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lumbricus

Watersheds

77 posts in this topic

13 hours ago, Benchmark Blasterz said:

How is that water pump a border between drainage areas? 

This Pump Fountain is not the border between drainage areas. It is a monument dedicated to this border.

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A group has been created and is hard working on a good category description.

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The category is in Peer Review now. Please vote!

 

Answers to some nay-votes:

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watershed has a different meaning in the USA than in Europe [...]  What one would have to look for in the US is something like the "Continental Divide"

We will add the term 'divide' or 'Continental Divide' to the category description to make it more clear - even for the players in the USA.

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Hope you are going to accept "Continental Divide" markers as well

Of corse we will accept 'Continental Divide' markers.

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I would suggest the requirements be adjusted to make at least one picture to have been taken by the person submitting, otherwise we have another armchair Waymarking category on our hands

Sorry we missed this. But this is something which is an absolute basic thing in Waymarking. But we will add a sentance that only 'selfmade' pictures are allowed.

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Maybe I can add some background information that may help to solve to confusion some American waymarkers have.

The problem is not English as first language or not, as one of the voters suggested. The problem is the difference between British (and in this case also international) and American English. The original British meaning of the term is "divide", probably as a loan word from German "Wasserscheide", but with a connection to an Old English verb "sceadan" with the same meaning. This usage is also the generally accepted one in international hydrology and is the one we used in the category description. In the US there was a shift of the original meaning from the borderline of a drainage basin to the whole area; this happened around 1870 for unclear reasons without any inherent logic and was maybe the result of a misunderstanding. We were not fully aware of how much this small difference was going confuse people when the category description was written.

So, Americans can replace all "watershed" with "drainage divide", until the description has taken account of the problem.

One thing, I did not find out: On what side of this terminology watershed (British usage) are Canadians?

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2 hours ago, fi67 said:

Maybe I can add some background information that may help to solve to confusion some American waymarkers have.

The problem is not English as first language or not, as one of the voters suggested. The problem is the difference between British (and in this case also international) and American English. The original British meaning of the term is "divide", probably as a loan word from German "Wasserscheide", but with a connection to an Old English verb "sceadan" with the same meaning. This usage is also the generally accepted one in international hydrology and is the one we used in the category description. In the US there was a shift of the original meaning from the borderline of a drainage basin to the whole area; this happened around 1870 for unclear reasons without any inherent logic and was maybe the result of a misunderstanding. We were not fully aware of how much this small difference was going confuse people when the category description was written.

So, Americans can replace all "watershed" with "drainage divide", until the description has taken account of the problem.

One thing, I did not find out: On what side of this terminology watershed (British usage) are Canadians?

When traveling in Canada, we have found watershed boundary markers that also use the term "divide."

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As with many things in Canada, we are bilingual.  We understand both terms, watershed and/or (drainage) divide.  Many of us learned metric and Imperial measurements.  My height is still feet and inches.  I still buy fruit by the pound.  I put so many litres of fuel in the car and drive so many kilometres on a full tank.  However, I still think of fuel economy as miles per gallon.  It's hot outdoors if it's 30 degrees but I set the indoor thermostat to 68 degrees.  Don't worry about us Canadians.  We're stuck somewhere between the rest of the English-speaking worlds.

Edited by elyob
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Divide is the proper term.  Continental Divide is just a subset of all Divides, and are much too rare (lack of prevalence).  In North America, there is really only one Continental level Divide, splitting the waters that run into the Pacific Ocean from those in the Atlantic.  There are other useful divides, such as that which splits water flowing into the main Atlantic Ocean versus that which runs into the Gulf of Mexico, and which does not really divide the continent.

The place we lived in before we moved down to the Ozarks was just a few feet from the divide between the Illinois River watershed and the Rock River water shed.  May not sound like much, but the two rivers run into the Mississippi River something like 400 miles apart.  But there was no sign for that divide.

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Some more answers to some nay-votes from Peer Review:

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I don't see enough difference to the first part of 23A: River Origins, Destinations, and Confluences. That seems to be a 'Catch-all'.

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Redundant, already exists. Watershed means the entire area that drains into a particular river. Therefore, this proposed category is already covered under River Origins in the existing River Origins, Destinations and Confluences category.

Sorry, but you are wrong! The new proposal is neighter redundant nor included in the category 'River Origins, Destinations and Confluences'.
The mentioned category is only for origins (wells or the beginning of a river), destinations (end of a river) or the confluence of two rivers.
This is NOT the topic of the new category. There are two identical officers in the two categories. I'm sure they know the difference!

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Saw a sign on Sunday about waters from that point flowing into a particular river. I don't think that's what you're after but could be wrong.

Sounds like you found a sign we're looking for.

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The three officers of this category group are all European, perhaps adding someone with English as the first language could have helped with the category writeup to make the content more clear and less confusing to others.

You are right! It was never a good idea not taking a native speaker from somewhere else in the world as an officer. We have found an US american player who will become an officer after Peer Review is over. He has already created a better explanation of the term 'watershed' and 'divide'.

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19 hours ago, elyob said:

As with many things in Canada, we are bilingual.  We understand both terms, watershed and/or (drainage) divide.  Many of us learned metric and Imperial measurements.  My height is still feet and inches.  I still buy fruit by the pound.  I put so many litres of fuel in the car and drive so many kilometres on a full tank.  However, I still think of fuel economy as miles per gallon.  It's hot outdoors if it's 30 degrees but I set the indoor thermostat to 68 degrees.  Don't worry about us Canadians.  We're stuck somewhere between the rest of the English-speaking worlds.

I couldn't have said it better, or more accurately have described my own situation!

That deserves at least a couple of :lol: LOLs!!! :lol:

Keith

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Looks like the category has passed Peer Review.

The officers are working at some minor changes to the category description including all the promised things and additions during Peer Review.
We will add the term 'divide' to help the North American Players to understand the topic of the category.

I hope the new category will be online in the nearest future.

Thanks for all your support!

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On 9/29/2017 at 3:38 AM, Tante.Hossi said:

We will add the term 'divide' to help the North American Players to understand the topic of the category.

 

Just a question after I voted yea on watersheds. Are we Waymarking watersheds or divides? I may have missed something in the translation, but there is a difference between the two.

Look at this EarthCache, now this is a divide. Help me understand what we are Waymarking, I can get some watershed sign photos too.

divide.jpg

Edited by Manville Possum
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The category is for signs or monuments at the borders of drainage basins. It does not really matter, if the sign says "this is the Y divide" or "you are entering watershed X"; both signs would be at the divide. (In US terminology).

There are different reasons for such a sign. One is more about the border itself as an interesting or even touristic place. They would more probably use the word divide in the US or watershed in the UK (or various translations of that in other languages, of course).

The other reason more about the basin, not only but also for ecological reasons, because contaminations and other possibly hazardous substances take the same way the water does. These signs would more often say watershed in the US or drainage basin in Europe.

But anyhow, both types of signs could be at the same locations: a divide between drainage basins.

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39 minutes ago, Manville Possum said:

 

Just a question after I voted yea on watersheds. Are we Waymarking watersheds or divides? I may have missed something in the translation, but there is a difference between the two.

Look at this EarthCache, now this is a divide. Help me understand what we are Waymarking, I can get some watershed sign photos too.

divide.jpg

Yes it looks like you missed something. To repeat it another time: You and all other players from North America have to waymark DIVIDES. All other players from the rest of the world will waymark WATERSHEDS. Different words - same meaning.

Your picture is very tiny. It is hard to read. But I gess it is about a continental divide. So it would qualify into the category. I will be happy to see your submission when the category is online.

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20 minutes ago, Tante.Hossi said:

Yes it looks like you missed something. To repeat it another time: You and all other players from North America have to waymark DIVIDES. All other players from the rest of the world will waymark WATERSHEDS. Different words - same meaning.

Your picture is very tiny. It is hard to read. But I gess it is about a continental divide. So it would qualify into the category. I will be happy to see your submission when the category is online.

 

I still believe that you are not understanding the difference between the two. A continental divide is a line of elevated terrain, which forms a border between two watersheds. We have 4 divides in the US and thousands of watershed drainages. 

I will not waste my time with this category. I was hoping to submit some watersheds for review but I'm not dealing with a fussy category that may not even be translated correctly for the US.

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7 minutes ago, Manville Possum said:

 

I still believe that you are not understanding the difference between the two. A continental divide is a line of elevated terrain, which forms a border between two watersheds. We have 4 divides in the US and thousands of watershed drainages. 

I will not waste my time with this category. I was hoping to submit some watersheds for review but I'm not dealing with a fussy category that may not even be translated correctly for the US.

I do understand, always did. A divide is a border between drainage basins, no matter what level. The top level is the continental divide, but also lower levels of basin borders between rivers that flow into the same ocean, or even into the same lake or river system, are called divides.

And the "elevated terrain" is often true, but not necessarily. Depending on the structure and permeability of the underground material, the borders of a drainage can be different from the terrain on the surface.

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1 hour ago, fi67 said:

I do understand, always did. A divide is a border between drainage basins, no matter what level. The top level is the continental divide, but also lower levels of basin borders between rivers that flow into the same ocean, or even into the same lake or river system, are called divides.

 

But yet you are Waymarking watersheds and calling them just that. It makse no sense. May I have my yea vote back please?:(

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The number of categories on the Waymarking home page went up to 1108 today, but there are no new categories anywhere!

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58 minutes ago, DougK said:

The number of categories on the Waymarking home page went up to 1108 today, but there are no new categories anywhere!

My category number still says 1106 -- 

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2 hours ago, Manville Possum said:

 

But yet you are Waymarking watersheds and calling them just that. It makse no sense. May I have my yea vote back please?:(

Nobody ever wanted to waymark watersheds. It is Watershed Markers and Monuments. Locations at the borders of watersheds, that someone decided are interesting or important enough to inform the people about them. This is a big difference.

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1 hour ago, fi67 said:

Nobody ever wanted to waymark watersheds. It is Watershed Markers and Monuments. Locations at the borders of watersheds, that someone decided are interesting or important enough to inform the people about them. This is a big difference.

 

We have signs here that read "Entering bla bla watershed" and are common highway signs. I thought that was what we were Waymarking, not divides.

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2 hours ago, Manville Possum said:

 

We have signs here that read "Entering bla bla watershed" and are common highway signs. I thought that was what we were Waymarking, not divides.

I think those will be accepted in the category - they are divides as well, just between watersheds. That was my understanding. I do not expect aquifer recharge zone signs (common around the Edwards Aquifer around Austin/San Antonio) to be accepted, 

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Posted (edited)

Okay, I had a sign local in mind and it's not there now due to bridge construction but I found the ones I was thinking about that I see in Virginia and Tennessee.

Here are examples of Watersheds marker signs as I understood them. The green ones with the word watershed on them. They must be placed by the State.

Edited by Manville Possum
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1 hour ago, Manville Possum said:

Okay, I had a sign local in mind and it's not there now due to bridge construction but I found the ones I was thinking about that I see in Virginia and Tennessee.

Here are examples of Watersheds marker signs as I understood them. The green ones with the word watershed on them. They must be placed by the State.

Yes, those signs are what we are Waymarking.

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16 minutes ago, elyob said:

Yes, those signs are what we are Waymarking.

 

Okay, thank you! :) I have no idea what Tante.Hossi was attempting but it sure confused me. :unsure:

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The category is acitive now. Some changes have been integrated to make thing more clear. (We hope so).

We're waiting to see your signs and markers for those watersheds and divides all around the world.

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1 hour ago, Tante.Hossi said:

The category is acitive now.

If the category just became active, how can there be a waymark approved three days before?

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3 minutes ago, DougK said:

If the category just became active, how can there be a waymark approved three days before?

This happend by accident. One of the officer submitted a waymark to the category. Another officer thought the category is already active.

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