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Underwater geocaches and geocoins


orion612004

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I am in the process of creating an underwater network of geocaches.  My question is about geocoins and/or trackables.

Do I place a coin in the cache as we put them out?  Leave them empty and allow the first person to place the coin in?

We were going to create our own trackable coins.  Are they necessary or would trinkets be more fun?

The caches themselves are 6 inch PVC tubes with concrete forming the base at one end and a PVC cap at the other end.  There will be a pencil to allow people to sign the tube.

Cheers,

Ryan

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Placing a Trackable into a cache before it's published is OK, but requires a little extra work. What people often do in that case is, wait til just after the cache is activated, and then make the “Drop” log for the Trackable.

There's no requirement to place a coin in a new cache. But it's fine to place your new coins as you like. Or place them later, once you decide which caches are most suited to Trackables, based on cache activity.

Are these to be taken out of the water for a find, or do they remain always underwater?  If the containers pretty much always fill with water, the swag (and Trackables) must be waterproof.  PVC tube caches are super tough to keep dry inside.  And yours are to be submerged.

 

 

Edited by kunarion
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1 hour ago, ryanpatrylak said:

There will be a pencil to allow people to sign the tube.

It's not clear if you intend people to sign the outside of the PVC tube or not, but you might want to review the Guidelines on the subject:

 

Quote

For all physical caches, there must be a logbook, scroll or other type of log for geocachers to record their visit.

I'm not sure signing the outside of the container would be in the spirit of the Guidelines.

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3 minutes ago, Touchstone said:

It's not clear if you intend people to sign the outside of the PVC tube or not, but you might want to review the Guidelines on the subject:

 

I'm not sure signing the outside of the container would be in the spirit of the Guidelines.

I think "other type of log for geocachers to record their visit" is open to interpretation.  That said, I'd still go with something a bit more... indelible--the concern being the action of the water abrading the signatures off of the "log".  YMMV.

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1 hour ago, ryanpatrylak said:

I am in the process of creating an underwater network of geocaches.  My question is about geocoins and/or trackables.

Do I place a coin in the cache as we put them out?  Leave them empty and allow the first person to place the coin in?

We were going to create our own trackable coins.  Are they necessary or would trinkets be more fun?

The caches themselves are 6 inch PVC tubes with concrete forming the base at one end and a PVC cap at the other end.  There will be a pencil to allow people to sign the tube.

A cache is a container with a log inside to sign.   The basics of geocaching can be found in Geocaching 101.

How would you keep it dry (if under water) ?  The few pvc containers we've found above ground had water issues...

Some odd reason, I get a 404-File not Found when attempting to access your account (wanted to see how many "underwater" caches you've already found).  :)

There's no requirement to place a FTF prize, but when you said "Leave them empty and allow the first person to place the coin in?", that kinda tells me you may not fully understand the trackable side-game.   That's explained in Geocaching 101 as well.

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39 minutes ago, Touchstone said:

It's not clear if you intend people to sign the outside of the PVC tube or not, but you might want to review the Guidelines on the subject:

29 minutes ago, RufusClupea said:

I think "other type of log for geocachers to record their visit" is open to interpretation.   

The full sentence is , "For all physical caches, there must be a logbook, scroll or other type of log for geocachers to record their visit".

The guideline  also says, "A traditional cache consists of at least a container and logbook and is located at the posted coordinates" - A container, with a log inside....

For example, a Reviewer who owns an underwater cache has a divers board inside an ammo can.

Though not a paper log, it is a log inside of a container. 

 

Edited by cerberus1
explainifications
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49 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

For example, a Reviewer who owns an underwater cache has a divers board inside an ammo can.

I've found a few similar cases.  The Guidelines do not specify the material that the "logbook" is made of, but I've never found one where the outside of the container surface or object is intended as the "logbook" (excluding an Event I've been to where we signed the Host's car with a washable marker....but logbooks are not a requirement for Events).

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16 minutes ago, Touchstone said:

I've found a few similar cases.  The Guidelines do not specify the material that the "logbook" is made of, but I've never found one where the outside of the container surface or object is intended as the "logbook" (excluding an Event I've been to where we signed the Host's car with a washable marker....but logbooks are not a requirement for Events).

We've found a couple "write on the item" caches years ago, and all that we know of are archived today.

Events I believe are where most get that idea, "but we wrote on a teepee at that mega" kinda thing, and I agree, it's simply because events didn't need to even have that teepee log in the first place.     :)

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Well, a few new guidelines came out today to make some things a bit more clear.   Check out the thread    Here.    :)

Geocache contents

 Must include logbook

For all physical caches, there must be a logbook for geocachers to record their visit. The logbook must be

  • Physical
  • Replaceable
  • Easy to sign
  • Enclosed within a container

Examples: Notebook, paper scroll.

Geocache container

Choose container wisely

The container must hold the  logbook.

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19 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

It was clear before. Guess it's human nature to push it.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on that...(clarity).  If I weren't correct about the lack of clarity, they wouldn't have clarified--or (felt they) needed to. :D

19 minutes ago, cerberus1 said:

 - TPTB just made "how can I get away with..." just a bit tougher to accomplish.  :)

I don't see it as trying to "get away" with something (I don't do that); I see it as being creative, and some of the decisions of TPTB as stifling creativity.  OTOH, I see the relaxing of the buried cache policy as capitulation moderation (can't find the right word :mad:)--allowing some creativity... sort of.

It's definitely human nature to seek to exploit in order to improve chances of/for survival and preservation of species.

 

Edited by RufusClupea
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1 hour ago, RufusClupea said:

I don't see it as trying to "get away" with something (I don't do that); I see it as being creative, and some of the decisions of TPTB as stifling creativity. 

Sheesh... That seems to be the common line when one's trying to get something they want okayed (often knowingly against basic guidelines)...

If you were around at the time, the numerous threads on the issues that Reviewers had with many (enough to warrant a  "pause" on new challenge caches)  showed that there's more than a couple who want to figure a way to beat the system to fit them.                                                             

 
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On 9/5/2017 at 0:44 PM, Touchstone said:

It's not clear if you intend people to sign the outside of the PVC tube or not, but you might want to review the Guidelines on the subject:

 

I'm not sure signing the outside of the container would be in the spirit of the Guidelines.

The original idea was to have people sign the outside of the tube or attach a slate to the tube which would allow them to sign and easily replaceable.  I now see I have to find something to fit inside or not register them.  The guidelines state that the log be replaceable.  Does this mean if I put a smaller slate inside the cache, it can be removed, cleaned and replaced to make room for more people to sign

 

On 9/5/2017 at 0:59 PM, cerberus1 said:

A cache is a container with a log inside to sign.   The basics of geocaching can be found in Geocaching 101.

How would you keep it dry (if under water) ?  The few pvc containers we've found above ground had water issues...

Some odd reason, I get a 404-File not Found when attempting to access your account (wanted to see how many "underwater" caches you've already found).  :)

There's no requirement to place a FTF prize, but when you said "Leave them empty and allow the first person to place the coin in?", that kinda tells me you may not fully understand the trackable side-game.   That's explained in Geocaching 101 as well.

I have found only a handfull of underwater geocaches while living in the Caribbean but never logged any because I didn't know about it.  They were mostly statues and attached logs or boxes with trinkets in them.  I joined this forum when I posted my question.

 

On 9/5/2017 at 0:59 PM, cerberus1 said:

A cache is a container with a log inside to sign.   The basics of geocaching can be found in Geocaching 101.

How would you keep it dry (if under water) ?  The few pvc containers we've found above ground had water issues...

Some odd reason, I get a 404-File not Found when attempting to access your account (wanted to see how many "underwater" caches you've already found).  :)

There's no requirement to place a FTF prize, but when you said "Leave them empty and allow the first person to place the coin in?", that kinda tells me you may not fully understand the trackable side-game.   That's explained in Geocaching 101 as well.

The point of using PVC pipe and signing of the container would allow divers to open underwater.  One of the caches I found in TX had to be brought up, opened, closed, and brought back down.  We will be placing some of these on shipwrecks 100-140ft deep making this impossible.   

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Maybe use a waterproof notebook for a log sheet. I'm not sure how well Rite-in-the-rain sheets hold up being constantly submerged, but there's got to be something that will work for that purpose.

Keep in mind that divers won't be able to take a GPS with them to 100 feet, so you'll want to include a detailed description of how to find the cache once in the vicinity.

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You can use sheet plastic (goto a hobby store) or buy purpose made dive slates (wayyy more expensive) the plastic sheet from the hobby store works well, is flexible enough to be rolled up into the pipe (I would attach some sort of lanyard to retrieve it out of the pipe underwater (punch a hole in the corner, put a short length of braided fishing line through it in a loop and put some floating thing on the loop so it floats up and into reach when the cache is opened)  These can be written on underwater with a standard pencil, or even the cheap"BIC" plastic barrel mechanical pencils.

 

That's all I ever used when teaching to write on slates and they lasted years and years of heavy diving.  I still have some home made plastic dive slates from years ago and they still work fine (after years of writing and erasing) although the plastic will start to get brittle from sun exposure (at 100ft that wont be much of an issue)

 

As for directions, if your placing them that deep you'll want explicit directions as the time at depth thee on air is very limited, even on Nitrox you don't have a lot of time to be searching around for something, struggling to open it, sign it, replace and continue on.... I would recommend shallower placement, but that's my 2 cents.

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On 9/5/2017 at 1:21 PM, cerberus1 said:
On 9/5/2017 at 0:44 PM, Touchstone said:

It's not clear if you intend people to sign the outside of the PVC tube or not, but you might want to review the Guidelines on the subject:

On 9/5/2017 at 0:53 PM, RufusClupea said:

I think "other type of log for geocachers to record their visit" is open to interpretation.   

The full sentence is , "For all physical caches, there must be a logbook, scroll or other type of log for geocachers to record their visit".

The guideline  also says, "A traditional cache consists of at least a container and logbook and is located at the posted coordinates" - A container, with a log inside....

For example, a Reviewer who owns an underwater cache has a divers board inside an ammo can.

Though not a paper log, it is a log inside of a container. 

PVC tubes come in different sizes.  Place a 1" diameter PVC tube inside a 3" diameter PVC tube and you've got a  container and "a log".  

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