Waypoint averages

[+McNew]

I have a very rough understanding on the waypoint averaging thing. but not on how it works. I just want to avoid placing a cache with bad coordinates. (for the record I cache on my iPhone.)

 

Could someone explain (step by step) how I manually average waypoints (as I don't think there is a way to do it automatically on iphone). I just don't quite understand, exactly how this process works and I think a dumbed down explanation would help me out a lot.

 

(I tried searching the forums, didn't quite find what I was looking for, if this thread already exists, I apologize, could I get a link please?)

[+The_Incredibles_]

For example,

 

Say you take 4 readings.

 

N 48 23.456 W 123 25.678

N 48 23.457 W 123 25.679

N 48 23.450 W 123 25.670

N 48 23.462 W 123 25.666

 

Ok, so for the northing

 

1) add 23.456 + 23.457 + 23.450 + 23.462 = 93.825

 

2)divide by 4 -> 93.825 divided by 4 = 23.456

 

So your averaged northing is N 48 23.456

 

Do the same for the westing

[+Chief301]

Or, download a free app called Perfect Mark, which will do the averaging for you. Unless you really just want to brush up on your math skills

 

Whichever method you choose, when you take a reading, just set the phone down and step back for a couple of minutes....let it settle down and get a good fix before saving the reading (also prevents your body from blocking the satellite signal). I would recommend getting 3 or 4 readings, and preferably on a couple of different days and at different times (to minimize any slight variations due to relative positions of the satellites, atmospheric conditions, etc. )

 

When you have a good set of averaged coordinates, try to navigate to them as though you are navigating to the cache. Do this a couple of times, from different directions. If you are consistently brought within about 10 feet or so of the hide, you should be good to go!

Edited May 10, 2013 by Chief301

[+McNew]

For example,

 

Say you take 4 readings.

 

N 48 23.456 W 123 25.678

N 48 23.457 W 123 25.679

N 48 23.450 W 123 25.670

N 48 23.462 W 123 25.666

 

Ok, so for the northing

 

1) add 23.456 + 23.457 + 23.450 + 23.462 = 93.825

 

2)divide by 4 -> 93.825 divided by 4 = 23.456

 

So your averaged northing is N 48 23.456

 

Do the same for the westing

 

I guess one of the things I am missing here is, am I placing the waypoint on the spot of the cache? When I place the waypoint, do I place it by standing at the location I am placing, or somehow remotely?

[+The_Incredibles_]

Yes, you need to be standing next to the cache when you take your waypoints.

[+McNew]

Yes, you need to be standing next to the cache when you take your waypoints.

 

This makes much more sense now.

[+TeamRabbitRun]

Thank you for asking this question and insisting on very simple, clear, practical and non-technical answer.

And thank the rest of you for the simple, clear answers.

[+Markwell]

I used to have a section in my FAQ on averaging waypoints, and then I was corrected by quite a few posters - knowledgeable ones. I also did some deep thought into the process as well.

 

It's great that we all want to get as accurate of readings as possible, but averaging within a couple of minutes is not likely to improve a set of coordinates.

Ask yourself: Why would I average the coordinates?

Likely answer: what if the readings are wrong?

 

These devices are pretty darn accurate. With WAAS turned on, I've seen these devices get people within 10 feet of a container. But occasionally they do get bad readings (here's some wiki reading on why). Most of the reasons have to do with a loss of a satellite signal. But even then, it's not likely that the signal is going to be really off for multiple times.

 

My current thinking for coordinates for a new cache:

GOOD: Set your GPS down at the cache site, and leave it there for 5 minutes. Most GPS units now have "auto averaging" to try to get the best reading possible.

BETTER: Do the first one. Walk away from the cache (maybe back to the car?). Then walk back to the cache and repeat the first one.

EVEN BETTER: Do the first two. Go home. A week later, go back to the cache and repeat the first two. THEN average if you must.

 

I wouldn't worry about the second and third levels unless people tell you that this cache (or all of your caches) have bad coordinates.

Edited May 11, 2013 by Markwell

[+fizzymagic]

Ok, so for the northing

...

Do the same for the westing

 

I'm really not trying to get on your case, but I am genuinely interested in something.

 

I recently saw "northing" and "westing" used in this same way on a couple of caches near Reno, NV. I had never seen it anywhere before, and never again until I saw your post.

 

Where did you get that terminology from?

 

I should add that the usage is incorrect. "Northing" and "easting" are used in UTM coordinates because the axes do not point exactly north and east. But latitude and longitude are exactly defined, so correct terminology would be "north coordinate" and "west coordinate."

 

But mostly I am curious about the origin of this usage.

[+The A-Team]

But mostly I am curious about the origin of this usage.

I can't explain for sure how that usage came about, but I may have a possible explanation.

A prolific cache-hiding team from the early years of caching placed lots of complex puzzles in this region. Almost all of them use UTM for the calculations, which, as you mentioned, use northing and easting. I wonder if the many UTM-centric caches, alongside lots of lat/lon caches, eventually led to the two systems of terminology combining?

Just a theory.

[+The_Incredibles_]

Ok, so for the northing

...

Do the same for the westing

 

I'm really not trying to get on your case, but I am genuinely interested in something.

 

I recently saw "northing" and "westing" used in this same way on a couple of caches near Reno, NV. I had never seen it anywhere before, and never again until I saw your post.

 

Where did you get that terminology from?

 

I should add that the usage is incorrect. "Northing" and "easting" are used in UTM coordinates because the axes do not point exactly north and east. But latitude and longitude are exactly defined, so correct terminology would be "north coordinate" and "west coordinate."

 

But mostly I am curious about the origin of this usage.

 

Dunno, just saw it on some Team caches here.

[+geofry25]

Morning, instead of starting another thread on the same subject I hope it's Ok if I "hijack" This one. I hid my first cache yesterday. It's on an island in the middle of a local river. It's small, maybe 300 ft x 200 ft. Maybe I should have read a little more in averaging and understood that my Oregon had the feature, etc but I didn't. I used the reposition here feature like a dozen times over the course of 10 minutes. I get it,not ideal but consisering the location ,this little island, will this suffice? Looking forward to hiding more and being as creative and specific as possible with future hides.

[AZcachemeister]

Ok, so for the northing

...

Do the same for the westing

 

I'm really not trying to get on your case, but I am genuinely interested in something.

 

I recently saw "northing" and "westing" used in this same way on a couple of caches near Reno, NV. I had never seen it anywhere before, and never again until I saw your post.

 

Where did you get that terminology from?

 

I should add that the usage is incorrect. "Northing" and "easting" are used in UTM coordinates because the axes do not point exactly north and east. But latitude and longitude are exactly defined, so correct terminology would be "north coordinate" and "west coordinate."

 

But mostly I am curious about the origin of this usage.

 

I noticed that, too...but decided not to be pedantic...this time.

 

The OP DID ask to have it explained as if they were an idiot, and an idiot wouldn't know what latitude or longitude is...but they CAN see the 'N' and the 'W' in front of the numbers.

 

So, in a way it does make sense if you don't want to go too much in depth about latitude and longitude.

[+The_Incredibles_]

Morning, instead of starting another thread on the same subject I hope it's Ok if I "hijack" This one. I hid my first cache yesterday. It's on an island in the middle of a local river. It's small, maybe 300 ft x 200 ft. Maybe I should have read a little more in averaging and understood that my Oregon had the feature, etc but I didn't. I used the reposition here feature like a dozen times over the course of 10 minutes. I get it,not ideal but consisering the location ,this little island, will this suffice? Looking forward to hiding more and being as creative and specific as possible with future hides.

 

Well, if there aren't many trees or steep slopes or rock walls where you were standing, 1 reading would probably be enough. You can always add a good hint if you're worried and anyway, people finding your cache will let you know if your coordinates are off.

[+The_Incredibles_]

Ok, so for the northing

...

Do the same for the westing

 

I'm really not trying to get on your case, but I am genuinely interested in something.

 

I recently saw "northing" and "westing" used in this same way on a couple of caches near Reno, NV. I had never seen it anywhere before, and never again until I saw your post.

 

Where did you get that terminology from?

 

I should add that the usage is incorrect. "Northing" and "easting" are used in UTM coordinates because the axes do not point exactly north and east. But latitude and longitude are exactly defined, so correct terminology would be "north coordinate" and "west coordinate."

 

But mostly I am curious about the origin of this usage.

 

I noticed that, too...but decided not to be pedantic...this time.

 

The OP DID ask to have it explained as if they were an idiot, and an idiot wouldn't know what latitude or longitude is...but they CAN see the 'N' and the 'W' in front of the numbers.

 

So, in a way it does make sense if you don't want to go too much in depth about latitude and longitude.

 

Thanks for setting me straight, even if it is annoying. I wouldn't want to be ignorant forever.