Recruiting: New Group - Ice Junkies

[+jhuoni]

There is a natural progression to this little game we call Waymarking... You start out by finding a few waymarks, a few more, and then a lot more. Somewhere in the middle of that you decide that you should start to post a few of your own. Then you join a group or two as a member.

 

All the while you are trying to find something for that "NEW CATEGORY". Something different, something that isn't all ready out there.

 

That is where I am at.

 

Over the past few years, there has been an explosion of free standing ice vending machines showing up all around the states. The two that I am aware of are "Twice The Ice", the one with the Penguin on it, and ICE BORN, which I have not seen except for in pictures. This new category would be to locate these ice makers and see just how many there really are.

 

My PROBLEM is that since I don't have a whole bunch of friends who Waymark, I don't have anyone to join my chilly little group. No officers, no submittion to Groundspeak for approval. (See where this is going yet?)

 

If you would like to get in at the beginning of yet another WM Category, and help me kick start this little project, I would be glad to have your help.

 

Thanks

John

[+fi67]

Welcome to Waymarking! You describe the progress very well, that have many of us gone through.

 

The process of creating a category is described technically correct in the FAQ and Category Creation Guide. But take care! A few years ago, it was that easy. Things have changed. It has become much more difficult to get a category approved.

 

A category that is approved in peer review was usually discussed here in the forum in every detail of the proposal and has received broad support here. If you don't feel enough enthusiasm or even opposition, the category will most likely not pass peer review.

 

This is especially true for commercial categories like the one you're proposing. There is a large group of waymarkers who don't like commercial categories at all, and think they should never have been started. These categories have almost no chance. There are many of those, I know, but they are old and would probably not succeed anymore, if they were new today

 

I can understand your wish to manage a category of your own, and there are a lot of great categories that still wait to be created. You should try to get a feeling for what is considered a good category. You can read some of the older threads in this forum, then you will know what I mean.

[+jhuoni]

Long Cane Massacre Site (WMHQZ8)

This is especially true for commercial categories like the one you're proposing. There is a large group of waymarkers who don't like commercial categories at all, and think they should never have been started. These categories have almost no chance. There are many of those, I know, but they are old and would probably not succeed anymore, if they were new today

 

I had planned to fire back at you with the statistics on all of the Fast Food Restaurants, Starbucks, and other "commercial" WM's out there. But I stopped and did my research: You ARE CORRECT - Most of those categories were started before 2010.

 

But let me ask you this. Haven't you ever just needed to get out and find a Waymark, Benchmark, or even (here it goes) a GEOCACHE? All the "ones" add up to a bigger number. I looked at your numbers and they are pretty impressive, and most of your WM's are some good ones. But I do see a few McD's, the Taco Bell, the Starbucks and others that are commercial. I too have visited a few of those, and even posted a Subway. (WMHJA6) Of course the Subway is next to the county court house (WMHFK2)(a U.S. National Register of Historic Places), which also has four other WM's on its lawn.

Submitted for Your Approval: When a person starts out WM'ing, what are the easiest WM's to get? The things they see everyday - the McD's, the State Historical Signs. Then they realize that some of the places they see everyday, like the Flour and Grist Mill (WMHFWH) or the spooky Long Cane Massacre Site (WMHQZ8) are Waymarks. The descriptions are no longer: McDonalds at the corner of Oak and Elm St in Anywhere USA. They now contain historical and factual information, that someone took the time to research and create the waymarks page. Even more surprising is that they are not just places around town, but they are U.S. National Register of Historic Places, or sites where people did things that created a nation.

 

For me, Waymarking started when a Geocache owner sent me a note that said "Hey, did you know that the cache you just logged is also a WAYMARK? It started me down a road of wanting to know more about these places. To a lot of people history is interesting. Especially when you move to a new place, a thousand miles from where you have known as "home".

 

I didn't plan on jumping up on the SOAP BOX. I don't even know if this would be considered as such.

 

I just thought I'd "share", now lets see what sort of beat down I get.

 

Best regards Y'all!

[+fi67]

Your observations are correct and so are your conclusions.

 

I was not talking about waymarks, but about categories, new categories. Now is not the time for new commercial categories, this was different six years ago and maybe one day it will change again, I don't know. I just wanted to tell you that you better not spend too much time and effort in a category that has little chance to get approved.

 

Coming back to the single waymarks. There are the existing commercial categories (and all the others), and it's fine to post and visit waymarks there. Some like commercial categories, some like historic ones, some do not care. There are many ways to play the game, there is place for all. And it's true, McD is an easy clearly defined category, perfect for beginners. But this one would have been enough, we do not need hundreds more of them.

 

Then we have the grid or icon hunting. Even some history specialists try to get as many icons in the category grid as possible and post one of every commercial category they can get, if they like them or not.

 

I even do this for every region. So, yes, I have seven McDonald's waymarks and I still don't like this category . But they are located in seven different regions/states in three countries, I don't care about the rest of them I daily pass by.

[+silverquill]

Hi!

 

The debate over commercial categories is been going on since day-one. McDonald's was one of the first categories created by Groundspeak, and in fact contains the very first waymark. This was long before Waymarking.com was opened up to user-created categories and the whole peer review process. And, preferences shift over time, and at this point there is less support within the Waymarking community for new commercial categories. That is just a fact.

 

People I respect are on both sides of the issue. Personally, I think there is a place for them. Although they may seem like litter on the Waymarking landscape, and can see no reason why people who enjoy them shouldn't have them. We are all free to waymark in our own way. So, if someone wants to waymark a McDonlads, it doen't bother me. At least McDonald's is global, and so are many others such as 7-Eleven and Subway. I was surprised to find my favorite coffee and doughnut chain from New England, Dunkin Donuts, ubiquitous in Korea.

 

Anyway, back to your ice machines. I understand your interest in them, and my problem is not that they are "commercial," but that I really don't see the point in Waymarking them. I don't think such a category would pass the "interesting or useful" criterion. There may not be enough of these to warrant a category, either. Do these exist in many countries? Are they permanent, or might they be moved or removed? If your goal is to find out how many there are, creating a Waymarking category will not give you the answer. The number and distribution of people who would waymark them is not adequate for that, or for any other category, really. At most, it would be a curiosity.

 

This is not meant to discourage you from creating a category, by any means. Keep thinking; keep exploring and more ideas will come to you, and I'm sure one of them will strike a responsive chord.

[+jhuoni]

Twice the Ice

Hi!

 

Anyway, back to your ice machines. I understand your interest in them, and my problem is not that they are "commercial," but that I really don't see the point in Waymarking them. I don't think such a category would pass the "interesting or useful" criterion. There may not be enough of these to warrant a category, either. Do these exist in many countries? Are they permanent, or might they be moved or removed? If your goal is to find out how many there are, creating a Waymarking category will not give you the answer. The number and distribution of people who would waymark them is not adequate for that, or for any other category, really. At most, it would be a curiosity.

 

This is not meant to discourage you from creating a category, by any means. Keep thinking; keep exploring and more ideas will come to you, and I'm sure one of them will strike a responsive chord.

 

Thanks for your response. Let me see if I can answer some of your questions:

 

Interesting: I started out trying to describe the buildings, but decided that it would be easier if I just attached photos. Since I can't find one that will let me link to it, I guess I will have to send you to the actual website. http://www.twicetheice.com As you can see they are pretty “interesting” looking.

 

Useful: “Whether you are looking for an Ice House in your neighborhood or planning a trip and need to find one on your route,”

 

Locations: “There are over 2,500 independent Twice the Ice locations across the US to supply you with your ice needs.” http://www.icehouseamerica.com/locations

 

Permanent: As you can see in the photo, they are pretty much attached to a 3 foot high concrete slab.

 

I edited my original goal to now read: “The mission of this group is to locate the 2,500 (plus) Twice the Ice and Ice Born locations across the United States. Most will be found in the Southeast, but locations are popping up in the Southwest, Midwest and Northeast.” If you go to the link above,(locations) you can put in your zip code and see how many locations are within a 10, 20, or 50 mile radius from you. I have 47 within a 50 mile radius from my location, and I live in a small town. We actually have a location here, which is why I thought about it as a new category.

 

I realize that I may be fighting a losing battle to get this category admitted, but I am going to give it my best shot. If I can convince one person at a time, that is how it is going to be. I see where there are some categories from 2009 that are still in limbo.

 

I have a Waymark in Historic Upping Stones, Hitching Posts, and Carriage Blocks. There are only 218 of those so far. I was amazed that I actually found one. The only reason why I knew what it was is becasue I found one that someone else (the group manager) had listed. Upping Stone, that is.

 

I have nothing to lose trying to push this category. And in the mean time, I might just think of another category or two to try to get going.

 

So, can I put YOU down as an OFFICER?

 

Thanks

John

[+jhuoni]

I managed to get one person behind me on this. Anyone else care to join?

[+PGWelch Photography]

I have been thinking about this same category. I don't think it should be limited to specific brands. My thought is to have the category be more general such as Automated Ice Machines. When I travel I love these things. The problem is there is no database to tell where they are located. Waymarking would be a good way of building the database. Many waymarkers carry ice coolers with them for the day of Waymarking, finding the ice machine to get the ice would be a bonus. I support this category and volunteer to help. Patrick Welch

[+jhuoni]

Patrick -

 

You are correct, I did a little more digging and found there are several other companies out there. I made some changes to the group description to reflect this new found info.

 

Since you say you have been thinking about this category too, I sent you a invite to join. With you that would give the group THREE members and we can move to the next step - Getting it approved as a category.

 

Anyone else interested in joining? Let me know.

[+jhuoni]

Looks like we made it to PEER REVIEW!

 

Now all we have to do is get a bunch of YOU to agree with a few individuals that this would make a good category.

 

Just a little update: The new and improved category, Ice and Water Vending Machines, includes ALL brands of Ice Vending Machines as well as Water Vending Machines. (Hotel ice machines and water machines inside store are excluded.)

 

These machines are world wide. In searching for additional information, I came across machines with the lettering with Asian and Arabic characters and a few other languages which I could not read.

 

I was told that "commercial" waymarks are no longer "the in thing". I am hoping that YOU will prove this wrong.

 

Please go to PEER REVIEW and vote. Comments are more than welcome.

 

Hopefully three days from now I will be posting a thank you note listing the names of EVERYONE who voted "Yea".

 

Thanks

 

If nothing else, give me the category just based on the enthusiasm I am showing trying to get it passed!