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noncentric

[BUG]: Logs displayed out-of-order

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I've already submitted a ticket via the Help Center, so am waiting to hear back about that.  Wanted to post a thread here to see if anyone else is experiencing the same thing.

Issue:  My recently posted logs are displaying in my 'history' out-of-order.  Usually, geocache logs appear to be sorted by Date and LogID, but I'm not seeing that happen with some recent logs that I posted.  I have been holding off on submitting additional Found It logs until this is resolved, as I do like to have my cache logs in the correct order.

For example, my two finds on 3/29 are showing in backwards order.  I submitted the logs on Saturday (3/31) via the official Android app, then noticed Monday (4/2) that they were out-of-order. So I deleted the "Favorite Rocks" Found It log and re-submitted it, thinking that might fix the problem. Nope, it still shows that I found "Favorite Rocks" 1st that day, but that cache was the 2nd cache I found that day and I submitted the log for "Favorite Rocks" well after I submitted the log for "Puncheon".

Another example, I had 5 of my finds for 3/15 submitted before the weekend. Yesterday (4/2), I submitted the log for my 6th find of that day via the website. It shows up between the 4th and 5th finds, instead of showing up in the correct order.

It's pretty clear from looking at the LogID's that the logs are displaying out-of-order. Just curious if anyone else has seen similar?

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On the 31st I found 22 caches while up at a nearby mega and, as far as I can tell, they're all listed in the order I logged them. I used the website for all my logging, not the app, though. Likewise for the 5 I logged on the 27th and the two on the 29th.

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5 minutes ago, barefootjeff said:

On the 31st I found 22 caches while up at a nearby mega and, as far as I can tell, they're all listed in the order I logged them. I used the website for all my logging, not the app, though. Likewise for the 5 I logged on the 27th and the two on the 29th.

Yeah, I generally log via the website too.  I logged a few via the app over the weekend, although I don't remember which ones.  Seems that Log-ID's are still being assigned sequentially though, so they should still show up in the correct order in my history.  Hhmmm.

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So far, the answer I'm getting is that it's related to my use of Drafts. The explanation I've received so far doesn't quite make sense, but I'm hoping additional investigation at GS will resolve things.

I don't think I'm the only one that wants to have their cache finds be in correct order.

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On 4/4/2018 at 0:27 AM, noncentric said:

Issue:  My recently posted logs are displaying in my 'history' out-of-order.  Usually, geocache logs appear to be sorted by Date and LogID, but I'm not seeing that happen with some recent logs that I posted.  I have been holding off on submitting additional Found It logs until this is resolved, as I do like to have my cache logs in the correct order.

So glad you posted this as I thought it was only happening to me.  My logs MUST be submitted in the order I've found them.  Call me crazy but it really matters to me and I love writing and reviewing them as I can relive the whole day/experience/remember other things I did that day besides caching.  I call it my geocaching diary so it is important to me. 

On 3/29 I found 10 caches of a geo-art along a rail trail and 1 DNF.  For some reason I decided to log the first cache via Cachly as a real time log and then the rest I just created drafts since that is my normal M.O.  Later, I write about my experiences for my own purposes, even on geo-arts. When I got back to my car at the end of the searches that night I then went to GC.com on my phone's browser and created some real logs from my drafts for maybe 5 of them and then the rest I did later that night.  The next day I was devastated to find the first log I recorded in real time was now on the site as the 'last' cache found instead of the first.  I thought about deleting all the logs but instead I went back and edited the first and last log by adding the find number so I would know when I read them later which order I had actually found them.  To my surprise, after I edited the log they moved into the correct order.  I think numbering them was only a coincidence but I was very happy to see they were now in order but I thought it very bizarre too.

Two days later I found 50 caches while out with friends doing another geo-art. You can imagine how long it took me to write 50 logs.  I decided to add a few photos to my logs so I used Cachly to 'edit' the logs and add the photos which is so much easier than sending them from my phone to the pc then uploading.  Plus you have the advantage of it wiping the coords from the photo as well.  I also used the Cachly 'edit' feature to correct a few typos.  I then continued on, logging the rest of the caches on my pc from my recorded drafts until suddenly I noticed they were out of order again! Ugh!!!  This time I didn't know what to do.  Cry?  There was no way I was going to delete and re-do them.  I figured I would just have to live with it so I again edited the logs to add the find number so I would at least know which order I found them in and again they magically went back to the correct find order.  So weird!  I really don't think it has anything to do with me numbering them and that is a coincidence.  I think maybe there is a flaw in the code somewhere.

My suggestion is to just edit your log that is out of order and I bet it will move back in place to the correct location.  

Edited by Twinklekitkat
Clarification

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9 hours ago, Twinklekitkat said:

So glad you posted this as I thought it was only happening to me.  My logs MUST be submitted in the order I've found them.  Call me crazy but it really matters to me and I love writing and reviewing them as I can relive the whole day/experience/remember other things I did that day besides caching.  I call it my geocaching diary so it is important to me.

Thanks for mentioning this. I knew I wasn't the only cacher that is "a little OCD" about having cache history in the correct order. It's why one of my favorite features of the website is the calendar function on THIS PAGE.

 

9 hours ago, Twinklekitkat said:

On 3/29 I found 10 caches of a geo-art along a rail trail and 1 DNF.  For some reason I decided to log the first cache via Cachly as a real time log and then the rest I just created drafts since that is my normal M.O.  Later, I write about my experiences for my own purposes, even on geo-arts. When I got back to my car at the end of the searches that night I then went to GC.com on my phone's browser and created some real logs from my drafts for maybe 5 of them and then the rest I did later that night.  The next day I was devastated to find the first log I recorded in real time was now on the site as the 'last' cache found instead of the first.  I thought about deleting all the logs but instead I went back and edited the first and last log by adding the find number so I would know when I read them later which order I had actually found them.  To my surprise, after I edited the log they moved into the correct order.  I think numbering them was only a coincidence but I was very happy to see they were now in order but I thought it very bizarre too.

I was able to get things sorted out. The problem was that I submitted some of my Draft logs via the app, and then other Draft logs via the website. Submitting Draft logs via the app is something I hadn't done before. I rarely submit logs via the app, usually only in cases of FTF's.

GS explained to me that the app handles timestamps differently than the website and that was the cause of the problem I was seeing. I'd assume that the app added/subtracted X hours to the timestamp of my Draft log.  Probably the same thing happens when Live logs (not Drafts) are submitted via the app, I'm not sure. The solution for me was to delete certain logs and then re-log them via the website.

I'm glad that editing the logs worked for you. I had tried editing one of my logs, but the order didn't change. It may be that I didn't edit the correct one or that I was doing my edits via the website, since log editing isn't possible via the official app. Perhaps editing via Cachly prompts some type of change to the log timestamp that doesn't happen with website edits. Adding the find number when editing the logs was probably just a coincidence. If it happens again, then you could test it by doing an edit that doesn't add that find number.

The lesson I learned:  Always submit Drafts via the website, even if it's via a browser app on my phone.  It would be okay to submit Draft logs via the app, but only if all Drafts for that day are submitted via the app. The out-of-order issue arises if some Drafts for a day are submitted via the app and others are submitted via the website.

 

9 hours ago, Twinklekitkat said:

I decided to add a few photos to my logs so I used Cachly to 'edit' the logs and add the photos which is so much easier than sending them from my phone to the pc then uploading.

I also prefer to add photos to logs via my phone, so I can skip downloading to my PC. My usual method for this is opening the log via a browser app and essentially doing the same thing as if I was editing the log via the website on my PC. 

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1 hour ago, noncentric said:

The lesson I learned:  Always submit Drafts via the website, even if it's via a browser app on my phone.  It would be okay to submit Draft logs via the app, but only if all Drafts for that day are submitted via the app. The out-of-order issue arises if some Drafts for a day are submitted via the app and others are submitted via the website.

Still a head scratcher on how GS hasn't addressed this and normalized date/time tracking across their platform. API via 3rd Party app, Official App and GC Website logging shouldn't have a different date/time logic. 

It's common knowledge to log only via app or only via website to avoid this long standing defect. 

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6 hours ago, Team DEMP said:

Still a head scratcher on how GS hasn't addressed this and normalized date/time tracking across their platform. API via 3rd Party app, Official App and GC Website logging shouldn't have a different date/time logic.

I'm hoping they will get it straightened out. At least between the Official app and the website.  There seems to have been some recent progress, as Trackable logging via the app isn't shifting an entire day anymore.  Not sure if it's still shifting by X hours though, the same way logs are being shifted.

 

6 hours ago, Team DEMP said:

It's common knowledge to log only via app or only via website to avoid this long standing defect. 

"common knowledge"?  Guess I missed the memo.  I mean, I knew that submitting Live logs would have date/time issues, but when opening a Draft that already has a timestamp on it and then Posting that log - I didn't realize that the timestamp would be changed yet again from the timestamp that was already attached to that Draft.

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1 hour ago, noncentric said:

"common knowledge"?  Guess I missed the memo.  I mean, I knew that submitting Live logs would have date/time issues, but when opening a Draft that already has a timestamp on it and then Posting that log - I didn't realize that the timestamp would be changed yet again from the timestamp that was already attached to that Draft.

You participated in a couple over the past. Only API or only web direct or web drafts. Don't mix or, if you care, there could be a difference from the order of your finds and the order the sites shows. 

https://forums.geocaching.com/GC/index.php?/topic/343087-edit-log-changes-original-log-dattime/#comment-5636590

https://forums.geocaching.com/GC/index.php?/topic/346562-order-of-logged-caches/

https://forums.geocaching.com/GC/index.php?/topic/341239-sort-order-of-logs/#comment-5607803

https://forums.geocaching.com/GC/index.php?/topic/311798-order-of-caches/#comment-5258537

https://forums.geocaching.com/GC/index.php?/topic/342076-found-it-logs-in-incorrect-order/#comment-5619770

https://forums.geocaching.com/GC/index.php?/topic/341239-sort-order-of-logs/#comment-5607811

 

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7 minutes ago, Team DEMP said:

You participated in a couple over the past. Only API or only web direct or web drafts. Don't mix or, if you care, there could be a difference from the order of your finds and the order the sites shows.

Yes - IIRC, those discussions were about posting LIVE logs.  As in, find the cache, log the Found It/DNF/etc right away.  Those discussions were not about opening Draft logs (that were saved days ago) from the app, and then clicking "Post" on those Draft logs.  I started this thread because I had issues with Draft logs, not LIVE logs.

Draft logs have a timestamp on them and I've found that those displayed timestamps are correct. Although I wish those timestamps wouldn't display only on hover. Anyway, since Draft logs have a timestamp attached to them, then I expected that posting those Draft logs would use that displayed timestamp - regardless of how the log is posted/submitted (app/website).  If it's common knowledge that the timestamp already attached to Draft logs is further modified when the Draft logs are posted/submitted, then I guess I missed the memo.

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12 hours ago, Team DEMP said:

It's common knowledge to log only via app or only via website to avoid this long standing defect. 

Normally I would agree with this statement and think that may have been part of what happened on 3/29 since I did indeed send one log via the app then completed the rest from drafts.  Normally I don't do that becasue I have known about the time stamp issue since 2013.  But, I did find it very strange that just opening the log in edit mode and then saving it caused the time stamps to rearrange themselves.

In my second scenario I created ALL 50 of my logs from drafts that were created on Cachly and completed on the web site with a pc.  The ones that I made edits to using the app were then placed out of sequence, even though they had just minutes prior been in the correct order on the site.  These edits were done through Cachly AFTER I had created my official log from a draft using the website on my pc.  Why would editing an already posted log on my phone change its sequence?  It was only after I went back to the web site and edited the log again on there and saved it that it went back to its correct order.  I guess I won't be adding photos or making edits through Cachly anymore to already posted logs if this is normal behavior (even though it's far easier).

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2 minutes ago, Twinklekitkat said:

In my second scenario I created ALL 50 of my logs from drafts that were created on Cachly and completed on the web site with a pc.  The ones that I made edits to using the app were then placed out of sequence, even though they had just minutes prior been in the correct order on the site.  These edits were done through Cachly AFTER I had created my official log from a draft using the website on my pc.  Why would editing an already posted log on my phone change its sequence?

See http://www.cach.ly/support/index.php?/topic/1252-edit-log-changes-order/#comment-6712 . I don't know if it's an issue with the new Cachly edit or GC's persistent issue with date/times.  The end post is the Cachly developer is trying to work this out with GS. If it happens with other apps (assuming those apps allow updating/editing via the API) that would point more to a GS issue then a specific app issue. 

There was testing of this feature before Cachly released it and it could be that the testing didn't uncover it or that something changed on the GS (or of course on the Cachly end) that results in this undesired behavior. 

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If logs always showed what GS thinks is the date/time, it would be easier to troubleshoot. [Or if there is a way, I'm not familiar]

Edited by Team DEMP
auto correct

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Recently, I had a wrong order issue several times when editing a log via the site. I log my finds of the day via API (GSAK). Sometimes I correct a typo afterwards via the site. If I do that on the same day, the editted log appears before all the others.

 

It may be a time zone issue. I'm in CEST which is nine hours ahead if PST. My time zone settings in GSAK are correct as is the time zone in the preferences of my geocaching.com account.

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2 hours ago, daRAMA said:

Recently, I had a wrong order issue several times when editing a log via the site. I log my finds of the day via API (GSAK). Sometimes I correct a typo afterwards via the site. If I do that on the same day, the editted log appears before all the others.

 

It may be a time zone issue. I'm in CEST which is nine hours ahead if PST. My time zone settings in GSAK are correct as is the time zone in the preferences of my geocaching.com account.

 

The issue/situation (depends who you are or ask) is the time-stamping of logs when done via the API vs the website.  I stopped editing logs on the website if they were originally posted via the API.

 

I'm also not sure if editing via the website is altering the timestamp (it shouldn't) but there's no way to tell as far as I know. If someone knows a way to display log date and time after publishing, post the info here.

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On 4/6/2018 at 7:43 PM, Twinklekitkat said:

So glad you posted this as I thought it was only happening to me.  My logs MUST be submitted in the order I've found them...

 

This is entirely normal. I cannot conceive of any other viewpoint. Well, they don't call it OCD (Obsessive Caching Disorder) for nothing.

 

I log everything from the field, in order, from the same app (usually just a "more later" log) and then go through them using the web browser, again in order, to write proper logs. That seems to keep things ordered for me.

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1 hour ago, The Snowdog said:

I log everything from the field, in order, from the same app (usually just a "more later" log) and then go through them using the web browser, again in order, to write proper logs. That seems to keep things ordered for me.

Note that if you do this by editing your "more later" logs, then the cache owner (and anyone watching the cache) will get email notifications for the "more later" logs, but not for the proper logs.

 

And if you do this by posting a "more later" Find in the field, and then deleting that and posting a proper Find later, then you won't have as many Favorites Points to award as you would if you had posted Find logs without deleting them.

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19 hours ago, niraD said:

Note that if you do this by editing your "more later" logs, then the cache owner (and anyone watching the cache) will get email notifications for the "more later" logs, but not for the proper logs.

 

And that is very much the down side to quick field logging. I wonder if I should just do notes instead, then delete them and log the first "Found It" once at the PC at home.

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19 minutes ago, The Snowdog said:

 

And that is very much the down side to quick field logging. I wonder if I should just do notes instead, then delete them and log the first "Found It" once at the PC at home.

I just use field notes drafts, and turn them into real logs later, when I'm using a real keyboard. No one sees my field notes drafts but me, which is good because they're just little shorthand reminders to myself that aren't really intended for public consumption.

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16 hours ago, The Snowdog said:

 

And that is very much the down side to quick field logging. I wonder if I should just do notes instead, then delete them and log the first "Found It" once at the PC at home.

 

Use Field Notes/Drafts and you can log out in the field, go home and then post to Geocaching.com from your computer. You can review the log entry, edit/fix typos, write a novel, etc. Just do everything as Field Notes/Drafts for that day and the order/time for that batch will be consistent.

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