - old TB drop logs show different coords from current).  

 

kept opening pages and checking descriptions and galleries from the GeocachingHQ list of 100 oldest 

  A lot of plastic containers change out for ammo cans, or other better or bigger containers.

 

GC5B clearly the original ammo can     NOT  edited after finding archive https://coord.info/GL15BXK  and unarchive logs on this -  current version dates from 2006.

 

GC5C Southern Idaho's First   the original log may be there ?  per very recent gallery image but   the original can was a fat 50 https://coord.info/GLZR7F and the current seems to be a 30... found a "replaced cache" log from 2008. 

 

Edited by Isonzo Karst
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Mike's First (GC4)  hidden 5/7/2000 is the oldest active listing. It has only two logs: 1 find and 1 DNF, but there's no solid indication that it has been replaced or gone missing. It's almost certainly gone, but so far as anyone can tell from the cache page, it's still out there and in its original state.

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14 minutes ago, The Rat said:

Mike's First (GC4)  hidden 5/7/2000 is the oldest active listing. It has only two logs: 1 find and 1 DNF, but there's no solid indication that it has been replaced or gone missing. It's almost certainly gone, but so far as anyone can tell from the cache page, it's still out there and in its original state.

 

I would not call that cache "active" in the usual sense of the word. The page is locked. If you type it into the search page it will come up but if you click on "nearest caches" on a nearby cache ( GC5Y0BT for example) it does not appear. "Memorialized" seems a better description.

Oh, and the guy that logged it...I don't know if we can trust him:D

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Dang, I keep opening caches on the First 100, and not finding any that haven't been replaced. 

 

Oldest Australian  https://coord.info/GC7A  does have the original log, but started as a plastic bucket and is now an ammo can. 

Oldest Canadian, https://coord.info/GCBBA  likewise started as plastic bucket, now an ammo can.

 

I've gone through all active caches on that list, and none are original

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3 hours ago, Isonzo Karst said:

Oldest Australian  https://coord.info/GC7A  does have the original log, but started as a plastic bucket and is now an ammo can. 

 

Not quite. Austalia's oldest is GC3E, placed on the 18th of May 2000 and originally a traditional in Lane Cove National Park but converted to a virtual when the ranger removed it. There was a Geocaching NSW event held there in 2015 marking the 15th anniversary, where one of the guests was that ranger who still has the original container.

Edited by barefootjeff

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Thanks Jeff, you're right, I should have written Melbourne's first,  not OZ oldest - in any case, I may keep hammering away at this from time to time. Using a PQ for all US states, and working forward though the rest of Oct, Nov, Dec 2000.   ....Or not ;-)

 

I don't personally care  about original container, I'm more impressed with original owner, still actively monitoring cache. It is nice to find original logs. I do wish people would post photos of the first pages (mostly you see photos of their sig on the last page...)

 

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Well that was quick. As I expected, in the dry southwest USA - original metal tin container,  and as Touchstone mentioned, remote, few visits.

A new log has been added, per 2013 log, but the original log seems to still be in the cache.

 

Labyrinth Canyon GC7E 08 October 2000   https://coord.info/GC7E

 

Edited by Isonzo Karst

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On 5/20/2018 at 7:54 AM, Isonzo Karst said:

Thanks Jeff, you're right, I should have written Melbourne's first,  not OZ oldest - in any case, I may keep hammering away at this from time to time. Using a PQ for all US states, and working forward though the rest of Oct, Nov, Dec 2000.   ....Or not ;-)

 

I don't personally care  about original container, I'm more impressed with original owner, still actively monitoring cache. It is nice to find original logs. I do wish people would post photos of the first pages (mostly you see photos of their sig on the last page...)

 

 

The gallery for "The Spot" has a lot of pictures of the first page of the logbook.   Although not the original container, the 50 cal ammo can that replaced it in April 2002 is still there today.  When there was speculation that the cache might be missing a year or so ago, the original (and current) CO posted several notes in the log.    There's a photo in the gallery which shows a log from April 2001, which seems to confirm that the original logbook was transferred from the original container to the container that is there today.  The first online found it log was in February 2001,  which indicated that they had signed the log book though the earliest log (with photo evidence) was two months later.  There was one other online log in February 2001 and none in March.  

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It was called GPS-stash in its inception.  The Geocaching name came along a few months later.  The first year or two were very different than it is now.

Edited by mcb

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2 hours ago, thebruce0 said:

Man, geocaching was a mess in the early days! :ph34r::ph34r::laughing:

Yeah, it's like no one was paying any attention to the guidelines at all... ;)

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4 hours ago, mcb said:

It was called GPS-stash in its inception.  The Geocaching name came along a few months later.  The first year or two were very different than it is now.

I did some research a few years ago after someone in the forums was considering the question "What is the name of the person who placed the first Geocache?" for a quiz. Here are the results:

 

On ‎10‎/‎28‎/‎2014 at 1:11 PM, The A-Team said:
On ‎10‎/‎28‎/‎2014 at 10:11 AM, Bear and Ragged said:
On ‎10‎/‎28‎/‎2014 at 9:51 AM, 3GDs said:

What is the name of the person who placed the first Geocache?

What year was the first Geocache placed?

 

Trick question!

Dave didn't place/hide a 'Geocache' :P

 

Good point!

 

Dave Ulmer, on 3 May 2000 said:
Well, I did it, created the first stash hunt stash...

...which then begs the question, who really did hide the first "geocache"? After doing some research on the gpsstash group, I found that it was May 30, 2000 when the new name of "geocaching" was adopted. The already-existing stashes were retroactively renamed, but the first one that was hidden under the new name would have been Arikaree on May 31, 2000. Therefore, the correct answer to the above question is actually "The Kansas Stasher".

 

BTW, it's very interesting reading the earliest discussions on the gpsstash group. I didn't realize that if the renaming went differently, we'd either be "geostashers" or "planeteers"!

 

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14 minutes ago, Isonzo Karst said:

It was still the GSP Stash hunt in 2004. I picked up an ammo can of mine from that time and found the this in it - link to log image posted this year  - GPS Stash Hunt note.

 

I'm sure there were people who simply would not give up the "original name" of the hobby, seeing 'geocache' as some new-fangled marketing ploy to take it over or something like that :ph34r::blink::lol:

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25 minutes ago, Isonzo Karst said:

It was still the GSP Stash hunt in 2004. I picked up an ammo can of mine from that time and found the this in it - link to log image posted this year  - GPS Stash Hunt note.

I like how they referred to it as the GPS Stash Hunt, but then gave the address of geocaching.com. :laughing:

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That was the Stash note that you got from Geocaching.com - it used to be on the right navigation bar, I think, on the home page.   I may even still have it, somewhere ;-) on my computer.

Early on I recall modifying it to specifically mention "NO FOOD ITEMS" - as people who stumbled on caches, invariably took something, left gum or candy.

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On 5/22/2018 at 3:38 PM, thebruce0 said:

 

I'm sure there were people who simply would not give up the "original name" of the hobby, seeing 'geocache' as some new-fangled marketing ploy to take it over or something like that :ph34r::blink::lol:

 

There were some very lively discussions on sci.geo.satellite-nav newgroup about the name back in the day when this was all starting out.  I am afraid that I favored the GPS-Stash name but was clearly in a minority.

 

If I can find the right backup file I have the first ~70-80 GPS-stashes in a Garmin compatible file (Wayback Machine has a copy of the file I made with the first 59 Stashes in it).  At the time I was taking Mike Teague's data base and loading all the stashes into MapSourse and sharing the file through Mike's site.  Obviously that got pretty unwieldy pretty quickly.  The good old days...  :lol:

 

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 I'd think "stash" just didn't sit well as being "family friendly",   still referred to as a "drug stash" today.

When we first started, most didn't know what a cache was (and just means the same...), but definitely knew what a stash is.   

It  probably would be different  today if cache was the  term used for hidden drugs when the hobby got popular.      :)

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1 hour ago, mcb said:

 

There were some very lively discussions on sci.geo.satellite-nav newgroup about the name back in the day when this was all starting out.  I am afraid that I favored the GPS-Stash name but was clearly in a minority.

 

If I can find the right backup file I have the first ~70-80 GPS-stashes in a Garmin compatible file (Wayback Machine has a copy of the file I made with the first 59 Stashes in it).  At the time I was taking Mike Teague's data base and loading all the stashes into MapSourse and sharing the file through Mike's site.  Obviously that got pretty unwieldy pretty quickly.  The good old days...  :lol:

 

 

Here's a link to one of, if not the version of Mike Teague's site (it was a static html page, not a database) from the Wayback Machine:  

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20000621194709/http://www.triax.com/yngwie/gps.html

 

A couple of interesting things to note:   Many of the entries did not have cache names,  but just included the location and cache owners name.  That includes The Spot and Mingo.  Here is a link to the email message that Dave Ulmer sent following the lively discussion on Usenet:  http://web.archive.org/web/20000621194709/http://www.triax.com/yngwie/gps.html

 

Although I don't remember reading about that first post by Dave Ulmer on sci.geo.satellite-nav I was using Usenet early enough that it was actually possible to read every post in every group.   I used to participate in a group called rec.backcountry in 2000 and remember the names of a couple of posters that participated there and in the sci.geo.satellite-nav group.  There were some lively discussions about the use of a GPS vs. a compass in rec.backcountry around that time as well.

 

 

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20 minutes ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 

Here's a link to one of, if not the version of Mike Teague's site (it was a static html page, not a database) from the Wayback Machine:  

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20000621194709/http://www.triax.com/yngwie/gps.html

 

A couple of interesting things to note:   Many of the entries did not have cache names,  but just included the location and cache owners name.  That includes The Spot and Mingo.  Here is a link to the email message that Dave Ulmer sent following the lively discussion on Usenet:  http://web.archive.org/web/20000621194709/http://www.triax.com/yngwie/gps.html

 

Although I don't remember reading about that first post by Dave Ulmer on sci.geo.satellite-nav I was using Usenet early enough that it was actually possible to read every post in every group.   I used to participate in a group called rec.backcountry in 2000 and remember the names of a couple of posters that participated there and in the sci.geo.satellite-nav group.  There were some lively discussions about the use of a GPS vs. a compass in rec.backcountry around that time as well.

 

 

 

If you go to the August 15th capture of the website (http://web.archive.org/web/20000815110954/http://www.triax.com:80/yngwie/gps.html) I am on the 7/20/00 news entry line.  I remember the original post from Dave on the news group.  I was a GPS junky before GPS-Stash/Geocaching came along.  I remember sitting on the front porch of my house late the night of May 1st with my Garmin II+ watching the EPE number waiting for it to drop.

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