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VinnieX

How do I convert DM.M coordinates?

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I'm trying to complete part two of a multi and the CO has not respond to my request for assistance.

 

The coordinates given for part two is as follows (these numbers were drilled like dice numbers, all on one long piece, in order as you see it below so the numbers and order are absolutely correct):

 

[numbers redacted]

The hint the CO gives is "Dots = lat,lon in DM.M"

 

No matter what convertor I use, none of them say they are DM.M format. My GPS and GEOCACHING.com uses the DMS (N XX° XX.XXX W YYY° YY.YYY) style format

I've tried converting for micro coordinates and the results are invalid coordinates (closest thing to DM.M I could find is Day Minute Micro):

[Numbers and conversion math redacted]

 

Google earth and Google maps both have different (about half a mile) difference in [solution redacted]

 

A couple of convertors gave me [solution redacted], problem is that is a lot further away from the original cache to be valid, part two is within .15 miles, and short at least on number in length.

All other convertors give me at least one if not two too many numbers to work properly.

 

So what is DM.M format above?

How do I convert it to xxx xx.xxx (DMS that GC.com and my GPS uses, Garmin 64ST)? My Garmin has a ton of different formats, not match the DM.M numbers give by the CO.

 

There are no DNF's for this cache. Everyone seems to find part two pretty easy.

Also, it's only rated a 2 star on difficulty.

I've been GC'ing for about two years, never seen this format before.

 

HELP please,

Thank you,

Kevin (VinnieX)

Edited by Keystone
spoiler information removed by moderator

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VinnieX, according to Groundspeak's Terms of Use, section 2.d.,

You agree not to:

...

Publish on our websites the solutions, hints, spoilers, or any hidden coordinates for any geocache without consent from the geocache owner.

 

At the very least, please edit your post so that it does not have the "absolutely correct" numbers.

 

geocaching.com doesn't use Degrees Minutes Seconds. Check out this page on coordinate formats.

 

The final stage of a puzzle is supposed to be within 2 miles of the posted coordinates, unless it was listed before this guideline took effect. If there are intermediate stages, they are not subject to this distance limit, however.

Edited by msrubble

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I edited the post to remove the spoiler information, which easily allowed me to locate the multicache in question. The OP is welcome to re-create the information using totally made-up numbers.

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The final stage of a puzzle is supposed to be within 2 miles of the posted coordinates...

The cache in question is a multicache. I wanted to clarify this so as not to mislead or confuse the OP about listing guideline requirements.

 

Major hint for the OP: The information given in the public cache description is an accurate description of how to get to the final location.

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I'd see DM.M as degree minute.minute. This is the standard GS lat lon format.

 

Hans

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Thanks for removing the numbers, sorry about that.

 

The Cache says part two is within .15 miles from part 1. I wasn't stating the rules for a multi, simply what the cache says.

 

Ok, so here is where I am still confused.

 

DM.M is posted above by Hans as the standard. What does that look like in long format?

 

xxx.xxxxxx or xxx xx.xxxx

xx.xxxxxx or xx xx.xxxx

 

How do I convert the coordinates from part 1 to match GC.com and my 64ST format as "xxx xx.xxx"?

None of the sites have an output to match the format I need. Most have a format to match either of the above formats for input so not sure which is correct and how to get the correct conversion.

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[...]

DM.M is posted above by Hans as the standard. What does that look like in long format?

[...]

 

It looks like this:

hddd mm.mmm (xxx xx.xxxx)

h=header (ie: N E W S) d= degree m= minute

 

Hans

Edited by HHL

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I think H actually stands for "Hemisphere."

 

Right you are. smile.gif

But header isn't wrong at all and way easier to remember for a newbie.

[end of hairsplitting]

 

Hans

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xxx.xxxxxx or xxx xx.xxxx

xx.xxxxxx or xx xx.xxxx

 

How do I convert the coordinates from part 1 to match GC.com and my 64ST format as "xxx xx.xxx"?

None of the sites have an output to match the format I need. Most have a format to match either of the above formats for input so not sure which is correct and how to get the correct conversion.

To convert xxx.xxxxxx to xxx xx.xxxx you multiply 60 by .xxxxxx. Here is an example for you.

-117.363786 = -117 (60 X .363786) = W 117 21.827

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Thanks for removing the numbers, sorry about that.

 

The Cache says part two is within .15 miles from part 1. I wasn't stating the rules for a multi, simply what the cache says.

 

Ok, so here is where I am still confused.

 

DM.M is posted above by Hans as the standard. What does that look like in long format?

 

xxx.xxxxxx or xxx xx.xxxx

xx.xxxxxx or xx xx.xxxx

 

How do I convert the coordinates from part 1 to match GC.com and my 64ST format as "xxx xx.xxx"?

None of the sites have an output to match the format I need. Most have a format to match either of the above formats for input so not sure which is correct and how to get the correct conversion.

Have you posted a cache log note about your progress (not specific coordinates, just in general) and that you're stuck? If so, you did as much as you can for now. I'd put that cache at the bottom of the pile and go find other caches. I always mention puzzle confusion in my cache log. I'm also the one who seems to get cache errors corrected on new caches, by figuring out where the typos are. The Cache Owner fixes it, and the FTF people then are able to go find the cache right away. :ph34r:

 

If it's super tough to figure out, take a break and find other caches. Some of these puzzles are designed to be at least a mild mystery to solve. If Forum participants work together or even just to provide hints to solve it, that's pretty unfair to the Cache Owner. On the other hand, if the puzzle is not understandable, ask the Cache Owner. If the CO is unresponsive, take a break and find other caches. If you're otherwise excellent at solving puzzles in general, you will see a ton of the same kind of coord formats, and soon recognize them.

 

But here's one site that has outputs to match formats you need:

http://boulter.com/gps/?c=N+33%C2%B0+25.754%27+W+084%C2%B0+27.125%27#N%2033%B0%2025.754%27%20W%20084%B0%2027.125%27

 

It usually works very well, copied from a cache page, copied from Google, or typed with or without typing the "degree" symbol. Plus it shows a map so you can see if you're way off.

Edited by kunarion

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[...]

How do I convert the coordinates from part 1 to match GC.com and my 64ST format as "xxx xx.xxx"?

[...]

 

Have a look there:

GPS Calc (click here)

 

Hans

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The hint the CO gives is "Dots = lat,lon in DM.M"

 

No matter what convertor I use, none of them say they are DM.M format. My GPS and GEOCACHING.com uses the DMS (N XX° XX.XXX W YYY° YY.YYY) style format

You don't need to do any conversions, because the format that the CO has told you the solution is in is the same as the one you're using in your GPS.

 

When the CO says "DM.M", what they're describing is "degrees, minutes, decimal minutes", which is the same as the standard format on Geocaching.com. It's 2-3 digits for the degrees, then two digits for the whole portion of the minutes, then a fraction of the minutes. It's typically written as "ddd mm.mmm".

 

Now, for the cache in question, you just need to insert the numbers from the puzzle directly into this format. For example, let's assume that the numbers you get from solving the puzzle are:

501234510054321

 

Plunking those into the "ddd mm.mmm" format gives:

50 12.345 100 54.321

 

If it isn't specified as part of the puzzle, you can safely assume that the hemisphere (N/S and E/W) will be the same as the posted coordinates on the cache listing. Since your profile says you're from California, it would be N and W, so the final coordinates would be:

N50 12.345 W100 54.321

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Thanks all for the help, here is what ended up happening and to clarify a couple of things.

 

The format the CO said the numbers were in was DM.m and had 8 and 9 numbers like this, xxx xx.xxxx or xxx.xxxxxx. It's just a long set of numbers without the decimal but he said it's DM.m format which would be the xxx xx.xxxx.

GC.com uses three after the decimal point. So those are not the same, and now not real sure which format is DM.m :o

 

Multiplying by .6, tried that, WAY OFF and did not work. :(

 

I took the numbers given at stage one and converted to xx.xxxxx format, then changed the format in my GPS and plugged it in since it doesn't have a format to match the DM.m format with four decimal places.

 

WOW, anyway, for a new guy to GPS and the 20-30 formats that my GPS can use, it's confusing. When I was changing the format in my 64ST, there was page after page after page.... Wow, would have thought something like this would have had a bit more standardization, at least down to a couple at least.

 

"What are your coordinates?"

Reply "What format do you use?"

Reply "What format do you use?"

Who's on first, anyway, rant over... :D

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VinnieX, I suspect you are overthinking this. I changed my earlier reply to you when I noticed something about the numbers you had as your solution. Maybe set this aside for awhile, and come back to it later with fresh eyes.

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From reading this thread I wouldn't expect you needed to convert anywhere.

 

Unless something isn't xx xx.xxx there shouldn't be a conversion. Unless you changed your GPS it should also be xx xx.xxx

 

In 3 different Garmin GPS units I've owned, they all show the coordinates in xx xx.xxx format. Same for any Android or iPhone app I've used.

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Unless you changed your GPS it should also be xx xx.xxx
Depends on the GPS. The one I purchased most recently came configured for decimal degrees (xx.xxxxx) rather than for decimal minutes (xx xx.xxx).

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The format the CO said the numbers were in was DM.m and had 8 and 9 numbers like this, xxx xx.xxxx or xxx.xxxxxx. It's just a long set of numbers without the decimal but he said it's DM.m format which would be the xxx xx.xxxx.

GC.com uses three after the decimal point. So those are not the same, and now not real sure which format is DM.m :o

It's very unlikely that the solution to the puzzle will have four decimal places on the minutes. The accuracy of consumer GPS devices isn't good enough to take advantage of the precision represented by that fourth digit.

 

If the CO has said the solution is in DM.m format, then (assuming the cache is in California) you should have 15 digits (for the sake of discussion, assume they're abcdefghijklmno) and the coordinates will be in the format "N ab cd.efg W hij kl.mno". It looks like most of your recent finds have been in the same general area, so assuming the cache in question is in the same general area, the first two digits of the solution (ab in the example above) should be "35" (ie. the degrees of the latitude) and the "hij" digits should be "117" (ie. the degrees of the longitude). The next two digits after each of those (cd and kl) will be the whole portion of the minutes. The remaining digits (efg and mno) will be the decimal portion of the minutes.

 

If the total number of digits that you get from the puzzle isn't 15, then the format is actually something different than what the CO is telling you, which could explain why things have been so confusing.

 

Edit: I just did some searching and identified the cache in question, and I see you actually found it already. You seem to have left that piece of information out of your most recent post. :laughing: Good job on figuring things out and making the find!

Edited by The A-Team

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If the total number of digits that you get from the puzzle isn't 15, then the format is actually something different than what the CO is telling you, which could explain why things have been so confusing.
It's rather academic at this point, but FWIW...

 

I've solved a few puzzle caches where the puzzle produced more than 15 digits, but in those cases, it was pretty clear to me that the extra digits were essentially irrelevant decimal places (e.g., N ab cd.efghi W jkl mn.opqrs) that were included because they were needed to make the puzzle work.

 

I've solved lots of puzzle caches where the puzzle produced fewer than 15 digits. Usually, it's pretty clear that the puzzle is producing only the least-significant six digits (e.g., N 37 15.abc W 121 57.def), eight digits (e.g., N 37 1a.bcd W 121 5e.fgh), or ten digits (e.g., N 37 ab.cde W 121 fg.hij). But there were a few that produced something else, and figuring out what they were producing was part of the puzzle. But puzzle caches like that are rare in my experience.

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