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I am not understanding GPS's..HELP!?!?!


CJAX2

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I currently Geocache with my phone, but I am tired of the battery running out so quickly, not being able to see the screen in the sunlight, and the signal jumping all over the place. Grr. Anyway, I have been looking and looking and looking, and I am just plain confused about GPS devices. I want one that can also be used in the car (Basically, I want one that does the same things the app on my phone does [only better] and I had no idea most GPS's don't come with maps?? I thought that was what a GPS was FOR!) So, I am under the impression that; A. they don't come with maps; B. You can't use them for driving C. You have to also purchase a some kind of GPS subscription to even be able to use it?? Are these impressions all correct? If I pay for my yearly subscription as a premium geocaching member, I won't be able to use the convenient app for it on the GPS? Someone please help me out here :( I do not have any tech savvy friends that can answer these questions and the internet is less than helpful (too much information that just confuses me). For reference, I have been looking at getting the Garmin eTrex 30x handheld. I simply cannot spend more than about $300 on a GPS. Should I be looking at something else?? Thank you so much for any help!

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Your impressions are pretty much all correct. Looks like you've been doing your homework/research :).

 

Based on your concerns, here's what I would suggest: Go check out local pawn shops and do some searching on craigslist for used car GPSs. You can usually pick up a used car gps for next to nothing ($15-30) at a pawn shop. Leave that one mounted in the car for road navigation.

 

For the GPSr to use for actual caching, I recommend the Garmin 62s or 62st. I scooped mine off of ebay for $100. It needed a new screen which i got off of amazon for $20. I'm in the same boat as you with the battery life on the cell phone. There are volumes of discussion to be found here on the boards regarding pros/cons of cell phone vs. GPSr so i won't even touch that here.

 

edit:

You could, in fact, get a high end handheld GPS and load it with maps to do navigation but I find they're just too small. Personally, i know the area i'm caching in. So once I see the cache online using the site map, I pretty much know the general area I'm going to so i'll just drive there. Once I'm close, I'll start spot-checking my location with th GPSr, get close, then park.

Edited by zihyer
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Another idea. If you have a local facebook site for selling things in your area, post a "wanted" or "LTB" ad there for a GPS. Post one for each - car and handheld. I did this and got several responses. Since almost everyone either uses their built-in car GPSs or phones to navigate now, lots of folks have their old car GPS units sitting in a box somewhere in their garage.

 

You're almost guaranteed to get bites on an ad like that.

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A lot of people have this preconceived notion that a GPS is an automatic navigation device, and that's just not true, though it can be a byproduct of the primary purpose of GPS, which is to communicate with satellites orbiting the earth and return back your location on the planet. In that regard, the only data being passed back and forth between the satellites and your GPS units are 3 numbers - an x coordinate (longitude), a y coordinate (latitude), and a z coordinate (elevation). Yes, we get a bit more information from the satellites such as the current time, but the basic premise of GPS is simply to spit back those 3 numbers so that you can locate yourself on a map and navigate your way with greater speed and accuracy than estimating your position manually using the same triangulation techniques with your compass.

 

Of course, the byproduct of this information is that the GPS can be built with a computer which, if you know the coordinates of your destination, can tell you what direction you need to travel and how far it will be. And since the GPS samples your location at regular time intervals, the distance and time between samples are used to calculate your speed and estimate time to your destination. And that's all you really need to navigate to a geocache. That's how it was done until mapping handhelds became a thing and became affordable.

 

Ok. Technical notes aside, most hand-helds are difficult to use in the car, and you might find better luck using your phone for driving directions, and then switching over to a hand-held GPS while on foot. The touch screen models (Oregon, Montana) are ok for vehicle navigation, but they are at the upper end or exceed your budget. All of the current GPS come with a basic basemap, the "T" models come with a better topographic map. Neither are routable... that is, you won't get turn-by-turn street directions. There are free routable maps (and detailed non-routable topo maps) out there, so you don't have to buy them. You don't need any kind of subscription to use a GPS. Access to the satellites is freely available. And be aware that a GPS does not directly access the internet, so you'll have to download geocaches ahead of time and install them on the GPS, keep them up to date yourself, and log your finds via the website or phone app.

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So, there is no way around the additional purchases of maps and GPS subscription to be able to use a GPS? I thought maybe I was just reading things wrong or not finding the right kind of info. (Maybe I was just hoping?) LOL

 

There are plenty of maps available for free. I have a car GPS (nuvi) and handheld (Oregon600) and use OSM (openstreetmap) on both. The Nuvi has European maps + lifetime updates so "locally" I'm set but I took the Nuvi on holiday to Australia and used the OSM map there for car navigation. No problems whatsoever.

My Oregon didn't come with maps (Oregon600, not 600T which has topomaps for extra $$)and I've used OSM maps locally and when on holiday in different countries. The same goes for my previous GPS (Garmin Colorado 300).

Loading maps on a Garmin unit is a piece of cake + you can just download a new one every few months to have the most up-to-date maps.

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So, there is no way around the additional purchases of maps and GPS subscription to be able to use a GPS?

I loaded street-routable maps for my convenience, the Garmin SD card map of the US, so I can easily switch the card to a new GPSr. There are some high-end GPSrs that have voice prompts like a Nuvi, but usually it's not ideal to use a handheld GPSr for street routing.

 

The GPSr comes with a very basic map, and shows some land features and major highways. If you use a Nuvi to direct you to an area, and especially if the caches are not along streets, you could get by without a particular map at all on the GPSr. If you hunt caches mainly at street-side, either load caches into the Nuvi, or load some street maps into the GPSr. But a Nuvi tends to have not much memory for "GPX" files, in which case you load caches with a special utility.

 

There are pros and cons to using a phone or handheld GPSr. My Garmin Oregon (with no GPS subscription) in concert with a Nuvi saves me a fortune over a smartphone data subscription, so for me, it was a no-brainer.

Edited by kunarion
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C. You have to also purchase a some kind of GPS subscription to even be able to use it??
Curious where you found info saying you needed some sorta subscription to use a GPSr.

I haven't spent extra on my GPSr since starting, in '04. :)

The only subscription based GPS I'm aware of is the DeLorme inReach. The current model doesn't support onboard maps though.

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C. You have to also purchase a some kind of GPS subscription to even be able to use it??
Curious where you found info saying you needed some sorta subscription to use a GPSr.

I haven't spent extra on my GPSr since starting, in '04. :)

The only subscription based GPS I'm aware of is the DeLorme inReach. The current model doesn't support onboard maps though.

There's also a satellite imagery subscription, from Garmin. It's a service that provides current satellite maps. Also, various companies offer subscriptions where you may access detailed trail maps. I somehow get by without any of that. :anicute:

Edited by kunarion
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So, there is no way around the additional purchases of maps and GPS subscription to be able to use a GPS? I thought maybe I was just reading things wrong or not finding the right kind of info. (Maybe I was just hoping?) LOL

 

There are plenty of maps available for free. I have a car GPS (nuvi) and handheld (Oregon600) and use OSM (openstreetmap) on both. The Nuvi has European maps + lifetime updates so "locally" I'm set but I took the Nuvi on holiday to Australia and used the OSM map there for car navigation. No problems whatsoever.

My Oregon didn't come with maps (Oregon600, not 600T which has topomaps for extra $$)and I've used OSM maps locally and when on holiday in different countries. The same goes for my previous GPS (Garmin Colorado 300).

Loading maps on a Garmin unit is a piece of cake + you can just download a new one every few months to have the most up-to-date maps.

I agree with this 100% I have just bought a 64ST and now wish I would have just gotten the 64s. No need for the garmin topo seeing as they are not routable and have very little detail. I bought my 64 from jet.com because they gave an extra 30$ off plus a few few extra $'s for the way you register or something like that. In reality you only need a base map to geocache but having topos and street info is a plus. Most newer GPSr's are paperless and just basically drag and drop file in the GPX file. I was a delorme user for years but since garmin bought delorme I thought I would go with garmin since no one at delorme could answer me if the PN-60 would be supported after the the sale goes through. It has been a huge learning curve for me and when I first got the 64 I thought "I am sending it back", but now after a month or so of use, I am finding it to be a great unit and I am slowly getting it modified to my liking. Wish it had a bigger screen but not a fan of touch screens so it is what it is.

 

As far as maps that is no biggie with garmin as I quickly found out. GPSfiledepot and Gmap OSM have everything you need to load great maps at little to no cost. If you use GPSfiledepot just remember to load my trails first and find the garmin folder it loaded in. Once you know that then just point any other downloads to that same folder. It is a bit of a learning curve but not to hard. With GMap OSM it puts it were you need it and then you just load it on the GPS from there. I am using garmin basecamp to load all of this. Hint is you install the maps with basecamp closed then open it and they will be there.

 

In the end a GPSr is a great investment not only for geocaching but a ton of other stuff. Depending on your money situation will depend on what you can get. I believe you could get a 64s for around 230$ from jet.com is they are still doing the first time discount. As I am learning this unit it is becoming a great caching unit and look forward to years of use from it. GPSr is the way to go, for me the 64st is working great and has been out long enough that most of the bugs have been worked out.

Edited by Team_Searchgeo
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I currently Geocache with my phone, but I am tired of the battery running out so quickly, not being able to see the screen in the sunlight, and the signal jumping all over the place. Grr. Anyway, I have been looking and looking and looking, and I am just plain confused about GPS devices. I want one that can also be used in the car (Basically, I want one that does the same things the app on my phone does [only better] and I had no idea most GPS's don't come with maps?? I thought that was what a GPS was FOR!) So, I am under the impression that; A. they don't come with maps; B. You can't use them for driving C. You have to also purchase a some kind of GPS subscription to even be able to use it?? Are these impressions all correct? If I pay for my yearly subscription as a premium geocaching member, I won't be able to use the convenient app for it on the GPS? Someone please help me out here :( I do not have any tech savvy friends that can answer these questions and the internet is less than helpful (too much information that just confuses me). For reference, I have been looking at getting the Garmin eTrex 30x handheld. I simply cannot spend more than about $300 on a GPS. Should I be looking at something else?? Thank you so much for any help!

 

use your smartphone, with OFFLINE mapping programs. it will do everything you need for mapping ( open street maps are free ) navigation (turn by turn and recording tracks) retrieving and storing geo caches, and do it all without a cellular signal.

 

the app I use for all of this is locus pro. no subscriptions, no service needed, nothing, just the phone.

 

if you want to use a waterproof phone, check out the prices of

rugby pro

Motorola moto g

and similar devices.they outperform stand alone GPS devices in both usability and sharing functionality.

 

and, it's usually in your pocket already.

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I currently Geocache with my phone, but I am tired of the battery running out so quickly, not being able to see the screen in the sunlight, and the signal jumping all over the place. Grr. Anyway, I have been looking and looking and looking, and I am just plain confused about GPS devices. I want one that can also be used in the car (Basically, I want one that does the same things the app on my phone does [only better] and I had no idea most GPS's don't come with maps?? I thought that was what a GPS was FOR!) So, I am under the impression that; A. they don't come with maps; B. You can't use them for driving C. You have to also purchase a some kind of GPS subscription to even be able to use it?? Are these impressions all correct? If I pay for my yearly subscription as a premium geocaching member, I won't be able to use the convenient app for it on the GPS? Someone please help me out here :( I do not have any tech savvy friends that can answer these questions and the internet is less than helpful (too much information that just confuses me). For reference, I have been looking at getting the Garmin eTrex 30x handheld. I simply cannot spend more than about $300 on a GPS. Should I be looking at something else?? Thank you so much for any help!

 

I would wait for a sale on the Garmin 64S or get a 62S if you can find one. Add a Garmin City Nav Map ( you get the whole US on a mini SD card, you put it in and you have detail maps of the whole US )...this is a great set up and is what I use and is just about in your budget.....no subscription needed, GPS reception is free. Your premium membership gives you all else that you need. I've traveled all 48 lower states using only a handheld...the map is great and I see where I am and where I want to go.

Later on you can pick up a used Nuvi on Ebay......I got a 780 and the caches load in as favorites so I can auto route to a cache for the few times I choose to do so.

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