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Oregon Hell Hole?


Croaker

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Well, if anyone does go up there looking for it, there is a cool little hidden campsite just across the bridge on the left side where Chtisty Creek dumps into the North Fork. That whole section of river along the scenic Auferhide Drive is most beautiful. It's like driving through an Old Growth canyon with the trees towering above you on both sides and the road stretching far off into the distance. And in the Fall it is even more spectacular with the vine maple ablaze with color.

 

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The adventures of Navdog, Justdog, and Otterpup

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Well, Eraseek got me thinkin again. This looks interesting:

4478_1400.jpg

 

Excuse me for misspelling Basalt, its getting late... The horizontal & vertical lines are the range and township borders. Here is the description of the areas of interest:

Flows, flow breccia, and pyroclastic deposits of the High Cascades Province. Flows are aphanitic to finely crystalline, commonly diktytaxitic, and aphyric to porphyritic. Textures are mostly intergranular grading to intersertal; some andesite flows are finely trachytic and a few basalt flows are subophitic. Phenocrysts, mostly unaltered, include bytownite and labradorite, olivine, calcic augite, and hypersthene. Flows and breccia form shields, lava cones, and valley fill; in places greatly dissected and modified by glacial and fluvial erosion. Includes Boring Lava of Trimble (1963) and Hampton (1972) and Battle Ax Basalts of Thayer (1936). Potassium-argon ages from this unit range from about 1.2 to 3.9 Ma; in places difficult to distinguish from youngest flows of unit Trb.

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Hey Uplink, this is a family site. Please watch your language icon_biggrin.gif

 

Navdog, you just brought back some old memories of Cycle Oregon #5 (1992) - first bike tour over the brand-spankin' new Aufderheide(sp) scenic byway (or whatever the official name is). Man that was a neat ride.

BTW: You're just now putting on your foil cap? icon_eek.gif

 

I hope this Hell Hole is found - that would make a good story just by itself.

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Quick Note:

 

I have all the 7.5 min maps of Oregon. Send coords, I'll look.

 

Anyone feel brave?

Try contacting:

Search results for "Long" in "Forest Service, Department of Agriculture, U.S. Government, UNITED STATES"

 

Michael J Long

Full Name

Michael J Long

Last Name (Surname)

Long

E-Mail

Michael.J.Long@usda.gov

 

X.400 Address

G=Michael;I=J;S=Long;OU1=R9;O=FS;P=GOV+USDA;A=attmail;C=US

 

Preferred Internet Address

mjlong@fs.fed.us

 

He may be in Ohio instead of Oregon (They both begin with "O".

 

Gotta go!

 

- - Sluggo

 

 

This 'flying saucer' situation is not at all imaginary or seeing too much in some natural phenomena. Something is really flying around. The phenomenon is something real and not visionary or fictitious. - Gen. Nathan Twining Chief of Staff, US Air Force, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff

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I saw the PBS television show on the Hellhole a few years ago. My friend taped the show. Unfortunately, the tape is now lost but I watched it a bunch of times trying to get clues to the location of it. I remember that it's not too far off of a dirt road. It can't be seen from the road but it's within 100-200 yards of a road. It looks like a very interesting place to visit.

 

"Wise men talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something."

-- Plato

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quote:
Originally posted by Geo Quest:

I saw the PBS television show on the Hellhole a few years ago. My friend taped the show. Unfortunately, the tape is now lost but I watched it a bunch of times trying to get clues to the location of it. I remember that it's not too far off of a dirt road. It can't be seen from the road but it's within 100-200 yards of a road. It looks like a very interesting place to visit.

 

"Wise men talk because they have something to say. Fools talk because they have to say something."

-- Plato


Good to know. Road's probably gated, but it would provide an easier route than bushwacking. Love to know how to get to this road!

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blranch-2.jpg

 

It looks to me that this is just one of many dry ravines running down off off High Prarie. If you look at the topo image you can see how the terrain slopes around the ranch buildings and then drains into the ravine. If you look carefully on the aerial image you can see another small ravine and its shadowing on the very left side. This is the ravine in the topo image below the red #5.

 

My thinking is that the Hell Hole sounds like it is not something that is running perpendicular to a steep slope or a product of erosion from water running down a slope.

 

19973_600.gif

The adventures of Navdog, Justdog, and Otterpup

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quote:
Originally posted by Navdog:

 

My thinking is that the Hell Hole sounds like it is not something that is running perpendicular to a steep slope or a product of erosion from water running down a slope.

 


 

Again, going from my 5-or-so year old memory of the show, it should be roughly parallel to the slope.

 

Imagine if you will... a parallel uninverse... No, wait, that's the wrong show. Imagine if you will something semi-firm, like old playdough in an inch thick flat slab being pushed off a flat surface onto a sloping one. If everything works right, it'll tear along the transition line and leave a crevasse. Sort of like crevasses in glaciers. That's what we should be looking for.

 

----

Never let Common Sense Get in the Way of Determination.

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Well this topic has really caught my interest. I was wondering if anyone could remeber exactly what episode of Oregon Field Guide it was in. Which might shed more light on the location if they had any shots of the surronding terrain appear in the show.

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I just snagged this off the OPB forums.

So this guy has been there twice but he won't even take his family? Not very charitable.

This is a couple years old, the number for ordering back episodes has changed. I called but no one answered. I left a message but don't expect to hear from them until the begging season.

Croaker

Author: Bryon Snapp (---.proaxis.net)

Date: 10-15-01 21:45

 

I have been to the bottom of the Hell Hole twice. I know that it is a severly guarded secret and I will not give clues to where it might be found. I heard that Oregon Field Guide did a story on it and I want to know how I could get a copy of the broadcast to show my wife, parents, and friends since I won't take them there. I want to know more about it than what was printed in the Oregonian in 1997-98.

 

Reply To This Message

 

RE: Hell Hole

Author: Jim Newman (---.opb.org)

Date: 11-21-01 16:20

 

OFG episode #803 features the hell hole. You can get a copy by contacting audience services, 503-244-9900

 

[This message was edited by Croaker on June 27, 2003 at 04:11 PM.]

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quote:
Originally posted by Gloom:

Again, going from my 5-or-so year old memory of the show, it should be roughly parallel to the slope.


 

That is what I meant to say when I posted the pic this morning, but I was in a rush to leave for work. To elaborate more, the original article calls it a rift, which indicates it is something that is sliding or opening up as it pulls away from the slope in a parallel direction along the contour lines. Below is an example of the type of anamoly I have been looking for. This is clearly a piece of land that has pulled away from the slope and as you can see from the topo image, is not a streambed or ravine. It runs across the slope and not downhill.

 

The newer dirt road to the south in the aerial image doesn't show on the older topo map. You can also see the shadowing to the left of the circles indicating the small creek and dry ravine.

 

Hell-1.jpg

 

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The adventures of Navdog, Justdog, and Otterpup

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Yahoo! Looks like the case may be solved? I was downtown doing a fine cache by Bodoni yesterday and thought I would do a little research at the Library. The guys at the desk for the map room were very helpful, but after an hour of searching different possibilities, we came up empty handed. What I did find was a copy of the Oregon Field Guide video of the Hell Hole episode in 1996. I watched it several times last night, sure love my Sony VCR and its jog shuttle, and it offered a wealth of information and clues that they probably didn’t realize a determined cacher could pick up on. icon_biggrin.gif There are a few copies of the video at a few other branches, if someone wanted to check one out. It would be nice to have a second opinion on the observations I will list below, but everything in the puzzle seems to fit together.

 

First thing, they show a custom map for a few seconds on the hood of the truck as they were standing around.It had the Hell Hole marked on it. There are no roads marked on the map, but there were the township section numbers. The Hell hole is marked in the NW corner of section 29. There is a small creek to the west and down at the bottom of the map you can see the North Fork and three creeks dumping into the river on the south side. I could just make out the name of one of the creeks and it looked like Plateau Creek There is also the name “Christy” on the map to the northeast of the hole. All these clues jive with the topo map. Christy Flats is to the NE of section 29.

 

They also briefly showed an aerial map image of the Hell Hole on the hood of the truck. Pausing the video, I was able to match it up with the Expert GPS image on my computer. I was able to identify the general line of the hole, the texture of the trees on the image around the hole, the bare spots of ground nearby, the road to the south and the road to the north, a hard edged clearing just to the WSW of the hole and the river to the south. The sun shadows on their map and the teraserver image on my computer match up and confirm the hole is on a south facing slope. All this matches with the area around Section 29.

 

There was also a short video clip of a plane flying over the hole. You could tell that the video was shot in the middle of the afternoon by the shadow of the plane on the ground. The shadow angle again indicates the hole is on a southerly slope. You could also see a small portion of the road to the north.

 

Several other things that are mentioned in parts of the video that offer some clues and fit the target area:

 

  • They mention they hiked in due east from the road.

  • The Hell Hole is 1000’ above the highway below

  • It is ½ mile from the river.

  • There is a quick shot on the video where they are above the hole before they go down into it. It shows what may be Huckleberry Mtn. across the valley to the south. Again the suns position, to what looks like the SE (late morning) and the fact they are looking down into the valley indicates they are on a south slope to a ridge.

 

I attached a geology map that shows the younger basalt flows (Qtba) and circled the target area. This seems to jive with the article posted above about the age of the rock at the hole.

 

The only thing that seems odd, is at the very end of the video, one of the forest service men was talking and said the they were now 200’ below the top of High Prairie. None of the clues even comes close to matching anything around High Prairie and I was wondering if this was just a ruse to throw potential hunters off or he misspoke. He could have been referring to Christy Flats as a Prairie.

 

Of course all this is still theory without seeing the hole in person and confirming the location and it is possible they could have put out some misinformation. But all the above clues and observations seem to mesh. I do want to say that after watching the video, I would not recommend putting a cache there. The rocks are extremely unstable and the rangers wore hardhats and needed ropes to get down into the hole. The last thing we neeed is for geocaching to get a bad rap from the Forest Service. If it is there I will enjoy checking it out sometime this summer, but as always, the hunt has been as much fun as finding the treasure! icon_smile.gificon_smile.gificon_smile.gif

 

hellholewide.jpg

 

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The adventures of Navdog, Justdog, and Otterpup

 

[This message was edited by Navdog on June 29, 2003 at 03:00 PM.]

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Thanks Uplink. I was a little hesitant in proffering a theory to its location, but all the little tibits of info pointed to that sight. That old map is very similar to the one they showed on the top of the truck hood in the video and it only showed a small portion of it. The "cedar" and the nearby "pine" were visible and I couldn't quite figure that out. Looking at the old map, it was denotions for timber type. What also had me wondering is they changed and moved the names of the creeks from the original old map that dump into the north fork to the south. That old map is pretty cool and shows the location of many small logging or miners cabins that are obviously not there anymore.

 

So when the ranger said in the video they were at High Prairie, it was a ruse after all. icon_wink.gif

 

Looks like I know where I am going camping later this summer!!! icon_biggrin.gif

 

19973_600.gif

The adventures of Navdog, Justdog, and Otterpup

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Unless I'm too hungover, I think I'll head down there This Saturday. I saw that special when it came out and have wondered about it ever since. I remember seeing that special map, but i never thought y'all would figure out where it is. Craziness.

 

all rights reserved, all wrongs reversed

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Wow! Very cool, you guys! I was thinking pretty good chance this was urban legend.

If I'm seeing this right, there is an old trail (something "Way Trail") that heads right up through the Hell Hole area that isn't on the newer maps.

When is the expedition? Whoever goes had better bring a digital camera so the rest of us can see. I might even come down for this one. Kudos to Navdog and Uplink, and all the rest who help out!

 

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"See the wonderous works of Providence! The uncertainty of human things!" Geo.Washington

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Incredible job everyone! Keep us posted on this one. I'll steer Dirtsqueezer aka Bellinghamster over to this post. He is a geologist and loves a mystery. Hey, how about this one? Supposedly southeast of Mt.Vernon, WA is a geological formation called the "Devils Garden" that consists of a large boulder field. "Big deal!" you say. But the boulders are rumored to be the size of houses! It's near a boy scout camp I've been told but other details are sketchy. There is a Devils Mountain near Big Lake...anyone know about this?

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quote:
Originally posted by Whatcom Wanderers:

Incredible job everyone! Keep us posted on this one. I'll steer Dirtsqueezer aka Bellinghamster over to this post. He is a geologist and loves a mystery. Hey, how about this one? Supposedly southeast of Mt.Vernon, WA is a geological formation called the "Devils Garden" that consists of a large boulder field. "Big deal!" you say. But the boulders are rumored to be the size of houses! It's near a boy scout camp I've been told but other details are sketchy. There is a Devils Mountain near Big Lake...anyone know about this?


Yes I am. I've never been there, but my 1990 Footsore 3 has it listed. It can be reached off Walker Valley Road (off Highway 9 at milepost 46). Drive the road about 2.7 miles to the gate and Fire MOuntain Scout Reservation. I'm being brief here, but if you want...I could type the hike desc in, but it's probably outdated.

 

Here's the problem...some years back there have been tresspassing issues and I've heard that you can no longer access the Devil's Gardens. The Gardens are public property as I understand it, but the surrounding land is private and land owners don't want you going through their land.

 

You might want to research this further. You might be able to get permission. Seattle Times or local papers might have back articles regarding these Gardens. Also the Seattle MOuntaineers might have some current information.

 

With regard to Hell's Hole...congrats everyone!!! Depending on when the get together is planned, I may be able to come down. August is probably a better month for me.

 

[This message was edited by evergreenhiker! on June 30, 2003 at 12:58 PM.]

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Well if a group from PDX wants to go down there, here is what I was thinking. Find a nearby state park or campground, head down Friday after work and set up camp. Spend Saturday finding it, Saturday night celebrating the find and drive home Sunday after sleeping in. I have a tent trailer that can serve as base camp and used for cooking etc. I have a mini van and can take several people but I think we may want a 4-W drive for the forest service road. I was thinking the 7/18-7/20.

 

Fathergoose

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I would highly recommend anyone thinking of actually going down into the Hell Hole to view the Oregon Field Guide video first to know what you are getting into. Not that it is that difficult, but it looks like it is something that you are not going to just walk down into. No specialized climbing gear is necessary, but a safety rope looks essential, as there are no hand holds to grab onto. And I don't think I would go down into it without some type of safety helmet and maybe the comfort of knowing you have health insurance. There is also a scramble down through a short rocky debris tunnel to get to the very bottom and the video showed them using another section of safety rope in this part too.

 

With all the disclaimers aside, I have rope and a few hardhats I would be willing to bring along to any organized event in the future if I can make it.

 

The closest campground is Kiahanie, just a few miles up the road. It has 21 tent/trailer sites.

 

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The adventures of Navdog, Justdog, and Otterpup

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OK folks, lets all take a deep breath here... The last thing we want is for the Forest Services worst fears to be realized. If someone goes charging down there and manages to hurt themselves, then a lot of us will be sorry we ever heard of Hell Hole. A cautious approach by a small group with at least a minimum amount of technical experience is what we really need for a first approach. I personally think we ought to let Navdog organize the first visit. Not only because he located it first (and shared it with us), but because he does such a good job of documenting places. Check out his Caching Life e-zine.

(edited for spelling)

 

[This message was edited by Uplink on July 01, 2003 at 06:31 AM.]

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quote:
Originally posted by Uplink:

...but because he does such a good job of documenting places.


 

That reminds me, how come my pics never look that good?

 

But you're right, Uplink. This is Navdog's baby. I really REALLY wanna go check this out Saturday afternoon, but it would be better to wait for Navdog to post one of those crazy photo-collages he so rocks at. Heck, that guy can make Woodburn look photogenic.

 

all rights reserved, all wrongs reversed

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I have no intention or desire to go into the Hell Hole. After holding on to that newspaper article for 10+ years, I just want to finally lay eyes on it.

 

It will be a while before I can get down there, though.

 

icon_geocachingwa.gif

 

[This message was edited by Moun10Bike on July 01, 2003 at 01:35 PM.]

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Well I would! But Uplink is right. Plus it would be tough for me to get way down there to Oregonland anytime soon. Maybe I can team up with Moun12Bike sometime. icon_wink.gif

 

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"See the wonderous works of Providence! The uncertainty of human things!" Geo.Washington

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It was fun solving the mystery of the Hell Hole and it would be fun to have an informal geo-gathering to go check it out and maybe descend down into it, but I really hope nobody runs down there and places a cache nearby to advertise the location to the world. Somehow that seems a little unethical as the Forest Service has strived to keep its location secret. But it is on public land and it is not an ecologically sensitive area, so we have a right to go there, and in the long run it would be in our best interests to not ruffle too many feathers at the Forest Service. Just my opinion.

 

19973_600.gif

The adventures of Navdog, Justdog, and Otterpup

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I have to agree with Navdog. This isn't a place for a cache. Not a traditional, nor virtual or any other. It's just a place I've wanted to go see since I read the newspaper article. That being said I'm going down that way on Saturday the 12th, Grin'N'Bearit has some caches down there that have caught my eye. There's also a land form that's going to have a cache by the name of MJOLNIR placed. After looking at the caches placed by Moondog3 and Grin'N'Bearit I am all to aware of the shortcomings of my one and only cache so far.

Croaker

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MIDWAY upon the journey of our life

2 I found myself within a forest dark,

3 For the straightforward pathway had been lost.

 

4 Ah me! how hard a thing it is to say

5 What was this forest savage, rough, and stern,

6 Which in the very thought renews the fear.

 

7 So bitter is it, death is little more;

8 But of the good to treat, which there I found,

9 Speak will I of the other things I saw there.

 

10 I cannot well repeat how there I entered,

11 So full was I of slumber at the moment

12 In which I had abandoned the true way.

 

13 But after I had reached a mountain's foot,

14 At that point where the valley terminated,

15 Which had with consternation pierced my heart,

 

16 Upward I looked, and I beheld its shoulders

 

Sound familiar?

 

www.divinecomedy.org

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MIDWAY upon the journey of our life

2 I found myself within a forest dark,

3 For the straightforward pathway had been lost.

 

4 Ah me! how hard a thing it is to say

5 What was this forest savage, rough, and stern,

6 Which in the very thought renews the fear.

 

7 So bitter is it, death is little more;

8 But of the good to treat, which there I found,

9 Speak will I of the other things I saw there.

 

10 I cannot well repeat how there I entered,

11 So full was I of slumber at the moment

12 In which I had abandoned the true way.

 

13 But after I had reached a mountain's foot,

14 At that point where the valley terminated,

15 Which had with consternation pierced my heart,

 

16 Upward I looked, and I beheld its shoulders

 

Sound familiar?

 

http://www.divinecomedy.org/

 

4497_300.jpg

 

"See the wonderous works of Providence! The uncertainty of human things!" Geo.Washington

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How fitting! How about this one:

 

1 IF I had rhymes both rough and stridulous,

2 As were appropriate to the dismal hole

3 Down upon which thrust all the other rocks,

 

4 I would press out the juice of my conception

5 More fully; but because I have them not,

6 Not without fear I bring myself to speak;

 

7 For 'tis no enterprise to take in jest,

8 To sketch the bottom of all the universe,

9 Nor for a tongue that cries Mamma and Babbo.

 

10 But may those Ladies help this verse of mine,

11 Who helped Amphion in enclosing Thebes,

12 That from the fact the word be not diverse.

 

13 O rabble ill-begotten above all,

14 Who're in the place to speak of which is hard,

15 'Twere better ye had here been sheep or goats !

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The coordinates that I have for Hell Hole are roughly N 43° 53.772', W 122° 21.120'. I located this point at what I eyeballed to be the approximate midpoint of what appears to be the rift:

 

Hell_Hole.jpg

 

It looks like the route to get there is to take North Fork Road/Forest Road 19 north from Westfir for about 13 miles to about N 43° 53.139', W 122° 21.387', then go left on Road 1926. This road passes below the Hole and is visible in the lower right corner of the picture above. If you go about a mile past the hole on this road, you can turn left onto Road 636. It looks like this is the road that passes above the Hole and is visible in the upper left corner of the picture.

 

icon_geocachingwa.gif

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I entered on the deep and savage way....

 

True is it, that upon the verge I found me Of the abysmal valley dolorous,

That gathers thunder of infinite ululations.

 

Obscure, profound it was, and nebulous,

So that by fixing on its depths my sight

Nothing whatever I discerned therein.

 

Let us descend now into the blind world.

 

I think we should make ''Inferno'' the official inspirational book of this adventure.

 

4497_300.jpg

 

"See the wonderous works of Providence! The uncertainty of human things!" Geo.Washington

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