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Shouldn't we as members expect a lot more from the Groundspeak team


geralduscambrensis

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A member of Geocaching.com retrieved and logged a very special, to me, TB on the 13th November 2012. I have written to the person at least three times asking them to either let me know their plans for the TB, or to get it placed in a cache or return it to my home address. I have had no replies. I can only presume that they are intending to keep the item, safe in the knowledge that I cannot report the theft to the local police because I don't know their locality. Groundspeak originally answered that the trackable was lost. I believed it to have been stolen. Yes they would give information if asked by the police, but if I don't know where the geocaching member lives then I can't contact the police to make a complaint.Is that a Catch 22 or a Cache 22??? It seems to me that joining geocaching.com is a permit to steal any little knickknack that takes ones fancy, tell people you've taken it and thumb their noses at the rightful owners. Surely this is a situation that shouldn't be allowed to continue.Another one of Groundspeak's "mistakes" ?

Edited by geralduscambrensis
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I looked up the TB that I believe you are talking about, and it appears that it was dropped in a cache and went missing after that. Accusing them of stealing the bug is a huge leap in my opinion. Travel bugs, and coins, go missing all the time. They get misplaced, forgotten about in a pocket of a jacket or backpack, dropped in a cache and forgotten, and yes, sometimes they get stolen.

 

Contacting the police about an item that you have left out in the wild seems way overkill. If it was a special watch to you, then it shouldn't be released.

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I looked up the TB that I believe you are talking about, and it appears that it was dropped in a cache and went missing after that. Accusing them of stealing the bug is a huge leap in my opinion. Travel bugs, and coins, go missing all the time. They get misplaced, forgotten about in a pocket of a jacket or backpack, dropped in a cache and forgotten, and yes, sometimes they get stolen.

 

Contacting the police about an item that you have left out in the wild seems way overkill. If it was a special watch to you, then it shouldn't be released.

I completely agree. DON'T send anything out there that you expect to get back. My one and only TB hasn't moved since August 2011. It was only after I released it that my wife informed me the object I used was actually hers. Despite numerous attempts to contact the person holding on to it, I finally gave up. I don't know which hurts more, being frustrated with the lack of response or periodically having my wife remind me about it...sheeesh!

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All TB's will eventually be lost its just a matter of time. After a few of mine had traveled a long way over several years I got them returned to me and retired them.....they still travel but in my vehicle.

Don't release a TB you're not prepared to lose....its really a game to see how long they will last.

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I've only found one TB so far...and I still have it. Yes yes...I'm guilty of hanging on too long. The problem for me is three-fold:

A - When I have it, none of the caches I find are big enough to hold it.

B - When I find caches big enough, I've forgotten to bring it along.

C - I don't usually have enough time to go searching for more than one or two at a time, and usually can't go too far from where I live or work...and then either A or B come into play.

 

Thing is, it goes both ways. I've already email the owner to let them know I plan on - hopefully - including it in a new mystery cache I'm working on...but got no response whatsoever. I think there are plenty of TB owners out there that honestly just don't pay attention anyway. The owner hasn't even logged on in about six weeks, so I don't feel any sense of urgency and I'd prefer to put this thing into a cache that I'm working on that is themed appropriately for the TB I have.

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I truly understand, as I'm sure most of the the TB owners who have lost a TB do, your frustration and even anger at the loss of your TB. (It was the pocket watch, yes?) We've lost about half of the TBs we've sent out, including one that was "collected" right at the very start of it's journey and so gained no miles at all. On the other hand, as another way to look at it, about half of our TBs are still travelling, including one that vanished for almost a year before resurfacing from a forgotten backpack and is back on the road again (so there is some hope, however remote it may be, that yours could reappear someday). How far they go and how long they last is just part of the game as someone already pointed out. There is very little you can do once the TB is set out free to roam. They are subject to the whims of chance and fancy of whoever finds them. I'm really not sure what you expect Groundspeak to be able to do. It is as beyond their control as it is yours. My sincere condolences on your loss though, I hope it doesn't spoil the game too much for you.

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I truly understand, as I'm sure most of the the TB owners who have lost a TB do, your frustration and even anger at the loss of your TB. (It was the pocket watch, yes?) We've lost about half of the TBs we've sent out, including one that was "collected" right at the very start of it's journey and so gained no miles at all. On the other hand, as another way to look at it, about half of our TBs are still travelling, including one that vanished for almost a year before resurfacing from a forgotten backpack and is back on the road again (so there is some hope, however remote it may be, that yours could reappear someday). How far they go and how long they last is just part of the game as someone already pointed out. There is very little you can do once the TB is set out free to roam. They are subject to the whims of chance and fancy of whoever finds them. I'm really not sure what you expect Groundspeak to be able to do. It is as beyond their control as it is yours. My sincere condolences on your loss though, I hope it doesn't spoil the game too much for you.

 

I agree. You can't really blame Groundspeak, especially for a non-official cache.

 

Just keep you fingers crossed, you never know your luck. I had a TB go missing in Australia, to turn up in the UK 10 months later, not in a cache but hung on a fence post and found by chance by a geocacher.

 

This week (here in NZ) I picked up a TB that went missing in Canada 9 months ago.

Edited by Huntleigh
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Nothing creates quite as much angst to Geocaching as trackables. My 11+ years of experience is that about 70% of trackables will disappear from the caching world within a year or two of being put out. At least a quarter of those in the hands of a cacher. Very few survive more than 3 or 4 years of travel but it can. Loss is inevitable.

 

It happens. Get over it.

 

The item may simply be misplaced in a vehicle or house. The 7 year old may have added the trinket to the toy box. Illness may keep a cacher form going out. Weather concerns - etc. I personally have dropped and misplaced a TB before getting back to my car - I grabbed it out of the cache and lost it along the .5 mile trail back to the Jeep. No chance to log it. (I emailed the cache owner)

 

The lesson here is - once set free - do not ever expect to see it again. I just hope somebody finds it useful - or at a minimum, it brings a smile.

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I'm unclear how you relate a missing trackable no one has any control over once it leaves your hand to, 'Another one of Groundspeak's "mistakes" '

- And what exactly do/did you expect from the "Groundspeak Team"?

I for one would be real ticked to find they were giving my personal information to others on request, and as you found out, they don't.

 

Missing trackables happens with all other caching sites. May not hear about it as much, because no one has the numbers of members as this one.

- Threads on missing trackables are created often enough that maybe it could be explained better in the help/getting started sections, but, "There's a chance these will get swiped" probably wouldn't sell many coins/T.B.s .

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Just keep you fingers crossed, you never know your luck. I had a TB go missing in Australia, to turn up in the UK 10 months later, not in a cache but hung on a fence post and found by chance by a geocacher.

 

This week (here in NZ) I picked up a TB that went missing in Canada 9 months ago.

I had one recently reappear that went missing in 2006

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Wow. Didn't expect so much interest. Must admit I was feeling just a bit emotional yesterday as it would have been my son's ,PJ, 37th birthday yesterday. Even managed to give incorrect pick up date of the TB sent off in his memory. It was retrieved on the 13th November 2012.

I am resigned to the fact that TBs will get stolen from caches but am at a loss to understand fellow geocachers who retrieve them, log them and then when they are approached, resolutely fail to answer emails about them. If they have subsequently lost them, we're all human, I can accept that,but why no response?

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I'm unclear how you relate a missing trackable no one has any control over once it leaves your hand to, 'Another one of Groundspeak's "mistakes" '

- And what exactly do/did you expect from the "Groundspeak Team"?

I for one would be real ticked to find they were giving my personal information to others on request, and as you found out, they don't.

 

Missing trackables happens with all other caching sites. May not hear about it as much, because no one has the numbers of members as this one.

- Threads on missing trackables are created often enough that maybe it could be explained better in the help/getting started sections, but, "There's a chance these will get swiped" probably wouldn't sell many coins/T.B.s .

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I looked up the TB that I believe you are talking about, and it appears that it was dropped in a cache and went missing after that. Accusing them of stealing the bug is a huge leap in my opinion. Travel bugs, and coins, go missing all the time. They get misplaced, forgotten about in a pocket of a jacket or backpack, dropped in a cache and forgotten, and yes, sometimes they get stolen.

 

Contacting the police about an item that you have left out in the wild seems way overkill. If it was a special watch to you, then it shouldn't be released.

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I truly understand, as I'm sure most of the the TB owners who have lost a TB do, your frustration and even anger at the loss of your TB. (It was the pocket watch, yes?) We've lost about half of the TBs we've sent out, including one that was "collected" right at the very start of it's journey and so gained no miles at all. On the other hand, as another way to look at it, about half of our TBs are still travelling, including one that vanished for almost a year before resurfacing from a forgotten backpack and is back on the road again (so there is some hope, however remote it may be, that yours could reappear someday). How far they go and how long they last is just part of the game as someone already pointed out. There is very little you can do once the TB is set out free to roam. They are subject to the whims of chance and fancy of whoever finds them. I'm really not sure what you expect Groundspeak to be able to do. It is as beyond their control as it is yours. My sincere condolences on your loss though, I hope it doesn't spoil the game too much for you.

 

I agree. You can't really blame Groundspeak, especially for a non-official cache.

 

Just keep you fingers crossed, you never know your luck. I had a TB go missing in Australia, to turn up in the UK 10 months later, not in a cache but hung on a fence post and found by chance by a geocacher.

 

This week (here in NZ) I picked up a TB that went missing in Canada 9 months ago.

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My Black Phantom Tetra geofish coin went missing in NZ after being retrieved from a cache. The geocacher concerned eventually answered my emails with "I can't remember which cache I left it in". He'd visited about 5 other caches that day.Keep an eye out for it, it could still get a place in the race.Happy caching

http://img.geocaching.com/track/display/7377e4d6-921b-4682-92f9-96330c4851c8.jpg

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Wow. Didn't expect so much interest. Must admit I was feeling just a bit emotional yesterday as it would have been my son's ,PJ, 37th birthday yesterday. Even managed to give incorrect pick up date of the TB sent off in his memory. It was retrieved on the 13th November 2012.

I am resigned to the fact that TBs will get stolen from caches but am at a loss to understand fellow geocachers who retrieve them, log them and then when they are approached, resolutely fail to answer emails about them. If they have subsequently lost them, we're all human, I can accept that,but why no response?

Good to see you took a deep breath and calmed down a bit.

I had to stop posting when I'm upset, as I noticed that because of my tone, replys often were returned in kind.

We've lost many. CJ has her own page just for coins (too many to scroll through when logging on our shared profile) and finally decided that unless a freebie comes out again (like the GEICO Gecko ), we're not wasting the cash to send mor out.

 

Fear, lack of interpersonal communication skills, just plain ol' rude - a number of things could make one not reply.

- I agree, a simple " Sorry, I screwed up" wouldn't have fixed it, but would have alleviated a lot of stress.

I never get any "thank you" cards from my nieces/nephews either. :laughing:

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I wasn't expecting personal information from the Groundspeak team but felt they could be a bit more pro-active, eg writing to the person involved. making it less personal.

There was a time (back in the day?) when we'd sometimes get a bit of help from a "Diplomat" if you will, but there isn't (really) much they can do to these people other than maybe leave an email note.

I'd guess that simply due to the number of trackables out there it's probably no longer possible today.

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That pocket watch would be irresistible to a thief. Tough luck, that.

 

If it is that watch, it appears the cache itself was muggled.

 

Shaun

Yes. The best way to try to insure against someone swiping your trackable is to make it as ugly as possible. That doesn't mean it won't go missing...but shiny objects tend to vanish far quicker than some popsicle sticks glued together.

 

I am resigned to the fact that TBs will get stolen from caches but am at a loss to understand fellow geocachers who retrieve them, log them and then when they are approached, resolutely fail to answer emails about them. If they have subsequently lost them, we're all human, I can accept that,but why no response?

That is the hardest part of this. You are left in the dark and no idea of what is happening on the other end. It could be that your emails are going into their spam/junk folder and they don't even realize you're sending them. That does happen occasionally.

 

What can you do about it? Pretty much what others have already said. Never release something you hold dear. When you release a trackable into the wild, just assume it will go missing and as you drop it into the cache, you're saying goodbye to it forever. Then you can go home and hope for the best.

 

Or you can bang your head against the wall in frustration but you already know how that feels and it ain't getting your bug back into circulation any faster. Enjoy the miles as they happen.

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I am resigned to the fact that TBs will get stolen from caches but am at a loss to understand fellow geocachers who retrieve them, log them and then when they are approached, resolutely fail to answer emails about them. If they have subsequently lost them, we're all human, I can accept that,but why no response?

 

Just one possible thought - When you sent emails to make enquiries, did you tick the little box which says "I want to send my email address along with this message."? If you didn't, and the person received the email then clicked 'Reply' to send their response, their email will have ended up in the No Man's Land of "noreply @ geocaching.com" and you'll never know that they did, in fact, send a reply.

 

MrsB :)

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I am resigned to the fact that TBs will get stolen from caches but am at a loss to understand fellow geocachers who retrieve them, log them and then when they are approached, resolutely fail to answer emails about them. If they have subsequently lost them, we're all human, I can accept that,but why no response?

That is the hardest part of this. You are left in the dark and no idea of what is happening on the other end. It could be that your emails are going into their spam/junk folder and they don't even realize you're sending them. That does happen occasionally.

Kudos to the OP for putting the info onto the TB page. Most TB Owners come to the Forums and ask why there's “no reply”, when the TOs themselves made no indication on the TB page that they're still interested in the TB, or that there's any problem.

 

Often, the issue is that people immediately grab a TB from a cache with no further plans. Then they forget about it. It's compounded by Groundspeak's black hole of a message system, but one way around that is to post on the TB page -- leave a note.

 

There are plenty of posts around here by cachers who will take a TB and become furious if asked to place it into a cache. Can everyone agree that if you're that crazy, to simply leave the TB in the cache? Log a Discover and leave.

 

When you take a Trackable, or when you lose it, or regardless of what happened, log that you did so.

 

Will everyone reading this Thread please do us all one favor? Visit your Inventory page, and see if you're holding any Trackables that aren't yours:

http://www.geocaching.com/my/inventory.aspx

 

Go to the TB pages and let the TOs off the hook. Type a note on the TB's page, with some kind of status information, regardless of how long you've held it. Do NOT email. Thanks.

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I am resigned to the fact that TBs will get stolen from caches but am at a loss to understand fellow geocachers who retrieve them, log them and then when they are approached, resolutely fail to answer emails about them. If they have subsequently lost them, we're all human, I can accept that,but why no response?

 

Just one possible thought - When you sent emails to make enquiries, did you tick the little box which says "I want to send my email address along with this message."? If you didn't, and the person received the email then clicked 'Reply' to send their response, their email will have ended up in the No Man's Land of "noreply @ geocaching.com" and you'll never know that they did, in fact, send a reply.

 

MrsB :)

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I looked at your travel bug. The cacher that picked up your travel bug has not gone caching since that day. I do believe it is winter where they live. They are an infrequent cacher. And probably a fair weather cacher. Just be very polite and friendly when you email. Do not email over and over. Wait patiently.

Angry and aggressive emails can turn someone off entirely, perhaps to the point of quitting the game entirely. So if you have already emailed more than once, wait. Spring is right around the corner.

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Yes I ticked all the boxes, except the friend request, and even sent my home address.Perhaps they ended up in the junk folder, but I do check mine just in case something important has been filtered out. :)

Regarding The Blorenges post, that return email will not go to your spam filter... it goes to "no reply", which does not exist -- therefore nobody gets it. It WILL NOT appear in your filtered file.

 

Just so you understand. :)

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Yes I ticked all the boxes, except the friend request, and even sent my home address.Perhaps they ended up in the junk folder, but I do check mine just in case something important has been filtered out. :)

Regarding The Blorenges post, that return email will not go to your spam filter... it goes to "no reply", which does not exist -- therefore nobody gets it. It WILL NOT appear in your filtered file.

 

Just so you understand. :)

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Yes I am well aware of that fact. I check my Junk folder for emails that might have been filtered there in error. I was wondering if perhaps the holder of the TB checked hers? Perhaps my emails to her are there???????????? :rolleyes:

 

 

 

 

Just so you understand :blink:

 

I run a number of Internet emails systems for various folks and I am well aware that some emails filtered as junk do not go into any kind of folder but are rather simply rejected by the server or deleted without any further action. Sometimes firewalls and filters at your ISP, your company, your PC just dump certain emails. They will never be found by searching through a "junk" folder.

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