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What Irks you most?

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Having someone come by and archive your cache for no reason. No contact attempted with CO nothing. Just a note Archived for being in restricted area. When the area it is in is clearly not in the restricted category on geocaching.com.

 

Or

 

Having cache reviewers that make up rules as they go. Then contact cache owners and DEMAND they remove over 50% of their caches because this new made up rule now applies.

 

1. If a reviewer is notified that a cache may be on private property without permission, or in a restricted area, they will error on the side of caution and usually archive it. That is your notice. If you have permission for the cache, just notify the reviewer and they will un-archive it.

 

2. Can you elaborate on this new made up rule that only applies to your area?

Edited by Don_J

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Having someone come by and archive your cache for no reason. No contact attempted with CO nothing. Just a note Archived for being in restricted area. When the area it is in is clearly not in the restricted category on geocaching.com.

 

 

Oh, I see what's going on. GC1X4WN.

FWIW, your cache was not archived by a volunteer reviewer but by an actual Groundspeak employee from headquarters, obviously in response to a complaint from the last finder.

 

You should start a new topic on this as it indicates a departure from the normal "pretend we don't see it" attitude. If this were to be enforced across the board, Groundspeak would have to revise their total active caches number substantially.

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Having cache reviewers that make up rules as they go. Then contact cache owners and DEMAND they remove over 50% of their caches because this new made up rule now applies.
Are you sure this "made up rule" isn't a land owner policy that is more restrictive than Groundspeak's guidelines? I've read park policies that require caches to be .25 mile (or further) apart. And I've seen parks change policies and NOT grandfather existing caches.

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What I hate the most is cache owners who make little effort to maintain them.

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Ignored calls for maintenance. I don't mean I need INSTANT satisfaction, but within a few months caches should be fixed or archived. In my area there are 2 that I know are gone because I've found them before and I used them to teach friends about geocaching. (And yes, I searched surrounding areas, they are gone.) I've sent NM notes and nothing. Just replace it or archive it. These caches are hogging up awesome spots for caches. I've even emailed on person and offered to take over the cache. (It's an adorable large cache at a nearby park, perfect for kids.) Anyway...that's my big fat gripe.

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Mass placement with copy and paste descriptions, okay you have placed 100+ caches on a long walk, 99% are micro, the result is coordinates that are not averaged, so you have to use the hint, that ends up being "base", or "left hand side" on the ones when the coordinates are really bad.

CO logging their own cache, or just being a member of a team "finding" those caches err sorry you know where the caches is meant to be just explain to me how you found it again.

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Ignored calls for maintenance. I don't mean I need INSTANT satisfaction, but within a few months caches should be fixed or archived. In my area there are 2 that I know are gone because I've found them before and I used them to teach friends about geocaching. (And yes, I searched surrounding areas, they are gone.) I've sent NM notes and nothing. Just replace it or archive it. These caches are hogging up awesome spots for caches. I've even emailed on person and offered to take over the cache. (It's an adorable large cache at a nearby park, perfect for kids.) Anyway...that's my big fat gripe.

Log it as needs archiving as it does.

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Point is a few people are "irked" by thse that get puzzle solutions from others ,some even call it cheating. The point of a puzzle is to figure out the final coordinates, what difference does it make how I figure thm out?

 

If I use logic and figure out the final based on what's posted on the cache page by the CO but don't solve the puzzle, did I cheat?

 

If I use posted logs to figure out the coordinates, did I cheat?

 

If the co gives me a hint, did I cheat?

 

If a friend gives me a hint, did I cheat?

 

If either walk e through solving it, dd I cheat?

 

If the answer to any is no then getting the coordinates can not be cheating either as I just "solved the puzzle" my own way, but what irks me is COs that think they have a right to tell me how I have to solve their puzzle.

As the owner of puzzle caches (and am planning more) I am finding this interesting, IMO if you find my caches well done, how you solved it does not bother me. I like puzzles I have solved a few near me that I have not gone and got the cache as they are away from my normal routes but I will pick them up at some point. They also have a uses put a cache is a location and you get a mad rush to get the FTF, also a cache will bring more people than normal to a spot this has an impact on the location, a good puzzle will slow that.

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I still remember looking for a missing LPC at a grocery story when this geocacher drove up. He said the cache was missing and went on to tell me about his day. He apparently had found a cache in four or five different states that day and had completed his grid or something. He then told me he lived in the area and had thousands of geocache finds. I got all excited thinking that with this guy's vast experience, he must have some awesome hides of himself close by. Nada, he had never hidden a single cache. I logged the DNF and drove home.

 

So yeah, it slightly irks me that are some folks that find thousands of caches every year, yet apparently don't have the time to hide and maintain a single cache of their own.

 

Try giving a little back to the game instead of making it all about you and your geocaching accomplishents IMO.

 

I'm personally more impressed by the guy that hides one awesome/legendary cache than the guy that finds 10,000 caches in a year. The previous requires real thought, the latter just requires time.

 

I'd rather someone just carried on finding caches than starting leaving unimaginative hides just because of some convention that they were expected to hide even if they didn't really want to.

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Clues that refer to "left side of path" are really useless given the CO can't know which way I'm walking along the path.

 

Clues that say "ivy covered tree" when the cache is a micro and all you can see for hundreds of yards in all directions is endless ivy covered trees.

 

Micros hidden in ivy covered trees.

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This was probably mentioned already but i'll state it again.

 

Cachers who whine that a cache is either physically or mentally too hard. We need to remember that we're not owed a smiley on every cache that gets placed!

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And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

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And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

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Clues that refer to "left side of path" are really useless given the CO can't know which way I'm walking along the path.

 

Clues that say "ivy covered tree" when the cache is a micro and all you can see for hundreds of yards in all directions is endless ivy covered trees.

 

Micros hidden in ivy covered trees.

You're not visiting the same caches as I have recently have you or is this a common thing. Oh and it is annoying very annoying.

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And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

I can make the same argument about power trails, except that in the case of a PT, they take up a *lot* more real estate than a handful of puzzle caches, and unlike puzzle caches I can't ignore dozens if not hundreds of email notifications for each cache in the PT.

 

 

 

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]

 

And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

I can make the same argument about power trails, except that in the case of a PT, they take up a *lot* more real estate than a handful of puzzle caches, and unlike puzzle caches I can't ignore dozens if not hundreds of email notifications for each cache in the PT.

 

 

To me, it's not an either/or they are both irksome.

 

What also irks me is the dismissive phrase "Simply ignore them if you don't like them."

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]

 

And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

I can make the same argument about power trails, except that in the case of a PT, they take up a *lot* more real estate than a handful of puzzle caches, and unlike puzzle caches I can't ignore dozens if not hundreds of email notifications for each cache in the PT.

 

But you know where the power trails are. How can you tell me to ignore a hidden waypoint if I don't know where it is. If I want to hide a cache in an area that is saturated with hidden waypoints, I CAN'T ignore them! My argument is not that puzzles are taking up too much space but that we don't know what space they are taking up.

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other then the mentioned irks.. i would have to say the spelling either on the cache pages or the responses from emails. When its on the page and its just a word, thats fine, but a ton of mistakes make me want to ignore. Also, a few times i have asked for a hint or a nudge in the right direction of the puzzle. then, with the answer i get back, i cant even make out what they are trying to say giving me more of a headache.

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]

 

And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

I can make the same argument about power trails, except that in the case of a PT, they take up a *lot* more real estate than a handful of puzzle caches, and unlike puzzle caches I can't ignore dozens if not hundreds of email notifications for each cache in the PT.

 

 

To me, it's not an either/or they are both irksome.

 

What also irks me is the dismissive phrase "Simply ignore them if you don't like them."

 

Yes, I was pretty much through with this thread, but that phrase set me off again because it shows a basic failure to understand the issue.

 

The thing is, there is no easy solution for puzzle saturation but there are several measures that GS could take to allow people to ignore power trails, (attributes, ignore by user), but they don't seem interested in helping out their users.

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Deadly sin would be not maintaing your puzzle cache. Nothing like getting to the end of it and finding an empty container with no lid. If your going to take the time to hide and post it the least you can do is make sure it's still there and in good condition. If not give it up for adoption.

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]

 

And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

I can make the same argument about power trails, except that in the case of a PT, they take up a *lot* more real estate than a handful of puzzle caches, and unlike puzzle caches I can't ignore dozens if not hundreds of email notifications for each cache in the PT.

 

 

To me, it's not an either/or they are both irksome.

 

What also irks me is the dismissive phrase "Simply ignore them if you don't like them."

 

To be honest, i don't usually like to use a phrase like that either. But in this case, i think it works. Yes, a puzzle's final can be in the way of another cache. Let's be honest though, how often does that happen? Actually, it's the same as any other type of cache that is placed there that you don't care for.

 

I don't like power trails myself and i can see them causing way more problems than puzzles. But i don't worry about them either. They were there first and i can simply ignore them if i want. :D

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And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

I can make the same argument about power trails, except that in the case of a PT, they take up a *lot* more real estate than a handful of puzzle caches, and unlike puzzle caches I can't ignore dozens if not hundreds of email notifications for each cache in the PT.

 

 

To me, it's not an either/or they are both irksome.

 

What also irks me is the dismissive phrase "Simply ignore them if you don't like them."

 

Yes, I was pretty much through with this thread, but that phrase set me off again because it shows a basic failure to understand the issue.

 

The thing is, there is no easy solution for puzzle saturation but there are several measures that GS could take to allow people to ignore power trails, (attributes, ignore by user), but they don't seem interested in helping out their users.

 

I don't see any basic failure to understand the issue. What issue? You don't like puzzles and you think they should go away. That's easy enough to figure out. Sounds to me like you are trying to tell others how the game should be played.

 

The phrase works in this instance, with regards to a cache type. In this case, ignore those ? marks, and you're done. Much much easier than trying to figure out how to exclude power trails, lpcs, and guardrails.

 

Hey, i did just think of something. Is your area really saturated with puzzle caches? I've seen areas with more than the normal but i've never been to an area that was saturated. If this is actually the case, then i can see where your area might have more problems with proximity issues than the norm.

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I still remember looking for a missing LPC at a grocery story when this geocacher drove up. He said the cache was missing and went on to tell me about his day. He apparently had found a cache in four or five different states that day and had completed his grid or something. He then told me he lived in the area and had thousands of geocache finds. I got all excited thinking that with this guy's vast experience, he must have some awesome hides of himself close by. Nada, he had never hidden a single cache. I logged the DNF and drove home.

 

So yeah, it slightly irks me that are some folks that find thousands of caches every year, yet apparently don't have the time to hide and maintain a single cache of their own.

 

Try giving a little back to the game instead of making it all about you and your geocaching accomplishents IMO.

 

I'm personally more impressed by the guy that hides one awesome/legendary cache than the guy that finds 10,000 caches in a year. The previous requires real thought, the latter just requires time.

 

I'd rather someone just carried on finding caches than starting leaving unimaginative hides just because of some convention that they were expected to hide even if they didn't really want to.

 

So you've found 2,000 caches and can't come up with something? If maintenance is an issue, try hiding an ammo can in a remote location. No maintenance required. Indeed, we've had ammo can caches abandoned by their owner back in 2004 that are still holding up just fine. Besides, if you actually took the time to hide a cache, I think you'd find it to be quite rewarding.

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I still remember looking for a missing LPC at a grocery story when this geocacher drove up. He said the cache was missing and went on to tell me about his day. He apparently had found a cache in four or five different states that day and had completed his grid or something. He then told me he lived in the area and had thousands of geocache finds. I got all excited thinking that with this guy's vast experience, he must have some awesome hides of himself close by. Nada, he had never hidden a single cache. I logged the DNF and drove home.

 

So yeah, it slightly irks me that are some folks that find thousands of caches every year, yet apparently don't have the time to hide and maintain a single cache of their own.

 

Try giving a little back to the game instead of making it all about you and your geocaching accomplishents IMO.

 

I'm personally more impressed by the guy that hides one awesome/legendary cache than the guy that finds 10,000 caches in a year. The previous requires real thought, the latter just requires time.

 

I'd rather someone just carried on finding caches than starting leaving unimaginative hides just because of some convention that they were expected to hide even if they didn't really want to.

 

So you've found 2,000 caches and can't come up with something? If maintenance is an issue, try hiding an ammo can in a remote location. No maintenance required. Indeed, we've had ammo can caches abandoned by their owner back in 2004 that are still holding up just fine. Besides, if you actually took the time to hide a cache, I think you'd find it to be quite rewarding.

I'll have to side with Team Tisri on this one. Folks should hide caches when they are ready to hide caches, not when they get guilted into it. No good can come from forcing someone who does not currently wish to become a cache owner. The only realistic result of compelling those who are not ready is crappy caches. For me, I'd rather see someone with 50,000 finds and zero hides, than some arbitrary number of finds and even one unwanted hide.

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And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

I can make the same argument about power trails, except that in the case of a PT, they take up a *lot* more real estate than a handful of puzzle caches, and unlike puzzle caches I can't ignore dozens if not hundreds of email notifications for each cache in the PT.

 

 

To me, it's not an either/or they are both irksome.

 

What also irks me is the dismissive phrase "Simply ignore them if you don't like them."

 

Yes, I was pretty much through with this thread, but that phrase set me off again because it shows a basic failure to understand the issue.

 

The thing is, there is no easy solution for puzzle saturation but there are several measures that GS could take to allow people to ignore power trails, (attributes, ignore by user), but they don't seem interested in helping out their users.

 

I don't see any basic failure to understand the issue. What issue? You don't like puzzles and you think they should go away. That's easy enough to figure out. Sounds to me like you are trying to tell others how the game should be played.

 

The phrase works in this instance, with regards to a cache type. In this case, ignore those ? marks, and you're done. Much much easier than trying to figure out how to exclude power trails, lpcs, and guardrails.

 

Hey, i did just think of something. Is your area really saturated with puzzle caches? I've seen areas with more than the normal but i've never been to an area that was saturated. If this is actually the case, then i can see where your area might have more problems with proximity issues than the norm.

 

Your first paragraph is incorrect and it seems that you are confusing me with someone else. Your second paragraph shows that you really do not understand my side of the issue. The third paragraph shows that you might be starting to understand.

 

I don't hate puzzles and I don't want them to go away. That's someone else. I used to simply ignore puzzles as they were few and far between. The chances of placing a cache and then finding that you were too close to a hidden waypoint was very small. Then, a guy showed up a couple of years ago and started hiding a lot of them not to far from me, like about 75 in a three-four square mile area. Many of these are almost impossible for the average person to solve, (I've managed 6). So, because of this, by ignoring the puzzles, I am also forced to accept the fact that it is next to impossible for me to hide a cache in that area. Cool, I accepted that long ago, but I keep seeing people posting to the forum about having the same problem and when I look at the areas they are caching in, the map is overwhelmingly blue. It looks like if you live in one of those areas, you are either solve the puzzles, or you don't hide caches. It shouldn't be necessary to find all of the caches in an area before you can hide one, but when the puzzle saturation is approaching 50% in a metro area, it practically is.

 

With a power trail, you can walk 528' away from it and place a cache. You do not have to find the location of the power trail first because it is freely available.

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I hate it when people hide a MICRO in the middle of the WOODS!!!!! WHY???? There are tons on spots for ammo cans... WHY HIDE A STINKIN EVIL NANO????!!!!!!

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And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

I can make the same argument about power trails, except that in the case of a PT, they take up a *lot* more real estate than a handful of puzzle caches, and unlike puzzle caches I can't ignore dozens if not hundreds of email notifications for each cache in the PT.

 

 

To me, it's not an either/or they are both irksome.

 

What also irks me is the dismissive phrase "Simply ignore them if you don't like them."

 

Yes, I was pretty much through with this thread, but that phrase set me off again because it shows a basic failure to understand the issue.

 

The thing is, there is no easy solution for puzzle saturation but there are several measures that GS could take to allow people to ignore power trails, (attributes, ignore by user), but they don't seem interested in helping out their users.

 

I don't see any basic failure to understand the issue. What issue? You don't like puzzles and you think they should go away. That's easy enough to figure out. Sounds to me like you are trying to tell others how the game should be played.

 

The phrase works in this instance, with regards to a cache type. In this case, ignore those ? marks, and you're done. Much much easier than trying to figure out how to exclude power trails, lpcs, and guardrails.

 

Hey, i did just think of something. Is your area really saturated with puzzle caches? I've seen areas with more than the normal but i've never been to an area that was saturated. If this is actually the case, then i can see where your area might have more problems with proximity issues than the norm.

 

Your first paragraph is incorrect and it seems that you are confusing me with someone else. Your second paragraph shows that you really do not understand my side of the issue. The third paragraph shows that you might be starting to understand.

 

I don't hate puzzles and I don't want them to go away. That's someone else. I used to simply ignore puzzles as they were few and far between. The chances of placing a cache and then finding that you were too close to a hidden waypoint was very small. Then, a guy showed up a couple of years ago and started hiding a lot of them not to far from me, like about 75 in a three-four square mile area. Many of these are almost impossible for the average person to solve, (I've managed 6). So, because of this, by ignoring the puzzles, I am also forced to accept the fact that it is next to impossible for me to hide a cache in that area. Cool, I accepted that long ago, but I keep seeing people posting to the forum about having the same problem and when I look at the areas they are caching in, the map is overwhelmingly blue. It looks like if you live in one of those areas, you are either solve the puzzles, or you don't hide caches. It shouldn't be necessary to find all of the caches in an area before you can hide one, but when the puzzle saturation is approaching 50% in a metro area, it practically is.

 

With a power trail, you can walk 528' away from it and place a cache. You do not have to find the location of the power trail first because it is freely available.

 

Yep, it does sound like your area is not average at all. I can see that it could be frustrating at times when trying to hide new caches. The cacher that hid the 75 had a right to hide them but i'll be honest and say that it would have been nice if he would have thought about the potential problems that many could cause.

 

My argument goes along with what i call typical areas that are more saturated with traditional park and grabs. The puzzles are fewer in these places and a person can ignore the ones they don't want to or can't solve. They can get in the way of new cache placement but it happens less frequently.

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And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

I can make the same argument about power trails, except that in the case of a PT, they take up a *lot* more real estate than a handful of puzzle caches, and unlike puzzle caches I can't ignore dozens if not hundreds of email notifications for each cache in the PT.

 

But you know where the power trails are. How can you tell me to ignore a hidden waypoint if I don't know where it is. If I want to hide a cache in an area that is saturated with hidden waypoints, I CAN'T ignore them! My argument is not that puzzles are taking up too much space but that we don't know what space they are taking up.

 

I don't know where a power trail is until after it's published and has put 200 messages in my mail inbox and cluttered up my pocket queries. I don't see a lot of places that are saturated with hidden waypoints because puzzle caches, in general, are far less common that the number of caches are showing up as part of a power trail or series.

 

 

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One of the things that irks me is log books that are too small to write my Story of the Find in them. This means that there is nothing for me to read when I do find the cache. I enjoy reading what others have gone through to get the container, but I rarely, if ever read the on line description or logs.

 

I accept the fact that this is my own fault.

Edited by tomowens

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Okay. I have decided. What irks me the most is throw downs. "I'm too special to ever DNF a cache." "I looked twelve seconds and did not find, so I tossed down a film canister to replace your ammo can, that is probably still there." "Hurricane Sandy washed your cache away. So, I'll replace the large Lock and Lock with a bison tube. That way you don't have to replace it, and I get my Found It!" "I didn't look too hard, so I put a replacement in a spot your cache could never be. That way I get my find. Who cares if there are now two caches here?"

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People incessantly complaining about iPhone loggers. I was not as good about writing thorough logs when I started as I am today. However, I do all of my caching from the iPhone as well as my logging. I try to VERY rarely write a simple log or a tftc as my log. Sometimes though, I look at a cache and there is little to say other than, "hey... Thanks for putting that there I guess... " Furthermore, I think I am more likely to write a long log when I am there in the heat of the moment really appreciating the cache. I'm just saying that if you get a whole ton of tftcs, rather than coming to the forums and whining about iPhone loggers, take a long hard look at your cache and ask yourself, is there much more to say?

 

Sent from my iPhone.

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Cache owners who don't delete the logs of those throwdowns, perpetuating the problem instead of working to end it.

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What would you consider a Deadly Sin in geocaching? What irks you most? I'm compiling a list for an event...

 

People jamming swag into micro or mini containers like match containers or magnetic keyholders.

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A true story: I'm new to this area, caching has introduced me to some cool spots I would have missed otherwise. The other day we went looking for a "small" my gps led me to a cul-de-sac, at the end of a street there were woods, so I (thinking the owner would know what was up) parked and entered through a trail, I come out the other side... In the back of a sports field in a school. GPS led me thru that to an assisted living facility, I walked through all their "recreation area" to the parking lot in the front, to find a pill bottle in a lamp skirt! When we finally went back to the car, we see... A freaking cop! The landowner was mad as heck, I was embarrassed, the kids were scared. I understand this is sometimes the fun part, maybe in a secluded area but a hint like "don't go through a residential area" would have really helped a lot there :(

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Cache owners who don't delete the logs of those throwdowns, perpetuating the problem instead of working to end it.

 

My only ever throw down on one of my caches (and this was in like 2007) was from someone on their first day of caching, with a Nuvi plucked off their windshield during the "try Geocaching with your car GPS" craze. Beats the heck out of the "try Geocaching with you smartphone" craze, at least they all went home to computers and wrote more than Tftc for a log. :ph34r:

 

Anyways, it was their first day of caching as I said, and I just checked, and they went on to find three caches, and haven't logged in since 2008. Should I have deleted that log? I think that would make me a really big meanie. Most throwdowners really do think they're doing a good deed.

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A true story: I'm new to this area, caching has introduced me to some cool spots I would have missed otherwise. The other day we went looking for a "small" my gps led me to a cul-de-sac, at the end of a street there were woods, so I (thinking the owner would know what was up) parked and entered through a trail, I come out the other side... In the back of a sports field in a school. GPS led me thru that to an assisted living facility, I walked through all their "recreation area" to the parking lot in the front, to find a pill bottle in a lamp skirt! When we finally went back to the car, we see... A freaking cop! The landowner was mad as heck, I was embarrassed, the kids were scared. I understand this is sometimes the fun part, maybe in a secluded area but a hint like "don't go through a residential area" would have really helped a lot there :(

 

Sounds like you made this park and grab a little harder than you needed to. :lol:

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A true story: I'm new to this area, caching has introduced me to some cool spots I would have missed otherwise. The other day we went looking for a "small" my gps led me to a cul-de-sac, at the end of a street there were woods, so I (thinking the owner would know what was up) parked and entered through a trail, I come out the other side... In the back of a sports field in a school. GPS led me thru that to an assisted living facility, I walked through all their "recreation area" to the parking lot in the front, to find a pill bottle in a lamp skirt! When we finally went back to the car, we see... A freaking cop! The landowner was mad as heck, I was embarrassed, the kids were scared. I understand this is sometimes the fun part, maybe in a secluded area but a hint like "don't go through a residential area" would have really helped a lot there :(

 

Wow, you've been Geocaching 2 days and things irk you already, give it a few months and you'll fit right in with the angry, grumpy oldtimers that are regulars here. :lol:

Edited by Roman!

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A true story: I'm new to this area, caching has introduced me to some cool spots I would have missed otherwise. The other day we went looking for a "small" my gps led me to a cul-de-sac, at the end of a street there were woods, so I (thinking the owner would know what was up) parked and entered through a trail, I come out the other side... In the back of a sports field in a school. GPS led me thru that to an assisted living facility, I walked through all their "recreation area" to the parking lot in the front, to find a pill bottle in a lamp skirt! When we finally went back to the car, we see... A freaking cop! The landowner was mad as heck, I was embarrassed, the kids were scared. I understand this is sometimes the fun part, maybe in a secluded area but a hint like "don't go through a residential area" would have really helped a lot there :(

 

Sounds like you made this park and grab a little harder than you needed to. :lol:

 

Mmmmhmmm...the geocaching app's driving directions can often lead you to the "back" of a park. This happened a couple times and I've learned that if a cache is at the back end of a park the driving directions will often lead me to the house on the OTHER side of the park, leading you to think you have to walk through strange areas, when really...you just have to go over to the next street.

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A true story: I'm new to this area, caching has introduced me to some cool spots I would have missed otherwise. The other day we went looking for a "small" my gps led me to a cul-de-sac, at the end of a street there were woods, so I (thinking the owner would know what was up) parked and entered through a trail, I come out the other side... In the back of a sports field in a school. GPS led me thru that to an assisted living facility, I walked through all their "recreation area" to the parking lot in the front, to find a pill bottle in a lamp skirt! When we finally went back to the car, we see... A freaking cop! The landowner was mad as heck, I was embarrassed, the kids were scared. I understand this is sometimes the fun part, maybe in a secluded area but a hint like "don't go through a residential area" would have really helped a lot there :(

 

Wow, you've been Geocaching 2 days and things irk you already, give it a few months and you'll fit right in with the angry, grumpy oldtimers that are regulars here. :lol:

 

I can't see myself getting to upset over much other than lack of maintenance. I love all the caches I've found. I just hate that so many good spots are on hold because of poor maintenance.

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Most throwdowners really do think they're doing a good deed.

Most throwdowners pretend they are doing a good deed.

No one bright enough to operate a GPSr actually believes it.

Then they use that fallacy to justify not posting a DNF.

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Most throwdowners really do think they're doing a good deed.

Most throwdowners pretend they are doing a good deed.

No one bright enough to operate a GPSr actually believes it.

Then they use that fallacy to justify not posting a DNF.

 

Yeah. I was thinking of a great cache with 11 favorites. Pulley system inside the hollow of a tree.

Did not find the cache. GZ had a great big tree that looks like it was just cut down. Might be gone. Owner should check it out.

A few weeks later:

Based upon the condition of the immediate surroundings and

information in some previous logs, we were fairly certain that

the original cache container was missing, so we replaced it

in a location close to the posted coordinates. TFTH - SL

Great old cache is now a film canister. (Well, didn't last long.)

The only ones they helped ware themselves (to a misbegotten smiley.)

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1. Harming environment by burying/attaching containers or simply not thinking about the Impacts of having a geocache on a decent location. This includes giving bad examples, even when this single cache may be allowed to be in that harmful area or appearance (similar example: bird houses - even if this one is fake, it may train cachers to look in real bird houses and disturb breeding). Giving bad hints ("under a stone" in a stone covered area) may add to this problem.

 

2. Dangerous hides. Power stations are an example. Even camouflaging as potential dangerous hides is irking (i.e. fake power outlets). Don't want to get kids thinking they have to try all power outlets near GZ for possible caches. :(

 

3. Owner requesting maintenance by others. Thats true for a power trail around here ("you have to understand that I can't maintain 100+ film canisters"). If you can't, don't place it.

 

4. Owners not maintaining their cache. Why not archiving or giving it for adoption?

 

5. Throwdowns. If you don't find at least a valid logbook in some container, you simply DNF. Or if you want to betray yourself, log a "Found". But please don't spoil the game for others by dropping something which isn't the intended cache!

 

6. Plastic bags as container protection (never works!) and generally inadequate containers considering the elements. The degenerate and make a mess.

 

7. Anything else to throw a bad light on geocaching: this include caches near children playgrounds, on restricted property etc. as well as cachers not ignoring such spots (if they had the chance) thus causing trouble. Putting irking things in containers (food, smelly/slimy things, ammunition etc.) is part of this.

 

Unfortunately, I have experienced examples for all of the above. :(

 

Regarding #4 and #5:

Actually I'm watching one where we found both, the actual container (dry logbook) and a film canister nearby (wet logbook). We placed them together in one spot near the visible but defective attachment and posted a NM. Even the caches reasoning was gone (a statue, giving the cache name and description). No owner reaction since months, only a plea to remove one of the containers in a owner's note meanwhile far down the log history. However, its fun to warch the incoming comments about two containers in the same place... :)

 

With short logs, fake finds or uninteresting cache locations/descriptions I can cope: that's just laziness or

stupidity and part of human life, at least it doesn't affect others much (simply ignore them). Even wrong container sizes don't take out the overall fun of finding.

 

Just annoying: complaints about "smartphone cachers". Every generalization is wrong. :)

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And yes - it's a matter of personal taste - just like every other aspect of geocaching.

 

If it was a matter of personal taste this thread would not exist, it's about everyone telling everyone else how the game shoud be payed.

 

Hey, i agree with you!

 

People will always have their opinions and if they could, many would try to force them on everyone else. Some of the "irks" in this thread for example,, not liking puzzles are silly to me. This is a situation that everyone pretty much has control over. Simply ignore them if you don't like them.

 

I really think it all comes back to greed. I say this because i know a few people like this. For whatever reason, they believe that they have to find every cache out there. Therefore, all caches need to be placed in a manner they are comfortable with...

 

What irks me is people who simply refuse to understand or accept a valid point of argument. I could give a flying flip about puzzles. You can go and work them to your hearts content. It is the proximity issues that puzzles create, especially when one person has some special need to show the rest of the world how smart he is and saturates an area with impossible so solve puzzles. There is a point where you can't "Simply ignore them if you don't like them".

 

You can ignore them if you don't like them, it just means you might have to travel a bit further to find geocaches you do like.

 

I mostly ignore film pots behind signs which means that my geocaching activity has reduced to almost zero as I live in an urban area where most of the caches out there are film pots and keysafes and a lot of them are behind signs. When I'm further away from home I may take in a nice walk, and some of the caches around the walk might be film pots, but it doesn't have the same sense of futility as cycling from one road junction to another to another to pull another film pot out from behind another piece of street furniture.

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I don't know where a power trail is until after it's published and has put 200 messages in my mail inbox and cluttered up my pocket queries. I don't see a lot of places that are saturated with hidden waypoints because puzzle caches, in general, are far less common that the number of caches are showing up as part of a power trail or series.

 

In my area you don't have to go very far before you stray into areas frequented by a few types of hiders.

 

We've got a few people who hide caches at the tops of tall trees, or down sheer drops and the like. They're given appropriately high terrain ratings - many of them are 5/5 rated although a few have been placed so they can be given a relatively rare rating such as D1/T5 - but there are still a fair few of them. We've got a few other people who set fiendish puzzles, to the point when I see the ? icon and one of their names I usually ignore the cache completely.

 

Ultimately the solution is easy, I ignore the climbing caches and ignore the puzzles I lack the inclination to attempt. It may leave areas effectively off-limits but it's not as if there's any obligation to find every single one.

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Cache owners who have no intention of maintaining their caches.

 

If an issue arises, they just archive it (and probably go out to place three new ones the next day).

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Cache owners who have no intention of maintaining their caches.

 

If an issue arises, they just archive it (and probably go out to place three new ones the next day).

Locally, the ones who hide caches they never intend to maintain wait for the NMs to pile up, disable it, ignore it till a Reviewer archives it, and hide 30 new ones the next day.

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Cache owners who have no intention of maintaining their caches.

 

If an issue arises, they just archive it (and probably go out to place three new ones the next day).

Locally, the ones who hide caches they never intend to maintain wait for the NMs to pile up, disable it, ignore it till a Reviewer archives it, and hide 30 new ones the next day.

 

Take that a step further. Ones that hide caches almost like a young tagger with a can of spray paint and then ignore ALL notifications on the caches, even those from the reviewer saying that the cache needs attention and will be archived in 30 days if you don't respond. Same cacher will drive .1mi down the road past one of their missing caches that is on a 30 warning and hide an identical cache.

 

If the reviewer is archiving one of your caches on the same day that you are hiding a new one, you're playing the game wrong. I personally would hang my head in shame if a reviewer had to archive one of my caches because I didn't respond to the notifications on it.

Edited by Don_J

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If the reviewer is archiving one of your caches on the same day that you are hiding a new one, your playing the game wrong.

 

I would like to see such people blocked from hiding new caches or at least given a stern warning from the reviewer next time they submit a cache. These people have an illness (compulsive cache hiding) and need professional help.

 

We've got someone here who 1)archived a cache hidden under a bench 2) hid a new cache under the same bench, centimeters away 3)left the old cache in place. One of the finders of the new cache retrieved the old cache and gave it back to her. :blink:

Edited by The_Incredibles_

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I personally would hang my head in shame if a reviewer had to archive one of my caches because I didn't respond to the notifications on it.

Yeah, me too. Unfortunately, one of the local numbers hiders feel they are contributing more to the community by spewing out 30 more crappy caches that they refuse to maintain, than by fixing the ones they have already had published. The numbers seekers agree with him, so his attitude is empowered, thus ensuring that the behavior will not change.

 

Yet another argument for an 'Ignore All Hides By User X' feature...

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