Armchair souvenir

[+Optimist on the run]

It's just occurred to me that all I need to do to get the week 2 souvenir is to log a TB drop at the event I'm planning to attend tomorrow, and that will give me the 10 coins I need for the souvenir. And if for any reason I don't attend, I can pick it up again for another 5 coins. I can do that, quite legitimately, without leaving home. I really don't think Groundspeak have thought this one through properly.

Edited July 24, 2017 by Optimist on the run
typo

[+LizzyRN]

23 minutes ago, Optimist on the run said:

It's just occurred to me that all I need to do to get the week 2 souvenir is to log a TB drop at the event I'm planning to attend tomorrow, and that will give me the 10 coins I need for the souvenir. And if for any reason I don't attend, I can pick it up again for another 5 coins. I can do that, quite legitimately, without leaving home.

Perhaps I'm not thinking your post clearly, help me understand, please.....if you've dropped the TB at an event you attended, how will you pick it up again? Are you saying that  armchair dropping your TB is actually legitimate?  Or just that Groundspeak wouldn't know?  

[+Optimist on the run]

6 minutes ago, LizzyRN said:

Perhaps I'm not thinking your post clearly, help me understand, please.....if you've dropped the TB at an event you attended, how will you pick it up again? Are you saying that  armchair dropping your TB is actually legitimate?  Or just that Groundspeak wouldn't know?  

If I'm attending an event, I will usually drop any TBs in advance (by posting a note saying "TB drop" ). This means the logs don't get screwed up if someone else picks up the TB before I log an attended and dropped. I don't know if this is technically within the rules, but most events I attend have similar logs.

In the case of tomorrow's event, if I didn't get there, the TB would show up in the inventory of the cache, but it would still be physically in my posession so I could log it as a pick-up.

[+LizzyRN]

Just now, Optimist on the run said:

If I'm attending an event, I will usually drop any TBs in advance (by posting a note saying "TB drop" ). This means the logs don't get screwed up if someone else picks up the TB before I log an attended and dropped. I don't know if this is technically within the rules, but most events I attend have similar logs.

In the case of tomorrow's event, if I didn't get there, the TB would show up in the inventory of the cache, but it would still be physically in my posession so I could log it as a pick-up.

Thanks for the clarification. I understand what you mean about the situation now. 

[+noncentric]

The following is just a wild guess.

 

I wonder if there wasn't a more challenging requirement planned for the 2nd week, and so that's why the various scoring categories were developed. Maybe that had to be determined well ahead of time to get the code developed and validated. That might've happened, for all 4 weeks, a while ago.

 

Then, the 1st week's requirements were announced and there was a lot of confusion by cachers (both in this forum and other social sites) about how the scoring worked. I'm sure TPTB didn't anticipate that level of confusion. So now, they've reached a point where they have to reveal requirements for week 2, but they haven't yet figured out how to refine those requirements in a way that won't be confusing. So instead, they made the requirements for week 2 simple. Just get 10 points.

 

This would buy them some time to refine how the requirements for weeks 3-4 are communicated. Just a guess.

[+Mineral2]

Technically you could armchair drop and pick up a trackable into any cache, though I haven't tried it yet. I wonder if the scoring system will recognize a drop and pick-up of the same trackable by the same user. Time to test it out.

[+Harry Dolphin]

1 hour ago, Mineral2 said:

Technically you could armchair drop and pick up a trackable into any cache, though I haven't tried it yet. I wonder if the scoring system will recognize a drop and pick-up of the same trackable by the same user. Time to test it out.

The rules/guidelines say "No dipping".  It does not define that word.  Obviously no 'Visit" permitted.  But would  'Drop" and 'Retrieve' qualify?   

[+Mineral2]

So far, it shows up in my counts. I dropped and immediately retrieved a trackable I picked up today into one of my own caches and my score increased by 15 points. I would like to think they could implement an algorithm to detect these actions. But I doubt it's at the top of their list of priorities to work on.

[+Optimist on the run]

Well, I've dropped off the TB I was carrying into tonight's event, all from the comfort of my office desk (not quite an armchair), and lo and behold, I've amassed the coins I need for this week's souvenir. All without doing any caching at all. Ho hum. (Let me make it clear that I have every intention of attending!)

Edited July 25, 2017 by Optimist on the run
typo

[+NYPaddleCacher]

1 hour ago, Optimist on the run said:

Well, I've dropped off the TB I was carrying into tonight's event, all from the comfort of my office desk (not quite an armchair), and lo and behold, I've amassed the coins I need for this week's souvenir. All without doing any caching at all. Ho hum. (Let me make it clear that I have every intention of attending!)

 

There are also some that have no interest in obtaining these souvenirs but will have to avoid dropping off a TB into a cache in order to prevent the souvenir from automatically being added to ones profile (yes, I know we can "hide it" if it's added).

 

[+Optimist on the run]

38 minutes ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 

There are also some that have no interest in obtaining these souvenirs but will have to avoid dropping off a TB into a cache in order to prevent the souvenir from automatically being added to ones profile (yes, I know we can "hide it" if it's added).

 

Yes, but they would also have to avoid finding more than one cache this week.

[+Mineral2]

2 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 

There are also some that have no interest in obtaining these souvenirs but will have to avoid dropping off a TB into a cache in order to prevent the souvenir from automatically being added to ones profile (yes, I know we can "hide it" if it's added).

 

Or finding caches in new states and countries. It's pretty hard to avoid souvenirs entirely. Much easier to ignore them.

[+fuzziebear3]

Overall, this is just a fun little promotion.  If someone wants to game the system to get a souvenir, its not really a big deal.  But it would probably be more fun to go and find a few caches, and maybe move a couple trackables.

 

 

[+J Grouchy]

6 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 

There are also some that have no interest in obtaining these souvenirs but will have to avoid dropping off a TB into a cache in order to prevent the souvenir from automatically being added to ones profile (yes, I know we can "hide it" if it's added).

 

 

I guess I just don't understand why anyone would ACTIVELY work to keep a digital souvenir from showing up.  I completely understand why folks wouldn't care about getting them, but getting upset when they are given to you just seems - and I'll be a bit blunt here - like a truly bizarre attitude.  I honestly can't even remember the last time I even looked at my souvenirs and it takes an effort to click through to view them.  Is there some obsessive/compulsive thing at play here where just knowing it might exist on their profile, two or three clicks down, is enough to drive them mental?  Does the paranoia run so deep that letting others know that you were in Kansas to find your first cache in that state six years ago is just too much to bear?

[+Mineral2]

2 hours ago, J Grouchy said:

 

I guess I just don't understand why anyone would ACTIVELY work to keep a digital souvenir from showing up.  I completely understand why folks wouldn't care about getting them, but getting upset when they are given to you just seems - and I'll be a bit blunt here - like a truly bizarre attitude.  I honestly can't even remember the last time I even looked at my souvenirs and it takes an effort to click through to view them.  Is there some obsessive/compulsive thing at play here where just knowing it might exist on their profile, two or three clicks down, is enough to drive them mental?  Does the paranoia run so deep that letting others know that you were in Kansas to find your first cache in that state six years ago is just too much to bear?

I can understand the shame that comes with setting foot in Kansas and why you might not want to broadcast that around. I suppose if you had to go to Kansas, you could just skip geocaching, but then you'd miss out on the oldest geocache that is still active. 

I'm kidding, of course, about the shame that comes with setting foot in Kansas, in case there are any Sam Brownback fans in here.

[+Harry Dolphin]

20 hours ago, Mineral2 said:

So far, it shows up in my counts. I dropped and immediately retrieved a trackable I picked up today into one of my own caches and my score increased by 15 points. I would like to think they could implement an algorithm to detect these actions. But I doubt it's at the top of their list of priorities to work on.

Grabbing the trackable from another does not work.  My nephew grabbed one from me to put in a cache this weekend for his ten gold coins.  He got no points for that.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

6 hours ago, Mineral2 said:

Or finding caches in new states and countries. It's pretty hard to avoid souvenirs entirely. Much easier to ignore them.

 

A couple of years ago I was traveling during the 31 days in August souvenir promotion.  I visited two states in which I had not yet found a cache and wanted to add them to my list.  I like collecting the region based souvenirs but that doesn't I want a souvenir just for finding a cache on a day in August.  I don't want to avoid souvenirs entirely but would rather choose the souvenirs I obtain (just as I would for real life souvenirs).  I got a souvenir for finding a cache in China when I found a cache on the great wall.  I wouldn't want a souvenir added to my profile for finding a cache in the parking lot of a walmart.  

[+hzoi]

One can cheat one's way to pretty much any souvenir one wants.  Log a find on a mega event without attending.  Log finds in other countries without leaving the house. 

 

And, of course, it's not limited to just souvenirs.  Armchair cachers were old news when we got started ten years ago.  (While standards have tightened considerably in the past few years, the words "Greetings from Germany" still likely send chills down some virtual cache owners' spines.) 

 

Integrity has always been a key part of geocaching.  It's pretty easy to determine those who have strayed from the path.  In some cases, social pressure will put a stop to it; in others, Groundspeak has been known to step in and take corrective action.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

2 hours ago, J Grouchy said:

 

I guess I just don't understand why anyone would ACTIVELY work to keep a digital souvenir from showing up.  I completely understand why folks wouldn't care about getting them, but getting upset when they are given to you just seems - and I'll be a bit blunt here - like a truly bizarre attitude.  I honestly can't even remember the last time I even looked at my souvenirs and it takes an effort to click through to view them.  Is there some obsessive/compulsive thing at play here where just knowing it might exist on their profile, two or three clicks down, is enough to drive them mental?  Does the paranoia run so deep that letting others know that you were in Kansas to find your first cache in that state six years ago is just too much to bear?

 

Upset?  Drive them mental?  Paranoia? You're reading way to much into this.  If you can't remember the last time you looked at your souvenirs then obviously you see the differently than others.  If you never look at the page then obviously you don't care what is on it.  I see them as a type of collection.   Whether one collects coins, stamps, or baseball cards the value to the collector is not measured in the quantity of coins, stamps, or cards but items specifically chosen for their individual value.  A coin collector probably doesn't want someone dumping their pocket change into their collection.  It would just clutter up the collections, making it more difficult to see the rare coins.  I've got state souvenirs for 28 states, about 17 for countries (and have found caches in 8 more that don't have a souvenir, and a couple of German Bundeslander souvenirs.   I like looking that them from time to time as a token of remembrance (e.g. the definition of a souvenir) of the places I've visited.  Adding souvenirs for simply finding 2 caches during a week in July adds no value to me and adding one of just finding a single cache each day in August is just clutter.  Some people that like souvenirs will gladly add any souvenir to their collection that's not me.   Some people will gladly find any cache, no matter how lame, as long as it adds to their find count.  That's not me either.

 

[+noncentric]

6 hours ago, Harry Dolphin said:

Grabbing the trackable from another does not work.  My nephew grabbed one from me to put in a cache this weekend for his ten gold coins.  He got no points for that.

Seems correct. The points are for "Grab" and "Retrieve" - from a cache.  There are no scoring categories labeled "Grab".

• Retrieve a trackable from a cache = 5 gold coins.
• Drop a trackable into a cache = 10 gold coins.

[+J Grouchy]

11 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 

Upset?  Drive them mental?  Paranoia? You're reading way to much into this.  If you can't remember the last time you looked at your souvenirs then obviously you see the differently than others.  If you never look at the page then obviously you don't care what is on it.  I see them as a type of collection.   Whether one collects coins, stamps, or baseball cards the value to the collector is not measured in the quantity of coins, stamps, or cards but items specifically chosen for their individual value.  A coin collector probably doesn't want someone dumping their pocket change into their collection.  It would just clutter up the collections, making it more difficult to see the rare coins.  I've got state souvenirs for 28 states, about 17 for countries (and have found caches in 8 more that don't have a souvenir, and a couple of German Bundeslander souvenirs.   I like looking that them from time to time as a token of remembrance (e.g. the definition of a souvenir) of the places I've visited.  Adding souvenirs for simply finding 2 caches during a week in July adds no value to me and adding one of just finding a single cache each day in August is just clutter.  Some people that like souvenirs will gladly add any souvenir to their collection that's not me.   Some people will gladly find any cache, no matter how lame, as long as it adds to their find count.  That's not me either.

 

And again, that's almost as disturbing as the examples I gave.  Caring so much about souvenirs that having those might bother you?  Well, I can't even comprehend such a mentality.

[+MartyBartfast]

49 minutes ago, J Grouchy said:

And again, that's almost as disturbing as the examples I gave.  Caring so much about souvenirs that having those might bother you?  Well, I can't even comprehend such a mentality.

Although the souvenirs don't bother me and I rarely look at that page I can sort of see where NYPC is coming from here. A better analogy might be that you like to collect paintings and hang them on your wall at home, there are particular styles and subjects that you like to collect and you hang them and enjoy looking at them, but every so often your landlord comes into your home and hangs a photo of a random cartoon character, you can't remove them, but you can cover them with a white sheet.

[+Mineral2]

The curator in me does wish the fine folks at HQ would introduce a way to group and organize souvenirs for better finding. I'd love to be able to see all of my state souvenirs together, for example.

[+CAVinoGal]

17 hours ago, NYPaddleCacher said:

 Some people that like souvenirs will gladly add any souvenir to their collection that's not me.   Some people will gladly find any cache, no matter how lame, as long as it adds to their find count.  That's not me either.

Nor me.  This whole Mary Hyde adventure is interesting, if only to see how differently people are reacting to it!

I'm really not caching any differently than I would have absent the treasure hunt.  It happens that my normal caching level earns the souvenirs ... and I may make a bit of extra effort  to collect them all.  We'll see what the next two weeks requirements are.  So far, as we've all seen, it's amounted to finding one or two caches (perhaps a few more the first week if you don't have active caching friends).  So I'm earning them without really trying.  

So they show up on my souvenir wall.  I can look at them or not.  It isn't going to affect my mental state.

[+Gill & Tony]

7 hours ago, Mineral2 said:

The curator in me does wish the fine folks at HQ would introduce a way to group and organize souvenirs for better finding. I'd love to be able to see all of my state souvenirs together, for example.

I have suggested, a couple of times now, that the "souvenir" tab should have 3 options:  display nothing; display the current format or display user-generated HTML which could be uploaded like the bio data in the "about" tab.

I have used GSAK to arrange my souvenirs exactly how I want them, but they are buried in my profile data.

[+The Jester]

On ‎7‎/‎25‎/‎2017 at 3:41 PM, NYPaddleCacher said:

 

Upset?  Drive them mental?  Paranoia? You're reading way to much into this.  If you can't remember the last time you looked at your souvenirs then obviously you see the differently than others.  If you never look at the page then obviously you don't care what is on it.  I see them as a type of collection.   Whether one collects coins, stamps, or baseball cards the value to the collector is not measured in the quantity of coins, stamps, or cards but items specifically chosen for their individual value.  A coin collector probably doesn't want someone dumping their pocket change into their collection.  It would just clutter up the collections, making it more difficult to see the rare coins.  I've got state souvenirs for 28 states, about 17 for countries (and have found caches in 8 more that don't have a souvenir, and a couple of German Bundeslander souvenirs.   I like looking that them from time to time as a token of remembrance (e.g. the definition of a souvenir) of the places I've visited.  Adding souvenirs for simply finding 2 caches during a week in July adds no value to me and adding one of just finding a single cache each day in August is just clutter.  Some people that like souvenirs will gladly add any souvenir to their collection that's not me.   Some people will gladly find any cache, no matter how lame, as long as it adds to their find count.  That's not me either.

 

Using the new dashboard, you can look at your souvenirs and hide the ones you don't want displayed. 

[+MartyBartfast]

1 hour ago, The Jester said:

Using the new dashboard, you can look at your souvenirs and hide the ones you don't want displayed. 

Using that function only hides them from other cachers' view, they still appear on your souvenir page but slightly greyed out, so that wouldn't help here:-

 

On 25/07/2017 at 11:41 PM, NYPaddleCacher said:

I like looking that them from time to time as a token of remembrance (e.g. the definition of a souvenir) of the places I've visited.

As NYPC is talking about looking at his own souvenir gallery.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

18 hours ago, CAVinoGal said:

Nor me.  This whole Mary Hyde adventure is interesting, if only to see how differently people are reacting to it!

I'm really not caching any differently than I would have absent the treasure hunt.  It happens that my normal caching level earns the souvenirs ... and I may make a bit of extra effort  to collect them all.  We'll see what the next two weeks requirements are.  So far, as we've all seen, it's amounted to finding one or two caches (perhaps a few more the first week if you don't have active caching friends).  So I'm earning them without really trying.  

So they show up on my souvenir wall.  I can look at them or not.  It isn't going to affect my mental state.

Just to be clear. It's not affecting my mental state either.  

[+thebruce0]

...or is it...?

[+hzoi]

12 hours ago, The Jester said:

Using the new dashboard, you can look at your souvenirs and hide the ones you don't want displayed. 

But the nassssty souvenir is still there, yessssss, preciousssssss...we knows, O yes we knows.

[+The Jester]

11 hours ago, MartyBartfast said:

Using that function only hides them from other cachers' view, they still appear on your souvenir page but slightly greyed out, so that wouldn't help here:-

Only if you view them from the dashboard, view them in you profile and they aren't visible.  So if they 'bug' you, hide them in the dashboard, but view them from your profile.  That way your memoriies of the caches giving you the souvenir isn't tainted by other 'cheap' souvenirs.

 

[+MartyBartfast]

41 minutes ago, The Jester said:

Only if you view them from the dashboard, view them in you profile and they aren't visible.  So if they 'bug' you, hide them in the dashboard, but view them from your profile.  That way your memoriies of the caches giving you the souvenir isn't tainted by other 'cheap' souvenirs.

 

Fair point, I hadn't realised that as I don't look at souvenirs often.

[+ottieolsen]

On 7/25/2017 at 4:50 PM, Mineral2 said:

I can understand the shame that comes with setting foot in Kansas and why you might not want to broadcast that around. I suppose if you had to go to Kansas, you could just skip geocaching, but then you'd miss out on the oldest geocache that is still active. 

I'm kidding, of course, about the shame that comes with setting foot in Kansas, in case there are any Sam Brownback fans in here.

And what's wrong with Kansas?

[+Mineral2]

2 hours ago, ottieolsen said:

And what's wrong with Kansas?

Sam Brownback. :-P

[+NYPaddleCacher]

2 hours ago, ottieolsen said:

And what's wrong with Kansas?

My most recent souvenir was for finding a cache in Kansas but I was no where near the oldest active cache.  I was in Kansas City for a few days (on the Missouri side) and met up with a local geocacher that used to live in my area and went over the border to grab a few caches in Kansas.  

[+ottieolsen]

18 hours ago, Mineral2 said:

Sam Brownback. :-P

Won't get any argument from me on that one lol

Edited January 18, 2018 by ottieolsen