Unofficial Caches

[+sharon133]

I'm conflicted. There is a camp I'm not to sure who it is but they are putting unofficial caches by Official Caches. And It has created a problem with some caches. They find the unofficial one thinking it is the official one and then go to the coords that it list. Basically sending them on a goose chase. I found this link to who I think is doing it. Can they really do this.

http://www.hankthecowdog.com/blog/press-release-events-in-and-around-kerrville-on-sept-18th[/url]

I don't care if a camp does it on there own property but to put them by official caches just seems wrong.

[4wheelin_fool]

It seems odd that they would do that. How far away are their geocaches hidden, and who is the property owner?

[+roundnround we go]

Maybe I read it wrong but it sounds like the city manager of Kerrville Texas is heading this up. Are these "official caches" on city property? If they are were they put out with adequate permission from the city? You need to tread lightly with this, if it is city property they could ask for the "Official Caches" to be removed and there wouldn't be anything you could do to stop them

[+GeoLog81]

I'm conflicted. There is a camp I'm not to sure who it is but they are putting unofficial caches by Official Caches.

 

I can't understand that line. What do you understand by putting unofficial caches by official caches? You mean replacing without owner's permission or something similar?

[cezanne]

I'm conflicted. There is a camp I'm not to sure who it is but they are putting unofficial caches by Official Caches.

 

I can't understand that line. What do you understand by putting unofficial caches by official caches? You mean replacing without owner's permission or something similar?

 

Probably what is meant is that stages of geocaches that are not listed on gc.com are placed to stages of geocaches listed on gc.com and some who head for the caches listed on gc.com

find the wrong container/information and get confused. There is nothing that can be done about that except a proper labeling of the stages of the caches listed on gc.com and a warning on the

cache listings that cachers should make sure to watch out for the information belonging to the cache they are searching for.

[+irisisleuk]

Totally agree with cezanne, but if I would own a cache that is big enough to hold trackables I would remove it (archive or move it to another place) if it could be found by one of the players of these not-geocaching.com caches.

[+wmpastor]

The link explains that this is a private activity not listed with GS and perhaps not listed with any online service:

 

On September 18, 2013 Kerrville, Texas based Lamb Creek Family Adventures, Inc. will launch its inaugural geo-coded based adventure.

 

The adventures all focus on tourist towns and destinations such as Kerrville. Each offers families a full day of a high-tech, GPS-coded, clue-based Easter egg style hunt, and geocaching discovery hike all rolled into one. On every adventure, families move from point-to-point through a mix of conventional geocaching and hidden clues in any number of places: inside stores, codes, puzzles, Hank the Cowdog ® stories and other kid-friendly fun.

[Mr.Yuck]

Maybe I read it wrong but it sounds like the city manager of Kerrville Texas is heading this up. Are these "official caches" on city property? If they are were they put out with adequate permission from the city? You need to tread lightly with this, if it is city property they could ask for the "Official Caches" to be removed and there wouldn't be anything you could do to stop them

 

Correct. How about the Geocaching.com listed caches are in the way of what they want to do on their property? Contrary to popular belief, Geocaching.com is not the Omnipotent world wide ruler of all that is Geocaching.

[+JL_HSTRE]

It seems like the CO needs to contact the CO of the other caches and try to work out moving the GC and non-GC caches farther apart.

[+Traditional Bill]

It seems like the CO needs to contact the CO of the other caches and try to work out moving the GC and non-GC caches farther apart.

This

[+Walts Hunting]

There are two possibilities. The Placer doesn't know about the other "real" caches and is unaware of the conflict. He is some sort of artist and may be thinking nothing else matters for his artistic project.

 

The other is he does know and doesn't care for the same reason.

 

Maybe do him a line and see.

[+narcissa]

I'm conflicted. There is a camp I'm not to sure who it is but they are putting unofficial caches by Official Caches. And It has created a problem with some caches. They find the unofficial one thinking it is the official one and then go to the coords that it list. Basically sending them on a goose chase. I found this link to who I think is doing it. Can they really do this.

http://www.hankthecowdog.com/blog/press-release-events-in-and-around-kerrville-on-sept-18th[/url]

I don't care if a camp does it on there own property but to put them by official caches just seems wrong.

 

Define "official" and "unofficial." This is just a listing service. People are free to place private geocaches, or list geocaches on other sites.

[+sharon133]

It seems odd that they would do that. How far away are their geocaches hidden, and who is the property owner?

I have found 2 so far like this. One was a foot away and the other was about 20ft away. They don't put a contact name or number in the container. It's on public property just like the other geocaches. I guess I can't worry about it too much. I just don't understand why they don't just do a geotour. That would bring more people here. I am pretty active around this area, I have over 150 caches in the area.

[+Manville Possum]

It seems odd that they would do that. How far away are their geocaches hidden, and who is the property owner?

I have found 2 so far like this. One was a foot away and the other was about 20ft away. They don't put a contact name or number in the container. It's on public property just like the other geocaches. I guess I can't worry about it too much. I just don't understand why they don't just do a geotour. That would bring more people here. I am pretty active around this area, I have over 150 caches in the area.

Why not approach the City manager with your experience and discuss the idea of a geotour?

[4wheelin_fool]

It seems odd that they would do that. How far away are their geocaches hidden, and who is the property owner?

I have found 2 so far like this. One was a foot away and the other was about 20ft away. They don't put a contact name or number in the container. It's on public property just like the other geocaches. I guess I can't worry about it too much. I just don't understand why they don't just do a geotour. That would bring more people here. I am pretty active around this area, I have over 150 caches in the area.

 

That's odd. I would first guess that they are trying to get geocachers to play their game by finding the containers accidentally, but without any info it's likely a fellow geocacher who is rather trying to introduce new people to the game by using their site. They won't list existing containers as theirs, but they are trying to get non geocachers to find listed caches. Try emailing them and asking what their geocaching name is.

[cezanne]

I have found 2 so far like this. One was a foot away and the other was about 20ft away. They don't put a contact name or number in the container. It's on public property just like the other geocaches. I guess I can't worry about it too much. I just don't understand why they don't just do a geotour.

 

Why should they want to pay money to Groundspeak? Groundspeak is not the centre of the geocaching universum.

[cezanne]

That's odd. I would first guess that they are trying to get geocachers to play their game by finding the containers accidentally, but without any info it's likely a fellow geocacher who is rather trying to introduce new people to the game by using their site. They won't list existing containers as theirs, but they are trying to get non geocachers to find listed caches. Try emailing them and asking what their geocaching name is.

 

Why do they need to have a geocaching account at gc.com at all in order to be able to offer geocaching-like activities to the local population? People can enjoy geocaching without being active at gc.com at all (that holds for cache owners and searchers).

[Mr.Yuck]

It seems odd that they would do that. How far away are their geocaches hidden, and who is the property owner?

I have found 2 so far like this. One was a foot away and the other was about 20ft away. They don't put a contact name or number in the container. It's on public property just like the other geocaches. I guess I can't worry about it too much. I just don't understand why they don't just do a geotour. That would bring more people here. I am pretty active around this area, I have over 150 caches in the area.

 

Private caches are more common than you think. I've seen or heard of several nature preserves in several different parts of the Country who have them. This is interesting though, are they purposely piggybacking off of the Geocaching.com caches? I suppose you, or someone should email the person in charge, and see if they know about the gc.com caches.

[+wmpastor]

Basically sending them on a goose chase.

 

Like straight to "Hank the Cowdog" stores, which is a no-no with real caches!

[4wheelin_fool]

That's odd. I would first guess that they are trying to get geocachers to play their game by finding the containers accidentally, but without any info it's likely a fellow geocacher who is rather trying to introduce new people to the game by using their site. They won't list existing containers as theirs, but they are trying to get non geocachers to find listed caches. Try emailing them and asking what their geocaching name is.

 

Why do they need to have a geocaching account at gc.com at all in order to be able to offer geocaching-like activities to the local population? People can enjoy geocaching without being active at gc.com at all (that holds for cache owners and searchers).

I don't know, you tell me. They most likely have geocaching accounts already and are placing these near existing geocaches without the owners knowledge.

[cezanne]

I don't know, you tell me. They most likely have geocaching accounts already and are placing these near existing geocaches without the owners knowledge.

 

I'm not convinced that they already have accounts at gc.com. From what the web page tells it appears to be a mixture of several elements, geocaching only being one aspect.

If it's an urban area with many caches on gc.com, it is very likely that somehow who places several stages around the town will somewhere get close to a cache listed on gc.com.

Sending people into stores and businesses is an integral part of the activity described on the web page provided in the first post, but does violate the guidelines of gc.com.

I cannot see any reason why these people should care about caches listed at gc.com at all. The gudelines at gc.com are quite restrictive when it comes to projects of the discussed type.

Edited September 29, 2014 by cezanne

[4wheelin_fool]

I don't know, you tell me. They most likely have geocaching accounts already and are placing these near existing geocaches without the owners knowledge.

 

I'm not convinced that they already have accounts at gc.com. From what the web page tells it appears to be a mixture of several elements, geocaching only being one aspect.

If it's an urban area with many caches on gc.com, it is very likely that somehow who places several stages around the town will somewhere get close to a cache listed on gc.com.

Sending people into stores and businesses is an integral part of the activity described on the web page provided in the first post, but does violate the guidelines of gc.com.

I cannot see any reason why these people should care about caches listed at gc.com at all. The gudelines at gc.com are quite restrictive when it comes to projects of the discussed type.

 

Having one, a foot away, as well as another 20 feet away, indicates they are aware of them. Although Groundspeak is not the centre of the geocaching universe, these hides sure seem to be satellites in orbit around existing caches. The planet certainly is wide enough to place them 50 or more feet away. What's happening is that their webpage is being used to have non geocachers find geocaches that other people placed, and without their knowledge. The town manager is involved, and they all think its great. Go to the town's visitor center to find a map to someone else's cache.

Edited September 29, 2014 by 4wheelin_fool

[+BlueMoth]

It's a three business marketing scheme. Buy the maps, the pathtags, the books, the trinkets. Visit the various stores on the adventure map and buy more stuff. Spend money in our town, but only where we want you to. Of course they can't list their "caches" on gc.com. What they don't understand, and obviously the city manager doesn't either, is that if I came to visit your town, I would have caches preloaded in my gps, and would never do something as obvious and silly as this. Why should I be gouged for something I can already do for free?

They also claim that their "caches" have no logbook (except the final), and are clearly labeled as belonging to them. Guess they put them out and forgot that part.

[cezanne]

Having one, a foot away, as well as another 20 feet away, indicates they are aware of them.

 

Not neccesarily and even if they are aware it depends what they have placed.

 

The planet certainly is wide enough to place them 50 or more feet away. What's happening is that their webpage is being used to have non geocachers find geocaches that other people placed, and without their knowledge.

 

But interestingly the complaint from the OP is the other way round. She objects that people do not find the gc.com caches, but get redirected on their hunt at some stage to the caches not listed at gc.com.

 

The activities described on the web page seem to be of multi stage type. It will not always make sense to move a clue by several feet to a place where it might not fit any longer.

 

To avoid what the OP is describing, it should suffice if the gc.com caches are clearly marked.

 

 

Cezanne

[+Manville Possum]

It's a three business marketing scheme. Buy the maps, the pathtags, the books, the trinkets. Visit the various stores on the adventure map and buy more stuff. Spend money in our town, but only where we want you to. Of course they can't list their "caches" on gc.com. What they don't understand, and obviously the city manager doesn't either, is that if I came to visit your town, I would have caches preloaded in my gps, and would never do something as obvious and silly as this. Why should I be gouged for something I can already do for free?

They also claim that their "caches" have no logbook (except the final), and are clearly labeled as belonging to them. Guess they put them out and forgot that part.

Maybe they do understand, that is exactly why the caches are placed within close proxcimity to active Groundspeak listings. Their listings would never be published here, so it looks like a clever work around to me.

[+BlueMoth]

I guess my point is that if I visited that town I would Already be spending money - food, gas, lodging, maybe even trinkets. I would boycott their adventure scheme on general principals. I don't like being led around by the nose.

[cezanne]

I guess my point is that if I visited that town I would Already be spending money - food, gas, lodging, maybe even trinkets. I would boycott their adventure scheme on general principals. I don't like being led around by the nose.

 

I doubt that their target audience includes experienced geocachers.

 

Cezanne

[+narcissa]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

[+Chrysalides]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

Exploit, what a word. How about "how can I encourage some people to voluntarily spend some money in my stores"? I'd hate to be exploited every time I visit a website, open a magazine, watch a video, step into a supermarket, listen to the radio...

[+The A-Team]

Having one, a foot away, as well as another 20 feet away, indicates they are aware of them.

Not necessarily. I've encountered a scenario where a Traditional had been hidden right on top of a Puzzle final (the Puzzle didn't have a final coordinate waypoint, and that's another issue), with only an inch or two of pieces of bark separating them. Neither owner knew about the other until finders started getting confused. I was also told by a reviewer once that during one of our local annual cache-hiding events, three different caches were all submitted as being hidden in the same stump! The thing is, a spot that looks like a good hiding spot to one cacher might also look good to another cacher. The same applies to non-geocaching.com geocachers. If an existing cache is well-hidden, as it should be, a second hider may not realize there's already a cache there, especially if they're not using this listing service.

[4wheelin_fool]

Having one, a foot away, as well as another 20 feet away, indicates they are aware of them.

Not necessarily. I've encountered a scenario where a Traditional had been hidden right on top of a Puzzle final (the Puzzle didn't have a final coordinate waypoint, and that's another issue), with only an inch or two of pieces of bark separating them. Neither owner knew about the other until finders started getting confused. I was also told by a reviewer once that during one of our local annual cache-hiding events, three different caches were all submitted as being hidden in the same stump! The thing is, a spot that looks like a good hiding spot to one cacher might also look good to another cacher. The same applies to non-geocaching.com geocachers. If an existing cache is well-hidden, as it should be, a second hider may not realize there's already a cache there, especially if they're not using this listing service.

I think it is more likely the hider of the traditional knew about the puzzle, but didn't admit it. Perhaps the intention was for finders to get 2 smileys, or to spoil the puzzle, I don't know. Of course coincidences happen and it is possible for such instances to be accidental, but in the OPs case when it occurs 3 or more times, it's more likely to be intentional. They are also using the term "geeocaching", not letterboxing, nor is it a general treasure hunt.

[Mr.Yuck]

Eh, personally, and this could just be me, in the OP, they said "Can they really do this?" regarding the unofficial caches. Of course they friggin' can, no one website owns Geocaching. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess she has no clue that the people behind this website had absolutely nothing to do with "inventing" Geocaching. They merely went out and bought the domain name before anyone else thought of the idea. Of course they did a good job with it. Could you imagine if like I bought it before anyone else thought of the idea?

 

All that being said, if this guy is purposely putting these "unofficial caches", as defined by the OP on top of previously listed Geocaching.com caches, I'd disagree with that.

[+The A-Team]

Having one, a foot away, as well as another 20 feet away, indicates they are aware of them.

Not necessarily. I've encountered a scenario where a Traditional had been hidden right on top of a Puzzle final (the Puzzle didn't have a final coordinate waypoint, and that's another issue), with only an inch or two of pieces of bark separating them. Neither owner knew about the other until finders started getting confused. I was also told by a reviewer once that during one of our local annual cache-hiding events, three different caches were all submitted as being hidden in the same stump! The thing is, a spot that looks like a good hiding spot to one cacher might also look good to another cacher. The same applies to non-geocaching.com geocachers. If an existing cache is well-hidden, as it should be, a second hider may not realize there's already a cache there, especially if they're not using this listing service.

I think it is more likely the hider of the traditional knew about the puzzle, but didn't admit it.

No, I can assure you, they didn't know. Both caches were hidden and submitted over a several-week period and then published at virtually the same time as part of a mass-cache-publication (thanks to our helpful and accommodating reviewers). For all intents and purposes, neither was a pre-existing cache. Neither owner knew about the existence of the other cache until they were published.

 

Perhaps the intention was for finders to get 2 smileys, or to spoil the puzzle, I don't know. Of course coincidences happen and it is possible for such instances to be accidental, but in the OPs case when it occurs 3 or more times, it's more likely to be intentional.

If they were intentionally placing their geocaches/stages near geocaching.com-listed caches, I'd expect all of them to be close, not have at least one 20 feet away. My money's still on ignorance and coincidence, but we won't know for sure unless someone actually asks them. If they are indeed doing it intentionally, then I'm in the "bad idea" camp. Knowingly putting a cache/stage at the same spot as another will, and can be foreseen to, cause confusion.

Edited September 29, 2014 by The A-Team

[+fishgeek]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

 

I agree (though I too might choose a different word than "exploit"). I also think that discretion might be the better part of valor in this case. The promotion has been around for over a year. The City Manager is on board and those businesses probably have a lot more political power than all of the geocachers in the area put together. If the OP has 150+ caches, it would not be the end of the world for her to move or archive a few of them.

[+narcissa]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

Exploit, what a word. How about "how can I encourage some people to voluntarily spend some money in my stores"? I'd hate to be exploited every time I visit a website, open a magazine, watch a video, step into a supermarket, listen to the radio...

 

I don't know what this rant is about. I'm talking specifically about the numerous ways people try to turn geocaching into a sales pitch.

[+Chrysalides]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

Exploit, what a word. How about "how can I encourage some people to voluntarily spend some money in my stores"? I'd hate to be exploited every time I visit a website, open a magazine, watch a video, step into a supermarket, listen to the radio...

 

I don't know what this rant is about. I'm talking specifically about the numerous ways people try to turn geocaching into a sales pitch.

That was not a rant, which actually brings up yet another example of what I'm trying to point out - that of your deliberate use of provocative words in your posts.

[+narcissa]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

Exploit, what a word. How about "how can I encourage some people to voluntarily spend some money in my stores"? I'd hate to be exploited every time I visit a website, open a magazine, watch a video, step into a supermarket, listen to the radio...

 

I don't know what this rant is about. I'm talking specifically about the numerous ways people try to turn geocaching into a sales pitch.

That was not a rant, which actually brings up yet another example of what I'm trying to point out - that of your deliberate use of provocative words in your posts.

 

Exploit is the correct word to use. I'm glad that Groundspeak is selective about their commercial partnerships, and I'm happy that we don't have geocaches leading us into stores and restaurants. It's unfortunate if that interferes with your plans, but that has nothing to do with me or my posts.

[+narcissa]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

 

I agree (though I too might choose a different word than "exploit"). I also think that discretion might be the better part of valor in this case. The promotion has been around for over a year. The City Manager is on board and those businesses probably have a lot more political power than all of the geocachers in the area put together. If the OP has 150+ caches, it would not be the end of the world for her to move or archive a few of them.

 

In these situations, there's not much you can do except move your caches and wait for the other thing to flop (which it will).

[+Chrysalides]

Exploit is the correct word to use. I'm glad that Groundspeak is selective about their commercial partnerships, and I'm happy that we don't have geocaches leading us into stores and restaurants. It's unfortunate if that interferes with your plans, but that has nothing to do with me or my posts.

You must be under some delusion. What plans?

 

You are free to use whatever words you want. I'm free to point out what I think is wrong with the words you choose.

 

Groundspeak HQ leads me into their store, come to think of it. I have no issues with that. I've done multiple caches that brings me into stores. As long as I'm not forced to, or feel compelled to buy something, that's perfectly fine with me.

 

Groundspeak is also the entity that commercializes the game to the greatest extent. And I'm fine with that too.

 

If you don't like commercialism in geocaching, that's perfectly OK. Just don't pretend that Groundspeak is the champion against that.

[+narcissa]

Exploit is the correct word to use. I'm glad that Groundspeak is selective about their commercial partnerships, and I'm happy that we don't have geocaches leading us into stores and restaurants. It's unfortunate if that interferes with your plans, but that has nothing to do with me or my posts.

You must be under some delusion. What plans?

 

You are free to use whatever words you want. I'm free to point out what I think is wrong with the words you choose.

 

Groundspeak HQ leads me into their store, come to think of it. I have no issues with that. I've done multiple caches that brings me into stores. As long as I'm not forced to, or feel compelled to buy something, that's perfectly fine with me.

 

Groundspeak is also the entity that commercializes the game to the greatest extent. And I'm fine with that too.

 

If you don't like commercialism in geocaching, that's perfectly OK. Just don't pretend that Groundspeak is the champion against that.

 

I'm still not clear on what this has to do with anything I said in my original comment. It's unfortunate that you've taken offense at a word in my post but I can assure you that "exploit" is the correct word to describe the behaviour of non-geocachers who only view this game as a way to lead unsuspecting geocachers into their businesses (or those who "sell" geocache maintenance to businesses who don't understand the game).

Edited September 30, 2014 by narcissa

[4wheelin_fool]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

 

I don't think that they can "exploit" the game any more than Groundspeak has. They don't have any apps, its just a little commercialism for the town with some people inappropriately sharing locations without consent. I think you are confusing official exploitation with unauthorized exploitation.

[+narcissa]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

 

I don't think that they can "exploit" the game any more than Groundspeak has. They don't have any apps, its just a little commercialism for the town with some people inappropriately sharing locations without consent. I think you are confusing official exploitation with unauthorized exploitation.

 

Looking at it a different way, it's kind of like a shady guy standing outside of a watch store, selling watches out of his trenchcoat. You can tell the shady guy that he can't be in the store, but you can't stop him from being on the sidewalk.

[+Chrysalides]

It's unfortunate that you've taken offense at a word in my post but I can assure you that "exploit" is the correct word to describe the behaviour of non-geocachers who only view this game as a way to lead unsuspecting geocachers into their businesses (or those who "sell" geocache maintenance to businesses who don't understand the game).

Please do not be concerned, I did not take any offense in the slightest. I was trying to point out that deliberate use of inflammatory words in your comments only helps to distract from whatever point you're trying to make.

[+narcissa]

It's unfortunate that you've taken offense at a word in my post but I can assure you that "exploit" is the correct word to describe the behaviour of non-geocachers who only view this game as a way to lead unsuspecting geocachers into their businesses (or those who "sell" geocache maintenance to businesses who don't understand the game).

Please do not be concerned, I did not take any offense in the slightest. I was trying to point out that deliberate use of inflammatory words in your comments only helps to distract from whatever point you're trying to make.

 

I'm still not following how your faint-hearted reaction to the word "exploit" in any way relates to the discussion at hand. I might be off-base here, but I suspect that a thread in Geocaching Topics is not the most appropriate place for you to offer unsolicited personal editorial advice to a stranger.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

Exploit is the correct word to use. I'm glad that Groundspeak is selective about their commercial partnerships, and I'm happy that we don't have geocaches leading us into stores and restaurants. It's unfortunate if that interferes with your plans, but that has nothing to do with me or my posts.

You must be under some delusion. What plans?

 

You are free to use whatever words you want. I'm free to point out what I think is wrong with the words you choose.

 

Groundspeak HQ leads me into their store, come to think of it. I have no issues with that. I've done multiple caches that brings me into stores. As long as I'm not forced to, or feel compelled to buy something, that's perfectly fine with me.

 

Groundspeak is also the entity that commercializes the game to the greatest extent. And I'm fine with that too.

 

If you don't like commercialism in geocaching, that's perfectly OK. Just don't pretend that Groundspeak is the champion against that.

 

I agree with narcissa (hey, it happens occasionally) that exploit is the right word. Yes, there is commercialism in geocaching, but for many of us, when we go out to find some caches some of us trying to get *away* from the constant commercial bombardment "every time I visit a website, open a magazine, watch a video, step into a supermarket, listen to the radio...". The fact is, there are some commercial entities that will exploit the fact that by placing a geocache there will be a steady stream of visitors, and they will try to use the cache as a medium for commercial solicitation. It's great that it doesn't bother you if you're not compelled to buy something. If I see a cache which gives me the impression that the CO is using it for commercial solicitation I would be compelled to boycott that business and suggest that others do as well.

 

 

[+Chrysalides]

I'm still not following how your faint-hearted reaction to the word "exploit" in any way relates to the discussion at hand. I might be off-base here, but I suspect that a thread in Geocaching Topics is not the most appropriate place for you to offer unsolicited personal editorial advice to a stranger.

It is an appropriate place for this discussion because you used to describe what you perceived a third party to be doing with respect to geocaching.

 

You also failed to follow my assertion that Groundspeak is also, by your own definition, exploting the game.

 

Finally, you appear to have failed to follow the fact that what I'm casually commenting on is your tendency to use inflammatory words in your posts, not on the word "exploit" exclusively.

[+narcissa]

I'm still not following how your faint-hearted reaction to the word "exploit" in any way relates to the discussion at hand. I might be off-base here, but I suspect that a thread in Geocaching Topics is not the most appropriate place for you to offer unsolicited personal editorial advice to a stranger.

It is an appropriate place for this discussion because you used to describe what you perceived a third party to be doing with respect to geocaching.

 

You also failed to follow my assertion that Groundspeak is also, by your own definition, exploting the game.

 

Finally, you appear to have failed to follow the fact that what I'm casually commenting on is your tendency to use inflammatory words in your posts, not on the word "exploit" exclusively.

 

Is there a particular reason that you've chosen to use this thread to vent about what, by all appearances, is a personal gripe about a random stranger? I'm just not following your line of thinking here.

[+Chrysalides]

I'm just not following your line of thinking here.

That's OK, I figured that out some time ago that you have trouble following dissenting thoughts from your own. Carry on.

[+MKFmly]

They might have already tried to do it through geocaching.com and were thwarted by the commercialism guidelines. Sadly, there are still lots of people who hear about this activity and immediately think "Oh boy, how can I exploit this game and the people who play it?"

 

Is there a particular reason that you've chosen to use this thread to vent about what, by all appearances, is a personal gripe about a random stranger unsubstantiated perceived transgression that has nothing to do with the op? I'm just not following your line of thinking here.

[cezanne]

If I see a cache which gives me the impression that the CO is using it for commercial solicitation I would be compelled to boycott that business and suggest that others do as well.

 

Actually, I prefer an "unofficial" cache (not listed at gc.com) that violates the commercial guideline of Groundspeak to a geotour allowed by Groundspeak because they get paid for it. I also think that some lab caches are at least as commercial as this project discussed here which does not seem to include any obligatory payment of money.

 

I'm not in favour of having projects of the discussed type on gc.com, but I do not have any issues if someone combines geocaching with several other elements. Noone who does not want to be exposed, needs to be exposed - there is no argument about clearing out radiuses, PQs, saturation etc

 

As said before I do not think that the key audience for such projects are experienced geocachers. For example, there is an audience for offers where the participants (mainly families with children) are provided with GPS-devices and a guide (that explains geocaching to them and helps them along the hunt if required) and find together a cache that has been set up just for this hunt. These people are even fine with paying a fee for participation even though you could argue that they could head out on their own and hunt for one of the many "official" caches at gc.com.

I have a friend who offers such tours in Germany for a local community college and it works very well. Some of the participants come more often than once and they really enjoy it, but still hardly anyone of them becomes a regular geocacher at gc.com.

It's just not the same audience.

 

Cezanne

Edited September 30, 2014 by cezanne