German Benchmarks

[+Tante.Hossi]

The German speaking Waymarking group has worked together to create a new category proposal for German Benchmarks.

 

A new Waymarking group has already been installed, actually 5 officers have signed in and a category description has been created. This bilingual description (Englisch/German) includes a clear definition of what will be accepted and of what will be excluded. A selection of sample pictures has been uploaded. Posting and visiting instructions have been defined. We have already done a lot of work.

 

For historical reasons there are several different types of Benchmarks in Germany. In Germany exists no public and free database for TrigPoints and Benchmarks. You always have to pay for details about the TrigPoints and Benchmarks. A Waymarking category for the German TrigPoints has been created years ago. Now it's time to create this additional category which shall include all official German Benchmarks.

 

I know that this category will not be global! But TrigPoint and Benchmark categories have always been excluded from the global criteria in the history of Waymarking. This will be just another national Benchmark category.

 

Please help us and take a look at our description!

[+Max and 99]

There is no free database, but waymarkers must use only officially registered benchmarks (from a list). I am a little confused. Sorry.

[+jhuoni]

The German speaking Waymarking group has worked together to create a new category proposal for German Benchmarks.

 

I know that this category will not be global! But TrigPoint and Benchmark categories have always been excluded from the global criteria in the history of Waymarking. This will be just another national Benchmark category.

 

Please help us and take a look at our description!

 

As for not being GLOBAL - Last time I checked there are 50 US Historical Marker categories which can not be waymarked outside of the US. Not to mention Latvian, Canadian, Disney, and all those other benchmarks which do not exist outside of their home country (or Magical Kingdoms).

 

I really think the GLOBAL criteria really prohibits a lot of good categories from being formed. We have an Ancient Roman Civilization category, I don't think there will ever be a waymark found in North or South America, Australia, (or a whole lot more locations), but the category still exists. We have an American Civil War Monuments category, but I challenge you to find one of those markers in your home country - Germany.

 

I looked over your write up. To be honest, I couldn't tell a difference in the photos of the acceptable and not acceptable benchmarks, but I don't speak the language so I don't know what they mean.

 

I did find a typo, actually in the word "TYPE" below, the letter "E" has been left off.

 

[EN] If you find another typ of Benchmark, which is contained neither in the one nor in the other list, you can contact the Leader or one of the Officers. The type of the Benchmark is then checked and will be taken into one of the lists.

 

I also see that just today, someone has began the process of forming a Belgium Benchmark category.

 

I believe that the global requirement should not be an issue for the passing of this category.

[+Max and 99]

 

I believe that the global requirement should not be an issue for the passing of this category.

 

I think most of us would agree with this.

[+Tante.Hossi]

There is no free database, but waymarkers must use only officially registered benchmarks (from a list). I am a little confused. Sorry.

 

YES! There's no free database. But the offical Benchmarks are easy to identify because of their labeling. You can find them outdoors and take a look at the labeling. If it's in the list of the accepted points you can waymark it.

The other excluded points are no Benchmarks. They are TripPoints, survey marker, border points or something else.

If they don't have any lebeling, they are not official. Easy isn't it?

For historical reasongs there are different types of Benchmarks.

 

I hope you're no longer confused!

[+Tante.Hossi]

I looked over your write up. To be honest, I couldn't tell a difference in the photos of the acceptable and not acceptable benchmarks, but I don't speak the language so I don't know what they mean.

 

The excluded points are no Benchmarks. They are TrigPoints, survey markers, border points and other points.

Yes, not easy if you cannot read the labeling. That's the reason why we have included the sample pics.

[+silverquill]

I've talked about the "Global" criterion before, and I still think it needs some clarification.

 

As I understand it, this requirement is meant to eliminate categories that are _arbitrarily_ limited such as "U.S. Lighthouses." So, the category must be just "Lighthouses."

 

Some categories are limited geographically just because they don't have a world-wide distribution. "Gothic Buildings," comes to mind. London Coal Tax sites or the U.S National Register of Historic Places and similar categories are somewhat similar.

 

There are some that don't really make sense to me, such as one category for "U.S. National Parks," and another category "World National Parks," for all other countries.

 

Then there some categories that actually are country-specific only because that makes them more manageable. Examples are the Post Office categories for different countries, and benchmarks are similar. There are many categories for benchmarks and trig-points for individual countries, which makes total sense.

 

So, there is certainly no reason to deny your category on the basis of the global criterion.

 

I really think it needs to be rewritten for clarification.

[+Tante.Hossi]

No more comments about our category proposal?

So it is ready for Peer Review?

[+Max and 99]

I would have to abstain from voting for this category since I still don't understand the write-up.

 

But I DO support the category and DO think it should be approved. I just think the write-up needs a little tweaking first. Sorry, but I'd rather tell you now than in the peer review comments.

[+Max and 99]

There is no free database, but waymarkers must use only officially registered benchmarks (from a list). I am a little confused. Sorry.

 

YES! There's no free database. But the offical Benchmarks are easy to identify because of their labeling. You can find them outdoors and take a look at the labeling. If it's in the list of the accepted points you can waymark it.

The other excluded points are no Benchmarks. They are TripPoints, survey marker, border points or something else.

If they don't have any lebeling, they are not official. Easy isn't it?

For historical reasongs there are different types of Benchmarks.

 

I hope you're no longer confused!

 

That really sounds to me like in order to waymark a German benchmanrk I must first PAY to access/get the information from the list, since it's not free.

 

I have no idea the difference in the accepted and not accepted benchmarks, except maybe... the accepted ones must be on the list that you have to pay for?

 

I DO support the category, I just hope for a little more clarification. Thank you!

[+Manville Possum]

So what if it is not on the list but is a German benchmark? Also no free data base? I also think more clarification is needed before sending it to peer review.

[+Tante.Hossi]

OK I'll try to change the description a little bit to make it more clear.

 

- No free database: This means you cannot search a database as first step to find a benchmark. You have to find a benchmark by luck before you can waymark it. Sorry but no other possible way in Germany.

 

- accepted benchmarks vs. excluded objects: to make it more clear: every official German benchmark can be easily identified by its labeling. It's one of the labelings listed in list #1. All the objects listed in list #2 are NO benchmarks (So we better call them 'objects'). They are other things like TrigPoints, survey points, border points. They are only listed up because they can be easily confused with a benchmark.

 

I hope this makes things more clear!

[+Max and 99]

To recap.....

You can only waymark a German benchmark IF it is on the list. But the list isn't free, you have to pay for the information?

[+Tante.Hossi]

A more clear definition of accepted benchmarks and excluded objects has been written into the category description:

 

What kind of Benchmarks can be posted? ==> All official German Benchmarks can be easily identified because they have one of the following labeling: ...

Which Points will NOT be accepted? ==> The following objects can be easily confused with a Benchmark, although they are no Benchmarks. All objects with one of these labelings are generally excluded because they are no Benchmarks: ...

 

Clearly enough?

[+Tante.Hossi]

To recap.....

You can only waymark a German benchmark IF it is on the list. But the list isn't free, you have to pay for the information?

 

No you missunderstood (or I did ... or we both did ...)

The list means the list of accepted labelings written in the category description. NOT the list of benchmarks you have to pay for.

You do NOT need to pay for the details of the benchmark! You just have to find one by luck, check the labeling and if the labeling is equal to one of the listed labelings - BINGO - you can waymark it! Because it is a German benchmark.

[+Max and 99]

To recap.....

You can only waymark a German benchmark IF it is on the list. But the list isn't free, you have to pay for the information?

 

No you missunderstood (or I did ... or we both did ...)

The list means the list of accepted labelings written in the category description. NOT the list of benchmarks you have to pay for.

You do NOT need to pay for the details of the benchmark! You just have to find one by luck, check the labeling and if the labeling is equal to one of the listed labelings - BINGO - you can waymark it! Because it is a German benchmark.

 

Got it! Thanks.

[+Manville Possum]

OK, sounds similar to the old TVA benchmarks that I find by accident that there are no public records of.

[Bon Echo]

I have a few questions and comments about the category, which I think is viable and appropriate in spite of it not being "global" because it just makes sense (at least to me) that benchmarks should be in separate categories by country.

 

First, let me say that my comments come about from reading only the English translation of the category description, and maybe the original German text provides additional details.

 

Point 1:

The description states:

Historically, in Germany there are different types of Benchmarks. The different types can be easily distinguished by the respective labeling.

Yet I cannot find anywhere in the description where these "different types of Benchmarks" are clearly given. Furthermore, I see one of the variables is "type", so can I suggest that you provide in the description the three "types" of benchmarks

 

Point 2:

the one photo in the bottom center of the "a Selection of accepted Points", the one that is marked "336 m" - it seems to me that the inscription under the numbers is not included in the list of acceptable benchmarks ("What kind of Benchmarks can be posted? All official German Benchmarks can be easily identified because they have one of the following labeling:")

 

Point 3:

Maybe just me but I find two of the variables to be a bit unusal:

gemessene Höhe / measured elevation

GPS-Empfänfger / GPS Device

Does this mean that anyone posting a benchmark will need to obtain the elevation at the site? Not all GPS devices can do this. And does this information add any to the waymark? Really, does it matter what GPS unit is used?

 

Thanks

[Bon Echo]

Sorry, please ignore Point #1. I see the different types now, but only in German. I thought those were just markings, I didn't realize they are also the types

[+Tante.Hossi]

Point 1:

The description states:

Historically, in Germany there are different types of Benchmarks. The different types can be easily distinguished by the respective labeling.

Yet I cannot find anywhere in the description where these "different types of Benchmarks" are clearly given. Furthermore, I see one of the variables is "type", so can I suggest that you provide in the description the three "types" of benchmarks

The variable 'type' corresponds with the list of accepted benchmarks.

 

Point 2:

the one photo in the bottom center of the "a Selection of accepted Points", the one that is marked "336 m" - it seems to me that the inscription under the numbers is not included in the list of acceptable benchmarks ("What kind of Benchmarks can be posted? All official German Benchmarks can be easily identified because they have one of the following labeling:")

Yes! You're right! I fixed this issue. Now it is identical. Thanks!

 

Point 3:

Maybe just me but I find two of the variables to be a bit unusal:

gemessene Höhe / measured elevation

GPS-Empfänfger / GPS Device

Does this mean that anyone posting a benchmark will need to obtain the elevation at the site? Not all GPS devices can do this. And does this information add any to the waymark? Really, does it matter what GPS unit is used?

This two variabes are optional!

And Yes! The elevation is the one and only reason why this benchmark exists. It is the basement of everything about benchmarks! But we've decided to set it to optional.

It is quite interesting which GPS device was used, because it may say something about the quality of the measurement. And I'm sure any GPS device can measure altitudes, because this is one of the bases of the GPS system. But it is optional as well.

 

Thanks for your good comments!

[+Tante.Hossi]

Category has been sent to Peer Review. Please vote!

[+Tante.Hossi]

Seems so that our new category has pased Peer Review! Thanks for your votes!

Now we have to wait for the start ...

[+Tante.Hossi]

The category is active. First waymarks have already been submitted and they got approved. We officers are looking forward for the next benchmarks to come.

[+lumbricus]

Congratulations!

[+BruceS]

Just leave a couple available so that when I get well and can travel again I can get some on my visit.

[+lumbricus]

Just leave a couple available so that when I get well and can travel again I can get some on my visit.

 

I know one in my home town so I'll leave that one for you.

[+Tante.Hossi]

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