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Superted

Wales, Scotland and England Souvenirs

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I would like to make a suggestion/plea for there being Wales, Scotland and England Souvenirs.

 

Note that I am purposely refraining from calling them Country Souvenirs as the United Kingdom already has a souvenir.

 

My argument is based on cache density and cache numbers i.e. these regions have high cache density and numbers without there being individual regional souvenirs. They would in effect be similar to State souvenirs in other countries where there is high cache density.

 

I think I am right in saying that the artwork already exists for these three regional souvenirs.

 

Thank you :)

 

Superted

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I think I am right in saying that the artwork already exists for these three regional souvenirs.

 

 

Yep:

 

England - Geocaching.com Souvenirs

Scotland - Geocaching.com Souvenirs

Wales - Geocaching.com Souvenirs

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It has been suggested before, and might one day happen.

 

It would be unique though. On a cache page listing, there are 2 levels - country, and state/region. The US has a souvenir for each state of course, as do Canada with Provinces, Germany with Bundesländer.

 

The UK is divided in to 14 regions - 10 in England, 2 in Scotland, and 2 in Wales. Groundspeak could give a souvenir for each region, though they are somewhat arbitrary (e.g. Southern England).

 

It would be possible to award an England souvenir if you find a cache in any of the 10 English regions (and similar for Scotland and Wales), but I think this would be the first location based souvenir which isn't a country or a "state" (as defined by Groundspeak).

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It has been suggested before, and might one day happen.

 

It would be unique though. On a cache page listing, there are 2 levels - country, and state/region. The US has a souvenir for each state of course, as do Canada with Provinces, Germany with Bundesländer.

 

The UK is divided in to 14 regions - 10 in England, 2 in Scotland, and 2 in Wales. Groundspeak could give a souvenir for each region, though they are somewhat arbitrary (e.g. Southern England).

 

It would be possible to award an England souvenir if you find a cache in any of the 10 English regions (and similar for Scotland and Wales), but I think this would be the first location based souvenir which isn't a country or a "state" (as defined by Groundspeak).

 

Groundspeak isn't defining what is a country or "state". The list of countries/states is based on an existing authoritative standard (the UN geopolitical ontology). That standard doesn't define England, Scotland, and Wales either.

 

BTW, There is also artwork for Ethiopia

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/geocaching_com/6195982427/

 

 

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It has been suggested before, and might one day happen.

 

It would be unique though. On a cache page listing, there are 2 levels - country, and state/region. The US has a souvenir for each state of course, as do Canada with Provinces, Germany with Bundesländer.

 

The UK is divided in to 14 regions - 10 in England, 2 in Scotland, and 2 in Wales. Groundspeak could give a souvenir for each region, though they are somewhat arbitrary (e.g. Southern England).

 

It would be possible to award an England souvenir if you find a cache in any of the 10 English regions (and similar for Scotland and Wales), but I think this would be the first location based souvenir which isn't a country or a "state" (as defined by Groundspeak).

 

Groundspeak isn't defining what is a country or "state". The list of countries/states is based on an existing authoritative standard (the UN geopolitical ontology). That standard doesn't define England, Scotland, and Wales either.

 

BTW, There is also artwork for Ethiopia

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/geocaching_com/6195982427/

 

For the UK, Groundspeak has defined the "states". Or actually it was the local reviewers at the time. I'm not an expert on UN geopolitical ontology but I don't believe it contains "Southern England".

 

It is defined here

Edited by redsox_mark

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Groundspeak isn't defining what is a country or "state". The list of countries/states is based on an existing authoritative standard (the UN geopolitical ontology). That standard doesn't define England, Scotland, and Wales either.

 

 

I suspect that whatever "standard" it is that they use that defines Jersey and Isle of Man as countries will have a similar definition for England, Scotland & Wales.

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It has been suggested before, and might one day happen.

 

It would be unique though. On a cache page listing, there are 2 levels - country, and state/region. The US has a souvenir for each state of course, as do Canada with Provinces, Germany with Bundesländer.

 

The UK is divided in to 14 regions - 10 in England, 2 in Scotland, and 2 in Wales. Groundspeak could give a souvenir for each region, though they are somewhat arbitrary (e.g. Southern England).

 

It would be possible to award an England souvenir if you find a cache in any of the 10 English regions (and similar for Scotland and Wales), but I think this would be the first location based souvenir which isn't a country or a "state" (as defined by Groundspeak).

 

Groundspeak isn't defining what is a country or "state". The list of countries/states is based on an existing authoritative standard (the UN geopolitical ontology). That standard doesn't define England, Scotland, and Wales either.

 

BTW, There is also artwork for Ethiopia

 

https://www.flickr.c...com/6195982427/

 

For the UK, Groundspeak has defined the "states". Or actually it was the local reviewers at the time. I'm not an expert on UN geopolitical ontology but I don't believe it contains "Southern England".

 

It is defined here

 

The UN geopolitical ontology only includes countries and transnational regions (North Africa). I have built a dataset which uses the UN geopolitical ontology for countries then links each country to geonames to obtain a list of first order administration divisions (states, provinces). GS has first level administration divisions for many countries but not all and I have no idea how they've constructed that list.

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Groundspeak isn't defining what is a country or "state". The list of countries/states is based on an existing authoritative standard (the UN geopolitical ontology). That standard doesn't define England, Scotland, and Wales either.

 

 

I suspect that whatever "standard" it is that they use that defines Jersey and Isle of Man as countries will have a similar definition for England, Scotland & Wales.

 

The UN geopolitical ontology doesn't include Jersey or Isle of Man either. The other standard that is commonly used is the ISO-3166 country codes standard. It *does* include Jersey and Isle of Man but does not include England, Scotland or Wales. From a technical standpoint I think it would make more sense to use the ISO-3166 list, which recognizes Scotland, Wales and England as part of the UK but doesn't assign a numeric code to them.

 

However, in the case of creating a souvenir, in order to determine if a specific cache found is in a souvenir region it has to have a country or state code (from the GS list). GS *could* create a country code for Scotland, Wales, and England but what would they do about all of the caches there which currently have a country designation as United Kingdom?

 

BTW, lest anyone think I'm arguing against souvenirs for England, Wales, and England I thought that when GS created souvenirs for the regions in Ireland it should have, instead, created a Ireland "country" souvenir and created souvenirs for each region in the UK. GS already has "state level" regions defined (South England, North Wales, etc) and could have used those regions. They wouldn't be *country* souvenirs but it would have broken down the UK into smaller regions.

Edited by NYPaddleCacher

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The UN geopolitical ontology only includes countries and transnational regions (North Africa). I have built a dataset which uses the UN geopolitical ontology for countries then links each country to geonames to obtain a list of first order administration divisions (states, provinces). GS has first level administration divisions for many countries but not all and I have no idea how they've constructed that list.

 

As I said, they made it up (with the UK reviewers at the time).

 

My only point was: GS could decide to award souvenirs for these "states" (regions) if they wanted. e.g. "Southern England". Or, they could award a souvenir for "England" if you find a cache in any of the 10 English Regions they have defined. (And similarly for Scotland and Wales). Or they could do nothing and leave the UK with only the country souvenir.

 

I wasn't suggesting they treat England, Scotland and Wales as country, as they already have the UK as a country. I was suggesting they could create a souvenir based on multiple regions mapping to one souvenir, but that this would be unique (it hasn't been done for other countries).

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The UN geopolitical ontology only includes countries and transnational regions (North Africa). I have built a dataset which uses the UN geopolitical ontology for countries then links each country to geonames to obtain a list of first order administration divisions (states, provinces). GS has first level administration divisions for many countries but not all and I have no idea how they've constructed that list.

 

As I said, they made it up (with the UK reviewers at the time).

 

My only point was: GS could decide to award souvenirs for these "states" (regions) if they wanted. e.g. "Southern England". Or, they could award a souvenir for "England" if you find a cache in any of the 10 English Regions they have defined. (And similarly for Scotland and Wales). Or they could do nothing and leave the UK with only the country souvenir.

 

I wasn't suggesting they treat England, Scotland and Wales as country, as they already have the UK as a country. I was suggesting they could create a souvenir based on multiple regions mapping to one souvenir, but that this would be unique (it hasn't been done for other countries).

 

Depending on how they've written it it could be more effort than they're prepared to invest, and it might also set a precedent that they don't want to see being brought up to justify future requests.

 

Personally I'm not that bothered about souvenirs so I don't really care, but having said that I wouldn't want to see souvenirs created for the purely arbitrary "States" we have created in the UK, better to just leave the one UK souvenir than that.

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I no almost nothing about what is considered a "state" or whatever, but I do think we should have souvenirs for Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland, and England. Of course you should take my opinion as little more than some strangers two cents as I haven't even been to the UK. I would just like to see souvenirs for each of these distinct regions of the UK.

Edited by marvin03
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On a close topic, under Statistics - Maps, I would like to see the states of Australia listed separately as they are done for Canada and the USA. Australia is a continent and it's a long way to travel between states and territories, so it would be nice to have the find numbers, as is done in Canada and USA, listed for each state. Australia is the only continent with only an overall find number. The continent of Europe has its own bit, so why not the continent of Australia. We are just just lumped in with Oceania.

Edited by Goldenwattle
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3 hours ago, Goldenwattle said:

 

 

3 hours ago, Goldenwattle said:

Australia is the only continent with only an overall find number.

I take that back, we are not the only continent to have it's own map. Only North America and Europe do, but it was possible to make two maps for North America, but other continents don't even have one.

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