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Battery and charger advice


Chief301

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OK, so I have come into $100 worth of Amazon gift certificates, and debating what I want to buy. I'm considering getting some decent rechargable batteries and a smart charger for my GPS (Garmin Oregon 550). I have been using rechargables but they are a mix of different brands, and one of those cheap chargers from Wally World. I also have two Garmin batteries with charger that came with the Oregon. Needless to say this mixed bag of brands and models is less than ideal and my battery efficiency ranges from merely inconsistent to downright crappy. I recently got so fed up with the whole situation that I went back to using disposables, but these aren't doing too well either...a brand new pair only goes an hour or two before it starts giving me low battery warnings, even though I'm still showing half the battery life left (and yes, I did change the setting on the Oregon back to alkalines)

 

Having said all that, I'm thinking of going back to rechargables, but obviously I need to upgrade my equipment. So I'm looking for suggestions for a good charger and batteries. I'm considering the LaCrosse BC-700 and Sanyo Eneloops. What I want to know is, does this sound like a reasonable setup? Anything else out there I might consider? And finally, will the "smart" charger be able to recondition some of the various makes and models of batteries I already have or does it only work with a certain grade or type of battery?

 

I've done a search on the forums already but there aren't too many threads on the topic and most of them quickly went into a lot of technical discussion of voltages and discharge rates and stuff that went right over my head :( So if someone could break it down for me in layman's terms I would really appreciate it. Thanks!

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Medium capacity, low discharge NiMH's (2000-2300 mAh) from a reputable manufacturer like Varta or GP, together with a low-current (overnight) charger, is the best option in my opinion. You can count on at a few hundred good runs from every cell by such a setup, at least.

 

If you are going to do outings in freezing temperatures, forget NiMH though.

Edited by tr_s
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A LaCrosse BC-700 and Sanyo Eneloops sounds like a reasonable approach. I use a Powerex MH‑C9000 & Sanyo Eneloops. I've also just used the quick charger that comes with the batteries, but I am well aware that it shortens the overall life of the battery. Sometimes I just can't wait overnight.

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Eneloops are definitely the way to go. They give me about 9-10 hours of life in my Oregon 450t with no backlight and power save turned on. You might be able to get a couple more hours out of the XX, but they cost twice as much. If you're going to be out for long trips and need to minimize your weight and battery count, that's when you grab a pack of Energizer Lithium Ultimate, which last close to the 16-hour mark. But for normal usage, eneloops are just fine and will last you a day. I always bring an extra set with me just in case, but don't usually have to swap them out unless I'm on multi-day or extended day trips.

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Definitely yes on the Eneloops.

 

I'd look at Maha/Powerex chargers. The MH-C9000 is a great 4 bay charger/analyzer. Another good Maha charger is the MH-C800S, an 8 bay charger (I have both of these).

 

If you would like a LaCrosse charger, skip the BC-900 and BC-9009 ones - the chargers have a nasty tendency to melt.

The BC-700 does not seem to have that problem.

 

EDIT: I missed the part about reconditioning batteries. In that case, the MH-C9000 is the one you want.

Edited by BlackRose67
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Definitely yes on the Eneloops.

 

If you would like a LaCrosse charger, skip the BC-900 and BC-9009 ones - the chargers have a nasty tendency to melt.

The BC-700 does not seem to have that problem.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the BC-1000, which has replaced the BC-900, has addressed the melting tendency.

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I have a jar of rechargable batteries that won't hold much of a charge anymore (waiting for proper disposal).

 

There is not a single Eneloope in the jar. Many other brands are in there. Even some other Sanyo types which I figured were probably similar to Eneloopes, but they were the worst rechargables I ever had.

 

Many of the ones in the jar ended up there within a few weeks after I quick-charged them once. :(

 

I used to think Eneloops were too expensive so I kept buying the cheaper ones, but as I got Eneloopes as gifts I now have mostly those. Not sure what they actually cost but my sense is that they are a better deal than the cheaper ones.

Edited by Hynr
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Hey Chief.....your ship has come in.

I'm a battery charger, battery,flashlight, GPS, nut.

I own all the MAHA chargers and this is the one I love and have used for a few years now :

 

http://www.thomasdistributing.com/MAHA-MH-C801D-AA--AAA-Battery-ChargerbrDELUXE-8-Cell-Professional-Battery-Charger-w-Full-LCD-Display_p_2559.html

 

These are the batteries you want :

 

http://www.thomasdistributing.com/New-Version-Sanyo-XX-Eneloop-2500-mAh-Low-Discharge-AA-Batteries_p_2930.html

 

I love thomas distributing and have used them for 10 years or so.

 

Your $100 is about a perfect fit.

 

Using the above setup I rarely have to calibrate the electronic compass on my 450 or 62S after a battery change...the voltage is that spot on charge to charge.

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I've also used NiMh cells (Eneloops and Duracell Pre-Charged aka Duraloops) when it's been between -10C and -20C.

Other than lasting about 3/4 as long as they do in warmer weather, there worked fine in my eTrex 20.

 

It's just one of the things we Canadians have to deal with for several months of the year. Lithium primaries are insanely expensive here due to the Energizer monopoly on lithium primary cells in North America.

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Thanks everyone for the input. At least I now have a couple of good options to look at. Looks like I should be able to get a decent setup for the budget I have. As far as the freezing temps, not a problem, I'm in south Louisiana where we only have 3 or 4 days a year that get (barely) to freezing...and quite frankly, I probably won't be out caching on those days :ph34r:

 

Thanks again!

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Just a couple other questions....Bam, what's the major differance between the MH-C801D that you're suggesting and the MH-C9000 recommended by BlackRose? I see the 801 does 8 cells at a time whereas the 900 only does 4...I can live with only charging 4 cells at a time, or are there some other differences I'm not seeing?

 

Also, it sounds like the thing to do to maximize the lifespan of the batteries is a slow charge, correct? The slower the better, I guess? How does that work?

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Chief, I love MAHA chargers and the C9000 is a quality charger but I find it waaaaay too complicated ( I wouldn't be surprised if it made coffee ). It comes with a nice manual but I get a headache every time I read it. I have some older PowerX batteries it refuses to charge ( I wouldn't put them in my GPS but good for toys , etc )We usually hit the field with 3 GPS units and I like to cap off spares so its nice having 8 cell capacity. On a lesser note when I first got the 9000 I put in four batteries and went to bed.....the light this thing gives off lit up the bedroom......I had to put a handkerchief over the display.

SOFT CHARGING IS BEST....I only soft charge. On the 801 you insert a battery in the far left slot and then press the right hand button for soft charge then insert as many as you like.....THAT'S IT. I've never reconditioned my Eneloops as there is no need to.....they continue to cap off 100%. On a 450 or 62S if a battery is not perfect, change to change , 80% of the time you will need to calibrate the electronic compass if you want it perfect. Using the Eneloop and 801 on overnight soft charge 80 % + of the time the compass will be PERFECT after the change ( not so if you fast charge )

Again, IMO, it just doesn't get any better than the C801D and 2500 Sanyo Eneloops.

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The experts advocate charging NiMh cells at what it called 0.5C (a value equal to half the stated capacity).

 

For a 2000 mAh Eneloop, that would be 1000 mA or 1A.

 

The standard charge rate on the C801D for AA cells is 2 Amps (2000 mA), so soft charging on the C801D does use the prescribed rate of 1A for an AA cell and is better for the cells.

 

The C9000 is really an analyzer that can also be used as a charger.

 

I first bought the C9000, but I use my C800S about 80% of the time.

 

If I have a set of cells that don't seem to be lasting as long, I'll discharge them and then put them through a Refesh/Analyze cycle to see how they do.

If they are showing some wear, I'll put them through what is called a break-in cycle, which takes close to 2 days to complete.

 

For someone like me that has over 200 NiMh cells :blink: , that would take a lot of time if I had to do that regularly.

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EDIT: deleted my post.. here are the manuals for the two chargers

 

http://www.mahapowerex.eu/user-manuals/mh-c9000-manual-en.pdf

http://www.mahapowerex.eu/user-manuals/mh-c801d-manual-en.pdf

 

 

From the C9000 manual: "If no key is pressed within ten seconds, the charger will proceed to the default mode which is charging with 1000mA rate" This is fine for AA Eneloop. Be sure to leave the cells in for at least 2 hours after DONE appears for the topoff mode to complete.

 

I have the C9000, but I see the appeal of the c801d for just charging.

Edited by JustMyName
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All you have to do is start a thread about "Best Batteries?" and you get 37000+ opinions.....

 

Here are actual FACTS....

 

Approx 6 years ago, I bought a total of 20 Sanyo Eneloop (2000 mah) batteries and a Maha C-9000 charger (4 slots).

 

These batteries power 4 GPSs, 1 digital handheld scanner, backup for 2 HAM handheld radios,and 1 digital camera. Some of the various units are used DAILY. I am NEVER without freshly charged bats on standby.

 

In my GPS case, I carry a backup set of standard alkaline bats for "emergency replacement in the field"......never happens..... Some "replacement" pairs have been carried for so long that all the printing on the OD has been worn off(from friction) but have never (yet)been placed in the unit.

 

How many batteries have I NOT bought over the last several years? ....A BUNCH !

 

How many times have I been caught with no fresh replacement batteries in the field? NEVER

 

Oh yeah, I still only have and use the ORIGINAL 20 Eneloops.

 

Not an endorsement for a particular product, just actual facts from actual use. YMMV

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I carry a backup set of standard alkaline bats for "emergency replacement in the field"

 

I suggest you carry either Energizer "Advanced Lithium AA" or another pair of Eneloops for your replacement. Alkalines are not reliable.

 

10-4.

In a year an Eneloop will still have almost 80 % of its top charge.

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I carry a backup set of standard alkaline bats for "emergency replacement in the field"

 

I suggest you carry either Energizer "Advanced Lithium AA" or another pair of Eneloops for your replacement. Alkalines are not reliable.

 

10-4.

In a year an Eneloop will still have almost 80 % of its top charge.

 

The point I was making was that, for as many times as they have been used in the last several years, my "backups" could have been made of peanut butter! So, why buy expensive Lithium for "Non use"?

A GPS is supposed to be a "thinking person's tool". That means, start off with fully charged batteries, and test your "backups" before you start also. (whether they be Lithium, Eneloop, Alkaline, or reg Heavy Duty.

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Well, I placed my order this morning (call it a birthday present to myself :). ) and I opted for the MAHA C-800s BlackRose referred to and an 8-pack of Sanyo XX Eneloops recommended by Bamboozle. After considering my actual usage requirements I felt this would be a suitable compromise between cost and utility. I really only get out caching a couple of times a month if I'm lucky, and I'm not a professional user or hobbyist who goes through batteries on a daily basis, so a fairly simple setup seemed best for me.

 

I first bought the C9000, but I use my C800S about 80% of the time.

 

I kind of read between the lines here....as with any technical device or tool, it's good to get an experienced person's input on what they'd recommend, but what do they actually USE? That's a more telling but of info, I think 😉

 

I also threw in an 8 cell battery case just to round my purchase up to my $100 card balance.

 

You guys have provided me some great info. I consider it a continuation of the learning curve....first I had to learn about Geocaching itself, through the Forums and using a smartphone app, then I had to educate myself about GPSr's and make a purchase decision there....and now I know a little more about what to feed it. 😄 Thanks again!

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UPDATE: Well, I'd like to be able to report what kind of life I'm getting out of the Eneloop XX's. I'd like to report that, but I really don't know yet because I haven't killed the first pair yet! Topped them all off the day I got them, popped a pair in the Oregon and played around with it a bit that day, went caching the next day (not all day but a couple of hours straight usage anyway), played around with it a bit more since then and took a couple of sets of coordinates for a new cache I'm planning, and they are STILL showing full charge in the GPS! So I have no idea how long these things are going to last, but so far I'm quite impressed!

 

I got the 8-cell carry case to make sure to have backups with me when I go out, but at the rate I'm going I doubt I'd ever use 2 pairs in a day of caching, much less 4 :D

 

Thanks again for the great advice! I feel like I've finally fitted the last piece of the puzzle :)

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UPDATE: Well, I'd like to be able to report what kind of life I'm getting out of the Eneloop XX's. I'd like to report that, but I really don't know yet because I haven't killed the first pair yet! Topped them all off the day I got them, popped a pair in the Oregon and played around with it a bit that day, went caching the next day (not all day but a couple of hours straight usage anyway), played around with it a bit more since then and took a couple of sets of coordinates for a new cache I'm planning, and they are STILL showing full charge in the GPS! So I have no idea how long these things are going to last, but so far I'm quite impressed!

 

I got the 8-cell carry case to make sure to have backups with me when I go out, but at the rate I'm going I doubt I'd ever use 2 pairs in a day of caching, much less 4 :D

 

Thanks again for the great advice! I feel like I've finally fitted the last piece of the puzzle :)

 

Sounds great Chief.....if there is a slam dunk on this forum its the C801 MAHA and 2500 Eneloops....it just doesn't get any better.

On an Oregon 450 with full brightness and backlight on most of the time I'll get somewhere between 8-10 hours....the 62S set the same will go much longer.

At the end of a caching day get a good compass and be sure your 450 is dead on. Take the batteries out and put them on soft charge overnight. Install them in the morning.....I find 80-90% of the time the compass will read dead on....before Eneloops 80 % of the time I re-calibrated after a battery change ( it has to do with voltage change-to-change )

Lots has been written about the " rigors " of compass calibration....this " nightmare " takes about 10 seconds but I still like to check it as above and I won't re-calibrate unless its required ( I don't use a compass each time.....standing in my dining room I know exactly where N is so its a quick check )

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The MH-C800S 'standard' charge is only 1A (equivalent to 'soft' on the MH-C801D), and should be used for Eneloops AA.

 

The standard charge on the C-800S is rapid charge by default. If you just stick the batteries in it and press nothing it does a rapid charge. Put one battery in and press "Soft" and it goes to soft charge mode. Or put one battery in and press the "condition" button and it goes into condition mode. Pretty simple really, so I think I made a good choice for my electronically challenged self.

 

And I did change the battery setting to rechargeable NiMh. 😊

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The MH-C800S 'standard' charge is only 1A (equivalent to 'soft' on the MH-C801D), and should be used for Eneloops AA.

 

The standard charge on the C-800S is rapid charge by default. If you just stick the batteries in it and press nothing it does a rapid charge. Put one battery in and press "Soft" and it goes to soft charge mode. Or put one battery in and press the "condition" button and it goes into condition mode. Pretty simple really, so I think I made a good choice for my electronically challenged self.

 

And I did change the battery setting to rechargeable NiMh. 😊

 

Chief....what he's saying is true. My C800D and your C800S are somewhat different chargers. My " soft " charge rate of 1000 ma is the same as your " fast " charge rate of 1000 ma. I believe for optimum charging of the 2500 Eneloops 1000 ma should be used so when you put your battery in there is no need to press the right button for soft charging.....just let it rip. For other batteries perhaps your soft charge rate of 500 ma would be optimum.

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