Geocache Archive Requests

[+Sharks-N-Beans]

... who is held in such a high regard (?) throughout the entire community.

Ahem!

 

I never had any chance to vote for this world-wide-whatever title... Is this like the World Series, really only a local thing?

I think it's a Blog thing, so sure, world wide. If I remember, you get nominated and whoever can get more of their own locals to come to the Blog and vote wins. So ya, it's also a local thing. Your analogy to the WS is pretty accurate as local voting plays a big part in both.

 

...had my coffee...I should have said All Star Game is a good analogy, not WS.

Edited December 7, 2013 by Sharks-N-Beans

[Mr.Yuck]

... who is held in such a high regard (?) throughout the entire community.

Ahem!

 

I never had any chance to vote for this world-wide-whatever title... Is this like the World Series, really only a local thing?

 

If I'm not mistaken.....it's a global thing.

 

http://blog.geocaching.com/category/geocachers-care/geocacher-of-the-month/

 

I have "interviewed" a previous winner. There are 3 nominees every month. There's an introductory blog post about the 3 of them, then comments are open for usually two weeks. I didn't say voting I said comments, as in comments to the blog post by readers. Groundspeak then chooses the winner from reviewing the comments. They don't necessarily say they choose the nominee who has the most comments, but it pretty much seems to turn out that way.

[+ChileHead]

Is Groundspeak really going to get involved in a nasty situation with someone deemed as World Wide Geocacher of the month ~ September 2013?

 

Obviously he would have never gotten that now. I wonder if it can be retracted and give him another "award".

[+Sharks-N-Beans]

Is Groundspeak really going to get involved in a nasty situation with someone deemed as World Wide Geocacher of the month ~ September 2013?

 

Obviously he would have never gotten that now. I wonder if it can be retracted and give him another "award".

I don't think we know that. Not sure what the locals think other than those who post here.

[+Walts Hunting]

Looks like the award fed his power hungry urges.

[+briansnat]

Is Groundspeak really going to get involved in a nasty situation with someone deemed as World Wide Geocacher of the month ~ September 2013?

 

Obviously he would have never gotten that now. I wonder if it can be retracted and give him another "award".

 

Let's not go overboard. There are few people who have worked as tirelessly to promote and, where necessary, defend geocaching than John. Even fewer who have done it so effectively. He deserved that award.

 

As I've said before, I don't doubt that he meant well and he believed he was giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1. The positive reaction from the community when similar power trails were introduced in partnership with parks served to fuel that belief. I don't think he realized how this one would be viewed any differently.

[+Viajero Perdido]

...giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1.

I'm always on the lookout for places to visit, where caches are individually special, and more than just a +1.

 

I'll keep looking. Cheers.

[Clan Riffster]

...giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1.

I'm always on the lookout for places to visit, where caches are individually special, and more than just a +1.

 

I'll keep looking. Cheers.

Yeah, pretty much. Any place which thinks a "Positive Geocaching Experience" is naught but an accumulation of +1s, especially when those +1s are cookie cutter, copy/paste drivel, created at the expense of quality, existing caches is not a place I would be interested in visiting.

[+briansnat]

...giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1.

I'm always on the lookout for places to visit, where caches are individually special, and more than just a +1.

 

I'll keep looking. Cheers.

 

I'm completely with you on this, however we are becoming voices in the wilderness. My caches were once popular. Now most of them can go months between finds. A long time area geocacher recently announced he will be archiving two highly regarded caches because of lack of interest. He diligently maintains them and feels that he can apply his time better than caring for caches that get a visit or two every year and a half.

 

Meanwhile if you find a rail trail or stretch of road and throw out 50 film canisters every .1 mile, cachers flock to them.

 

Face it, geocaching has strayed far from its roots and we're dinosaurs. The NNJC can't be blamed for giving the community more of what it has proved that it wants.

[Clan Riffster]

...giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1.

I'm always on the lookout for places to visit, where caches are individually special, and more than just a +1.

 

I'll keep looking. Cheers.

 

I'm completely with you on this, however we are becoming voices in the wilderness. My caches were once popular. Now most of them can go months between finds. A long time area geocacher recently announced he will be archiving two highly regarded caches because of lack of interest. He diligently maintains them and feels that he can apply his time better than caring for caches that get a visit or two every year and a half.

 

Meanwhile if you find a rail trail or stretch of road and throw out 50 film canisters every .1 mile, cachers flock to them.

 

Face it, geocaching has strayed far from its roots and we're dinosaurs. The NNJC can't be blamed for giving the community more of what it has proved that it wants.

I think anyone who promotes quantity, at the expense of quality, can be blamed. If that shoe happens to fit that particular group, they'll just have to wear it. If they had fostered their infatuation with numbers upon the community, without bullying quality caches into the scrap heap, we probably wouldn't be having this conversation. This group knows that quality and quantity can coexist in peaceful harmony. Their leaders chose to ignore that fact, opting to inflate their egos, rather than promoting a quality experience for the community.

[+Team Geofrog]

My caches were once popular. Now most of them can go months between finds.

 

Hey, I'm trying, briansnat! I've found 109 of yours so far. The lonelier and further, the better!

 

[+Mudfrog]

...giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1.

I'm always on the lookout for places to visit, where caches are individually special, and more than just a +1.

 

I'll keep looking. Cheers.

Yeah, pretty much. Any place which thinks a "Positive Geocaching Experience" is naught but an accumulation of +1s, especially when those +1s are cookie cutter, copy/paste drivel, created at the expense of quality, existing caches is not a place I would be interested in visiting.

 

I agree 110%. Unfortunately, we're in the minority.

 

The main problem seen here is the forced archiving of the existing caches. Otherwise, i guarantee you that the bringing on of more caches would have been welcomed with open arms by the numbers crowd.

[Mr.Yuck]

Is Groundspeak really going to get involved in a nasty situation with someone deemed as World Wide Geocacher of the month ~ September 2013?

 

Obviously he would have never gotten that now. I wonder if it can be retracted and give him another "award".

 

Let's not go overboard. There are few people who have worked as tirelessly to promote and, where necessary, defend geocaching than John. Even fewer who have done it so effectively. He deserved that award.

 

As I've said before, I don't doubt that he meant well and he believed he was giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1. The positive reaction from the community when similar power trails were introduced in partnership with parks served to fuel that belief. I don't think he realized how this one would be viewed any differently.

 

Oh, I'm quite sure Chilehead isn't serious. It is getting moderately ugly around here though. We're all Geocachers, and The Prez is a great guy, from all I've heard. He, and his Ranger members of the NNJC board just need to know that steamrolling over existing caches was a very bad idea. As I said before, I'm sure they have their side of the story, but I can't imagine it's anything that few, if any, are going to agree with in this thread. They should consider this thread a long winded "dudes, what were you thinking?" response.

[+coachstahly]

I'm finding that caching has cycles with regards to new cachers. When I started 3 1/2 years ago, there weren't many puzzle solvers that were that active unless a FTF was available. I began to work on puzzles and a bunch of newer cachers did as well, creating a little puzzle renaissance that led to LOTS of lonely puzzles getting solved and visited. Now that most of those have been solved and found, here we are 3 1/2 years later and that puzzle flurry has again reduced to a much smaller number. I'm waiting on the next cycle when a few cachers begin solving yet again. The same thing happens (as I've noticed) with a series of caches (or just harder caches) that require some effort, be it due to difficulty or terrain. It appears to go in cycles and every once in a while there's a new influx of cachers looking for something just a bit out of the usual run of the mill caches and it repeats itself. It will be interesting to see if that holds true the longer I cache.

 

I've found my caching habits changing the longer I cache. Instead of going more for the 1/1.5 D/T caches, I find myself gravitating to ones that require a bit more effort either way. I'll still go after the easier ones, but unlike in the past when I would go for them regardless, I now find myself passing on them unless they're for a challenge or part of a series (Indiana Spirit Quest comes to mind immediately for me).

[+Harry Dolphin]

Is Groundspeak really going to get involved in a nasty situation with someone deemed as World Wide Geocacher of the month ~ September 2013?

 

Obviously he would have never gotten that now. I wonder if it can be retracted and give him another "award".

 

Let's not go overboard. There are few people who have worked as tirelessly to promote and, where necessary, defend geocaching than John. Even fewer who have done it so effectively. He deserved that award.

 

As I've said before, I don't doubt that he meant well and he believed he was giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1. The positive reaction from the community when similar power trails were introduced in partnership with parks served to fuel that belief. I don't think he realized how this one would be viewed any differently.

 

Oh, I'm quite sure Chilehead isn't serious. It is getting moderately ugly around here though. We're all Geocachers, and The Prez is a great guy, from all I've heard. He, and his Ranger members of the NNJC board just need to know that steamrolling over existing caches was a very bad idea. As I said before, I'm sure they have their side of the story, but I can't imagine it's anything that few, if any, are going to agree with in this thread. They should consider this thread a long winded "dudes, what were you thinking?" response.

 

Yes! He has worked long and hard (and very effectively) with the parks to support geocaching! I had interactions with the county park service concerning a friend's EarthCache. They had reached an agreement that the caches in the park would probably be permitted to stay, but new ones would require permission, and would have to be on/near the trails. They offered suggestions, and approved the EarthCache (Quickly!!!) I am impressed with his interworking with TPTB. (Well. The county park service's first reaction was: Oh! You're Harry Dolphin!)

I understand that geocaching has devolved to 'numbers!' Which I find sad. This leads to recycling locations.

Here's an event! Lots of new caches. (And they were interesting caches.) New event. Same location. Archived all the caches from the first event, and hid a new fifteen or twenty. And this is what I do not understand. Okay. They're your caches. You can archive them anytime you want, and recycle the location. (My caches are here to stay! Nine years and thirty finds? Works for me! But that's me...) Fine. They're your caches.

But the problem here is when it happens to someone else's caches. "Dude. What were you thinking?!?)

[Clan Riffster]

... and The Prez is a great guy...

From what I've heard, I have no doubt that, at some point in the past, he was a great guy. But great guys do not trample other people. The adjectives I would use to describe someone even remotely capable of that sort of behavior would likely cause Mtn-Man to throw another brick at me. Add to the trampling the fact that this great guy still has not acknowledged that he even did anything wrong, and has made no efforts to make it right, and more naughty adjectives come to mind.

[+fizzymagic]

...giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1.

I'm always on the lookout for places to visit, where caches are individually special, and more than just a +1.

 

I'm completely with you on this, however we are becoming voices in the wilderness. My caches were once popular. Now most of them can go months between finds.

...

Face it, geocaching has strayed far from its roots and we're dinosaurs.

 

And you know what? I am OK being a dinosaur. I'm OK with only having my caches visited a few times a year by the most motivated cachers. It gives my hides a little (pardon the pun) cachet.

 

Geocaching has all kinds of caches, from the grab-and-go to the long-hike ones. As long as TPTB leave me alone and let me hide my favorite kind, I won't try to get the kinds I don't like banned.

 

But the minute somebody tells me to archive one of my caches because it isn't getting found enough (to someone else's satisfaction) then we are going to have a serious problem.

[Clan Riffster]

Geocaching has all kinds of caches, from the grab-and-go to the long-hike ones. As long as TPTB leave me alone and let me hide my favorite kind, I won't try to get the kinds I don't like banned.

 

But the minute somebody tells me to archive one of my caches because it isn't getting found enough (to someone else's satisfaction) then we are going to have a serious problem.

That. Exactly.

The 'great guy' crossed a huge line.

He could uncross it, but he chooses not to.

[+NeverSummer]

Geocaching has all kinds of caches, from the grab-and-go to the long-hike ones. As long as TPTB leave me alone and let me hide my favorite kind, I won't try to get the kinds I don't like banned.

 

But the minute somebody tells me to archive one of my caches because it isn't getting found enough (to someone else's satisfaction) then we are going to have a serious problem.

That. Exactly.

The 'great guy' crossed a huge line.

He could uncross it, but he chooses not to.

To me, their behavior looks more and more like well-intentioned moves toward more caches. Meaning, a shift toward the "numbers cacher" side of the game. I couldn't agree more with what fizzy said above.

 

Leave power trails to places that can fit them. Don't push out existing caches just because you can with the muscle of a land manager behind you. As soon as you can't leave well enough alone, you're pushing an agenda...and isn't that against the guidelines?

[+trowel32]

Okay so not to belabor the point but here is one of the new caches published today: http://coord.info/GC4TQ6D It is a micro hidden in a crack in a rock right next to the trail as far as I can tell.

 

The "Christmas Presents for Brian Snat" cache http://coord.info/GC2JFXR, a giant sized ammo can, was archived so the one above could be placed. The new cache is 471 feet away from where the archived cache was, however its interesting that there is a note on the new cache page, showing the coordinates were moved 46 feet further north today. The initial listing/submission had it 517 feet from the archived cache, in which case, why couldn't they place it 11 feet further away to preserve the older cache? Especially since it is just a micro in a rock crack. Its likely that the coordinate change was due to the original coordinates being off, but either way, surely there are other cracks within 50 feet or so on the same rock outcrop being highlighted?

[+Traditional Bill]

Okay so not to belabor the point but here is one of the new caches published today: http://coord.info/GC4TQ6D It is a micro hidden in a crack in a rock right next to the trail as far as I can tell.

 

The "Christmas Presents for Brian Snat" cache http://coord.info/GC2JFXR, a giant sized ammo can, was archived so the one above could be placed. The new cache is 471 feet away from where the archived cache was, however its interesting that there is a note on the new cache page, showing the coordinates were moved 46 feet further north today. The initial listing/submission had it 517 feet from the archived cache, in which case, why couldn't they place it 11 feet further away to preserve the older cache? Especially since it is just a micro in a rock crack. Its likely that the coordinate change was due to the original coordinates being off, but either way, surely there are other cracks within 50 feet or so on the same rock outcrop being highlighted?

 

In another aspect....with all of the geological information on the page.....why did they have to stick a micro in the crack of a rock? This could have been an excellent earthcache. (Which by the way, would not have had any proximity issues with other, pre-established caches)

[+TheWeatherWarrior]

Okay so not to belabor the point but here is one of the new caches published today: http://coord.info/GC4TQ6D It is a micro hidden in a crack in a rock right next to the trail as far as I can tell.

 

The "Christmas Presents for Brian Snat" cache http://coord.info/GC2JFXR, a giant sized ammo can, was archived so the one above could be placed. The new cache is 471 feet away from where the archived cache was, however its interesting that there is a note on the new cache page, showing the coordinates were moved 46 feet further north today. The initial listing/submission had it 517 feet from the archived cache, in which case, why couldn't they place it 11 feet further away to preserve the older cache? Especially since it is just a micro in a rock crack. Its likely that the coordinate change was due to the original coordinates being off, but either way, surely there are other cracks within 50 feet or so on the same rock outcrop being highlighted?

Geocachers should post on NJ's State Parks facebook page a shame notice on them for acting this way. I am both doing that as well as messaging the park directors directly. It is absolutely unexcusable, and against the spirit of the game. Of course Groundspeak likely encourages this becuase the geo-trails are the newest big revenue generator. Boycotting ALL New Jersey parks should be done until the action is rectified.

 

post a note on NJ State Parks facebook page here:

https://www.facebook.com/NewJerseyStateParks

Edited December 8, 2013 by TheWeatherWarrior

[+M4RKO]

...giving the community what it wanted, more opportunities for a +1.

I'm always on the lookout for places to visit, where caches are individually special, and more than just a +1.

 

I'm completely with you on this, however we are becoming voices in the wilderness. My caches were once popular. Now most of them can go months between finds.

...

Face it, geocaching has strayed far from its roots and we're dinosaurs.

 

And you know what? I am OK being a dinosaur. I'm OK with only having my caches visited a few times a year by the most motivated cachers. It gives my hides a little (pardon the pun) cachet.

 

Geocaching has all kinds of caches, from the grab-and-go to the long-hike ones. As long as TPTB leave me alone and let me hide my favorite kind, I won't try to get the kinds I don't like banned.

 

But the minute somebody tells me to archive one of my caches because it isn't getting found enough (to someone else's satisfaction) then we are going to have a serious problem.

 

I'd like to thank you, and cache owners like you. And my local geocaching community for NOT wanting to "recycle locations" because all the big number finders have found all the caches on the area. I'm new to geocaching, and I'm not in it for the numbers I'm in it to be taken to cool locations and see unique hides. A lot of the best caches I've found are older caches that have been around for years and that don't get found as frequently. I'm glad the COs didn't just archive them, that they maintain them and keep them alive for new geocachers to experience.

 

That's part of my problem with this forced archival of what sounds like quality caches. Just because you've found it, you want to get rid of it so you can get a new smiley in the same location? Seems very selfish.

[+M4RKO]

Okay so not to belabor the point but here is one of the new caches published today: http://coord.info/GC4TQ6D It is a micro hidden in a crack in a rock right next to the trail as far as I can tell.

 

The "Christmas Presents for Brian Snat" cache http://coord.info/GC2JFXR, a giant sized ammo can, was archived so the one above could be placed. The new cache is 471 feet away from where the archived cache was, however its interesting that there is a note on the new cache page, showing the coordinates were moved 46 feet further north today. The initial listing/submission had it 517 feet from the archived cache, in which case, why couldn't they place it 11 feet further away to preserve the older cache? Especially since it is just a micro in a rock crack. Its likely that the coordinate change was due to the original coordinates being off, but either way, surely there are other cracks within 50 feet or so on the same rock outcrop being highlighted?

 

I posted a note to the new cache because I just couldn't help myself. It'll probably be deleted but whatever, I don't Facebook.

[+Team Bayberry]

 

Geocachers should post on NJ's State Parks facebook page a shame notice on them for acting this way. I am both doing that as well as messaging the park directors directly. It is absolutely unexcusable, and against the spirit of the game. Of course Groundspeak likely encourages this becuase the geo-trails are the newest big revenue generator. Boycotting ALL New Jersey parks should be done until the action is rectified.

 

post a note on NJ State Parks facebook page here:

https://www.facebook.com/NewJerseyStateParks

 

No NJ boycott, please. The Parks & Forestry folks down in South Jersey are not involved in this bullying. If you want to boycott the specific locations that are involved, I won't argue, but please don't put the burden on our half of the state.

[+Traditional Bill]

 

Geocachers should post on NJ's State Parks facebook page a shame notice on them for acting this way. I am both doing that as well as messaging the park directors directly. It is absolutely unexcusable, and against the spirit of the game. Of course Groundspeak likely encourages this becuase the geo-trails are the newest big revenue generator. Boycotting ALL New Jersey parks should be done until the action is rectified.

 

post a note on NJ State Parks facebook page here:

https://www.facebook.com/NewJerseyStateParks

 

No NJ boycott, please. The Parks & Forestry folks down in South Jersey are not involved in this bullying. If you want to boycott the specific locations that are involved, I won't argue, but please don't put the burden on our half of the state.

 

I'm with bayberry on this one. The parks that have advocated this behavior are in the numbers of 3 or 4. South Jersey geocachers has a fantastic relationship with the land managers in our state park and the state parks in south Jersey in which I am familiar do not advocate this type of behavior and nor does SJG.

 

The land managers I'm familiar with in the southern part of the state are familiar and happy about geocaching and they let us place caches at our leisure. They have no desire to archive caches, recycle locations or place state sanctioned geotrails.

[+cerberus1]

I posted a note to the new cache because I just couldn't help myself. It'll probably be deleted but whatever, I don't Facebook.

Don't facebook, perfectly fine and up to you.

- But posting rants on cache pages isn't helping anyone who's trying get this thing fixed.

It just gets locals upset and annoys the heck out of COs and Reviewers who have to correct it all.

 

"I just couldn't help myself" ....is a whole other topic, but OT here.

Edited December 8, 2013 by cerberus1

[+M4RKO]

Don't facebook, perfectly fine and up to you.

- But posting rants on cache pages isn't helping anyone who's trying get this thing fixed.

It just gets locals upset and annoys the heck out of COs and Reviewers who have to correct it all.

 

"I just couldn't help myself" ....is a whole other topic, but OT here.

 

You're right, it's not helpful. I'd delete it but its already been taken care of, so I'll repost my "rant" here:

 

Wow a LARGE cache was force archived for a MICRO in a crack? That's sad.

[+tozainamboku]

Wow a LARGE cache was force archived for a MICRO in a crack? That's sad.

 

Size ≠ quality

Age of cache ≠ quality

Distance between caches ≠ quality

 

This is a sad situation only because the leadership of a local geocaching organization and a land manager decided that the their definition of quality trumped the quality of preexisting caches. When anyone decides to enforce their personal definition of a quality geocaching experience on others, it is bound to upset someone.

[+Ambrosia]

Okay so not to belabor the point but here is one of the new caches published today: http://coord.info/GC4TQ6D It is a micro hidden in a crack in a rock right next to the trail as far as I can tell.

 

The "Christmas Presents for Brian Snat" cache http://coord.info/GC2JFXR, a giant sized ammo can, was archived so the one above could be placed. The new cache is 471 feet away from where the archived cache was, however its interesting that there is a note on the new cache page, showing the coordinates were moved 46 feet further north today. The initial listing/submission had it 517 feet from the archived cache, in which case, why couldn't they place it 11 feet further away to preserve the older cache? Especially since it is just a micro in a rock crack. Its likely that the coordinate change was due to the original coordinates being off, but either way, surely there are other cracks within 50 feet or so on the same rock outcrop being highlighted?

Geocachers should post on NJ's State Parks facebook page a shame notice on them for acting this way. I am both doing that as well as messaging the park directors directly. It is absolutely unexcusable, and against the spirit of the game. Of course Groundspeak likely encourages this becuase the geo-trails are the newest big revenue generator. Boycotting ALL New Jersey parks should be done until the action is rectified.

 

post a note on NJ State Parks facebook page here:

https://www.facebook.com/NewJerseyStateParks

I have to take exception to this. Groundspeak does not encourage geotrails. I know that there has a been talk here and there in the forums about geotrails being good for Groundspeak because of money, and that Groundspeak wants geotrails. But that is just not the case.

 

You need to remember that the founders of the site, Jeremy and Bryan, are old school cacher types. When they go out caching, they'd rather go on nice hikes and get a smattering of caches here and there. They are not gung-ho about geotrails. Just because they allow them, doesn't mean that they're "encouraging" them in order to get more money.

[+TheWeatherWarrior]

I have to take exception to this. Groundspeak does not encourage geotrails. I know that there has a been talk here and there in the forums about geotrails being good for Groundspeak because of money, and that Groundspeak wants geotrails. But that is just not the case.

 

You need to remember that the founders of the site, Jeremy and Bryan, are old school cacher types. When they go out caching, they'd rather go on nice hikes and get a smattering of caches here and there. They are not gung-ho about geotrails. Just because they allow them, doesn't mean that they're "encouraging" them in order to get more money.

You can take exception to it all you want...but the fact is they do encourage and promote it.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/travel/

 

And with five digit income, I'd say they certainly like them. That is a lot of memberships to make up....and not sure they are getting those.

 

The fact is, the whole archive thing has gotten out of control and very few in control have much interest in maintaining the game. If archiving can now be forced...I hope they are ready for a whole new rash of cache thieves. I doubt it would happen with the NJ situation, but I've seen a number of folks turn to the other side for lesser issues.

[+TheWeatherWarrior]

No NJ boycott, please. The Parks & Forestry folks down in South Jersey are not involved in this bullying. If you want to boycott the specific locations that are involved, I won't argue, but please don't put the burden on our half of the state.

Only a statewide boycott works. By doing so puts greater pressure on the park service to correct the actions done by the one park. It also puts them on notice to not try it elsewhere.

 

This also would show to Groundspeak that allowing this is NOT a good idea and they will alienate more cachers than they will gain through the tour. I've also stopped all geocaching related purchases, but not ready to call for anything because I don't really know if they are aware and what their position on the matter is.

Edited December 9, 2013 by TheWeatherWarrior

[+Frodo_Underhill]

No NJ boycott, please. The Parks & Forestry folks down in South Jersey are not involved in this bullying. If you want to boycott the specific locations that are involved, I won't argue, but please don't put the burden on our half of the state.

Only a statewide boycott works. By doing so puts greater pressure on the park service to correct the actions done by the one park. It also puts them on notice to not try it elsewhere.

 

Leave South Jersey out of this boycott nonsense. Bayberry said it well. We have good relations with the Parks and State Forest and want to keep it that way.

[Keystone]

I have to take exception to this. Groundspeak does not encourage geotrails. I know that there has a been talk here and there in the forums about geotrails being good for Groundspeak because of money, and that Groundspeak wants geotrails. But that is just not the case.

 

You need to remember that the founders of the site, Jeremy and Bryan, are old school cacher types. When they go out caching, they'd rather go on nice hikes and get a smattering of caches here and there. They are not gung-ho about geotrails. Just because they allow them, doesn't mean that they're "encouraging" them in order to get more money.

You can take exception to it all you want...but the fact is they do encourage and promote it.

 

http://www.geocaching.com/travel/

 

And with five digit income, I'd say they certainly like them. That is a lot of memberships to make up....and not sure they are getting those.

 

The fact is, the whole archive thing has gotten out of control and very few in control have much interest in maintaining the game. If archiving can now be forced...I hope they are ready for a whole new rash of cache thieves. I doubt it would happen with the NJ situation, but I've seen a number of folks turn to the other side for lesser issues.

Please note, these cache series in New Jersey are NOT official Groundspeak GeoTours, which are indeed revenue generating. You can confirm this on the linked page in your post. There are no GeoTours in New Jersey.

 

Since this is not an official GeoTour please stop this line of discussion. Thanks.

[+K13]

I had planned to stop in Jersey on an upcoming trip to NYC. There is NO CHANCE I will support the cachers & parks which allowed & condoned this behavior. I'm guessing this change in my travel plans will cost NJ over $750 in motels & food, etc., that my family will not spend there.

Does anyone know of a good place to stay near Levittown, PA?

 

Am I being petty? Maybe, but nowhere near as petty as the NNJC and their Park Ranger.

[+briansnat]

No NJ boycott, please. The Parks & Forestry folks down in South Jersey are not involved in this bullying. If you want to boycott the specific locations that are involved, I won't argue, but please don't put the burden on our half of the state.

Only a statewide boycott works. By doing so puts greater pressure on the park service to correct the actions done by the one park. It also puts them on notice to not try it elsewhere.

 

This also would show to Groundspeak that allowing this is NOT a good idea and they will alienate more cachers than they will gain through the tour. I've also stopped all geocaching related purchases, but not ready to call for anything because I don't really know if they are aware and what their position on the matter is.

 

I doubt the state parks system is quaking in their boots at the thought of a geocacher boycott.

[+macatac1961]

No NJ boycott, please. The Parks & Forestry folks down in South Jersey are not involved in this bullying. If you want to boycott the specific locations that are involved, I won't argue, but please don't put the burden on our half of the state.

Only a statewide boycott works. By doing so puts greater pressure on the park service to correct the actions done by the one park. It also puts them on notice to not try it elsewhere.

 

This also would show to Groundspeak that allowing this is NOT a good idea and they will alienate more cachers than they will gain through the tour. I've also stopped all geocaching related purchases, but not ready to call for anything because I don't really know if they are aware and what their position on the matter is.

 

I doubt the state parks system is quaking in their boots at the thought of a geocacher boycott.

If they see the schoolyard bickering the game can create they may just tell us to take it somewhere else.

[+Packanack]

No NJ boycott, please. The Parks & Forestry folks down in South Jersey are not involved in this bullying. If you want to boycott the specific locations that are involved, I won't argue, but please don't put the burden on our half of the state.

Only a statewide boycott works. By doing so puts greater pressure on the park service to correct the actions done by the one park. It also puts them on notice to not try it elsewhere.

 

This also would show to Groundspeak that allowing this is NOT a good idea and they will alienate more cachers than they will gain through the tour. I've also stopped all geocaching related purchases, but not ready to call for anything because I don't really know if they are aware and what their position on the matter is.

 

I doubt the state parks system is quaking in their boots at the thought of a geocacher boycott.

If they see the schoolyard bickering the game can create they may just tell us to take it somewhere else.

 

That is exactly what I said one week ago:m I pointed to the ATV folk as they are regarded as being the most problematic

 

"In Jersey, the parks folk would sa y we aren't getting involved in this BS, get all your caches out of the parks, the AtV folk give us less agita."

 

This was never about the State Parks, it was all about how the local club approached members and fellow cachers, what their role should be . The event took place and now it would seem to be time to mend fences, get a handle on this and move forward. There are many who could care, just as long as the numbers are there. There are those who are passionate about preserving the individuals role in the "community". So either the sides come to an understanding or the community will probably fracture in interest, which would be sad because this community counts many fine people in its group.

[+CondorTrax]

This article was just posted on the "NNJC Free Speech Zone" FB page. May allow for insight on NNJC's plans for caching in NJ. I removed the link which contained names and personal contact details:

____________________________________________

Article from NJ350

 

"(Name Redacted) President NNJC

August 12, 2013 at 5:53 pm

 

NJ350 offers a perfect opportunity to celebrate and showcase New Jersey’s rich history and heritage by launching a New Jersey Historic Geocaching Geotrail.

 

Geocaching Geotrails combines both physical and education components as it connect today’s technology with the outdoors, all while learning about many educational aspects to spotlight New Jersey.

 

A New Jersey Geocaching Geotrail program will bring folks closer to its rich history; builds a sense of community pride; and get folks engaged with the New Jersey’s heritage by exploring many historic locations throughout the State.

 

A New Jersey Geocaching Geotrail offers many benefits to folks of all ages, from kids to retirees, families, teachers, scouts, corporate team building, and many outdoor groups.

 

Geotrails connect today’s technology by researching and teaching about the Historic location and educational aspects. Then, gets folks outdoors to see these locations combined with getting outdoors and exercise, all while they explore and learn about the historic location. Also, the communities all benefit too by bringing folks to their locations.

 

NJ Geotrail Themes:

 

As New Jersey is known as “New Jersey’s Crossroads of the American Revolution”, we propose to launch:

 

~ The “Crossroads of the American Revolution Geotrail”.

 

This Geocaching geotrail can be located across New Jersey to feature important “Crossroads” locations from Fort Lee to Trenton.

 

There are other future Geotrails ideas that can also be addressed:

 

~ New Jersey Lighthouse Geotrail,

~ Morris/DR Canal Geotrail, spotlighting New Jersey’s historic canals.

~ NJ Native American Cultural history

 

About Geocaching:

Geocaching is a modern day treasure hunt; it serves as a powerful information tool by spotlighting tourism, environmental and historic locations throughout the world. Today many Geocaching organization partner with National parks, nature conservancy groups, State, county, local organizations to promote many programs. This year, the Smithsonian in DC included new geocaching programs into their museum system, as geocaching has become a mainstream activity.

 

Who we are:

We are the Northern New Jersey Cachers, (NNJC) a non-profit organization and leading authority on Geocaching throughout New Jersey. NNJC supports and partners with many organizations to teach and present quality geocaching programs. Some of our current clients where we have put on programs; Essex, Morris, Somerset, Sussex Counties, Jefferson, Franklin, Chester, Denville Townships, NJ Conservation Foundation, Great Swamp Watershed Association, Harding Land Trust, Audubon at Scherman Hoffman wildlife Sanctuary, and Duke Farm Foundation.

 

NNJC installed an historic Geotrail at the Duke Farm Foundation in 2012, and we are currently working on new Geotrails at Franklin townships Griggstown Preserve for fall 2013 and at NJ State owned Waterloo Village in 2014. These trails are historic and educational, spotlighting the area history and will develop tourism by getting folks engaged in exploring the outdoors again.

 

Geotrails are not new in fact many states have seen the benefits of these Geotrails for years. Here are some examples below, click on these links and explore these wonderful Geotrail benefits:

 

http://www.visitdelaware.com/geo/

 

http://www.civilwargeotrail.wv.gov/about/Pages/default.aspx

 

http://friendsofchesapeakegateways.org/projects/ssb_geotrail/

 

http://www.alleghenygeotrail.com/

 

http://www.seawaytrail.com/geotrail/

 

http://amishtrail.com/geotrail

 

http://www.smithtrail.net/

 

Geotrail Reward:

Completing a Geotrail usually offer a reward of a geocoin, a sought after token and keepsake of the adventure. Many folks will travel from surrounding States to complete the Geotrail to receive their geocoin. These custom geocoins can be designed to reflect the message of the Geotrail, for example a New Jersey Crossroads of the American Revolution coin can depict a Patriot or historic state house.

 

Implementation:

If the “New Jersey Crossroads of the American Revolution” Geotrail theme is chosen for a Geotrail then we can develop a placement plan of geocaches at various approved locations from anywhere in New Jersey to showcase NJ’s Revolutionary War history, from Fort Lee, Monmouth Battlefield to Trenton. Geocaches can be simple and non intrusive depending on the location. As example National Parks are currently off limits for actual geocaching, but at Fort McHenry in Md. they approved a simple logbook at the visitor center whereas visitors seeking the “geocache” go inside and ask the Park Ranger for the logbook and sign their visit. A similar situation can be presented at Jockey Hollow National Park. Other historic locations can be a small container, depending on the location. Many NJ parks already have geocaches, including Monmouth battlefield which has many geocaches placed there. We can work on a plan to replace these and add new ones as we see fit.

 

NJ State involvement:

We would like the NJ geortail to be sponsored and supported by NJ State. (see the links of other States provided above). We would work together to determine locations and how many geocaches to be placed for the Geotrail. Also, the logistics when the Geocacher who completes the trail, how to receive their geocoin, usually at a state office.

 

We have already met with the Crossroads of the American Revolution organization in Trenton and they are excited about the prospect to showcase these important NJ locations. We propose to develop a committee to develop the Geotrail with NJ350.

 

Brochure:

Most State Geotrails offer a brochure or printable brochure with the locations, with a clue inside each location. When folks complete the geotrail they submit their brochure with the completed clues so the office knows they completed the geotrail. This can be something simple like a letter inside each of the geotrail caches the geocacher need to obtain. As example, inside each of the 11 Duke Farm Foundation geocaches are letters, once they person obtains the individual letters they must unscramble them to reflect a theme which spells STEWARDSHIP. See DFF’s Geotrail information:

 

http://www.dukefarms.org/en/Visit/Plan-Your-Visit/Geocaching/

 

Program Planning information:

 

Identify your team.

NNJC has an officer team in place with the abilities to successfully complete the planned geotrail program. NNJC has Geocaching members throughout the state who will act as consultants who can handle local logistics, throughout implementation.

 

Develop a budget.

Estimate depending on quantity of geotrail geocaches, geocoins, and website promotion.

Estimate: $3000 – $5000. We are submitting a NJ350 State Grant application to hopefully cover these expenses. Perhaps underwriting by NJ dept of Tourism or other groups.

 

Identify your partners.

NNJC already had many land managers throughout the state, from State, county, and local parks where geocachers can be placed. There are many NJ historic locations which have geocaches or new geocaches placed for the geotrail. NJ350’s sponsor Crossroads of the American Revolution will be a great addition at the program.

 

Identify your audiences.

The audience that a Geocaching.com geotrail will reach is endless. It will engage multi-ethnic and multi-generational folks from kids to retirees.

 

Develop a marketing plan.

All the NJ Geotrail locations will be listed on Geocahing.com, we will also promote the Geotrail on NNJC.org, NNJC Facebook as well as a new Geotrail website. (see other state’s links above for website promotion ideas.)

 

Develop a reasonable schedule for planning and implementation.

We feel that from a planning to implementation will take 3-4 months to determine locations and cache placement logistics.

 

Develop clear lines of communication inside and outside your planning team.

The NNJC team and Geocaching community will be informed of the progress of the project, via many social communications: NNJC.org website, e-mail, Facebook, and twitter.

 

Include a qualified historian on your planning team for history programs.

NNJC members cover many qualified folks from teachers to law enforcement. We will reach out to folks at The Crossroads of the American Revolution to discuss the Heritage sites in NJ as potential locations and get their insight.

 

Plan for evaluation

Evaluation and data will be collected by reviewing each Historic location’s geocache log (online) as folks visit each site they write a log, this data will capture the number of folks visiting the site, their experiences, what their perspective, and a way to communicate back for any survey.

 

Summary

We at NNJC feels New Jersey needs to join what many other States already are experiencing with offering a State Geotrail program. The benefits are unlimited, from increasing NJ tourism, education, exploring the outdoors, exercise and promote all the New Jersey has to offer.

 

Geocaching is a great family outing that takes you on an adventure to discover new places and learn about things you never thought you would learn about. It gives you a purpose to take a drive to a destination you would not normally know about, adds some excitement and adventure to your trip as you learn and explore a previously unexplored area. It give you a connection to the history and environment as you get back to nature, find those special places and create stories along the way.

 

Our NNJC team would be happy to meet with NJ350 to give a presentation on Geocaching in general and discuss a plan to implement New Jersey’s Crossroads of the American Revolution Geotrail.

 

Please feel free to contact me with any questions,

 

(Name Redacted)

President

Northern New Jersey Cachers ~ NNJC.org"

-----------------------------

This is the thinking that most bothers me:

"Many NJ parks already have geocaches, including Monmouth battlefield which has many geocaches placed there. We can work on a plan to replace these and add new ones as we see fit. "

 

Who is "we"?

Edited December 9, 2013 by CondorTrax

[+TheWeatherWarrior]

Since this is not an official GeoTour please stop this line of discussion. Thanks.

You know this for a fact, by asking the corporate office? Does Groundspeak think this is acceptable behavior from a member (KVSP)? How about the reviewer.

[+TheWeatherWarrior]

This was never about the State Parks...

It DIRECTLY involves the Parks as it they are the ones that took this action to boot out a fellow cacher.

 

And lets not forget...this is PUBLIC PROPERTY. They aren't allowed to just dictate whatever rule they want. It is the same BS battle in Maryland regarding off-roaders. One employee is not legally allowed to dictate policy. It just isn't. If cachers want to [edit] be complacent, that is OK. But others, who understand the rights of citizens, will fight for those rights.

Edited December 9, 2013 by TheWeatherWarrior

[jholly]

Since this is not an official GeoTour please stop this line of discussion. Thanks.

You know this for a fact, by asking the corporate office? Does Groundspeak think this is acceptable behavior from a member (KVSP)? How about the reviewer.

Best I can tell Groundspeak is not the morality police. Cachers voluntarily archived their cache and other caches were submitted for approval. The reviewers job is to publish the cache if it meets publishing guidelines. What the politics of the situation is not for the reviewer or Groundspeak to consider, there is no politic guideline. Yeah, it sucks, but it is not Groundspeak's or the the reviewers battle.

 

And I think your confusing a geotrail (a.k.a power trail) with a geotour.

[+TheWeatherWarrior]

Best I can tell Groundspeak is not the morality police. Cachers voluntarily archived their cache and other caches were submitted for approval. The reviewers job is to publish the cache if it meets publishing guidelines. What the politics of the situation is not for the reviewer or Groundspeak to consider, there is no politic guideline. Yeah, it sucks, but it is not Groundspeak's or the the reviewers battle.

 

And I think your confusing a geotrail (a.k.a power trail) with a geotour.

Groundspeak holds a very high moral compass of its members and more, so they are DEFINITELY part of this.

 

Do you honestly think it was a VOLUNTARY archived cache. No, if you read the message posted by the Park's Member ID it was a THREAT! Lets see how you feel when someone says "remove it or we'll remove it" about one of your caches.

 

I wasn't confused, but was under the impression that they were setting up a Geo Tour. Keynote said it wasn't and noted it wasn't on the Geo Tour list. However, I do remember talking with a fellow geocacher about a "tour" that was sanctioned by GS but doesn't appear on the Tour link. I'd have to find it though.

[+CondorTrax]

These are geotrails. By concept, a series of caches along a well maintained trail, fairly easy terrain where caches are placed along historic, significant, or interesting spots highlighting an attribute, fact or trivia. Think of it as a guided tour where smilies are picked up along the way. At the conclusion you submit some sort of proof (a passport or check book) etc whereby you get a pathtag from the park office.

 

The idea is there. The execution and sacrificing of someone's existing work is where it fails.

Secondly, from the article, and this may be presumptuous of me, but it does appear as if NNJC is approaching the parks rather than as claimed by NNJC, that NNJC was approached by land managers to kill any and all existing caches. This is where clarity is being muddied for the sake of an agenda.

[+weathernowcast]

This article was just posted on the "NNJC Free Speech Zone" FB page. May allow for insight on NNJC's plans for caching in NJ. I removed the link which contained names and personal contact details:

____________________________________________

Article from NJ350

 

"(Name Redacted) President NNJC

August 12, 2013 at 5:53 pm

 

NJ350 offers a perfect opportunity to celebrate and showcase New Jersey’s rich history and heritage by launching a New Jersey Historic Geocaching Geotrail.

 

Geocaching Geotrails combines both physical and education components as it connect today’s technology with the outdoors, all while learning about many educational aspects to spotlight New Jersey.

 

A New Jersey Geocaching Geotrail program will bring folks closer to its rich history; builds a sense of community pride; and get folks engaged with the New Jersey’s heritage by exploring many historic locations throughout the State.

 

A New Jersey Geocaching Geotrail offers many benefits to folks of all ages, from kids to retirees, families, teachers, scouts, corporate team building, and many outdoor groups.

 

Geotrails connect today’s technology by researching and teaching about the Historic location and educational aspects. Then, gets folks outdoors to see these locations combined with getting outdoors and exercise, all while they explore and learn about the historic location. Also, the communities all benefit too by bringing folks to their locations.

 

NJ Geotrail Themes:

 

As New Jersey is known as “New Jersey’s Crossroads of the American Revolution”, we propose to launch:

 

~ The “Crossroads of the American Revolution Geotrail”.

 

This Geocaching geotrail can be located across New Jersey to feature important “Crossroads” locations from Fort Lee to Trenton.

 

There are other future Geotrails ideas that can also be addressed:

 

~ New Jersey Lighthouse Geotrail,

~ Morris/DR Canal Geotrail, spotlighting New Jersey’s historic canals.

~ NJ Native American Cultural history

 

About Geocaching:

Geocaching is a modern day treasure hunt; it serves as a powerful information tool by spotlighting tourism, environmental and historic locations throughout the world. Today many Geocaching organization partner with National parks, nature conservancy groups, State, county, local organizations to promote many programs. This year, the Smithsonian in DC included new geocaching programs into their museum system, as geocaching has become a mainstream activity.

 

Who we are:

We are the Northern New Jersey Cachers, (NNJC) a non-profit organization and leading authority on Geocaching throughout New Jersey. NNJC supports and partners with many organizations to teach and present quality geocaching programs. Some of our current clients where we have put on programs; Essex, Morris, Somerset, Sussex Counties, Jefferson, Franklin, Chester, Denville Townships, NJ Conservation Foundation, Great Swamp Watershed Association, Harding Land Trust, Audubon at Scherman Hoffman wildlife Sanctuary, and Duke Farm Foundation.

 

NNJC installed an historic Geotrail at the Duke Farm Foundation in 2012, and we are currently working on new Geotrails at Franklin townships Griggstown Preserve for fall 2013 and at NJ State owned Waterloo Village in 2014. These trails are historic and educational, spotlighting the area history and will develop tourism by getting folks engaged in exploring the outdoors again.

 

Geotrails are not new in fact many states have seen the benefits of these Geotrails for years. Here are some examples below, click on these links and explore these wonderful Geotrail benefits:

 

http://www.visitdelaware.com/geo/

 

http://www.civilwargeotrail.wv.gov/about/Pages/default.aspx

 

http://friendsofchesapeakegateways.org/projects/ssb_geotrail/

 

http://www.alleghenygeotrail.com/

 

http://www.seawaytrail.com/geotrail/

 

http://amishtrail.com/geotrail

 

http://www.smithtrail.net/

 

Geotrail Reward:

Completing a Geotrail usually offer a reward of a geocoin, a sought after token and keepsake of the adventure. Many folks will travel from surrounding States to complete the Geotrail to receive their geocoin. These custom geocoins can be designed to reflect the message of the Geotrail, for example a New Jersey Crossroads of the American Revolution coin can depict a Patriot or historic state house.

 

Implementation:

If the “New Jersey Crossroads of the American Revolution” Geotrail theme is chosen for a Geotrail then we can develop a placement plan of geocaches at various approved locations from anywhere in New Jersey to showcase NJ’s Revolutionary War history, from Fort Lee, Monmouth Battlefield to Trenton. Geocaches can be simple and non intrusive depending on the location. As example National Parks are currently off limits for actual geocaching, but at Fort McHenry in Md. they approved a simple logbook at the visitor center whereas visitors seeking the “geocache” go inside and ask the Park Ranger for the logbook and sign their visit. A similar situation can be presented at Jockey Hollow National Park. Other historic locations can be a small container, depending on the location. Many NJ parks already have geocaches, including Monmouth battlefield which has many geocaches placed there. We can work on a plan to replace these and add new ones as we see fit.

 

NJ State involvement:

We would like the NJ geortail to be sponsored and supported by NJ State. (see the links of other States provided above). We would work together to determine locations and how many geocaches to be placed for the Geotrail. Also, the logistics when the Geocacher who completes the trail, how to receive their geocoin, usually at a state office.

 

We have already met with the Crossroads of the American Revolution organization in Trenton and they are excited about the prospect to showcase these important NJ locations. We propose to develop a committee to develop the Geotrail with NJ350.

 

Brochure:

Most State Geotrails offer a brochure or printable brochure with the locations, with a clue inside each location. When folks complete the geotrail they submit their brochure with the completed clues so the office knows they completed the geotrail. This can be something simple like a letter inside each of the geotrail caches the geocacher need to obtain. As example, inside each of the 11 Duke Farm Foundation geocaches are letters, once they person obtains the individual letters they must unscramble them to reflect a theme which spells STEWARDSHIP. See DFF’s Geotrail information:

 

http://www.dukefarms.org/en/Visit/Plan-Your-Visit/Geocaching/

 

Program Planning information:

 

Identify your team.

NNJC has an officer team in place with the abilities to successfully complete the planned geotrail program. NNJC has Geocaching members throughout the state who will act as consultants who can handle local logistics, throughout implementation.

 

Develop a budget.

Estimate depending on quantity of geotrail geocaches, geocoins, and website promotion.

Estimate: $3000 – $5000. We are submitting a NJ350 State Grant application to hopefully cover these expenses. Perhaps underwriting by NJ dept of Tourism or other groups.

 

Identify your partners.

NNJC already had many land managers throughout the state, from State, county, and local parks where geocachers can be placed. There are many NJ historic locations which have geocaches or new geocaches placed for the geotrail. NJ350’s sponsor Crossroads of the American Revolution will be a great addition at the program.

 

Identify your audiences.

The audience that a Geocaching.com geotrail will reach is endless. It will engage multi-ethnic and multi-generational folks from kids to retirees.

 

Develop a marketing plan.

All the NJ Geotrail locations will be listed on Geocahing.com, we will also promote the Geotrail on NNJC.org, NNJC Facebook as well as a new Geotrail website. (see other state’s links above for website promotion ideas.)

 

Develop a reasonable schedule for planning and implementation.

We feel that from a planning to implementation will take 3-4 months to determine locations and cache placement logistics.

 

Develop clear lines of communication inside and outside your planning team.

The NNJC team and Geocaching community will be informed of the progress of the project, via many social communications: NNJC.org website, e-mail, Facebook, and twitter.

 

Include a qualified historian on your planning team for history programs.

NNJC members cover many qualified folks from teachers to law enforcement. We will reach out to folks at The Crossroads of the American Revolution to discuss the Heritage sites in NJ as potential locations and get their insight.

 

Plan for evaluation

Evaluation and data will be collected by reviewing each Historic location’s geocache log (online) as folks visit each site they write a log, this data will capture the number of folks visiting the site, their experiences, what their perspective, and a way to communicate back for any survey.

 

Summary

We at NNJC feels New Jersey needs to join what many other States already are experiencing with offering a State Geotrail program. The benefits are unlimited, from increasing NJ tourism, education, exploring the outdoors, exercise and promote all the New Jersey has to offer.

 

Geocaching is a great family outing that takes you on an adventure to discover new places and learn about things you never thought you would learn about. It gives you a purpose to take a drive to a destination you would not normally know about, adds some excitement and adventure to your trip as you learn and explore a previously unexplored area. It give you a connection to the history and environment as you get back to nature, find those special places and create stories along the way.

 

Our NNJC team would be happy to meet with NJ350 to give a presentation on Geocaching in general and discuss a plan to implement New Jersey’s Crossroads of the American Revolution Geotrail.

 

Please feel free to contact me with any questions,

 

(Name Redacted)

President

Northern New Jersey Cachers ~ NNJC.org"

-----------------------------

This is the thinking that most bothers me:

"Many NJ parks already have geocaches, including Monmouth battlefield which has many geocaches placed there. We can work on a plan to replace these and add new ones as we see fit. "

 

Who is "we"?

 

Thank you for posting this. This is the local club policy that had impacted my previously approved KVSP geocaches, but I had not seen it in print,

 

Just an update which I will post here:

 

As the original request to archive my caches was for proximity issues with the new geotrail that NNJC and KVSP had arranged following the above club policy. I have sent the following requests to NNJC and KVSP:

 

OK-- so now that the new caches are active. I ask you consider if any of the following can remain at KSVP and a similar note to NNJC VP.

 

Specifically: XMas presents for BrianSnat---it seems the reviewers may allow my cache to be reactivated even if it is only 475 feet from the new cache. Specifically, Keystone and OReviewer indicated this was a possibility with KVSP support. The XMAS present for Klizich is 0.3 miles from the nearest cache--can I keep it? If you wish, I could lower it to an easier location. XMAS presents for Sue&Barry is a puzzle cache with a chirp--consequently the start of the puzzle cache does not need to be impacted by proximity issues with the near your building and the final does not conflict with any of the new caches. The XMAS Treequest will be removed on Sunday. Depending on the other questions I look to remove the caches next Sunday.

 

If you have any other suggestions that may facilitate closure of this mess-let me know.

Thanks

weathernowcast

----------

 

My only other comment is:

 

Regarding boycotts of state parks. I personally do not think that will be perceived as constructive or allow us to reach closure on this topic. I define closure as a change to club policy. The genesis for club supported archive requests is clear in the post above.

Edited December 9, 2013 by weathernowcast

[+L0ne.R]

This is the thinking that most bothers me:

"Many NJ parks already have geocaches, including Monmouth battlefield which has many geocaches placed there. We can work on a plan to replace these and add new ones as we see fit. "

Who is "we"?

 

Wow.

 

What's the buzz on the NJ Free Speech FB page? How do people suggest handling this?

 

Would it be a good idea to contact people who have caches in the park to suggest, if approached by NNJC/Old Navy/Ranger Lynn to archive a cache, that they ask that they officially post an NA log?

Edited December 9, 2013 by L0ne R

[+TheWeatherWarrior]

THAT is why the STATEWIDE BOYCOTT. YES.....INCLUDING SOUTHERN NEW JERSEY!

 

And I'd rather see a complete ban of ALL GEOCACHES rather than be dictated to by such blatant abusers of the game for personal gain!

Edited December 9, 2013 by TheWeatherWarrior

[+K13]

So the NNJC is wanting taxpayer dollars to pay for their takeover of geocaching in the Garden State?

 

Develop a budget.

Estimate depending on quantity of geotrail geocaches, geocoins, and website promotion.

Estimate: $3000 – $5000. We are submitting a NJ350 State Grant application to hopefully cover these expenses. Perhaps underwriting by NJ dept of Tourism or other groups.

[+TheWeatherWarrior]

So the NNJC is wanting taxpayer dollars to pay for their takeover of geocaching in the Garden State?

 

Develop a budget.

Estimate depending on quantity of geotrail geocaches, geocoins, and website promotion.

Estimate: $3000 – $5000. We are submitting a NJ350 State Grant application to hopefully cover these expenses. Perhaps underwriting by NJ dept of Tourism or other groups.

It already has happened in Maryland! Most of the money is pocketed. Actual costs are not that high.

Edited December 9, 2013 by TheWeatherWarrior

[+K13]

Wow, what a deal. Money from the gubment for bullying other cachers and taking their cache locations.