PQ question

[+sydnsue]

I use PQs regularly but we are about to visit an area that has several thousand caches showing. We will be travelling all over the area so I need to load the whole area into my Oregon. Here is the difficult bit to explain. PQs will only find the first thousand so dividing the area into 1000 cache segments will overlap & create multiple repeats, all of which increases the GPX/zip file size unnecessarily. There is also the risk of missing caches in the gaps between the radius overlaps. I have read the way round this is to filter the caches by date, but there is no way of setting a date to grab the maximum quantity of caches without testing each with a submission. This will quickly overrun the daily limit as many tests are needed to hit a figure just below the 1000 limit.

Is there a better way to this? Ultimately I want say 5000 caches in my Oregon with minimal file size so as not to max out the memory.

I still think in this age of cheap memory and bandwidth, the 1000 limit is way too low. If I could grab the whole area and the 5000 caches in a single PQ, this would not be a problem.

Thanks for any help and apologies for the long query, but it is a difficult one to explain.

[+NanCycle]

but there is no way of setting a date to grab the maximum quantity of caches without testing each with a submission. This will quickly overrun the daily limit as many tests are needed to hit a figure just below the 1000 limit.

Is there a better way to this?

 

Yes there is. You do not need to actually run the PQ to test the results. Submit it without selecting a day to run and you can play with the results as much as you need to until you get what you want.

[+Lil Devil]

Is there a better way to this?

Split the area by "placed during." Set up several PQs, all which cover the entire geographic area, and set the first one for, say, all caches hidden in 2000-2005. Use the preview and adjust the dates until you get just under 1000. Then set the 2nd PQ for the next date range, such as 2005-2006. Continue until you get all the caches up to current.

[+HHL]

[...] and adjust the dates until you get just under 1000. Then set the 2nd PQ for the next date range, such as 2005-2006. Continue until you get all the caches up to current.

 

Or you do it with the help of this page (a trusted Groundspeak Api partner).

http://project-gc.com/Tools/PQSplit

 

Hans

[+Walts Hunting]

Or you could GSAK and get 6,000 at one time and then do overlapping queries into the same DB so there would only be one of each. You could then divide them into groups of less than 5,000 (I am guessing your Oregon has a 5,000 limit). Put one on a sdcard and the rest on a thumb drive. Then use someone's computer along the way to change them. Also if you have an android tablet or phone you can hook the oregon up with a OTG cable and change them yourself

[+Mineral2]

1. Overlapping caches isn't really an issue. Your Oregon only reads a cache once, so you might have 5000 caches in 5 files, but with overlap, it's really only 3000 caches, so you still have room for 2000 more.

 

2. Don't worry about file sizes. You're not going to max out free space with PQ files. Maps, yes.

 

3. I get that it's a new area and there are lots of caches and you want to make sure you have them all. But let's be realistic. If you're visiting for a few days or even a week, you're not going to look for thousands of caches in that time. If you're missing a few caches in small regions where the PQ's don't cover, don't sweat it. You still have plenty loaded to keep you busy. If there are specific parts of the area (parks, etc.) that you know you'll be for sure, center your PQ's around those spots so you'll at least have those covered.

 

4. Which Oregon do you use? If it's a 600/650 (t), you can load as many caches on there as you want, which means there's no real reason to be concerned with how many files you're loading up. If it's a 450/550 (t), they do start to get cranky as you approach that 5000 cache limit. Cranky = slow to load, especially the map.

 

5. Have a laptop? Bring it with you. If you don't have access to internet at the place you're staying, there are always coffee shops and libraries where you can get online and make new PQ's if you end up going somewhere unexpected.

[+Markwell]

Also - narrow your criteria.

 

Within 20 miles of my house, there are 5,242 caches that I have not found

• Weed out the 73 disabled - 5,169
  
• Caching on the fly - probably going to weed out terrain higher than 3.5 - leaving 5,107
  
• I hate parking lot caches - so weed out level 1.0 terrain* - Leaving 4,656
  
• Attribute exclusion - hate parking lot caches - so exclude "Park and Grab" - leaving 4,000
  
• Attribute exclusion - exclude Needs Maintenance - leaving 3,661
  
• Caching on the fly - let's assume that I'm only going to do Traditionals - leaving 2,944
  
• I really dislike micro caches (my preference) and there's a tendency around here to have nanos as "other" or "Not chosen" so only include Small, Regular or Large - leaving 1,098
  
• I'm sensitive to poison ivy - so exclude caches with poison plant attribute leaving 1,044
  
• Not really fond of ticks - exclude that attribute - leaving 983
  
• Take out the Access or Parking Fee - leaving 977
  
• Exclude "Front Yard (Private Residence)" - yech - leaving 974
  

 

So what started off as 5,242 caches in an area, I'm down to 974 caches - 18.6%

 

*I know - the PQ generator either does <= or >= but not between

[+sydnsue]

Thanks for the advice everyone. I never thought of using preview. Idiot. I'm not even a newbie. I had all the filters running to minimise the selection. The area we will visit is a large area (the Lake District & Yorks Dales UK) and we simply do not know where we will be walking. I'm a waterfall photographer so the rambling can be pretty diverse and random. Nice to hear the Oregon will not duplicate repeat caches in memory. Makes sense but did not know. Once again, thanks to you all. Guess what I'm doing this evening.

[+sydnsue]

Is there a better way to this?

Split the area by "placed during." Set up several PQs, all which cover the entire geographic area, and set the first one for, say, all caches hidden in 2000-2005. Use the preview and adjust the dates until you get just under 1000. Then set the 2nd PQ for the next date range, such as 2005-2006. Continue until you get all the caches up to current.

Thanks. That is exactly what I was doing but trying to hit the 1000 mark was the difficult bit, but I never even thought of preview. As I stated in my post - idiot.

[+sydnsue]

[...] and adjust the dates until you get just under 1000. Then set the 2nd PQ for the next date range, such as 2005-2006. Continue until you get all the caches up to current.

 

Or you do it with the help of this page (a trusted Groundspeak Api partner).

http://project-gc.com/Tools/PQSplit

 

Hans

Just had a look at this. Will give it a try. Thanks. As they say "It's good to talk".

[+sydnsue]

1. Overlapping caches isn't really an issue. Your Oregon only reads a cache once, so you might have 5000 caches in 5 files, but with overlap, it's really only 3000 caches, so you still have room for 2000 more.

 

2. Don't worry about file sizes. You're not going to max out free space with PQ files. Maps, yes.

 

3. I get that it's a new area and there are lots of caches and you want to make sure you have them all. But let's be realistic. If you're visiting for a few days or even a week, you're not going to look for thousands of caches in that time. If you're missing a few caches in small regions where the PQ's don't cover, don't sweat it. You still have plenty loaded to keep you busy. If there are specific parts of the area (parks, etc.) that you know you'll be for sure, center your PQ's around those spots so you'll at least have those covered.

 

4. Which Oregon do you use? If it's a 600/650 (t), you can load as many caches on there as you want, which means there's no real reason to be concerned with how many files you're loading up. If it's a 450/550 (t), they do start to get cranky as you approach that 5000 cache limit. Cranky = slow to load, especially the map.

 

5. Have a laptop? Bring it with you. If you don't have access to internet at the place you're staying, there are always coffee shops and libraries where you can get online and make new PQ's if you end up going somewhere unexpected.

Good to know about the overlapping.

The PQs I use will be saved for the next visit - just a refresh needed, so I need them all.

I use a 600. Good but I wish in this age of cheap chips, it was better CPU.

Laptop? I take a rucksack, camera gear, tripod, nibbles, wife, dog. That's more than enough for day in the hills. I suppose I could strap the laptop to the wife.

[+Mineral2]

1. Overlapping caches isn't really an issue. Your Oregon only reads a cache once, so you might have 5000 caches in 5 files, but with overlap, it's really only 3000 caches, so you still have room for 2000 more.

 

2. Don't worry about file sizes. You're not going to max out free space with PQ files. Maps, yes.

 

3. I get that it's a new area and there are lots of caches and you want to make sure you have them all. But let's be realistic. If you're visiting for a few days or even a week, you're not going to look for thousands of caches in that time. If you're missing a few caches in small regions where the PQ's don't cover, don't sweat it. You still have plenty loaded to keep you busy. If there are specific parts of the area (parks, etc.) that you know you'll be for sure, center your PQ's around those spots so you'll at least have those covered.

 

4. Which Oregon do you use? If it's a 600/650 (t), you can load as many caches on there as you want, which means there's no real reason to be concerned with how many files you're loading up. If it's a 450/550 (t), they do start to get cranky as you approach that 5000 cache limit. Cranky = slow to load, especially the map.

 

5. Have a laptop? Bring it with you. If you don't have access to internet at the place you're staying, there are always coffee shops and libraries where you can get online and make new PQ's if you end up going somewhere unexpected.

Good to know about the overlapping.

The PQs I use will be saved for the next visit - just a refresh needed, so I need them all.

I use a 600. Good but I wish in this age of cheap chips, it was better CPU.

Laptop? I take a rucksack, camera gear, tripod, nibbles, wife, dog. That's more than enough for day in the hills. I suppose I could strap the laptop to the wife.

 

Yeah, I guess you don't want to take your computer into the wilds. When you said thousands of caches, I was envisioning you visiting one of the many cache-dense metropolitan areas in the western US (Denver, Salt Lake, Phoenix, etc.). I just upgraded to a 600 from a 450, and I can say that the CPU is much better on the 600. You can load 10's of thousands of caches and it won't slow down.

[+Walts Hunting]

The Oregon holds unlimited amount of caches but you have to use the ggz format. When people talk about a laptop they are referring to using it to handle the data work as you travel not carry into tge wood

Edited June 6, 2015 by Walts Hunting

[+Mineral2]

The Oregon holds unlimited amount of caches but you have to use the ggz format. When people talk about a laptop they are referring to using it to handle the data work as you travel not carry into tge wood

 

Do you know what the limit is in gpx? It's got to be quite high.

[+sydnsue]

but there is no way of setting a date to grab the maximum quantity of caches without testing each with a submission. This will quickly overrun the daily limit as many tests are needed to hit a figure just below the 1000 limit.

Is there a better way to this?

 

Yes there is. You do not need to actually run the PQ to test the results. Submit it without selecting a day to run and you can play with the results as much as you need to until you get what you want.

Major problem. I tried this but even though the day was left empty, each time I adjusted the date and clicked submit, that submit counts as a PQ and very quickly I hit the 10/day limit. After adjusting the date, the cache count will only update after a submit.

UPDATE - I just checked the PQ instructions and it does say about leaving the day unchecked, so not sure why it counted my submissions.

Edited June 7, 2015 by sydnsue

[+sydnsue]

[...] and adjust the dates until you get just under 1000. Then set the 2nd PQ for the next date range, such as 2005-2006. Continue until you get all the caches up to current.

 

Or you do it with the help of this page (a trusted Groundspeak Api partner).

http://project-gc.com/Tools/PQSplit

 

Hans

Just had a look at this. Will give it a try. Thanks. As they say "It's good to talk".

Tried the PQSplit but the areas in the filter are too large. It had North West England listed, but this area has tens of thousands of caches.

[+NanCycle]

but there is no way of setting a date to grab the maximum quantity of caches without testing each with a submission. This will quickly overrun the daily limit as many tests are needed to hit a figure just below the 1000 limit.

Is there a better way to this?

 

Yes there is. You do not need to actually run the PQ to test the results. Submit it without selecting a day to run and you can play with the results as much as you need to until you get what you want.

Major problem. I tried this but even though the day was left empty, each time I adjusted the date and clicked submit, that submit counts as a PQ and very quickly I hit the 10/day limit. After adjusting the date, the cache count will only update after a submit.

UPDATE - I just checked the PQ instructions and it does say about leaving the day unchecked, so not sure why it counted my submissions.

 

It never has counted them for me, and I just tried it about 6 times (in case this just changed today) and none were counted.

Are you absolutely certain that the "Days to Generate" boxes are blank in both the Pocket Query itself and in the list of all PQs?

[+sydnsue]

but there is no way of setting a date to grab the maximum quantity of caches without testing each with a submission. This will quickly overrun the daily limit as many tests are needed to hit a figure just below the 1000 limit.

Is there a better way to this?

 

Yes there is. You do not need to actually run the PQ to test the results. Submit it without selecting a day to run and you can play with the results as much as you need to until you get what you want.

Major problem. I tried this but even though the day was left empty, each time I adjusted the date and clicked submit, that submit counts as a PQ and very quickly I hit the 10/day limit. After adjusting the date, the cache count will only update after a submit.

UPDATE - I just checked the PQ instructions and it does say about leaving the day unchecked, so not sure why it counted my submissions.

 

It never has counted them for me, and I just tried it about 6 times (in case this just changed today) and none were counted.

Are you absolutely certain that the "Days to Generate" boxes are blank in both the Pocket Query itself and in the list of all PQs?

I double checked and both were empty of ticks. I assume it was the 10/day limit I had reached because I could not get a PQ emailed when I tried. It would not add to the PQ list. I will try again tonight.

[+niraD]

I assume it was the 10/day limit I had reached because I could not get a PQ emailed when I tried.

Just to clarify, PQs are no longer emailed. There is a notification email sent when a PQ runs, but the PQ data is no longer included in that email. You have to download the PQ data from the server, or via the API if you're using an API-based app.

[+sydnsue]

I assume it was the 10/day limit I had reached because I could not get a PQ emailed when I tried.

Just to clarify, PQs are no longer emailed. There is a notification email sent when a PQ runs, but the PQ data is no longer included in that email. You have to download the PQ data from the server, or via the API if you're using an API-based app.

That's what I meant.