A "Winter Only" Geocache?

[+ADKer]

Would It be against the rules to make a traditional cache, giving it the attributes "seasonal access" and "winter friendly", and say that it is only available in the winter months in the description. When summertime comes, I would remove the container until it is winter again.

 

I know that "temporary caches" aren't allowed, but this is different. What do you all think?

[+Gitchee-Gummee]

Well... that is a form of "temporary" cache... when it is designated as a winter ONLY geocache.

 

True, in your neck of the woods, winter can exceed three months, which is the minimum consideration for permanency, but to call it a winter only cache could pose a problem.

 

Pass it by your reviewer and get his/her take on it... our opinion counts far less than does that of a reviewer.

[+niraD]

Is there a particular reason why it can't be available year-round?

 

If the cache is available for 3+ months, then you could list it for the winter, archive it, and then list it for the next winter. You might also be able to disable it during the non-winter months, but make sure you explain the situation to your reviewer or the cache may get archived.

[+The_Incredibles_]

Any reason you can't leave the container year round and hide it high enough that snow won't be an issue?

 

My hometown has snow on the ground 6-9 months of the year. Lots of ammo cans hidden there year round without trouble. There's one near my mom's house that is stuck up in a tree so you can reach in winter by skis or snowshoes.

[+ADKer]

Well, basically what I'm saying is, since there is an attribute saying that a cache has seasonal access only, does that season have to be summer? It's not that I couldn't hide a cache that would be available year round, it's just that I'm choosing not to, just like some people choose to not place a cache in a winter friendly position.

[+K13]

I think the seasonal access attribute is meant to show that a cache may be more easily found in a certain season, not that it is unavailable in a certain season. Your idea seems to go against the idea of cache permanence.

[+ADKer]

Or, and I just thought of this possibility, could I have two separate containers/locations, one for winter, one for summer. Twice a year I would update the coordinates, and keep switching back between the two containers/locations. (Removing the unused container, of course)

 

Perhaps if I do that, it shoudn't be a traditional cache, but maybe a mystery cache?

Edited August 24, 2013 by Rinerts

[+BlueDeuce]

Low-temp release lock. Hey if people want to bring dry ice, let'em.

[+T.D.M.22]

Well, basically what I'm saying is, since there is an attribute saying that a cache has seasonal access only, does that season have to be summer? It's not that I couldn't hide a cache that would be available year round, it's just that I'm choosing not to, just like some people choose to not place a cache in a winter friendly position.

 

I think that attribute is for us up north, and in the higher elevations. Some parks in the higher elevations will close roads in the winter. Therefore disabling a cache that is in an area that's closed is a good idea. The attribute alerts people that may happen. There are also areas that are not accessible due to snow-either you can't get to it, or it's under 7 feet of snow.

 

On the other hand there is a place near my home that is closed during fire season-May be a couple days or a month. One cache-inadvertantely- went for a cache there and was stopped by the FD.

 

You still haven't said why you it wouldn't be available in the summer. If you explain why, someone may even be able to help you.

[AZcachemeister]

I think what you have outlined is perfectly acceptable and within the guidelines.

Seasonal Access can mean NOT available in winter, or ONLY available in winter.

Just to be sure, discuss it with your reviewer.

[+ADKer]

You still haven't said why you it wouldn't be available in the summer. If you explain why, someone may even be able to help you.

 

It (as of now) would be unavailable during summer simply because I want a cache specifically for finding in the winter, therefore, cachers in the winter would have a cache that they didn't find in the summer...or something like that

Edited August 24, 2013 by Rinerts

[+BlueDeuce]

You still haven't said why you it wouldn't be available in the summer. If you explain why, someone may even be able to help you.

 

It (as of now) would be unavailable during summer simply because I want a cache specifically for finding in the winter, therefore, cachers in the winter would have a cache that they didn't find in the summer...or something like that

 

I hear ya, but not available means that the conditions are that they can't attempt to find it. You'll have to figure out how to meet that requirement. Top of my head would be a location that the property owner only allows access via snowmobile when snow is on the ground. The ocean is only solid enough to traverse during January. That type of thing.

[+Team Hugs]

I hear ya, but not available means that the conditions are that they can't attempt to find it. You'll have to figure out how to meet that requirement. Top of my head would be a location that the property owner only allows access via snowmobile when snow is on the ground. The ocean is only solid enough to traverse during January. That type of thing.

 

Agreed.

 

Example (but in the opposite direction): in my area, there's a county park that is only open during the warm months. There are a bunch of geocaches legally placed in the park. When the park closes for the winter, the cache owner disables the caches until the park re-opens the following spring, when he re-enables them. This has gone on for several years.

[+ADKer]

You still haven't said why you it wouldn't be available in the summer. If you explain why, someone may even be able to help you.

 

It (as of now) would be unavailable during summer simply because I want a cache specifically for finding in the winter, therefore, cachers in the winter would have a cache that they didn't find in the summer...or something like that

 

I hear ya, but not available means that the conditions are that they can't attempt to find it. You'll have to figure out how to meet that requirement. Top of my head would be a location that the property owner only allows access via snowmobile when snow is on the ground. The ocean is only solid enough to traverse during January. That type of thing.

 

What about my other idea about changing the location/container every 6ish months?

[+BlueDeuce]

What about my other idea about changing the location/container every 6ish months?

 

Personally I think we keep caches in place too long as it is, but when dealing with gc.com requirements you'll need their buy in. If they are willing to list a 4/3 D/T lamp post cache I don't have a problem with a 4 month listed cache. Go for it.

[+CanadianRockies]

What about my other idea about changing the location/container every 6ish months?

You might have trouble convincing a reviewer to allow you to change the location every 6 months. As long as the "winter" location is less than 528 feet away from the "summer" location, however, and you bounce between two fixed spots, then you should be able to do this yourself. The risk, however, is that someone might put a cache near one of your two spots and cause proximity issues for you.

 

You can change the container as often as you like, but if the size changes, then please update that on your cache page.

 

I found a cache in Minnesota where the owner keeps the location constant but changes the cache's elevation twice a year (from winter friendly to winter unfriendly).

[+BlueDeuce]

What about my other idea about changing the location/container every 6ish months?

You might have trouble convincing a reviewer to allow you to change the location every 6 months.

 

Stated where?

[+ADKer]

What about my other idea about changing the location/container every 6ish months?

You might have trouble convincing a reviewer to allow you to change the location every 6 months. As long as the "winter" location is less than 528 feet away from the "summer" location, however, and you bounce between two fixed spots, then you should be able to do this yourself. The risk, however, is that someone might put a cache near one of your two spots and cause proximity issues for you.

 

You can change the container as often as you like, but if the size changes, then please update that on your cache page.

 

I found a cache in Minnesota where the owner keeps the location constant but changes the cache's elevation twice a year (from winter friendly to winter unfriendly).

 

Actually there is a local cache near (or at least was near me) that did travel a lot. I think it is pretty cool. If it can chance its location to any old spot every week, I'm pretty sure I could change mine every six months between two locations!

[+Gitchee-Gummee]

Actually there is a local cache near (or at least was near me) that did travel a lot. I think it is pretty cool. If it can chance its location to any old spot every week, I'm pretty sure I could change mine every six months between two locations!

Traveling Caches have been disallowed for some time now.

 

EDIT: There are some grandfathered ones still out and about.

Edited August 24, 2013 by Gitchee-Gummee

[+ADKer]

Actually there is a local cache near (or at least was near me) that did travel a lot. I think it is pretty cool. If it can chance its location to any old spot every week, I'm pretty sure I could change mine every six months between two locations!

Traveling Caches have been disallowed for some time now.

 

EDIT: There are some grandfathered ones still out and about.

 

Oh yeah, silly me.... I knew that

 

Luckily that is not what I want to make with my cache!

Edited August 24, 2013 by Rinerts

[mac367]

I say run it by your reviewer. If the cache has some cool (pun intended) reason that it would be available only in winter than why wouldn't the seasonal attribute apply? Personally I wouldn't do the move back and forth every six months, but that's just me. I quite like the idea of the seasonal access being pretty much the opposite of what most of us would consider. If you go forward with the idea update this thread so we know if you were successful.

[+ngrrfan]

Or, and I just thought of this possibility, could I have two separate containers/locations, one for winter, one for summer. Twice a year I would update the coordinates, and keep switching back between the two containers/locations. (Removing the unused container, of course)

 

Perhaps if I do that, it shoudn't be a traditional cache, but maybe a mystery cache?

Here is a cache like you are describing. Two containers at the same location. One low for summer and one high for winter.

 

Wolf Creek

Edited August 24, 2013 by ngrrfan

[+ADKer]

Or, and I just thought of this possibility, could I have two separate containers/locations, one for winter, one for summer. Twice a year I would update the coordinates, and keep switching back between the two containers/locations. (Removing the unused container, of course)

 

Perhaps if I do that, it shoudn't be a traditional cache, but maybe a mystery cache?

Here is a cache like you are describing. Two containers at the same location. One low for summer and one high for winter.

 

Wolf Creek

 

Yes, the only difference is that mine would be two containers at different locations at different times.

[+ngrrfan]

Or, and I just thought of this possibility, could I have two separate containers/locations, one for winter, one for summer. Twice a year I would update the coordinates, and keep switching back between the two containers/locations. (Removing the unused container, of course)

 

Perhaps if I do that, it shoudn't be a traditional cache, but maybe a mystery cache?

Here is a cache like you are describing. Two containers at the same location. One low for summer and one high for winter.

 

Wolf Creek

 

Yes, the only difference is that mine would be two containers at different locations at different times.

Then, IMHO, that is two separate caches, not a summer/winter one.

[+ADKer]

Or, and I just thought of this possibility, could I have two separate containers/locations, one for winter, one for summer. Twice a year I would update the coordinates, and keep switching back between the two containers/locations. (Removing the unused container, of course)

 

Perhaps if I do that, it shoudn't be a traditional cache, but maybe a mystery cache?

Here is a cache like you are describing. Two containers at the same location. One low for summer and one high for winter.

 

Wolf Creek

 

Yes, the only difference is that mine would be two containers at different locations at different times.

Then, IMHO, that is two separate caches, not a summer/winter one.

 

Yes but,

 

1: In that case I would have a cache that is not available for 6ish months at a time.

2: The distance between the two locations would only be about 10-20 feet apart.

[+CanadianRockies]

Or, and I just thought of this possibility, could I have two separate containers/locations, one for winter, one for summer. Twice a year I would update the coordinates, and keep switching back between the two containers/locations. (Removing the unused container, of course)

 

Perhaps if I do that, it shoudn't be a traditional cache, but maybe a mystery cache?

Here is a cache like you are describing. Two containers at the same location. One low for summer and one high for winter.

 

Wolf Creek

Yes, the only difference is that mine would be two containers at different locations at different times.

Then, IMHO, that is two separate caches, not a summer/winter one.

Yes but,

 

1: In that case I would have a cache that is not available for 6ish months at a time.

2: The distance between the two locations would only be about 10-20 feet apart.

If you're only going to move your cache 10 to 20 feet, then you can do this yourself with a single cache via the "Log your visit" link using the "Type of Log" box's "Update Coordinates" item selection. No need to involve a reviewer in that case.

Edited August 24, 2013 by CanadianRockies

[+ADKer]

Or, and I just thought of this possibility, could I have two separate containers/locations, one for winter, one for summer. Twice a year I would update the coordinates, and keep switching back between the two containers/locations. (Removing the unused container, of course)

 

Perhaps if I do that, it shoudn't be a traditional cache, but maybe a mystery cache?

Here is a cache like you are describing. Two containers at the same location. One low for summer and one high for winter.

 

Wolf Creek

Yes, the only difference is that mine would be two containers at different locations at different times.

Then, IMHO, that is two separate caches, not a summer/winter one.

Yes but,

 

1: In that case I would have a cache that is not available for 6ish months at a time.

2: The distance between the two locations would only be about 10-20 feet apart.

If you're only going to move your cache 10 to 20 feet, then you can do this yourself with a single cache via the "Log your visit" link using the "Type of Log" box's "Update Coordinates" item selection. No need to involve a reviewer in that case.

 

Yes, that is what I intended in the first place, every winter/summer I would update the coordinates, and place the new cache/remove the old.

[+Don_J]

Personally, I prefer to hide caches and then let the finders figure how and when they'll find them.

 

After reading up to this point, I still can't figure out why someone would want to intentionally restrict their cache from being found for a significant part of the year. "Because I want to", or "because I can", just doesn't seem like a valid reason to me. Place your cache at the beginning of winter then archive it four months later. Do it again next winter, provided no one has taken the spot. Holding a spot with no cache to find, for reasons that are personal to you only, seems a bit selfish.

Edited August 25, 2013 by Don_J

[+ADKer]

Personally, I prefer to hide caches and then let the finders figure how and when they'll find them.

 

After reading up to this point, I still can't figure out why someone would want to intentionally restrict their cache from being found for a significant part of the year. "Because I want to", or "because I can", just doesn't seem like a valid reason to me. Place your cache at the beginning of winter then archive it four months later. Do it again next winter, provided no one has taken the spot. Holding a spot with no cache to find, for reasons that are personal to you only, seems a bit selfish.

 

Selfishness has nothing to do with this at all .

 

My first though for coming up with this idea was that I was finding all these "winter friendly" caches during the summer, limiting what I could find during the winter. So, I though I could make a cache that people wouldn't find during the summer, therefore they could find it in the winter. I know some people would say "well that's their problem if they don't plan ahead. If they wanted to find caches in winter, they should save some for then!" That is quite hard in a very cache-sparse area, like where I live.

Anyway, my initial ideas began to evolve into also wanting to create a unique cache. Why not, right? Moving it back and forth between two very close locations isn't being selfish. If someone happened to put a cache 528 feet from one point while it was active, I just wouldn't make the other location withing the radius of that cache. It isn't "saving a spot" because there is always going to be a geocache there. If someone puts a cache where it is in the radius of one, the current one, but not the other, then they will just have to move their cache 10 feet farther away.

 

I hope I cleared things up without sounding too rant-y. My intended tone wasn't of anger, but of....well friendlier than anger, that's for sure!

Edited August 25, 2013 by Rinerts

[+BlackRose67]

Would It be against the rules to make a traditional cache, giving it the attributes "seasonal access" and "winter friendly", and say that it is only available in the winter months in the description. When summertime comes, I would remove the container until it is winter again.

 

I know that "temporary caches" aren't allowed, but this is different. What do you all think?

Here's one that has effectively become a winter only cache (unless you want to carry a kayak or canoe over 1.2 KMs into the woods, or the drought conditions that made this one possible return): http://coord.info/GC3X7FZ

[stebu]

Is there a particular reason why it can't be available year-round?

 

If the cache is available for 3+ months, then you could list it for the winter, archive it, and then list it for the next winter. You might also be able to disable it during the non-winter months, but make sure you explain the situation to your reviewer or the cache may get archived.

There are two caches in my neighborhood that are winter ONLY. Both involve swimming in icy water (a hole made into the ice to allow swimming during the winter). They are multi-caches, and the first point in the lake is removed when the water gets too warm for the challenge .

I logged on of them, but couldn't find the other, BRRRR

[+ADKer]

Is there a particular reason why it can't be available year-round?

 

If the cache is available for 3+ months, then you could list it for the winter, archive it, and then list it for the next winter. You might also be able to disable it during the non-winter months, but make sure you explain the situation to your reviewer or the cache may get archived.

There are two caches in my neighborhood that are winter ONLY. Both involve swimming in icy water (a hole made into the ice to allow swimming during the winter). They are multi-caches, and the first point in the lake is removed when the water gets too warm for the challenge .

I logged on of them, but couldn't find the other, BRRRR

Yes! So it is possible to make a cache winter only. Could I Have the link/GC code to one of them?

[+ngrrfan]

If someone puts a cache where it is in the radius of one, the current one, but not the other, then they will just have to move their cache 10 feet farther away.

Uh... no they won't have to move it, your spot is no longer valid. Now granted most caches are slightly more than 528' apart with a bit of a buffer between them but at some point someone will figure out how to wiggle one in.

[+ADKer]

Well yes, that'd what I mean. When they are placing a cache...

I was acting as if some rare occasion where someone actually did try to place one at the limit.

[stebu]

Is there a particular reason why it can't be available year-round?

 

If the cache is available for 3+ months, then you could list it for the winter, archive it, and then list it for the next winter. You might also be able to disable it during the non-winter months, but make sure you explain the situation to your reviewer or the cache may get archived.

There are two caches in my neighborhood that are winter ONLY. Both involve swimming in icy water (a hole made into the ice to allow swimming during the winter). They are multi-caches, and the first point in the lake is removed when the water gets too warm for the challenge .

I logged on of them, but couldn't find the other, BRRRR

Yes! So it is possible to make a cache winter only. Could I Have the link/GC code to one of them?

Here you are: http://www.geocaching.com/geocache/GC2Q5DQ_ice-swimming-at-lake-bodom

[+ADKer]

Is there a particular reason why it can't be available year-round?

 

If the cache is available for 3+ months, then you could list it for the winter, archive it, and then list it for the next winter. You might also be able to disable it during the non-winter months, but make sure you explain the situation to your reviewer or the cache may get archived.

There are two caches in my neighborhood that are winter ONLY. Both involve swimming in icy water (a hole made into the ice to allow swimming during the winter). They are multi-caches, and the first point in the lake is removed when the water gets too warm for the challenge .

I logged on of them, but couldn't find the other, BRRRR

Yes! So it is possible to make a cache winter only. Could I Have the link/GC code to one of them?

Here you are: http://www.geocachin...g-at-lake-bodom

 

Thank you! Very cool! And the reviewer didn't really have any problems? (I don't know much Finnish!)

[AZcachemeister]

 

Thank you! Very cool! And the reviewer didn't really have any problems? (I don't know much Finnish!)

 

HA HA! Nice pun there.

 

Please be aware that a cache published two years ago in Finland does not mean your reviewer will like/allow the idea.

 

In fact, I am personally becoming less enchanted...since there is no real reason to do this other than 'I wanted to'.

[+ADKer]

 

Thank you! Very cool! And the reviewer didn't really have any problems? (I don't know much Finnish!)

 

HA HA! Nice pun there.

 

Please be aware that a cache published two years ago in Finland does not mean your reviewer will like/allow the idea.

 

In fact, I am personally becoming less enchanted...since there is no real reason to do this other than 'I wanted to'.

Well, I mean, the cache mentioned above COULD be accessed year round, but the owner chose not to.

[AZcachemeister]

 

Well, I mean, the cache mentioned above COULD be accessed year round, but the owner chose not to.

 

True.

That cache is basically a back-handed ALR cache that forces us to 'swim' in a lake with ice-floes.

The CO is insisting you have that experience, and having the experience is the reason for the seasonal availability.

 

You could say you want people to have the experience of digging through a snowbank to find your 'winter only' cache, but you yourself state you have gone out and found the 'winter friendly' caches in the summertime rather than saving them for winter so you could have the fun of digging through a snowbank. Why is that?

 

In any case, you need to ask your reviewer what they think of the idea.

[+Don_J]

 

Thank you! Very cool! And the reviewer didn't really have any problems? (I don't know much Finnish!)

 

HA HA! Nice pun there.

 

Please be aware that a cache published two years ago in Finland does not mean your reviewer will like/allow the idea.

 

In fact, I am personally becoming less enchanted...since there is no real reason to do this other than 'I wanted to'.

 

That's where I'm at.

 

What I'm getting is that the OP went out and found all of the "available in winter" caches before winter, then didn't have any caches to find during the winter. He somehow thinks that this is a problem for everyone so he wants to fix it by making a winter only cache that can't be found in the summer because he's going to disable the listing and remove the cache. It's a solution in search of a problem, with the result being that a cache is disable for 2/3rd of the year for no real reason.

 

Mother Nature and local land use policies do not compare with what is suggested, so I'm kind of surprised that everyone keeps offering these as examples.

[+The_Incredibles_]

I can't believe I read the thread wrong. Must have been tired.

 

Even if the reviewer approves it, switching containers and moving the coordinates twice a year seems like too much fuss for 1 smilie, I mean cache.

 

If your area is cache-poor, how about focusing on putting more caches out, perhaps 1/month winter AND summer. That way your fellow cachers will have new caches to find in winter.

[+SwineFlew]

Here is a winter only cache.

 

http://coord.info/GC3F56

 

And here is a summer cache in the same general area.

 

http://coord.info/GC65CF

[+ADKer]

 

It's a solution in search of a problem, with the result being that a cache is disable for 2/3rd of the year for no real reason.

 

 

First of all, it would be more like 1/3rd of the year around here.

 

Second, my worrying about finding all the winter accessible caches was only the reason that I though of something like this in the first place. Now it has evolved into simply wanting to have a unique cache.

[AZcachemeister]

Here is a winter only cache.

 

http://coord.info/GC3F56

 

And here is a summer cache in the same general area.

 

http://coord.info/GC65CF

 

Both of those are apparently 'doable' in the 'off-season'...at least according to the logs.

Certainly easier in the intended season, but not disabled or removed.

[+ADKer]

Here is a winter only cache.

 

http://coord.info/GC3F56

 

And here is a summer cache in the same general area.

 

http://coord.info/GC65CF

 

Both of those are apparently 'doable' in the 'off-season'...at least according to the logs.

Certainly easier in the intended season, but not disabled or removed.

 

Yes, I do agree with you there. That isn't what I had in mind for my cache.

[+Don_J]

Here is a winter only cache.

 

http://coord.info/GC3F56

 

And here is a summer cache in the same general area.

 

http://coord.info/GC65CF

 

Didn't you once post a NA on a winter only virtual cache?

[+ADKer]

Here is a winter only cache.

 

http://coord.info/GC3F56

 

And here is a summer cache in the same general area.

 

http://coord.info/GC65CF

 

Didn't you once post a NA on a winter only virtual cache?

 

Who me?

[+Don_J]

Here is a winter only cache.

 

http://coord.info/GC3F56

 

And here is a summer cache in the same general area.

 

http://coord.info/GC65CF

 

Didn't you once post a NA on a winter only virtual cache?

 

Who me?

No. Edited August 26, 2013 by Don_J

[+SwineFlew]

Here is a winter only cache.

 

http://coord.info/GC3F56

 

And here is a summer cache in the same general area.

 

http://coord.info/GC65CF

 

Didn't you once post a NA on a winter only virtual cache?

No... wasnt me.

[+Fugads]

Not winter related really, but relevant to the discussion. A local here in Southern NM made a cache in the middle of the Rio Grande, GC2TAC2. The idea was for people to have to wade across the water to get to a little island. However, the Rio Grande here get's "turned off" in winter so most of the year you could just walk across the sand and get the cache easily. The first year of this cache, the CO actually had the cache archived once the water stopped flowing. He then got it un-archived the next year. He has since stopped doing this and the cache has become easy to find for most the year (although he also brought the Terrain rating down. Not sure why exactly he stopped doing this, maybe it just felt like too much work). It sounds like you are wanting to do something similar, where the cache is simply made off-limits for part of the year. I suppose if the Reviewer is good with it, go for it. What's the worst that could happen you don't get your cache published and have to remove the container (or simply change the listing until it can be accepted)?