+jusb Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 Hello all...I would like some advice. I own a multicache and to get the coordinates for the final, one must answer six pretty easy multiple choice questions. One day, a cacher couldn't find the final and decided it was missing. So s/he thought s/he would do me a favor by replacing it. A few days later I checked on it and discovered, no- it was not missing. Apparently that cacher got the coordinates wrong-perhaps answering a question wrong. Now, over the past few weeks some cachers have found the "replacement" cache and logged it as "found". Meanwhile, others have found the actual cache as well. I am leaning towards deleting the found logs for those who found the replacement. Should I do this or just forget about it? I don't want to be an uptight jerk, but I think it is unfair to those who got the questions right and did find the correct cache. I tried to find the replacement myself so I could throw it away but was unable to. I also posted a note on the cache page asking that if one should find the replacement ( a baggie rather than the pill bottle) to throw it away and keep looking. Any advice is appreciated- Thanks Quote Link to comment
+cerberus1 Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 Up to you. Depends on how strongly you feel about it. Not sure how this throwdown thing got started, but it sure is annoying sometimes.... There's some Groundspeak info here on throwdowns Quote Link to comment
+jusb Posted June 11, 2016 Author Share Posted June 11, 2016 Thanks for the link. Here is my cache My link Quote Link to comment
+T.D.M.22 Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 The person who put the replacement cache, delete it. They didn't find your cache (or any cache for the matter) Now you could delete the logs of Pele who found the replacement cache. The didn't find your cache after all. But I wouldn't, and I don't think you should either. It's not their fault, and they didn't know the found the wrong cache. Quote Link to comment
+MartyBartfast Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 The person who put the replacement cache, delete it. They didn't find your cache (or any cache for the matter) Now you could delete the logs of Pele who found the replacement cache. The didn't find your cache after all. But I wouldn't, and I don't think you should either. It's not their fault, and they didn't know the found the wrong cache. +1 Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 (edited) Hello all...I would like some advice. I own a multicache and to get the coordinates for the final, one must answer six pretty easy multiple choice questions. One day, a cacher couldn't find the final and decided it was missing. So s/he thought s/he would do me a favor by replacing it. A few days later I checked on it and discovered, no- it was not missing. Apparently that cacher got the coordinates wrong-perhaps answering a question wrong. Now, over the past few weeks some cachers have found the "replacement" cache and logged it as "found". Meanwhile, others have found the actual cache as well. I am leaning towards deleting the found logs for those who found the replacement. Should I do this or just forget about it? I don't want to be an uptight jerk, but I think it is unfair to those who got the questions right and did find the correct cache. I tried to find the replacement myself so I could throw it away but was unable to. I also posted a note on the cache page asking that if one should find the replacement ( a baggie rather than the pill bottle) to throw it away and keep looking. Any advice is appreciated- Thanks I noticed that the cache description did not indicate the type of container one should but looking for (until you added the note). Those that are finding the replacement aren't going to keep looking for another container after they've found what appears to be a cache at/near ground zero. The fact that others are finding the cache would suggest that either they all (including the person that dropped the throwdown) *did* answer the questions correctly or that either the C or F question is ambiguous. I wouldn't delete finds for those that found what they thought was the actual cache. You might want to add a sentence to the description indicting that it's a pill bottle. That note is going scroll down in the logs where future seekers won't see it. ETA: That's a nice way to do a multi at a rest stop. Edited June 11, 2016 by NYPaddleCacher Quote Link to comment
+Isonzo Karst Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 I completely agree with T.D.M.22 and the advice to add some container description to your listing. Quote Link to comment
+narcissa Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 If someone else found the throwdown, does that mean they made the same error? I would absolutely delete the charlatan who threw down the fake cache. This poor behaviour has no place in the game. I don't know about the others. I would investigate why cachers are making the same mistake and ending up in the same wrong spot. Quote Link to comment
+Bear and Ragged Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 Delete the log for the throwdown. Let the others know they didn't find your cache, but the throwdown... They may delete/edit their logs, based on your information. IF they dont... (I'd leave it to their own concience!) Quote Link to comment
+GeoLTL Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 Just a suggestion, but you might want to add a checksum so people know they're heading to the right coords. That way they're less likely to find the wrong container. Throwdowns should be outlawed. Ugh. I wouldn't delete the logs of people who didn't know, however. Innocent victims. Quote Link to comment
+MartyBartfast Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 I would also add a hint, something that will makeit clear that the throwdown location is NOT the place. Quote Link to comment
+NeverSummer Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 I would also take the time to contact a recent finder of the throwdown, and ask them to meet you there to find it. Once you find it, remove it, and then write an Owner Maintenance log. I'd delete the logs for those who logged the throwdown...only if it's clear as a bell what the container is that they *should* be finding at GZ. Going forward, any logs that aren't on the logbook from your next maintenance trip are much easier to make the call on deletion or not. Quote Link to comment
+Team Microdot Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 I would also take the time to contact a recent finder of the throwdown, and ask them to meet you there to find it. Once you find it, remove it, and then write an Owner Maintenance log. I'd delete the logs for those who logged the throwdown...only if it's clear as a bell what the container is that they *should* be finding at GZ. Going forward, any logs that aren't on the logbook from your next maintenance trip are much easier to make the call on deletion or not. Seems a bit harsh on the previous throwdown finder who has taken time out to meet you at GZ to assist you with your cache maintenance responsibilities to then delete their found log Quote Link to comment
+TheAuthorityFigures Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 If someone else found the throwdown, does that mean they made the same error? I would absolutely delete the charlatan who threw down the fake cache. This poor behaviour has no place in the game. I don't know about the others. I would investigate why cachers are making the same mistake and ending up in the same wrong spot. Yep. This. I would contact the folks who found the throwdown and get their story, how did they arrive at the cords that they did. They may even have the cords still in their gps'r and you can go directly to the offending throwdown. I'd also let those finds stand except for the person who threw it down. Quote Link to comment
+jusb Posted June 11, 2016 Author Share Posted June 11, 2016 Actually the type of container is listed in the description on the last line. Thanks for the input, everyone. I'm still torn on what to do. If they found the throwdown, it means they got the questions wrong and I don't really want to reward them with a "found". I think I will tweak the description page and leave the found logs alone. I think there are only four. And then after today I will delete those that find the replacement. Quote Link to comment
+narcissa Posted June 11, 2016 Share Posted June 11, 2016 Actually the type of container is listed in the description on the last line. Thanks for the input, everyone. I'm still torn on what to do. If they found the throwdown, it means they got the questions wrong and I don't really want to reward them with a "found". I think I will tweak the description page and leave the found logs alone. I think there are only four. And then after today I will delete those that find the replacement. This seems fair. The people who found the throwdown made an honest mistake and were misled by someone else's dishonesty. Unfortunately, this is a reality of the game now. Quote Link to comment
+WarNinjas Posted June 12, 2016 Share Posted June 12, 2016 Yea I wouldn't delete the ones who found the throw down. They probably didn't know. I am working on a streak of almost 5 years and would be very upset if someone deleted a found it log on a cache I found. It might be my only one of the day and if I didn't know better it would really suck. It is the guy who placed the throw down not the finder who actually found something not knowing better. Quote Link to comment
+justintim1999 Posted June 12, 2016 Share Posted June 12, 2016 I would, Contact the last finder of the throw-down and ask them for the coords they used. Find the container and remove it. Double check my math to make sure my coords are good. Let the cachers who found the throw-down keep their finds. Educate the cacher who placed the throw-down (in a polite way) and offer their container back. Quote Link to comment
+Mudfrog Posted June 12, 2016 Share Posted June 12, 2016 Actually the type of container is listed in the description on the last line. Thanks for the input, everyone. I'm still torn on what to do. If they found the throwdown, it means they got the questions wrong and I don't really want to reward them with a "found". I think I will tweak the description page and leave the found logs alone. I think there are only four. And then after today I will delete those that find the replacement. It sounds like you have question(s) that can be answered in more than one way. This needs to be remedied so that finders don't go wandering to the wrong place. I'd try to incorporate questions that require more specific answers. That's not always easy to do so yes, a geochecker of some sort might be good too. This won't stop throwdowns completely but it'll certainly help. Not sure about contacting the throwdowner and politely trying to educate them. For some, that may work but i've found that it may cause more angst than not. A lot of people dislike it when another person tries to tell them a different, even if it's the proper, way of doing things. My form of communication is to put the information in a note or maintenance log on the cache page. While i'm not rude, i do get to the point and let everyone who reads it know that throwdowns are not welcome. The perpetrator may not ever see it but at least it communicates to future finders the information and that i'll maintain my own cache. Quote Link to comment
+captnemo Posted June 12, 2016 Share Posted June 12, 2016 Have had two times on different caches with throw down caches. One was easy to fix. Went out and removed throw down and deleted the throw downers log. The other was a bit of a problem. I learned that there was a throw down from a online log where the finder made a comment that a film container was not a regular size cache. Went out and sure enough there was a throw down which I removed. The real cache was in place so I took both log books and deleted the throw downers log. I did not delete others who had used the throw down as they were victims. I also posted a note that throw downs are not accepted and that in the future all online logs without a signature in the cache log would be deleted. Every so often I go out and check the cache log against the on line logs and have had to delete several over the years. I should note that this cache is close to the start of a power trail that does support throw downs. Quote Link to comment
SicilianCyclops Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 (edited) I just got a log which was the first one from this person in this state and he had 16 finds. The kicker, however, was that he only wrote "tnln". The problem is that it's an urban micro cache which is a centrifuge container. Way too small to hold anything other than a log. A bit suspicious to say the least. I usually don't look over paper logs, but this one has me curious. Edited June 13, 2016 by SicilianCyclops Quote Link to comment
+fuzziebear3 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 I just got a log which was the first one from this person in this state and he had 16 finds. The kicker, however, was that he only wrote "tnln". The problem is that it's an urban micro cache which is a centrifuge container. Way too small to hold anything other than a log. A bit suspicious to say the least. I usually don't look over paper logs, but this one has me curious. He may just log that on all caches, regardless of size. You could go check and see if his name is on the paper if you are concerned. Also, he is new, so may just not know much about it. Quote Link to comment
+cerberus1 Posted June 13, 2016 Share Posted June 13, 2016 I just got a log which was the first one from this person in this state and he had 16 finds. The kicker, however, was that he only wrote "tnln". The problem is that it's an urban micro cache which is a centrifuge container. Way too small to hold anything other than a log. A bit suspicious to say the least. I usually don't look over paper logs, but this one has me curious. He may just log that on all caches, regardless of size. You could go check and see if his name is on the paper if you are concerned. Also, he is new, so may just not know much about it. +1 We know long-time cachers who've written TNLNSL on every cache they've found, including nanos. Quote Link to comment
+ArtieD Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 (edited) I would just delete the log of the person who placed the throwdown. The ones who found it after that person did not know it was the wrong cache, so they should not be punished. That said, we did have a cacher in the area that found a throwdown near their real cache and deleted all the logs in it. Let's just say it created some real angst and led to ill will. Edited June 14, 2016 by Arthur & Trillian Quote Link to comment
+NeverSummer Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 I would also take the time to contact a recent finder of the throwdown, and ask them to meet you there to find it. Once you find it, remove it, and then write an Owner Maintenance log. I'd delete the logs for those who logged the throwdown...only if it's clear as a bell what the container is that they *should* be finding at GZ. Going forward, any logs that aren't on the logbook from your next maintenance trip are much easier to make the call on deletion or not. Seems a bit harsh on the previous throwdown finder who has taken time out to meet you at GZ to assist you with your cache maintenance responsibilities to then delete their found log Not at all how I meant it, but I can see how that reads. Also, if you're there with a previous finder, I'd show them the actual container, have them sign it, and then they don't have to delete anything. Quote Link to comment
+niraD Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 I just got a log which was the first one from this person in this state and he had 16 finds. The kicker, however, was that he only wrote "tnln". The problem is that it's an urban micro cache which is a centrifuge container. Way too small to hold anything other than a log. A bit suspicious to say the least. I usually don't look over paper logs, but this one has me curious.He may just log that on all caches, regardless of size. You could go check and see if his name is on the paper if you are concerned.Also, he is new, so may just not know much about it. +1We know long-time cachers who've written TNLNSL on every cache they've found, including nanos. FWIW, I have included "TNLNSL" in logs for nano-caches and for events. (The acronym is just part of a longer log though, not the entire log.) Actually, I leave my personal signature items in larger caches, so the only time I use "TNLNSL" in a log is for nano-caches and for events, where I cannot leave even a small coin-sized signature item. Quote Link to comment
+cerberus1 Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 I just got a log which was the first one from this person in this state and he had 16 finds. The kicker, however, was that he only wrote "tnln". The problem is that it's an urban micro cache which is a centrifuge container. Way too small to hold anything other than a log. A bit suspicious to say the least. I usually don't look over paper logs, but this one has me curious.He may just log that on all caches, regardless of size. You could go check and see if his name is on the paper if you are concerned.Also, he is new, so may just not know much about it. +1We know long-time cachers who've written TNLNSL on every cache they've found, including nanos. FWIW, I have included "TNLNSL" in logs for nano-caches and for events. (The acronym is just part of a longer log though, not the entire log.) Actually, I leave my personal signature items in larger caches, so the only time I use "TNLNSL" in a log is for nano-caches and for events, where I cannot leave even a small coin-sized signature item. Sorry, I should have included that TNLNSL was part of their normal, written log. Quote Link to comment
+NYPaddleCacher Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 Actually the type of container is listed in the description on the last line. Thanks for the input, everyone. I'm still torn on what to do. If they found the throwdown, it means they got the questions wrong and I don't really want to reward them with a "found". If multiple people are getting one or more of the question wrong and are making the same mistake then the question being asked may be ambiguous. There may be more than one "correct" answer Quote Link to comment
+niraD Posted June 14, 2016 Share Posted June 14, 2016 If multiple people are getting one or more of the question wrong and are making the same mistake then the question being asked may be ambiguous. There may be more than one "correct" answerYep. I've refined the description of my EarthCache a couple times in response to email conversations with those who sent answers that weren't what I was expecting. Quote Link to comment
+justintim1999 Posted June 15, 2016 Share Posted June 15, 2016 Is it possible that they are getting the questions right and the throwdown is close enough to be mistaken for the original cache? Need to find the throwdown and get it removed. Quote Link to comment
+jusb Posted June 18, 2016 Author Share Posted June 18, 2016 Is it possible that they are getting the questions right and the throwdown is close enough to be mistaken for the original cache? Need to find the throwdown and get it removed. I looked for it but was unable to find it. I don't think there is any thing close to where it is hidden where the throwdown could be. Unfortunately I had to hide it in a LP since there is no other possible hiding spot and all the lp's are spaced far out. Quote Link to comment
+jusb Posted June 18, 2016 Author Share Posted June 18, 2016 Actually the type of container is listed in the description on the last line. Thanks for the input, everyone. I'm still torn on what to do. If they found the throwdown, it means they got the questions wrong and I don't really want to reward them with a "found". If multiple people are getting one or more of the question wrong and are making the same mistake then the question being asked may be ambiguous. There may be more than one "correct" answer No, the answers are pretty clear and easy. They are found on info plaques in the rest area building and just outside. Quote Link to comment
+jusb Posted June 18, 2016 Author Share Posted June 18, 2016 Actually the type of container is listed in the description on the last line. Thanks for the input, everyone. I'm still torn on what to do. If they found the throwdown, it means they got the questions wrong and I don't really want to reward them with a "found". If multiple people are getting one or more of the question wrong and are making the same mistake then the question being asked may be ambiguous. There may be more than one "correct" answer No, the answers are pretty clear and easy. They are found on info plaques in the rest area building and just outside. Quote Link to comment
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