Counterfeit caches....

[Geocachers X & Z]

We've encountered a very strange situation regarding one of our geocaches.

Around ground zero of one of our geocaches we are discovering a number of counterfeit caches and fake logs. The problem at first was quite frustrating. In fact we just renamed our cache The Counterfeit Art Cache because of this issue. Without retyping the whole situation here, please see the cache site and read the description, as we put all the details in the cache description.

 

GC2DJ56 The Counterfeit Art Cache

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=7299b7be-c80a-4f12-8885-15125107e034

 

Has anyone else come across this type of problem??? Is this a new trend? Have a new generation of geocachers just become lazy? Or is this just a type of prank?

[+geocat_]

Sounds like the college kids are bored.

[+T.D.M.22]

??? Maybe a cacher lives or works nearby and enjoys confusing you? If I was in that position I would-very obviously in the description- make sure people know what container they are looking for(LnL, ammo can, bison tube, whatever) and weekly or monthly check the log and delete anyone who logged a find online without finding the actual cache-but with 160 finds that might be a bit much. You could ignore it or archive it. I can't think of any other options.

[+Beach_hut]

Sounds like it could be a 'throw-down' or 'angel cache'. Sometimes a cacher can't find a cache or thinks it may have gone missing, and leaves their own (and logs a find) in your case I guess your container, the REAL container, was there the whole time.

 

If you search for these terms, in these forums, you'll get lots of hits. Many cache owners are disgruntled by the practice. They did it on one of ours whilst it was offline (specialist container we were in the process of repairing), didn't put in their log clearly what they'd done, didn't ask our permission first, and put it back in the wrong place, leaving us to have to go to GZ and work out what the hell had happened.

Edited December 7, 2012 by Beach_hut

[4wheelin_fool]

It sounds like the cache has been recruited to be used as part of a psychology project.

[Geocachers X & Z]

@ Beach_hut, Thanks for the lead. We never knew they existed, till now. Just read a few thoughts on boards about throw down caches... and I agree they are a complete PIA. If someone can't find a cache, send a message to the owner before starting another cache. We kept seeing logs about cache broken or wet log but when we checked on it it was fine every time. Until we figured out there was numerous fake caches it was confusing.

The fake logs I've recently found at GZ are actually quite lengthy. At this point I don't know whether to delete all the online finds or let them stand. I tried sending a couple messages and it seems like the response was "Well I signed a log there so the smiley counts."

 

@ geoCATing and 4wheelin_fool, Yes we thought it might be bored students. Some of the sillier things like a broken key seemed like it was some sort of joke.

 

@ T.D.M.22, In the new description we have a whole paragraph on how to identify the actual cache...Also we left up some spoiler photos that show the cache clear as day. Actually the cache location seems like such an easy park n grab we originally listed it as a 1 star.

[knowschad]

Very interesting that you started this thread! I received an email about one of my own caches this week. The cache name is important... its called Hole in One. While I can't say here how the cache is hidden, it is NOT a fake golf ball!

 

The email:

> Hello-

>

> I had stopped by a hole in one to try and score the find after my DNY in the rain the other morning. I searched another beacon this time and in the crotch of a tree under a small rock I found a golf ball that had been opened in two with GPS wrote on it. It was taped together. I carefully opened it up to find a red push pin and a penny. Wondering if this is the cache that may have migrated from its hiding spot and now minus the log or part of the presentation and I have missed the cache yet once again....

 

And he attached this picture:

 

At this point, I don't know what to make of this. Did the golfer right his initials on the ball? If so, then why was it cut in two and taped together? And why write "GPS" rather than "Geocache"?

[+dprovan]

Those buildings are gone?! I must have walked past them hundreds of times when I was at CMU. They were pretty decrepit at the time, so I'm actually kinda surprised they lasted long enough to get into the streetview pictures.

 

By the way, I happen to wander in the streetview up the street towards CMU, and there's a party welcoming the Google car into the new side street into campus a couple hundred feet to the east. If you're not up on your flag semaphore, they're trying to spell out "Google", although the O's aren't quite right.

 

Anyway, your issue is very interesting. Obviously a big part of the problem is that a lot of trash gets dumped there. I'm not sure what the other stuff that actually looks like caches with logs is about. They don't sound like something someone would throw down. Have you compared signatures on your log and the bogus logs to the on-line logs to see who exactly is signing what? That might shed some light on the mystery. You say the logs are "lengthy". You mean with a log of signatures?

 

I wouldn't be so cagey about what the container is: just come out and say it's a film canister (if my guess is right). I'd put that first thing in the intro paragraph to try to minimize the problem. That's a fun idea to explain and embrace the problem, though, by the way.

[+BlueDeuce]

It's certainly possible people have placed caches in that area and listed them on other cache sites.

 

If it's a situation like you are describing where they have placed a myriad of trash caches, my first thought it that they are trying to get a reaction out of you and the community. Nothing fuels these antics like getting the attention they are looking for. I personally would state on the cache page exactly what type of container they should be looking for and other identification in the cache container itself, as you have done, and completely stop discussing the situation on the cache page or in forums.

 

Discuss the issue offline with your locals and eventually these people will move on to something else that gives them the attention the seek.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

We've encountered a very strange situation regarding one of our geocaches.

Around ground zero of one of our geocaches we are discovering a number of counterfeit caches and fake logs. The problem at first was quite frustrating. In fact we just renamed our cache The Counterfeit Art Cache because of this issue. Without retyping the whole situation here, please see the cache site and read the description, as we put all the details in the cache description.

 

GC2DJ56 The Counterfeit Art Cache

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=7299b7be-c80a-4f12-8885-15125107e034

 

Has anyone else come across this type of problem??? Is this a new trend? Have a new generation of geocachers just become lazy? Or is this just a type of prank?

 

What did the area look like *before* you placed the cache? From your description of many of he counterfeit caches it sounds like the kind of area that could use a good CITO. It doesn't sound like something like a used bandaid or the unusual penny were counterfeit caches as much as they were just garbage someone tossed at GZ. Did someone actually post an online found log after finding what would normally be considered trash? Given another thread where a CO intentionally created a cache that was essentially a piece of trash that could be signed is there a trend that any piece of trash has become a potential cache? The implications of that that might mean for those that are quick to drop a "throw down" are pretty disturbing.

 

Found It:

Looked everywhere for the soda straw but couldn't find it, so I left a paper coffee cup as a replacement cache. TFTC.

[Geocachers X & Z]

@ dprovan and NYPaddleCacher: The area is cleaned up quite a bit here. And from the razed buildings they made a micro park area. That's why we originally placed the cache. However there are scraps of litter that are now scattered about. I saw signatures on a pizza box and even a gum wrapper. Moreover I got a message asking about the gum wrapper, and one about a broken key. A gum wrapper. Really??? Yes.

 

@ knowschad What is frustrating also is that I found 2 caches both approximately 1 foot from the real cache. If you were blindfolded and moved your arms around your hand would find the real cache. That's when I said "Wtf?"

 

@ BlueDeuce You might have a point. Logging trash as a geocache might be some environmental statement intended to make some sort of debate. The whole thing was frustrating, and while venting I rewrote the original cache. After reading everyone's thoughts here, and a day to think about it more, it seems that by making the fakes such an issue on the cache page, it just may draw the unwarranted attention to something other than geocaching at a scenic spot. Later tonight I'm just going to thin down the cache page, describe the real cache, and let it be known there may be counterfeit caches around.

 

Thanks everyone!

Edited December 8, 2012 by Geocachers X & Z

[Geocachers X & Z]

P.S. @ NYPaddleCacher, Yes someone actually sent a message and posted a log about the broken key (now deleted). Enough said. I'm going to play down this silliness on the cache site.

 

Thanks again.

[+Sol seaker]

I like what you've done with the cache page. It's very entertaining and approaches the problem in a really funny manner:

 

-This cache is NOT a discarded pizza box. First please note the cache size is listed as micro. That means small. Then please note that the soggy pizza box probably just didn't make it to the nearby garbage can when its previous owner tossed it drunkenly through the air. Hopefully at least you used rubber gloves, hand sanitizer and a face mask while you scraped away moldy old mushrooms looking for a place to scribble your name...?

 

Good one!!!! :laughing:

 

I like someone else's idea of actually describing the container, which I think is a key hider. A lot of caches say what the container is, and it sounds like this one might be a good one to do that with.

 

I think you may have been encountering "throw-downs". Unfortunately the practice of dropping something, or it seems, signing something when you can't find the cache seems to be spreading. People can't seem to be bothered to find the real container anymore.

 

I would delete any "finds" that are from caches without signatures on the real log. No find, no smilie. If they didn't sign the log they didn't find the cache. Simple as that. The game is not about just getting somewhere near the cache and signing whatever you find, it's about finding the cache.

I'd email the people first and give them the chance to actually find it, or delete it themselves. If they didn't, then I'd delete it with a nice note with what the cache looks like.

This is why they give us the delete button.

[+Understandblue]

"strange looking penny" -

 

That cache page is fantastic.

 

[4wheelin_fool]

I would go with the throwdown cache theory if it was a single normal container, but since there are multiple unusual varieties, it has to be something else.

[+Don_J]

We've encountered a very strange situation regarding one of our geocaches.

Around ground zero of one of our geocaches we are discovering a number of counterfeit caches and fake logs. The problem at first was quite frustrating. In fact we just renamed our cache The Counterfeit Art Cache because of this issue. Without retyping the whole situation here, please see the cache site and read the description, as we put all the details in the cache description.

 

GC2DJ56 The Counterfeit Art Cache

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=7299b7be-c80a-4f12-8885-15125107e034

 

Has anyone else come across this type of problem??? Is this a new trend? Have a new generation of geocachers just become lazy? Or is this just a type of prank?

 

What did the area look like *before* you placed the cache? From your description of many of he counterfeit caches it sounds like the kind of area that could use a good CITO. It doesn't sound like something like a used bandaid or the unusual penny were counterfeit caches as much as they were just garbage someone tossed at GZ. Did someone actually post an online found log after finding what would normally be considered trash? Given another thread where a CO intentionally created a cache that was essentially a piece of trash that could be signed is there a trend that any piece of trash has become a potential cache? The implications of that that might mean for those that are quick to drop a "throw down" are pretty disturbing.

 

Found It:

Looked everywhere for the soda straw but couldn't find it, so I left a paper coffee cup as a replacement cache. TFTC.

 

This was my thought as I was reading through everything. I once placed a cache at a nice place that turned into a trash dump a year later. I cleaned it up once on a maintenance visit, but it was quickly trashed again, so I simply archived the cache. It was never my intention to bring people to a dump. Things can change over time and sometimes our great location is no longer suitable for a cache. It was time to move on.

[+The_Incredibles_]

First and foremost: This cache is NOT a used dental floss container!!! We've heard that this dental floss container actually has a log in it with lots of signatures. Although we’ve looked for this imposter cache, we couldn’t find it.

 

ROFL

Edited December 10, 2012 by The_Incredibles_