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Release Notes (Website: Solution Checker) - October 19, 2017

218 posts in this topic

After some discussion with Groundspeak, I have come to understand their new development model, which is to quickly publish new features and then to iterate.  That is fine for many things; we still have the option to use the older system for new pages under development.

Unfortunately, IMO, this feature is different.  If COs start using it now, then solvers are required to use the horrid multi-field input.  As a result, unlike other new but imperfect features, this one is actively making life worse for puzzle solvers.

Therefore I think it is appropriate to ask Groundspeak how long we will have to wait for the improved iteration.  You have added a feature that cachers cannot ignore and makes the site less useful.  Please fix the multi-field entry problem now.

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1 hour ago, fizzymagic said:

You have added a feature that cachers cannot ignore and makes the site less useful.

This is all so negative.  Yes, there are issues with the implementation, but for some COs this is very useful - a simple to add checker for their puzzles.

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8 minutes ago, IceColdUK said:

This is all so negative.

Well, yes. There are significant usability issues with Groundspeak's built-in checker. When I recently added a checker to my own puzzle cache, I chose Certitude rather than impose those usability issues on others. But other puzzle cache owners may take the easy route and just check the checkbox.

Making it easier to provide a worse checker is not necessarily an improvement.

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23 minutes ago, IceColdUK said:

This is all so negative.  Yes, there are issues with the implementation, but for some COs this is very useful - a simple to add checker for their puzzles.

Yes.  Simple for the COs.  Not so much for the people who solve their puzzles.

To my mind, it is a step backward: by making it easy for COs to add a inferior checker to their puzzles, the availability of superior third-party checkers will diminish.  So the users lose.

Simple changes to the implementation of the Groundspeak checker would improve the usability dramatically, yet it was rolled out over a month ago and we have seen no response to the many requests.  I, for one, have become annoyed.

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25 minutes ago, fizzymagic said:

Simple changes to the implementation of the Groundspeak checker would improve the usability dramatically, yet it was rolled out over a month ago and we have seen no response to the many requests.  I, for one, have become annoyed.

This is very short time to evaluate new functionality. For example it was just today when I used the checker more extensively. I wouldn't say that this is step backward.

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On 22/11/2017 at 8:49 AM, IceColdUK said:

This is all so negative. 

Actually, no it's not. It's called feedback on a feature that has gone live without proper beta testing and opportunity for input.

While I won't say it's a step backward, I won't use it yet either (for the reasons I and others have enumerated above).

Personally, I don't look for improvement any time soon. There has been no response in this topic, and developers have already implemented changes in the messaging system... which suggests to me this is a done deal and they're moving on to other things.

Cheers all.

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Personally, I'm fine with the native checker being simple. The 3rd party checkers remain valuable resources for more advanced features and options.

However, for the native checker, I'd like to see:

1) The native checker include a notification like "This cache has a Solution Checker. Open this cache in your phone's browser to confirm your coordinates." when viewing the cache description within the official app. As it stands now, there is no indication that a cache has a native checker when viewing a cache in the official app. 3rd party geocheckers, like Certitude and geocheck.org, are visible in the cache descriptions within the app.

2) The native checker be available for other cache types, like Multi caches.

3) The native checker have a single field text entry box.

4) The native checker remain 'Optional'.

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This checker has two serious negatives that prevent you from using:
1) There is no information in listing about use of checker, perhaps even an HTML comment that could be decoded by third party programs
2) In case of successful verification, it will irreparably damage the cache information (overwrite coordinates) so I'm afraid to use it. For the purpose of finding a cache there is a substantial Final Waypoint and not some modified heading coordinates.

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4 hours ago, Arne1 said:

2) In case of successful verification, it will irreparably damage the cache information (overwrite coordinates) so I'm afraid to use it. 

You can revert to original coordinates. Don't be afraid!

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On 20.10.2017 at 0:35 PM, arisoft said:

Excellent solution! And maybe the final WP could be set visible and downloadable for players who has entered the right answer.

This only works for a single stage myst. Mine are different and I not always directly send the cacher to the final but to some other stage(s) first. That's why I couldn't use the new checker at the moment.

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8 minutes ago, monsterbox said:
On 20.10.2017 at 1:35 PM, arisoft said:

Excellent solution! And maybe the final WP could be set visible and downloadable for players who has entered the right answer.

This only works for a single stage myst. Mine are different and I not always directly send the cacher to the final but to some other stage(s) first. That's why I couldn't use the new checker at the moment.

When the integrated checker can check and disclose all hidden waypoints, this clever solution works even better than any external checker can do.

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14 minutes ago, arisoft said:

When the integrated checker can check and disclose all hidden waypoints, this clever solution works even better than any external checker can do.

That for I would need to have the option of chosing which waypoint I want to get checked. If it will be implemented that way: Great!

 

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5 minutes ago, monsterbox said:

That for I would need to have the option of chosing which waypoint I want to get checked. If it will be implemented that way: Great!

For what reason you shoud select waypoints? I think that every hidden waypoint is potential object for checking because it is hidden.

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3 hours ago, arisoft said:

For what reason you shoud select waypoints? I think that every hidden waypoint is potential object for checking because it is hidden.

For the checker! One of my mysts has a first stage and the final. So if I would like to use the checker I would need to be able to set the waypoint the checker is meant for. The default (final) wouldn't work for me and I also wouldn't use the checker for the final in this specific case. As you're solving the last calculation in the field anyways you would know pretty quick if you're right or wrong.

 

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3 hours ago, monsterbox said:

For the checker! One of my mysts has a first stage and the final. So if I would like to use the checker I would need to be able to set the waypoint the checker is meant for. The default (final) wouldn't work for me and I also wouldn't use the checker for the final in this specific case. As you're solving the last calculation in the field anyways you would know pretty quick if you're right or wrong.

 

The main and best idea of the integrated checker is that it can definitely check the final coordinates. Calculations may be easy but the player assumes that integrated checker can always check the final position - or any hidden waypoint, if this feature will be added at some day.

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Are there any plans to make this checker available for mobile apps? I just published some geo-art where we used the built-in checker to give searchers some reassurance. But I didn't realize that it doesn't display on any of the mobile apps. Searchers need to look at the checker on the web site.

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I have some issues with this checker (listed in increasing order of importance):

  1. I do not like the lay-out of it, nor the way it performs non-robot check.
  2. I like to get the number of correct/wrong answers to monitor the interest in my cache.
  3. The big problem: My cache requires some calculations, so rounding error my prevent you from getting the excact position. The checker should allow for some margin of error.

My cache was published with the buil in checker, but because of these issues I want to replace the builtin checker with a third party checker. My problem is: Even if I un-check the built in checker box on the edit page and save it, it will not go away.

My cache: https://coord.info/GC7G2TD

JarandR

 

Edited by JarandR
To clearify my problem
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Well, it DID go away, the only checker I see on your  cache page is Geocheck.org.

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