+Optimist on the run Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 A newly published event I've just been looking at has the following description: Quote The event will be open between 07:30 to 08:00 or longer if the chattering continues. Looking forward to discussing food, sorry caches. This leads to several obvious questions: 1) Where exactly is the event? I assume it's in a pub, but it doesn't make this clear. 2) Morning or evening? Evening is more likely for meals, though I've held some successful breakfast events, and the leading zeroes in the times makes me think of the 24 hour clock. 3) Is food available? Do I need to pre-book a table? I suspect that this is a regular meet-up point for local cachers, who are "in the know", but it does not seem welcoming to outsiders. Please, when writing descriptions, bear in mind that not everyone is familiar with the area, or your regular events! </mini rant> 1 Quote Link to comment
+on4bam Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 45 minutes ago, Optimist on the run said: 1) Where exactly is the event? I assume it's in a pub, but it doesn't make this clear. 2) Morning or evening? Evening is more likely for meals, though I've held some successful breakfast events, and the leading zeroes in the times makes me think of the 24 hour clock. 3) Is food available? Do I need to pre-book a table? 1. Take a look at the coordinates 2. Depends which country the event is I guess. If it were in Belgium it would be morning. 3. Ask the CO? Quote Link to comment
+Viajero Perdido Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 They probably had one too many run-ins with the reviewer, with requests to remove anything that might be construed as advertising for the venue, threw up their hands, and overshot to the point of total opacity. Been there. 3 Quote Link to comment
+HHL Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 1. At the given coords Hans 1 Quote Link to comment
+Optimist on the run Posted November 19, 2017 Author Share Posted November 19, 2017 Yes, obviously it's at the given coordinates. But what will I find when I get there? A pub? A picnic table? A lay-by? Yes, I could look it up on Google maps, but if the EO wants me to attend, why not just tell me? Quote Link to comment
+arisoft Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 20 minutes ago, Optimist on the run said: if the EO wants me to attend I wouldn't attend any 30 min event anyway. If 5 min events were allowed you would see many of them. Minimum effort is the key. Quote Link to comment
+Viajero Perdido Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 31 minutes ago, Optimist on the run said: Yes, obviously it's at the given coordinates. But what will I find when I get there? A pub? A picnic table? A lay-by? Yes, I could look it up on Google maps, but if the EO wants me to attend, why not just tell me? Aha! A clever workaround to the rule that you can't have a "puzzle event". (Event not at posted coords = illegal. But unknown venue at posted coords = legal.) Quote Link to comment
+Bear and Ragged Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 4 hours ago, arisoft said: I wouldn't attend any 30 min event anyway. If 5 min events were allowed you would see many of them. Minimum effort is the key. Minimum time for an event is 30 minutes. Organiser 'Playing by the rules' but does say... Quote or longer if the chattering continues. Quote Link to comment
+on4bam Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 I once organized an "event" While on holiday in Greenland and didn't even mention the duration, only starting time (18:00). Only a few people visited, as expected in such a remote area, but we stayed talking for well over an hour. I've planned 3 "events" for our upcoming holiday but so far no "will attends". Still hope at least someone will turn up at at least one of the locations. We'll be there for an hour but since it's once again in a remote area I'm not holding my breath. I too have not mentioned what the location is like, it's just a waterfront with benches which can be seen when looked up on streetview/GE. Quote Link to comment
+Mudfrog Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 59 minutes ago, on4bam said: I once organized an "event" While on holiday in Greenland and didn't even mention the duration, only starting time (18:00). Only a few people visited, as expected in such a remote area, but we stayed talking for well over an hour. I've planned 3 "events" for our upcoming holiday but so far no "will attends". Still hope at least someone will turn up at at least one of the locations. We'll be there for an hour but since it's once again in a remote area I'm not holding my breath. I too have not mentioned what the location is like, it's just a waterfront with benches which can be seen when looked up on streetview/GE. I don't understand why you wouldn't want to mention what the venue/location is. Seems like if it is outside, then it might be a good idea to state this so attendees can prepare. They might need a hat, sunscreen under the hot sun. They might need to bring a raincoat in case it's raining, or a warm coat if it's cold outside. Or if inside a building, is it a restaurant where food is expected to be bought? Honestly, and this i just my opinion, an event with a write up like the OP mentioned would not get much attention from me because it comes across the same as a lame, no thought put into it, traditional cache. 2 Quote Link to comment
+on4bam Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 15 minutes ago, Mudfrog said: I don't understand why you wouldn't want to mention what the venue/location is. Seems like if it is outside, then it might be a good idea to state this so attendees can prepare. They might need a hat, sunscreen under the hot sun. They might need to bring a raincoat in case it's raining, or a warm coat if it's cold outside. Or if inside a building, is it a restaurant where food is expected to be bought? I don't know what the weather will be like, At 18:00 the sun will be setting, and I have no idea how busy the area will be (never been, there). As all three events are in the main "town" of the islands everything is nearby, food, drink, lodging... I think people who visit there have no problem with the lack of detailed info as they probably have to "wait and see" as much as we are. It won't be cold as it's almost on the equator and at sea level. Quote Link to comment
+Mudfrog Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 35 minutes ago, on4bam said: I don't know what the weather will be like, At 18:00 the sun will be setting, and I have no idea how busy the area will be (never been, there). As all three events are in the main "town" of the islands everything is nearby, food, drink, lodging... I think people who visit there have no problem with the lack of detailed info as they probably have to "wait and see" as much as we are. It won't be cold as it's almost on the equator and at sea level. But what i'm getting at is that if nothing is mentioned about the event being outside, then they may not know to plan for the weather. The short trip between vehicle and going inside usually requires no extra measures but a person may not be prepared if they arrive to unexpectedly find it's an outdoor event. No biggie really but it is something i think most people would appreciate having a heads up on. Quote Link to comment
+cerberus1 Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 I don't think I've been anywhere where 0730 - 0800 wasn't understood as morning... Only a half-hour event, I wouldn't expect anything but a smiley (if interested...), which seems it's intention. Just a look at the map should be able to give a hint if inside or out, but for only a half hour (if you stay that long...) what difference would it make? We don't attend flash mobs anymore because it's (to us) only "another-pointforme-while-out-today" thing. Quote Link to comment
+dprovan Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 So don't go. It doesn't sound like the owner it pitching the event for you. In my area there are people that wouldn't bother to read past the owner's name before deciding to attend, so giving details wouldn't matter to them. Some wouldn't bother to look at the owner's name even. Those people show up to enjoy the company and really don't care what the venue or point is. They'd ask in their Will Attend log whether they should show up in the morning or evening...or they'd just pick one and see who else picks the same one. Quote Link to comment
+Mudfrog Posted November 19, 2017 Share Posted November 19, 2017 3 hours ago, dprovan said: So don't go. It doesn't sound like the owner it pitching the event for you. In my area there are people that wouldn't bother to read past the owner's name before deciding to attend, so giving details wouldn't matter to them. Some wouldn't bother to look at the owner's name even. Those people show up to enjoy the company and really don't care what the venue or point is. They'd ask in their Will Attend log whether they should show up in the morning or evening...or they'd just pick one and see who else picks the same one. In the past, most events consisted of more than just going to a restaurant or showing up at a location for 30 minutes. You're right, a person doesn't have to read the description for these kinds of events. Matter of fact, descriptions aren't really needed at all. Sorry OP, your opening post is all wrong. Quote Link to comment
+Mama514 Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 (edited) 5 hours ago, Mudfrog said: In the past, most events consisted of more than just going to a restaurant or showing up at a location for 30 minutes. You're right, a person doesn't have to read the description for these kinds of events. Matter of fact, descriptions aren't really needed at all. Sorry OP, your opening post is all wrong. I'm getting better at reading sarcasm. Yea, me! It would be good if the event host made it clear if it's an a.m. or p.m. event though. I've gone back a little and found that in my area, folks held events at their homes in the past and more events were held outdoors in parks back then. It was more personal, and now I understand why some people here don't like the change in this hobby. Edited November 20, 2017 by Mama514 Quote Link to comment
+redsox_mark Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 I agree it would be good to clarify AM or PM, and I would also give more details about the venue. Regarding the duration - this can be tricky if you don't know how long people will stay. My understanding of event duration is attendees can arrive anytime within that duration and as event owner I should be there. If the owner puts a 3 hour duration, and everyone except the owner leaves after 30 minutes, then he/she needs to wait for 2.5 hours alone in case someone else turns up. So maybe the event owner really has no idea if people will stay. As a sort of compromise, I am hosting a regular event next week. Starts at 7 PM, and as long as others stay (and they usually do) I'll be there until the venue closes at 11 PM and they throw us out. But I put the official end time at 9 PM, just in case I'm feeling tired or if everyone decides to go home early this month. But I also put on the page that likely we will be going until closing. Quote Link to comment
+arisoft Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 42 minutes ago, redsox_mark said: My understanding of event duration is attendees can arrive anytime within that duration and as event owner I should be there. Is there a guideline which says that event owner should participate at all? Quote Link to comment
+redsox_mark Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 13 minutes ago, arisoft said: Is there a guideline which says that event owner should participate at all? I don't think there explicitly is. Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 20 hours ago, on4bam said: 20 hours ago, Mudfrog said: I don't understand why you wouldn't want to mention what the venue/location is. Seems like if it is outside, then it might be a good idea to state this so attendees can prepare. They might need a hat, sunscreen under the hot sun. They might need to bring a raincoat in case it's raining, or a warm coat if it's cold outside. Or if inside a building, is it a restaurant where food is expected to be bought? I don't know what the weather will be like, At 18:00 the sun will be setting, and I have no idea how busy the area will be (never been, there). As all three events are in the main "town" of the islands everything is nearby, food, drink, lodging... I think people who visit there have no problem with the lack of detailed info as they probably have to "wait and see" as much as we are. It won't be cold as it's almost on the equator and at sea level. Why three events? I've never done a study on it but I suspect that most events are held inside some venue so mentioning that the meeting spot is outside might prevent someone from going into the nearby restaurant (since you've never been there you'd posting coordinates based on a map) and looking for someone they've never met. There's a pretty good chance that I'll be going to Kenya in January and have thought about hosting an event. It's also near the equator but inland a bit. Quote Link to comment
+Team Hugs Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 21 hours ago, Mudfrog said: I don't understand why you wouldn't want to mention what the venue/location is. As others have mentioned, there are guidelines that prohibit cache listings from being used for commercial endorsements. This gets a little tricky when events are held at commercial establishments. Some reviewers are stricter than others when it comes to interpreting that guideline when it comes to naming the event locale. On the other hand, some event organizers push the limit in the other direction and then overcompensate when they're shut down by a reviewer. I could see, for example, an event organizer submitting a description like "Event will be hosted at Joe's BBQ --- you have to try the brisket, it's fabulous", and having a reviewer complain about commercial endorsements, leading to the organizer overreacting and writing "Event will be hosted at posted coordinates". Locally, our reviewers allow event listings to name commercial establishments and give their address (which, of course, coincides with the posted coordinates), as long as there's no suggestion that a commercial transaction is required at that site. ("Event will be hosted at Joe's BBQ, at 142 Mason Street.") Quote Link to comment
+redsox_mark Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 10 minutes ago, Team Hugs said: Locally, our reviewers allow event listings to name commercial establishments and give their address (which, of course, coincides with the posted coordinates), as long as there's no suggestion that a commercial transaction is required at that site. ("Event will be hosted at Joe's BBQ, at 142 Mason Street.") Ours do too, and I think it is good to include it. I once went into the wrong pub for an event. I went to the posted coordinates and there was a pub, so I assumed that was the venue. Got a drink and walked around looking for other geocaches, didn't find any. Finished my drink and left, to find there was another pub right next door, and that is where the event was! In this case the cache page did not name the venue, though most commonly here the venue is named. Quote Link to comment
+on4bam Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 25 minutes ago, NYPaddleCacher said: Why three events? One on each island, trying to maximize the chance of meeting other geocachers. Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 13 minutes ago, Team Hugs said: Locally, our reviewers allow event listings to name commercial establishments and give their address (which, of course, coincides with the posted coordinates), as long as there's no suggestion that a commercial transaction is required at that site. ("Event will be hosted at Joe's BBQ, at 142 Mason Street.") Generally, whether or not a specific cache is considered to be commercial boils down to the language used on the listing. Simply mentioning the name of the venue and the address does not create the perception that the cache or event is promoting and agenda or is a commercial solicitation. A reviewer rejected an event cache which merely mentioned the name of the event I'd go straight to appeals. Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 18 minutes ago, on4bam said: One on each island, trying to maximize the chance of meeting other geocachers. Indonesia? Galapagos? Quote Link to comment
+on4bam Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 19 minutes ago, NYPaddleCacher said: Galapagos? yup Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 2 hours ago, on4bam said: yup Sounds great. Are there any local geocachers on the islands? It looks like every traditional cache there is a vacation cache. It looks like some of the geocaches get a fair amount of traffic so hopefully you'll find other geocachers there during your visit. Quote Link to comment
+niraD Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 For the record, the guidelines specifically allow the name of the business where the event is being held: Quote An Event Cache must meet the commercial cache guidelines, with the exception that Event Cache pages can include The business name, if the Event is at a commercial location Quote Link to comment
+on4bam Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, NYPaddleCacher said: Sounds great. Are there any local geocachers on the islands? It looks like every traditional cache there is a vacation cache. It looks like some of the geocaches get a fair amount of traffic so hopefully you'll find other geocachers there during your visit. Don't think so. It even looks that the largest portion of Ecuadorian caches is not in the best of shapes. I see a lot of "red squares" (DNF) in my GSAK database. We'll soon find out. Edited November 20, 2017 by on4bam Quote Link to comment
+rosebud55112 Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 I'm more interested in why they want to discuss sorry caches. Discussing great caches is much more interesting. Quote Link to comment
+J Grouchy Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 On 11/19/2017 at 4:10 AM, Optimist on the run said: Yes, obviously it's at the given coordinates. But what will I find when I get there? A pub? A picnic table? A lay-by? Yes, I could look it up on Google maps, but if the EO wants me to attend, why not just tell me? Seriously? I mean, have you actually plugged the coordinates into Google Maps or some other mapping tool? I'd think that would be the very first thing you'd do. Quote Link to comment
+TriciaG Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 55 minutes ago, rosebud55112 said: I'm more interested in why they want to discuss sorry caches. Discussing great caches is much more interesting. Ha ha! I think their punctuation is bad. I think they meant, "Looking forward to discussing food (sorry!) caches." Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 4 hours ago, on4bam said: 4 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said: Sounds great. Are there any local geocachers on the islands? It looks like every traditional cache there is a vacation cache. It looks like some of the geocaches get a fair amount of traffic so hopefully you'll find other geocachers there during your visit. Don't think so. It even looks that the largest portion of Ecuadorian caches is not in the best of shapes. I see a lot of "red squares" (DNF) in my GSAK database. We'll soon find out. It looks like there are quite a few Earthcaches in Galapagos. You shouldn't have to worry about DNFs on those. I have yet to find any caches in South America (nor I have I visited any of it's countries. The closest I've been was a short layover in Panama City on the way to Cuba. Quote Link to comment
+hal-an-tow Posted November 20, 2017 Share Posted November 20, 2017 8 hours ago, on4bam said: One on each island, trying to maximize the chance of meeting other geocachers. Very wise on the Galapagos, as the cachers will have evolved marked differences on each island ... That should get a grin from any evoultionary biologists who happen to be reading ... As for the OP, why not direct your questions to the event owner? Mind you, if they read your post here perhaps your welcome would not be as warm as it could be. 2 Quote Link to comment
+jellis Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 On 11/19/2017 at 1:31 AM, arisoft said: I wouldn't attend any 30 min event anyway. If 5 min events were allowed you would see many of them. Minimum effort is the key. Most of the events I've gone to some do leave early but more are hanging out and talking, comparing notes etc. Quote Link to comment
+niraD Posted November 21, 2017 Share Posted November 21, 2017 On 11/19/2017 at 1:31 AM, arisoft said: I wouldn't attend any 30 min event anyway. If 5 min events were allowed you would see many of them. Minimum effort is the key. I went to a few 5-minute flashmob events back when they were allowed. They weren't that different, really. The official part of the event (signing the log, a quick raffle, acknowledging the guest of honor, singing a song, whatever) took 5 minutes, but people spent much more time hanging out, talking, socializing, and so on, both before and after the 5-minute event window. Quote Link to comment
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.