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j0ckser

Benchmarks - Canada

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Alberta used to have a cache series called Brass Caps. They are survey benchmarks, but 'the program' was essentially a moveable cache. How it worked is irrelevant here. I want to find out if the benchmark idea can be used in Canada, perhaps starting in Alberta as many of us here are familiar with what they look like.

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Posted (edited)

You may find Canadian Benchmarks to be of interest to your idea.

 

Thanks for your speedy reply. I guess I need to understand how benchmarks (BMs) are handled as geocaches in the US, so that same approach could be used in Canada.

 

Specifically:

 

1. How does Groundspeak get the BM coords?

2. How are cachers notified about where BMs are located?

3. What process do cachers use to show that they have found a BM?

4. What credit do cachers get for 'discovering' a BM?

 

What other questions do I need to ask?

Edited by j0ckser
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1. How does Groundspeak get the BM coords?

They got a snapshot of the National Geodetic Survey data base in about 2000 or 2001. They appear to not plan to ever update that. The information is still available from NGS but not in the exact form they used back then as a compact disk.

 

2. How are cachers notified about where BMs are located?

Search options at https://www.geocaching.com/mark/ or "Nearest Benchmark" on cache pages.

 

3. What process do cachers use to show that they have found a BM?

A log just like for a cache, except that they are encouraged to not be secretive. It is good to give updates to the to-reach, coordinates if the original ones were scaled and far off, and pictures.

 

4. What credit do cachers get for 'discovering' a BM?

They do not count toward cache find totals but are reported separately.

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I list my Benchmark finds and photos as Waymarks in the US Benchmarks category. I found (not recovered) four BM's recently, all are disks as described except one, and it is a brass rod in a rock out cropping. The coordinates were within about 75 feet, the description of the out cropping seemed correct, but I could not locate a Benchmark Disk as it was described. Take in account that I am new to seeking Benchmarks, and the ones that I have found have been by accident.

 

Maybe someone here can take a look and give me an educated opinion?

GA 1330

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Posted (edited)

Your question should have been in a new thread instead of hijacking this one. But since we're here ...

 

Coordinates were scaled, and could easily be 100 ft or more off so they don't prove anything.

 

The disk had stamping on it (4032.531 U 327 1953), and was not just a rod.

 

If the object you found looks like a stem with the disk pried off of it (torn metal), and all the distance in the description check out, including 6 FEET ABOVE LEVEL OF ROAD, then you have a FOUND POOR. Also look for a depression cut in the rock about the diameter of a disk, which would often be made to seat the disk solidly against the rock. I don't see that clearly in the picture.

 

If this is a nice uniform undamaged brass rod, which the picture sort of suggests, or the distances don't make sense on that rock, then it is somebody else's mark and not the one on the data sheet, so if you looked very thoroughly at those distances then I'd log a NOT FOUND.

Edited by Bill93
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1. How does Groundspeak get the BM coords?

They got a snapshot of the National Geodetic Survey data base in about 2000 or 2001. They appear to not plan to ever update that. The information is still available from NGS but not in the exact form they used back then as a compact disk.

 

2. How are cachers notified about where BMs are located?

Search options at https://www.geocaching.com/mark/ or "Nearest Benchmark" on cache pages.

 

3. What process do cachers use to show that they have found a BM?

A log just like for a cache, except that they are encouraged to not be secretive. It is good to give updates to the to-reach, coordinates if the original ones were scaled and far off, and pictures.

 

4. What credit do cachers get for 'discovering' a BM?

They do not count toward cache find totals but are reported separately.

 

Thank you Bill93

 

I guess the next part is to find out if Groundspeak would entertain the idea of allowing Canadian benchmarks to be logged. I'm willing to contact the relevant department in Ottawa but only if Groudspeak says 'yes'. Maybe Canada's 150 BD would be an appropriate nudge?

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Your question should have been in a new thread instead of hijacking this one. But since we're here ...

 

Well, this part of the forums is not very active and I did not know where else to ask my question.

 

Thanks for your answer, but since we are here, I'm not really that ignorant to finding a Benchmark. That is the only rock outcropping in the area and it's a brass rod, no indentation of a BM, with an X in the middle.

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Groundspeak is already allowing Canadian benchmarks to be logged. As Manville Possum suggested, Canadian benchmarks is a Waymarking category. If the Canadian benchmark that you found is already in that Waymarking category, you can log a visit. If the benchmark is not in the Waymarking category, you are encouraged to create a waymark for that benchmark. Check out that site suggested by Manville Possum.

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Groundspeak is already allowing Canadian benchmarks to be logged. As Manville Possum suggested, Canadian benchmarks is a Waymarking category. If the Canadian benchmark that you found is already in that Waymarking category, you can log a visit. If the benchmark is not in the Waymarking category, you are encouraged to create a waymark for that benchmark. Check out that site suggested by Manville Possum.

 

I just listed 3 to be published that have not seen daylight in half a century, and hijacked the thread. I'm a Waymarker, and we hijack stuff. :laughing: Yes, it's an inside joke. :D

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I did not know where else to ask my question.

Right forum, but there's a New Topic button.

 

... That is the only rock outcropping in the area and it's a brass rod, no indentation of a BM, with an X in the middle.

What about distance measurements? Is it the right distance from a road, right height from road, right size rock, and right distance from highest point? The X certainly doesn't sound right for a stem remaining from a disk.

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Bill, my Waymarking friends in Canada also enjoy Benchmarking. But no, that gave me no right to wade into your forums and ask a question without creating a formal thread.

 

The brass rod that I found is not a broken stem, and I did not find this one by it's coordinates, but from it's data sheet from geocaching.com

Everything seems correct, except the coordinates were a little off, and it's a rod and not a disk as noted.

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j0ckser,

 

Maybe part way off your original 'Benchmarks - Canada' question, but there are quite a few 'off-set' marks north of the Medicine Line that have a PID and are in the Geocache database.

 

Enter this one: 'TH0878'ABOUT 2-1/2 MILES NORTHWEST OF INTERNATIONAL BOUNDARY MONUMENT 554', on the Benchmark Hunting page in the box titled: Search for Local Benchmarks > By Point ID (PID): > Go > Nearest; and then scroll to other PIDs that are directly east or west of this one.

 

I have seen this one. Scabbed a photo onto TH0829. Other information there which you may be interested in. And there is a string in this forum from awhile back dealing with the same subject. kayakbird

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Posted (edited)

Groundspeak is already allowing Canadian benchmarks to be logged. As Manville Possum suggested, Canadian benchmarks is a Waymarking category. If the Canadian benchmark that you found is already in that Waymarking category, you can log a visit. If the benchmark is not in the Waymarking category, you are encouraged to create a waymark for that benchmark. Check out that site suggested by Manville Possum.

I must confess to being confused - how does Waymarking tie in to my 'found' caches against my Geocaching profile?

Edited by j0ckser
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Your count of found geocaches does not include your logs for benchmarks and waymarks, as they are not geocaches.

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