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Competitive geocaching


ashtonmehrle
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I love Geocaching and I am a big fan of Si-Fi and table top war games such as "War hammer 40k" now I have an idea that might allow for me to combine my interests into one new version of geocaching. To start off I want to get ideas from you guys and opinions on this game. So please comment with your ideas and opinions below. The game will be to set up with a Sci-Fi like back story and then have the cacher join a faction or clan. They then would go out and claim Caches for their faction, leaving a token of some kind behind in the cache. I want this to like a competitive capture the flag like game where factions compete to have the most caches. My only dilemma is i'm not sure how to create a points system where people can claim the caches without having cheaters being able to cheat easily. I have thought that having a QR code on the token could be a good idea or maybe a website but thats only for people that have left behind a token. So my real question to you all is do you think this is interesting and would you play, and how to make a points system or community for this game grow quickly. I can have a website up within days but I want a sufficient community of players. please comment below or email me at ashtonmehrle@mac.com

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I love Geocaching and I am a big fan of Si-Fi and table top war games such as "War hammer 40k" now I have an idea that might allow for me to combine my interests into one new version of geocaching. To start off I want to get ideas from you guys and opinions on this game. So please comment with your ideas and opinions below. The game will be to set up with a Sci-Fi like back story and then have the cacher join a faction or clan. They then would go out and claim Caches for their faction, leaving a token of some kind behind in the cache. I want this to like a competitive capture the flag like game where factions compete to have the most caches. My only dilemma is i'm not sure how to create a points system where people can claim the caches without having cheaters being able to cheat easily. I have thought that having a QR code on the token could be a good idea or maybe a website but thats only for people that have left behind a token. So my real question to you all is do you think this is interesting and would you play, and how to make a points system or community for this game grow quickly. I can have a website up within days but I want a sufficient community of players. please comment below or email me at ashtonmehrle@mac.com

Let's see, new account today with zero hides and zero finds. How do you know you love the game, since you have not tried it? Or is this your sock talking since you are afraid have the real person do the talking? Do you realize that most cache solo, some with their partners and a few with friends? Doesn't sound like a setup for team competition. And how do you leave a token in a nano or a film can? I hate when folks think they have to put swag in every container they find. Besides I probably won already because the amount of monopoly money I have dropped into caches all over the western United States.

 

Go find 6 or 7 hundred caches and come back and tell us how much you love the game. Then I might think might at least like it for an occasional Saturday afternoon activity.

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I'm not sure what "War Hammer" is but are the folks who play this game also interested in Geocaching? We'd love to have more players. Are they also interested in a game like this?

 

It sounds interesting. I could see a group of cachers creating teams and counting the caches that are found to see who wins over a month or so.

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Here's my thought, Ashton. You are looking for the point system? That should be a derivative of how you design the game. Your passion should lead you to game play. Once you figure out what moves will make competitive Geocaching interesting, the point system will fall into place. I think gameplay should also lead you to make a decision on using caches listed on this site or one of the less regulated sites or one of your own. Game play is everything.

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I don't think encouraging competitive geocaching is good for the game. Besides, competitive geocaching already exists: power trails, everyone who's chasing Alamogul & Bobcam & Team Snook, and a certain GPS game hosted by another site that uses QR codes. What constitutes a Find, the legitimacy of Find numbers, and the value of stats is long debated in geocaching with no clear resolution in sight. A competitive scoring system beyond what we have now will only make the situation worse.

 

I'm not sure what "War Hammer" is but are the folks who play this game also interested in Geocaching? We'd love to have more players. Are they also interested in a game like this?

 

Warhammer 40k is a tabletop miniatures wargame (uses rulebooks, dice, assembled and painted plastic or pewter figures, and scenery similiar to model railroading). Quite geeky. I should know, I've played that game and several similiar games for more than a decade. I've met at least one other wargamer/geocacher (I recognized his geo-name as making a Warhammer reference and asked him about it).

 

I don't think there will ever be a significant wargamer/geocacher crossover. Both hobbies are too time consuming for most people to do both, but the kind of people who like one are generally not the kind to like the other (at its simplest level: indoors vs outdoors).

 

It's sort of ironic a wargamer brings in the idea for competitive geocaching as gaming, especially Warhammer 40k, has long been troubled by the fun vs competitive debate. Some folks try their darnedest to win including bending rules, putting together an army for a game that seems to create an overly powerful combination believed unforseen/unintended by the game designers, etc.

Edited by Joshism
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I see a lot of armchair logging being encouraged here.

 

At the GS block party, I already saw/heard people sharing the lab caches code words. QR codes can be scanned, emailed, etc. tokens can be stolen.

 

Besides...I already have a clan that I claim finds for...me. Me, myself, and I.

My son and I took the historic walking tour of Matewan, WV. during the Hatfield/McCoy MEGA event, we met several other cachers seeking the Lab caches. We were given the correct coordinates to a listing that had the wrong coordinates by a finder while we were still in Kentucky logging the HMGT caches, and many that logged the Lab caches shared emails. Even at MOGA some members "honorary" logged some caches because they worked the events. Armchair happens, so each to their own. I like posting photo proof with my logs. :laughing:

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I love Geocaching and I am a big fan of Si-Fi and table top war games such as "War hammer 40k" now I have an idea that might allow for me to combine my interests into one new version of geocaching. To start off I want to get ideas from you guys and opinions on this game. So please comment with your ideas and opinions below. The game will be to set up with a Sci-Fi like back story and then have the cacher join a faction or clan. They then would go out and claim Caches for their faction, leaving a token of some kind behind in the cache. I want this to like a competitive capture the flag like game where factions compete to have the most caches. My only dilemma is i'm not sure how to create a points system where people can claim the caches without having cheaters being able to cheat easily. I have thought that having a QR code on the token could be a good idea or maybe a website but thats only for people that have left behind a token. So my real question to you all is do you think this is interesting and would you play, and how to make a points system or community for this game grow quickly. I can have a website up within days but I want a sufficient community of players. please comment below or email me at ashtonmehrle@mac.com

Let's see, new account today with zero hides and zero finds. How do you know you love the game, since you have not tried it? Or is this your sock talking since you are afraid have the real person do the talking? Do you realize that most cache solo, some with their partners and a few with friends? Doesn't sound like a setup for team competition. And how do you leave a token in a nano or a film can? I hate when folks think they have to put swag in every container they find. Besides I probably won already because the amount of monopoly money I have dropped into caches all over the western United States.

 

Go find 6 or 7 hundred caches and come back and tell us how much you love the game. Then I might think might at least like it for an occasional Saturday afternoon activity.

Suppose it's a sock account - so what? He wants his privacy while sending up a "trial balloon." Maybe an esteemed senior reviewer is floating the idea. Why should he have to reveal his name and give up perks like invites to the owner's mansion funded by the $75 million of revenue estimated right here in the forum?! :laughing:

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While the world mostly consists of either real or imagined competition... geocaching is not one of them.

 

Many have tried to make competitions out of geocaching, a few have even succeeded -- but only to a point. Most always, even those supposed successful competitions, each geocaching competition attempt has failed. Folks who were friends, are not any more. Folks who weren't friends to begin with are now out-and-out enemies. Personally, I think you should stick to paintball and capture-the-flag.

 

Give 'er a whirl... I think you'll find that I am right.

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Suppose it's a sock account - so what? He wants his privacy while sending up a "trial balloon." Maybe an esteemed senior reviewer is floating the idea. Why should he have to reveal his name and give up perks like invites to the owner's mansion funded by the $75 million of revenue estimated right here in the forum?! :laughing:

How about the Forum Guidelines

5. Sock puppet accounts are not permitted. A sock-puppet account is created and used by a person who already has a primary account, for the purpose of posting anonymously. Posts from known sock puppet accounts may be deleted, and both the sock-puppet and primary accounts may be suspended from the Groundspeak sites. Please use your real, primary account for posting in the Groundspeak forums.

 

That said, there are people who have multiple accounts. Many reviewers keep a separate player account. They might use the player account to post in the forum to give their "unofficial" opinions any reserve the reviewer account to post made in their official capacity. Many people who cache as a team will have separated accounts for posting in the forum (especially once a spouse gets blame for some controversial remark).

 

I don't believe there is any rules against having multiple accounts, The problem has been with people posting anonymously and saying things that they might not have said otherwise.

 

I tend to discount that the OP is a sock puppet. Instead it is likely someone who 1) didn't realize that their geocaching account works on the forum, or 2) uses the mobile app to geocache and has forgotten the password they used to create the account.

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Suppose it's a sock account - so what? He wants his privacy while sending up a "trial balloon." Maybe an esteemed senior reviewer is floating the idea. Why should he have to reveal his name and give up perks like invites to the owner's mansion funded by the $75 million of revenue estimated right here in the forum?! :laughing:

How about the Forum Guidelines

5. Sock puppet accounts are not permitted. A sock-puppet account is created and used by a person who already has a primary account, for the purpose of posting anonymously. Posts from known sock puppet accounts may be deleted, and both the sock-puppet and primary accounts may be suspended from the Groundspeak sites. Please use your real, primary account for posting in the Groundspeak forums.

 

That said, there are people who have multiple accounts. Many reviewers keep a separate player account. They might use the player account to post in the forum to give their "unofficial" opinions any reserve the reviewer account to post made in their official capacity. Many people who cache as a team will have separated accounts for posting in the forum (especially once a spouse gets blame for some controversial remark).

 

I don't believe there is any rules against having multiple accounts, The problem has been with people posting anonymously and saying things that they might not have said otherwise.

 

I tend to discount that the OP is a sock puppet. Instead it is likely someone who 1) didn't realize that their geocaching account works on the forum, or 2) uses the mobile app to geocache and has forgotten the password they used to create the account.

Believe what you will, but I say it's a kid that enjoys playing video games and just found out about geocaching from a phone app. I could be wrong, but I enjoy my Xbox too. I'm just not into the live play, but my son is, and quite good. I understand the cheating aspect from the OP's post, that is why I don't have a live account anymore. I'm not into War Hammer, COD is my game, but I'm a Ghost and not a Sock Puppet. :ph34r:

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LPC'S As far as the eye can see. I can only imagine micros nanos and throwdowns would sprout in numbers with ppl planting lame caches to increase numbers/points.

 

You don't even have to imagine,, it's already happening! :(

Exactly!! Now think if there WAS actually points to be gotten and persons to beat on an actual level.... It would be 20 times worse :(

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LPC'S As far as the eye can see. I can only imagine micros nanos and throwdowns would sprout in numbers with ppl planting lame caches to increase numbers/points.

 

You don't even have to imagine,, it's already happening! :(

Exactly!! Now think if there WAS actually points to be gotten and persons to beat on an actual level.... It would be 20 times worse :(

 

That's assuming that what other do actually has an impact on you.

 

Back on topic...

 

There is a series of Puzzle caches in my area that has a relatively informal point system thing going, based on first to solve, FTF and so forth. I think the points break down depending on how far down in the pack you are. I'm not sure the OP is looking for something as loosely organized as that, since they appear to be concerned with cheating, which in my opinion is kind of inevitable.

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Just to editorialize on the cheating aspects a bit more; when my son was younger, I spent several years helping coach his schools First Lego League team. While there were numerous rules involved (i.e. must use certified Lego parts, no destroying the playing field to the point that it takes the judges an hour to put the table back together), the league actually encouraged cheating. They called it "innovation" however.

 

In some ways, it's kind of how the Challenge Listings are defined in the Help Center. There's a few hard and fast rules to keep the game fun and relevant, but how you choose to "innovate" your Challenge is really up to you.

 

edit spelling.

Edited by Touchstone
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LPC'S As far as the eye can see. I can only imagine micros nanos and throwdowns would sprout in numbers with ppl planting lame caches to increase numbers/points.

 

You don't even have to imagine,, it's already happening! :(

Exactly!! Now think if there WAS actually points to be gotten and persons to beat on an actual level.... It would be 20 times worse :(

 

This game is one that is on a personal level. I play this game by myself and with my girlfriend when we go on hikes. The competition is with yourself to use the clues, make the hike and find the cache. By trying to it more competitive you ruin the greatness of the original game.

 

What I don't understand is how this new use for existing (and new) caches is really effecting those who prefer "traditional" geocaching.

 

If a new game were to piggyback on Geocaching.com caches, you could still find and a log caches as you do today. Maybe there will be more to find - as caches are hidden specifically for some new game - and perhaps it will be that they will tend to be what you call "lame". Then it should be easy to ignore most of these new caches.

 

If the new game were to place their own caches separate from Geocaching.com you'd find it even easier to ignore these caches. Maybe you'll find one by accident while searching for another cache. Just like you might find a letterbox or a HWMNBN QR code.

 

It may be that relative of competition - personal achievement which some have decided means finding more caches - has resulted in more LPCs, power trails, and other caches people like to complain about. The idea that there is something inherently wrong with people who simply like to measure their geocaching experience by the find count bothers me. Those for whom "the numbers don't matter" can simply be more selective in the geocaches they go after. You don't have to find every one. You even have the option, when the GPS is leading you into a big box store parking lot, to press next and skip this cache. :mmraspberry:

Edited by tozainamboku
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...If a new game were to piggyback on Geocaching.com caches, you could still find and a log caches as you do today...

Sure, but "piggyback" is the reason I asked on the second post.

Our area got hit good a while ago from a "46 of 300 today" group and more than half the containers needed some sort of maintenance afterwards.

Put this on a scale where folks are competing with each other, on a site not associated with this one ("they're not our caches...") and it could be a real pain in the can with maintenance.

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↑↑↑ You're probably correct that it's a gaming kid with a combine-two-concepts idea. He should try it -that's how inventions happen. As with all inventions, there will be 99 failures until the 1 brilliant success.

I have seen similar ideas, capture the flag while playing paintball, use a GPS unit to acquire the coordinates to the flag, or ammo dump. Hide an ammo can stocked with things needed to play the game. The use of QR codes is already a part of geocaching, the new Garmin's support QR codes, Groundspeak does not. I could toss out a few ideas already tested to the OP, but the problem with gamers is you can't un-glue them from sitting in front of a screen indoors. Geocaching gets you off of the couch and promotes being active. One post and disappear? Geocaching was only great for a day, but War Hammer and Cyber Space are kwel! :laughing:

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↑↑↑ You're probably correct that it's a gaming kid with a combine-two-concepts idea. He should try it -that's how inventions happen. As with all inventions, there will be 99 failures until the 1 brilliant success.

I have seen similar ideas, capture the flag while playing paintball, use a GPS unit to acquire the coordinates to the flag, or ammo dump. Hide an ammo can stocked with things needed to play the game. The use of QR codes is already a part of geocaching, the new Garmin's support QR codes, Groundspeak does not. I could toss out a few ideas already tested to the OP, but the problem with gamers is you can't un-glue them from sitting in front of a screen indoors. Geocaching gets you off of the couch and promotes being active. One post and disappear? Geocaching was only great for a day, but War Hammer and Cyber Space are kwel! :laughing:

 

I appreciate all the comments, although mostly were harsh and rude, several people were quite helpful. Thank you for your comments and, What I hope was, constructive criticism.

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↑↑↑ You're probably correct that it's a gaming kid with a combine-two-concepts idea. He should try it -that's how inventions happen. As with all inventions, there will be 99 failures until the 1 brilliant success.

I have seen similar ideas, capture the flag while playing paintball, use a GPS unit to acquire the coordinates to the flag, or ammo dump. Hide an ammo can stocked with things needed to play the game. The use of QR codes is already a part of geocaching, the new Garmin's support QR codes, Groundspeak does not. I could toss out a few ideas already tested to the OP, but the problem with gamers is you can't un-glue them from sitting in front of a screen indoors. Geocaching gets you off of the couch and promotes being active. One post and disappear? Geocaching was only great for a day, but War Hammer and Cyber Space are kwel! :laughing:

 

I appreciate all the comments, although mostly were harsh and rude, several people were quite helpful. Thank you for your comments and, What I hope was, constructive criticism.

 

I have done some more thought in reviewing what you all said. Now I propose a new game. Not entirely competitive, but still a new aspect to the game of geocaching. lets talk about trackables, everybody loves them and they are an awesome attachment to the game. What about a collectable though? You leave a small token printed on cardstock or some thicker paper and on it you have your group or faction, signified by the color of the token, and your username to the forum. ( either this one or one I put together my self ) upon finding this token you can take it and replace it with a token of your own. This allows players to begin collecting tokens left by other players and seeing who is in their area. You can contact them through the forum by the username left on the token. By finding new tokens and leaving yours behind you can see whether you have gotten to this cache first, or if someone else beat you to it. This wont damage the classic idea behind geocacheing but it also allows for a new way to play. What do you think?

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↑↑↑ You're probably correct that it's a gaming kid with a combine-two-concepts idea. He should try it -that's how inventions happen. As with all inventions, there will be 99 failures until the 1 brilliant success.

I have seen similar ideas, capture the flag while playing paintball, use a GPS unit to acquire the coordinates to the flag, or ammo dump. Hide an ammo can stocked with things needed to play the game. The use of QR codes is already a part of geocaching, the new Garmin's support QR codes, Groundspeak does not. I could toss out a few ideas already tested to the OP, but the problem with gamers is you can't un-glue them from sitting in front of a screen indoors. Geocaching gets you off of the couch and promotes being active. One post and disappear? Geocaching was only great for a day, but War Hammer and Cyber Space are kwel! :laughing:

 

I appreciate all the comments, although mostly were harsh and rude, several people were quite helpful. Thank you for your comments and, What I hope was, constructive criticism.

If you are a gamer and have found out the same things that I have, Cyber Space is harsh and rude. I don't have a live account anymore because of all the cheats and garbage from other players. I enjoy capture the flag while playing paintball, and I used a GPS unit long before I found out about geocaching and Waymarking, which I also enjoy. Your idea about the QR codes already exists, but I am not allowed to discuss other GPS related listing services here. I like your idea and you have my support, so if you wish bring a little more to this game of geocaching you can. :) My clan is the Possum Clan, so you are not alone out there. :ph34r:

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First off I think some are being so critical because you don't have any experience in geocaching. Or at least that's how it appears. You are either a sock puppet account, or you really don't have experience.

 

You have to remember that geocaches are owned by the geocachers, not the owners of the website. That means adding any games or competition is unfair to those who have caches but don't want to be part of it-they either have to let if happen, or take down the listing.

 

As for your second idea, let's see if I have this correct. You find a cache. You leave a token to say you where there. Then I find a cache, and I leave my own and take yours to show I was the last person there. These tokens sound kinda like Path Tags.

 

And there's a much easier way to do it-instead of spending money on these tokens that you have to leave in every cache(Some people have thousands of finds. That's a lot of tokens) the CO could place a notebook in the cache, and have the people finding it, sign it. The last person to sign it is the last to find it. We could even create some form of system to "log" them online. Maybe even include options to let the cache owner know it may be missing, or in need of fixing-or maintenance if you will. It's really a great idea...to bad nobody around here has thought of that before. :ph34r: :ph34r:

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I have done some more thought in reviewing what you all said. Now I propose a new game. Not entirely competitive, but still a new aspect to the game of geocaching. lets talk about trackables, everybody loves them and they are an awesome attachment to the game. What about a collectable though? You leave a small token printed on cardstock or some thicker paper and on it you have your group or faction, signified by the color of the token, and your username to the forum. ( either this one or one I put together my self ) upon finding this token you can take it and replace it with a token of your own. This allows players to begin collecting tokens left by other players and seeing who is in their area. You can contact them through the forum by the username left on the token. By finding new tokens and leaving yours behind you can see whether you have gotten to this cache first, or if someone else beat you to it. This wont damage the classic idea behind geocacheing but it also allows for a new way to play. What do you think?

 

Not to be "harsh and rude" ;) but the functionality you describe pretty much exists on this site as well as several others. Nothing in your scenario is really screaming out, "Wow! that's neat and cool". I think it's going to be tough to "gameify" any further, a relatively mature game like Geocaching. My 0.02.

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First off I think some are being so critical because you don't have any experience in geocaching. Or at least that's how it appears. You are either a sock puppet account, or you really don't have experience.

 

You have to remember that geocaches are owned by the geocachers, not the owners of the website. That means adding any games or competition is unfair to those who have caches but don't want to be part of it-they either have to let if happen, or take down the listing.

 

As for your second idea, let's see if I have this correct. You find a cache. You leave a token to say you where there. Then I find a cache, and I leave my own and take yours to show I was the last person there. These tokens sound kinda like Path Tags.

 

And there's a much easier way to do it-instead of spending money on these tokens that you have to leave in every cache(Some people have thousands of finds. That's a lot of tokens) the CO could place a notebook in the cache, and have the people finding it, sign it. The last person to sign it is the last to find it. We could even create some form of system to "log" them online. Maybe even include options to let the cache owner know it may be missing, or in need of fixing-or maintenance if you will. It's really a great idea...to bad nobody around here has thought of that before. :ph34r: :ph34r:

Oh no T.D.M.22, you used the p-word in the frog's forum!

To the OP. What you are suggesting we are already doing on other geocaching sites. We have QR codes and other means to verify that you have visited the cache. There are more than a few ways to do this. It's just that you have never found or hidden a geocache or posted in the forums but claim that geocaching is the greatest game on earth. That is just a little too hard to believe. I could contact you through the email address that you provided but you seem too new to geocaching for me to introduce you to my gamer clan. A7X.

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Now I propose a new game. Not entirely competitive, but still a new aspect to the game of geocaching. lets talk about trackables, everybody loves them and they are an awesome attachment to the game. What about a collectable though? You leave a small token printed on cardstock or some thicker paper and on it you have your group or faction, signified by the color of the token, and your username to the forum. ( either this one or one I put together my self ) upon finding this token you can take it and replace it with a token of your own. This allows players to begin collecting tokens left by other players and seeing who is in their area. You can contact them through the forum by the username left on the token. By finding new tokens and leaving yours behind you can see whether you have gotten to this cache first, or if someone else beat you to it. This wont damage the classic idea behind geocacheing but it also allows for a new way to play. What do you think?
I'm not sure how this differs from the current practice of leaving and collecting personal signature items.
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I have done some more thought in reviewing what you all said. Now I propose a new game. Not entirely competitive, but still a new aspect to the game of geocaching. lets talk about trackables, everybody loves them and they are an awesome attachment to the game. What about a collectable though? You leave a small token printed on cardstock or some thicker paper and on it you have your group or faction, signified by the color of the token, and your username to the forum. ( either this one or one I put together my self ) upon finding this token you can take it and replace it with a token of your own. This allows players to begin collecting tokens left by other players and seeing who is in their area. You can contact them through the forum by the username left on the token. By finding new tokens and leaving yours behind you can see whether you have gotten to this cache first, or if someone else beat you to it. This wont damage the classic idea behind geocacheing but it also allows for a new way to play. What do you think?

Ashton, I purposely used the word "passion" in my first reply regarding game play. Anything worth while requires this. It appears you have none for this endeavor as you are now proposing something so watered down that it will never capture interest. I'm guessing that you are just trying to make a weak attempt at capitalizing on an activity that you just discovered. I've seen hundreds of attempts and only a handful that were successful.

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I have done some more thought in reviewing what you all said. Now I propose a new game.

...snip...

What do you think?

You asked...

 

What?!

You're giving up on your awesome idea so quickly, to just come up with another?

- Sounds (to me) like you're not serious (or really interested) at all, but simply trying to make a buck off of something you obviously have no knowledge of..

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I have done some more thought in reviewing what you all said. Now I propose a new game.

...snip...

What do you think?

You asked...

 

What?!

You're giving up on your awesome idea so quickly, to just come up with another?

- Sounds (to me) like you're not serious (or really interested) at all, but simply trying to make a buck off of something you obviously have no knowledge of..

Yeah, it's best to toss in the towel now. It's been just over three years that a very large corporation that manufactures GPS devices developed their very own geocaching site that uses QR codes and verification numbers that anyone can use for free, and it failed to attract the interest of most geocachers. So keep calm and kill Zombies. I'll have to check out War Hammer. PS, Don't think I'm just rude. I'm direct and to the point, that is just how I communicate. Have fun geocaching. :)

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...If a new game were to piggyback on Geocaching.com caches, you could still find and a log caches as you do today...

Sure, but "piggyback" is the reason I asked on the second post.

Our area got hit good a while ago from a "46 of 300 today" group and more than half the containers needed some sort of maintenance afterwards.

Put this on a scale where folks are competing with each other, on a site not associated with this one ("they're not our caches...") and it could be a real pain in the can with maintenance.

 

Exactly.

 

Also, if they're using other people's cache hides, they log their finds with a cut n paste log that thanks the guy who created the new game for the find - not acknowledging the individual caches and the individual cache owners' efforts. Which is what usually happens with a "46 of 300 today" large power caching group. 30+ logs all cut-n-paste, thanking the guy who organized the hunt for the fun day of mega smileys.

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First off I think some are being so critical because you don't have any experience in geocaching. Or at least that's how it appears. You are either a sock puppet account, or you really don't have experience.

 

You have to remember that geocaches are owned by the geocachers, not the owners of the website. That means adding any games or competition is unfair to those who have caches but don't want to be part of it-they either have to let if happen, or take down the listing.

 

As for your second idea, let's see if I have this correct. You find a cache. You leave a token to say you where there. Then I find a cache, and I leave my own and take yours to show I was the last person there. These tokens sound kinda like Path Tags.

 

And there's a much easier way to do it-instead of spending money on these tokens that you have to leave in every cache(Some people have thousands of finds. That's a lot of tokens) the CO could place a notebook in the cache, and have the people finding it, sign it. The last person to sign it is the last to find it. We could even create some form of system to "log" them online. Maybe even include options to let the cache owner know it may be missing, or in need of fixing-or maintenance if you will. It's really a great idea...to bad nobody around here has thought of that before. :ph34r: :ph34r:

Maybe he's hoping to sell tokens. You know, like some organizations sell aluminum tags that people leave in caches. :P

 

When one gas station opens across the street from another, it's not because people have nowhere to buy gas, it's because some people have a deep need to run the show. They live by the motto, "If you're not the lead dog, the view never changes." Without these people, cars and computers would not exist....and new games - including this one fifteen years ago - would not exist either!

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