Do officers double-check coordinate accuracy?

[+The A-Team]

Over in another discussion, thebeav69 mentioned the following:

I read another thread and Bruces posted that you can still access Google Maps in the lower left corner of the page when viewing a Waymark. It's inconvenient but at least it pops up a new Google Maps window for officers to check proper coordinates of Waymark submissions before accepting/denying them.

My question to the officers on here is, do you check coordinate accuracy whenever possible, or do you just assume that the Waymarker got it right?

 

I ask because there's a Waymarker in my region that has had chronic coordinate inaccuracy over their entire ~7-8 year Waymarking career. Their coordinates are almost universally at least several tens of metres away from the actual spot, and often much higher. In one area, their coordinates for a number of Waymarks were out by several hundred metres, and in another area they had a pair of Waymarks that were respectively about 700 metres and 1 kilometer out! They also post a cluster of relatively closely-spaced Waymarks all at the exact same incorrect coordinates. In many of these cases, it's crystal clear from the map that the coordinates are wrong (e.g. a covered bridge about 200 metres from the coordinates), and I find it strange that neither the Waymarker nor the officers noticed. I contacted the Waymarker and will see if we can figure out what's causing the problem, but many of these problems could have also been brought to light and rectified if the officers in the various categories noticed and pointed it out.

 

When you review a submission, do you try to verify that the coordinates are at least fairly close?

[+Manville Possum]

I do. I rejected one a few weeks ago that was over 100 feet away from the waymark and in the middle of a street.

[+fi67]

Where I live, Google maps is extremely accurate, much more than a normal GPS unit, although some overlays are not so good, a nearby country border has an offset of 5 to 12 meters. But I have been to places, where the maps were 30 to 60 meters off. And indeed, I had some waymarks denied there for wrong coordinates, which was not true.

 

Google maps is not a suitable tool to check exact coordinates, only the general area. With the new OSM it will be about the same.

[+MountainWoods]

I had been clicking on the satellite view just to make sure that the coordinates looked like they were in the right vicinity. After all, I have accidentally submitted waymarks where I had goofed a coordinate -- though I always caught it and did the cancel/fix/resubmit thing.

 

However, I can no longer do that now. It's back to copy/paste the coordinates into Google Earth, unless the silly Leaflet map looks like they were close enough.

[+dreamhummie]

Hi,

 

I never use the map in the right upper corner on Waymarking.

Only to check the E/W BUG with my first look at it.

I prefer the Leaflet map because it makes for me the site faster.

 

What i do when i'm reviewing a waymark:

First start up Google Earth then Waymarking.

 

I always use Google Street View. There are many ways to search with it. If Street View is not available, I often use the icons near the Waymark. Bing Maps Bird's eye is sometimes a little sharper. I also have some atlases and paper maps for control.

And Google is your friend, and of course fellow officers in the Category to ask there opinion about the Waymark.

 

But when reviewing is a problem, then it is an error in the rules in the Category to post a Waymark.

Always ask for a second photo of the Waymark including the environment.

I declined 2 ANWB Paddenstoelen this week, I see them on Street View and on my Paper Maps BUT the posting rule is: Post a second picture including the environment.

This also makes it easier for all the reviewers.

Grtz John.

[+Lat34North]

Most GSPr units are only accurate to between 25 to 50 feet, so the error maybe because of the accuracy of their GSPr, but then again, I have seen approved waymarks in the middle of the ocean. There was also one in the middle of the nowhere (was listed as N 33, should have been N 34, my own normally boo-boo). Also it depends on what you are Waymarking. A benchmark, yea, needs to be accurate, a large building, middle of the street is fine.

 

When checking coordinates, I normally just have Google Earth loaded in a different window and copy paste the coordinates from the waymark to Google Earth and verify that way. (in windows alt-tab will scroll thru you open windows, so it is simple to switch back and forth between Waymarking and Google Earth). If the coordinates are close enough for a fellow Waymarker to locate the waymark, it is good enough for me.

Edited May 13, 2015 by Lat34North

[+Lat34North]

An interesting tit-bit.

Using Google Earth street view.

 

Go to N 35.04011 W 85.272595 (1880 E 4th St, Chattanooga, TN).

Now while in street view move east on 4th Ave until you cross Orchard Knob Ave.

 

 

Look at the imagery date in the lower right corner. One image is from 2007, the other view is dated 2011. The building you see in the 2007 image, so no longer there. (I’ve been there in person).

[+Outspoken1]

I glance at the small map in the upper right hand corner to see if the coords 'look' correct. However, there is really no way to 'check' other than personally visiting the location (woo hoo, my excuse for world travel ) . The coords from Google Earth are close - but not dead on. In fact, I've had Waymarks declined saying the coords were off - went to recheck -coords were fine - it was Google Earth (or whatever other program they used to check). Additionally, most Waymarks are large enough that coords that are off be even a few yards/meters are still locatable (is that a word?). Unless someone reports a Waymark coords are waaaay off, I do not verify any further than the small map.

 

Take care, Outspoken1

[+dreamhummie]

Yes i was in China last year and the coordinates are very very incorrect with Google Earth.

[+Tuena]

Most GSPr units are only accurate to between 25 to 50 feet, so the error maybe because of the accuracy of their GSPr, but then again, I have seen approved waymarks in the middle of the ocean. There was also one in the middle of the nowhere (was listed as N 33, should have been N 34, my own normally boo-boo). Also it depends on what you are Waymarking. A benchmark, yea, needs to be accurate, a large building, middle of the street is fine.

 

When checking coordinates, I normally just have Google Earth loaded in a different window and copy paste the coordinates from the waymark to Google Earth and verify that way. (in windows alt-tab will scroll thru you open windows, so it is simple to switch back and forth between Waymarking and Google Earth). If the coordinates are close enough for a fellow Waymarker to locate the waymark, it is good enough for me.

 

If you live in the Southern Hemisphere & make a change to an approved waymark the co-ords will invariably change from SE to NW, which puts your waymark in the northern Pacific Ocean. You may notice, you may not.

[+silverquill]

Checking coordinates depends on a lot of factors.

 

I do look at the location on the map in the waymark for general accuracy. But, unless I have some reason to suspect inaccurate coordinates, I don't zoom in. Even then it is often difficult to determine accuracy, depending on the point. Commercial categories are ones I'm less likely to check. Addresses within a city are difficult to determine on a map.

 

As has been pointed out, the maps are not accurate either, and they are outdated. The building where I lived in Korea was at least five years old, but did not appear on any satellite views.

 

Occasionally it is discovered, as has been indicated in the start of this thread, that a particular waymarker consistently submits waymarks with coordinates that are highly inaccurate, and so I will check those more closely. And I will decline them if needed.

[+DougK]

Most GSPr units are only accurate to between 25 to 50 feet, …

 

The Garmin line (Colorado/Oregon/Montana/Dakota) has the feature of waypoint averaging. You set the GPSr unit down, start sampling and with an unobstructed sky view, in 30-90 seconds you usually have a coordinate reading that appears to be accurate to 6-10 feet. It's perfect for geocaching. I use it on all small objects, like utility boxes, sculptures, statues, etc, and for most other readings too. Presumably, other modern GPSr units have this capability too. I highly recommend it.

 

I always check the coordinates of submissions. After all, this is a GPS Coordinate based activity and should be as accurate as possible. I find inaccuracies in approved waymarks by glancing at maps and I find this very disheartening. For me, this devalues Waymarking in general. Most objects we waymark, outside of buildings, can often be seen in the satellite view. If the waymark is for a cemetery and the coordinates look to be in a residential neighborhood, something's wrong. For Static Aircraft Displays, I expect to find an airplane in the satellite view, unless it's recently placed. The same is true for Velodromes and many large objects. Entrances to buildings, museums, parks, etc should be reasonable close in the satellite view. For objects near a road, Google Street View can also be used and may have different photos available than the satellite view. Sometimes I see a utility box at the coordinates before it's been painted and sometimes I see the painted box.

 

Sometimes the submitted waymark contains an address as well. I often put that address into Google Maps and see if the map comes to the same place as the posted coordinates. I may also compare data from a supplied website URL to see if it matches.

 

As I've stated before in this thread, if you are not examining the coordinates somehow, you are not giving the activity of Waymarking your best service as a category officer.