Greedy TB Hotel

[+Seaglass Pirates]

This - http://coord.info/GC3VAG2

 

Has 20 TB's

Does not appear to be available 24 hours from the odd description tho blame google translate perhaps

 

One TB has been there since JULY!

Most have been there since September

The odd one has been there since October

And I think I counted 5 that were dropped off today or a few days ago.

 

WTF?

 

Ours has been in the blessed thing for two months and this one at least seems manned. Well the logs state that "he showed off his massive collection (OF OTHER PEOPLES STUFF!!!) as well as his own collection of coins.

 

I thought there were rules you lot had about length of stays or holding stuff hostage etc etc. Although cache pages can be edited it does not stop hoteliers holding on to stuff it seems.

 

So whats the rules please some reviewery jedi master obi bum Kanobi type blokey?

[+kunarion]

please some reviewery jedi master obi bum Kanobi type blokey?

Can you contact a local cacher (maybe a recent finder), and request that your TB be rescued? They would then need to move it a great distance.

[+Seaglass Pirates]

I could if I could overcome the language barrier. I have posted a note - google translated so god knows how insulting its been, but of course it relies on the nature of the TB hotel owner. From experience german geocachers do not reply to emails from the UK ... as for TB hotel owners ... I have had discouraging results.

 

Some have rules on which are not permitted as far as I am aware though that does not stop them leaving 'rules' written in the log book or on its cover. I mean a simple sweep of the fawning logs shows that it goes on. "I followed the rules as it says and only took 2 TB's as that is all I had to swap"/ "I did not have a TB to swap and as there were only 4 in the cache I read that I must leave that many in there at all times ... so thats what I did."

 

We have a TB hotel just down the road but several people care for its contents and it runs like a dream. Otherwise its a woolly affair.

[+dartymoor]

That does look a bit rubbish. Gets plenty of visits, so folk aren't afraid to use it, but I can only guess it's at a place of work and somebody is doling them out one-per-cacher? Unlucky for the tb owners.

 

Don't know if it's just me being unlucky, but I hardly ever find trackables now - perhaps 'collectors' like this are the reason?

 

A cache down here in the southwest was published very recently and started life with 12 trackables. I've never had more than 3 at a time! Clearly the owner had been hoarding them so his cache looked good.

[+thehoomer]

You could try contacting the reviewer who released it for publication. The CO might not have to reply to you but the reviewer should shouldn't they ? Perhaps they could email the CO on your behalf and ask them to release your TB? I’m guessing you should at least try to contact the CO directly first though.

[+sparklefingers]

That is rubbish. I'm trying to work out where it is.... About an hour from Hanover? Possibly 2 hours?

 

It's too far south for me, I tend to go to Bremen. I just wish I would go that far cause I'd go and take all tbs.

[+sparklefingers]

Just googled it. It is an hour and a half from my friends house (Hildesheim not the cache just the town...) I can see if they ever go there. They geocache but not very often due to three hobbits that just are too young.

[+kunarion]

I thought there were rules you lot had about length of stays or holding stuff hostage etc etc.

Every TB Owner is different. Travel Bugs are in the wind, once released. Many TOs don't mind where the wind blows.

 

The “Crabs” TB was placed on 09/02/2013. That's not an unusually long time to be in a cache. It's up to the finder to decide if they wish to do the extra work involved with retrieving it and placing in a new cache.

 

And your TB doesn't have any text on the TB's page about your desire that it be removed from that cache, nor even specify not to place it in “TB Hotels” in general. Can you get a good German translation to place on the TB page? Visit the German Forum area, and ask (and have them add any necessary info for Germans who I've been told have 'cherished German traditions' for messing with people's TBs handling TBs, that the rest of the world thinks is weird). If you have special requests for your TB, you must have info on the TB page. You can't micro-manage a TB, but if you have special instructions for people to follow, post it on the TB page. (Notice any theme developing here? )

 

Translate something like this: “The Crabs TB wishes to be placed into a cache, and then to keep moving from cache container to cache container. Don't place him in 'TB Hotels'” that have any restrictions on TB retrieval. If you see him in a 'TB Hotel', please retrieve him and place him into a different cache container immediately. Thank you!”

 

Be careful about what you post. Maybe you don't want the "TB rescuer" to then hijack your TB and log it forevermore from the safety of his own pocket. A "Geocacher" who has a psychological disorder and is basically "Geocaching" as a cry for help, will invent many creative ways to keep the drama at a high level, and it will be next to impossible to cover all the possibilities with "rules".

 

I'd also suggest that big, bold text is to be used only for the most important information (such as urgent news or special TB handling instructions). But if you require the TB story be in large text, I defer to your artistic license.

Edited November 12, 2013 by kunarion

[+Seaglass Pirates]

I take your points, however and unfortunately the result has been to imply/apportion blame and in the process you've lumped a bit of it on me and squished the point of the thread a smidge lol ...

 

The “Crabs” TB was placed on 09/02/2013. That's not an unusually long time to be in a cache. It's up to the finder to decide if they wish to do the extra work involved with retrieving it and placing in a new cache.

 

Actually the main point is that if the TB is in a cache and someone chooses to pick it up or not it not is not in contest. That is the way of the game with regard to cachers and normal caches. However a TB hotel which 'holds' onto a TB intentionally or otherwise is against groundpeaks rules ... and would not be permitted. It is also something that I have no ability to prevent. Because they should not exist I cannot prepare against them existing. I would be correct to assume that it would never be a problem that my TB would come up against.

 

 

And your TB doesn't have any text on the TB's page about your desire that it be removed from that cache, nor even specify not to place it in “TB Hotels” in general.

 

 

Nope nope you are quite correct but that is because usually a TB hotel which holds onto TB's in whatever fashion is archived or made to change its rules. So again I shouldnt have had to worry that this might happen. I could however do that now but I did this instead before I even started this thread ...

 

... and this has been translated back and was slightly more polite when it was sent in for translation but the point is it is there as a note on the cache page ....

 

"Please excuse the use of Google Translate. TB - ( visit link ) is our TB. It has lived here for over two months. We do not want that to continue. It is our property and we do not want it do not live here. If the cache owner please move it to another cache now please. Thank you ....undefined"

 

I could add a note to the TB's page but the point should'nt be I am beholden to prevent this happening to my TB, the point is that a TB hotel is not permitted to hold onto TB's it may only request that a certain amount be left in the hotel. And I assume this shouldnt really be permitted because that is against the rules/ instructions regarding TB's.

 

And it is unlikely that anyone will even see a note on my TB's page - the reason I posted on the cache page itself. So I get what you are saying but the hotel is still doing its thang isnt it? Is it allowed?

[+Seaglass Pirates]

Right reading through the logs - which was a bizarre read it appears this Hotel is in some sort of business. The logs speak of chatting with the nice lady behind the counter. Tentatively asking if there is a TB hotel here etc. So she shows them this box/cabinate thing with draws in. However it has opening times. So you cannot get to the main bit outside of those times. But you can still claim the cache as a find ... by going somewhere else along the street from what I can make out and sign that log book instead. I've never heard the like ...

 

Edit: It seems it is in a cinema. And that you cant get to the TB holding place outside of showing times at a guess. But if you just want to log the cache as a find you have to go roughly 50 feet away at 90 degrees to the place and you will find a cache there to sign, referred to as the field office???

Edited November 13, 2013 by Seaglass Pirates

[+redsox_mark]

Yes that is how I read it too. That does mean that some percentage of finders won't be able to access the trackables (but will log the cache). Others may sign the log but not bother to get the trackables box. So this will cut down on the chances for the TBs to get moved. Those with a TB to drop will get the box, as will those who want to move TBs. Others may not bother.

 

I can't tell if there are rules about not taking too many etc.

 

I see your TB was discovered recently, so at least it seems it isn't lost.

[+kunarion]

And it is unlikely that anyone will even see a note on my TB's page - the reason I posted on the cache page itself.

That's the chance you take. If people don't read the TB page, there will be problems regardless of the cache.

 

So I get what you are saying but the hotel is still doing its thang isnt it? Is it allowed?

Absolutely not. However, using the cache page as a forum is also not allowed. In order to get your TB back into play, you may have resort to something that other than making things worse.

[+Seaglass Pirates]

Classic - just searched (in vain) for some sort of categoric rule that clarifies the situation and I found a humourous alternative. And this will be our next TB. And a set of metal alphanumeric punches from fleebay to make our own replacement when it goes for a walk.

 

http://coord.info/TBJQ2F

 

http://coord.info/TB1R800

 

But seriously if it not permitted as it stands erm what next. I would say it is on shakey grounds for a few reasons:

 

1 in a business

2 two caches for one GC code 50 feet apart

3 possible infringement of proximity to other caches in area (I've not looked yet)

4 may have rules regarding guest count.

 

I have however found this from somewhere on Groundspeak Travel Bug Hotel Rules

 

Interesting thread from 2005 btw discussing the very same thing (edited ... sorry was on mobile version which is ... basic - here is the linky -

Forum Convo - 2005

Edited November 13, 2013 by Seaglass Pirates

[+vw_k]

The cache is in a cinema? According to the listing guidelines...

 

"Cache listings perceived as commercial will not be published. A commercial cache listing has one or more of the following characteristics:

It suggests or requires that the finder go inside a business, interact with employees and/or purchase a product or service."

 

Is there also something in writing saying that cache owners cannot place restrictions on other people's TBs?

 

Depending on the hours you either have to enter the business premises and interact with an employee or you have to project a waypoint and find a different cache that is offset somwehere else! So this is actually 2 physical caches, one that is against the guidelines and one that is listed as a trad but should actually be a mystery cache!

 

How wrong can this cache get?

[+The Blorenges]

If you trawl around cache listings on mainland Europe you can find plenty of examples (like this one) which appear not to meet the Groundspeak guidelines e.g. Many cachers who cache across The Channel come back with stories of how it's quite common to find "buried" caches, caches inside businesses, caches on obvious private property, inside derelict and dangerous-looking ruins, caches on historic/ancient sites...

 

There's not much point in discussing them here on the UK forum (apart from the joy of simply chewing the fat over such anomalies) If you want something done to bring all caches, world-wide, into line then make your case direct to Groundspeak.

 

Good luck with that...

 

MrsB

[+Seaglass Pirates]

ENEMY IN THE CAMP!!!!!

I got my leg slapped for an abreviated FU ... word. You'll get sent to the salt mines for herecy like that. There's probably a cache there though but if your lucks like mine it'll be an earth cache.

[+Seaglass Pirates]

How do you reply to that - the TB hotel sends a message -

 

"a few days ago, I read your request to let your Travelbug "CRABS" go on. Well, I´m the owner of the cache (and of course I left your TB in there) but I can´t force Cachers to take it further on. The landlady of the "Hotel" has an eye on it and offers every Cacher to take it with them.

 

But the real reason to write you is the note in the Listing of the Travelbug:

The google translations (the german ones) for the past Cachers to take your TB on the road don´t really make sense. In fact they confuse the readers and insult the cachers named.

You might better delete them. May be they are meant funny in the english language, then post them in english, in german they don´t.

 

Regards

ValoHildesia"

 

The "translated" unfunny comments I believe are something like "has passed it on to ..... Name ....... Or .......... Name ........ is running alive with 'it'. I think ... sigh I'll check

 

The self scratched and nearly feinted at the size of them .... erm well it was close

The fumbled in his udder and then turned him down .... Lol well erm

Seemed quite happy about the whole thing - beware!

The Dirty Urchins but (untranslated) but looks that way (was supposed to say looks the sort - but infected

 

Well nothing earth shatteringly terrible there. So it's an indignant shirty moan then.

[+TriciaG]

It's a long shot, but you could try listing your TB on http://www.tb-rescue.com/

[Dave from Glanton]

But seriously if it not permitted as it stands erm what next. I would say it is on shakey grounds for a few reasons:

 

1 in a business

2 two caches for one GC code 50 feet apart

3 possible infringement of proximity to other caches in area (I've not looked yet)

4 may have rules regarding guest count.

 

What next? From what I can see, you have a pretty strong case for arguing that it goes against the rules/guidelines. How about a "Needs Archived" log with the above in the text to draw it to the attention of a reviewer? It is a bit of a "go nuclear" option though....

[+Seaglass Pirates]

To be honest I think there are enough picky rules to follow in geocaching. Without giving everyone more hassle. I think perhaps this cache could be improved greatly if the co exchanged TB's with those that they are obviously trawling for. If you check the tbs logs that are there - quite often it the CO placing them in his cache. Ok fair enough then also bother to swap those that have lingered. As it is I would suggest that to the CO but I think that's an obvious good CO thing to do. I think the reply I got already tells me it would inflame the situation.

 

"Meh, what do you want me to do about it" - I am surprised the reviewer passed it but then rules are made to be broken *cough* fishing zones *cough*

[+Seaglass Pirates]

Case Closed really. Submitted the TB onto Tb rescue.com which we had planned to do as a last resort and our TB was rescued this morning. The people that rescued it state that the lady at reception was very friendly and helpful and they were permitted to take the TB without fuss. It still means that it relies upon another cacher to remove any TB's instead of a swap out completed by the CO.

 

As for logging a needs archived ... we wont be doing it. Not sure how they blagged the cache in the first place and to be honest if they did swap them out regularly it would be a good cache. But no doubt someone is going to go to it and decimate it of TB's and coins. Maybe then the CO will have a rethink. Thanks to anyone who posted.

[+dartymoor]

In a collection like this - especially one where somebody is monitoring its use and you feel obligated to only take one at a time, the "ugly TB" will stay in there forever.

[+RedSonja11]

Hello, I am German and have just read the description of the cache. Happy to help if I can, it seems like it's a shop or something and not a cinema. I haven't read all of the post in detail but let me know if you want me to contact the cache owner or write a note on the cache log to move your TB along.

 

Sorry, just read the last bit and saw your TB has been rescued.

Edited December 1, 2013 by RedSonja11