How long can a cache page remain unpublished before it's removed?

[+Mike & Jess]

Should be a fairly quick question for someone that knows...

 

How long can I keep an unpublished cache (or event) before it disappears from my list?

 

I have a number of caches and events going out that I would like to assemble their cache pages before hand. The caches are not physically in place (yet) and the Events are way too far outside the earliest listing permitted (for non-mega events).

I know unpublished cache pages will disappear after so long, but can not remember how long before they go.

[knowschad]

Should be a fairly quick question for someone that knows...

 

How long can I keep an unpublished cache (or event) before it disappears from my list?

 

I have a number of caches and events going out that I would like to assemble their cache pages before hand. The caches are not physically in place (yet) and the Events are way too far outside the earliest listing permitted (for non-mega events).

I know unpublished cache pages will disappear after so long, but can not remember how long before they go.

 

Unlimited. No, it shouldn't disappear.

Edited September 19, 2012 by knowschad

[+palmetto]

I know unpublished cache pages will disappear after so long,

 

There's no automated system that will make a page disappear. Once it's created, it's on the site and viewable from your account.

 

An unpublished listing might be archived by the owner or by a site admin. If it's archived by a site administrator, the owner receives an email notification of the archive log.

Usually the archiving admin will inquire about whether the cacher intends to make use of the listing, before they archive it.

 

Any listing you have ever created is viewable. An archived unpublished cache can be seen here

 

http://www.geocaching.com/my/geocaches.aspx?archived=y

 

in the gray pane on the right side of the screen with the title crossed out

[+SwineFlew]

I got one that I am waiting for the area to go free. Heard on the forum that you can "save" a spot if you do that. Not sure if it really work or what.

[+Mike & Jess]

I know unpublished cache pages will disappear after so long,

 

There's no automated system that will make a page disappear. Once it's created, it's on the site and viewable from your account.

 

An unpublished listing might be archived by the owner or by a site admin. If it's archived by a site administrator, the owner receives an email notification of the archive log.

Usually the archiving admin will inquire about whether the cacher intends to make use of the listing, before they archive it.

 

Any listing you have ever created is viewable. An archived unpublished cache can be seen here

 

http://www.geocaching.com/my/geocaches.aspx?archived=y

 

in the gray pane on the right side of the screen with the title crossed out

Thanks for the info. Your response was tack on.

I had an earth cache that had disappeared from my listing. It was exactly where and how you said it would be listed.

Unfortunately, it looks like if it shows up there, it's archived and can not be recovered like when a normal cache is archived.

 

I guess worse comes to worse, it gets archived, I can always copy and paste the details into another cache page when ready to submit.

[+Mike & Jess]

I got one that I am waiting for the area to go free. Heard on the forum that you can "save" a spot if you do that. Not sure if it really work or what.

 

I don't think that will work without reviewer involvement.

 

If it did, that would be a great reason for me to pre-create these cache and event pages.

I'm doing it as I have a fair bit of going into them (Toughest Cache Series previously mentioned here) and want to make sure the pages only require minor adjustments before going live.

[+JBnW]

To echo what others have said, I had a couple of draft pages that I managed to save from late 2008 until this spring. Just never got around to placing those. If I recall correctly, they may have stayed forever, unless someone else requested to hide a cache someplace near that spot and create a proximity issue, at which point I would have been asked to either finalize the cache let them have it. In the end, I simply rewrote the pages for hides in another location. But as you concluded, you'll always have the archived page to copy-paste from.

[+Mike & Jess]

To echo what others have said, I had a couple of draft pages that I managed to save from late 2008 until this spring. Just never got around to placing those. If I recall correctly, they may have stayed forever, unless someone else requested to hide a cache someplace near that spot and create a proximity issue, at which point I would have been asked to either finalize the cache let them have it. In the end, I simply rewrote the pages for hides in another location. But as you concluded, you'll always have the archived page to copy-paste from.

 

So from what I am getting from your post, it sounds like the draft page does actually count for something (mark the location)?

[+Viajero Perdido]

If you enter meaningful coordinates, the unpublished cache might keep showing up in front of the reviewer, much like a bug on the windshield. They know they need to ignore it, but keep seeing it there every time. So some reviewers ask whether you're planning to do something about it.

 

If you leave the coords in the middle of an ocean (eg, N0 W0), no reviewer should notice, and it shouldn't bother anybody. You can change coords freely before submitting.

[+secretagentbill]

But as you concluded, you'll always have the archived page to copy-paste from.

I let one sit for a year or so and it got archived to clear room for other caches (no new caches got published in the area...) Now that it is archived, it is no longer accessible because it was never published.

[+Mike & Jess]

If you enter meaningful coordinates, the unpublished cache might keep showing up in front of the reviewer, much like a bug on the windshield. They know they need to ignore it, but keep seeing it there every time. So some reviewers ask whether you're planning to do something about it.

 

If you leave the coords in the middle of an ocean (eg, N0 W0), no reviewer should notice, and it shouldn't bother anybody. You can change coords freely before submitting.

 

I didn't think it would be seen until I hit the make it go button (and check off the check box).

I guess I'll annoy one of my locals for a few.

[+T.D.M.22]

I thought reviewers could see ALL cache pages regardless of if you hit the submit button or not. They just got get notified until you hit the submit button. There are certain circumstances that can lead to a total disappearance from the website, but I believe that cache can't have any finds, and that you have to do something that would result in a banishment from the sight. other than that I've had caches sitting months with no problem. My reviewer will just change the hidden date if it's been sitting for more than a month before being published.

[+Harry Dolphin]

AFAIK, an unsubmitted cache will occupy the space until it gets in the way of someone wanting to hide a cache there. Then the reviewer will ask if you plan on hiding the cache. Don't know if they archive it for being in the way, or ask you to move it, or ignore it.

My archived caches are available for view on my list of owned caches. But I have not had any archived without a find. I shoudl think that they would be availble for view there. After all you do have a cache number.

The only ones I know of that are not available for view (if you look in the right place) are those that are retracted. I have found two that were later retracted. I can view my log, but not the cache page.

If you hit the 'submit' page, you get a cache number. If you hit 'not ready for review', you have a cache occupying the spot (unless it interferes... see above.) If you do not hit 'submit', then the cache does not exist. You have no cache number. But I don't think it will save that anyway.

[+Don_J]

If you enter meaningful coordinates, the unpublished cache might keep showing up in front of the reviewer, much like a bug on the windshield. They know they need to ignore it, but keep seeing it there every time. So some reviewers ask whether you're planning to do something about it.

 

If you leave the coords in the middle of an ocean (eg, N0 W0), no reviewer should notice, and it shouldn't bother anybody. You can change coords freely before submitting.

 

It's my understanding, from reading past posts on this forum, that if the cache is disabled, (not ready for review), they don't see it unless they do a proximity check for someones elses new submission. At that point, they will inquire as to your intentions and give you the opportunity to have it reviewed. If you don't intend to have it reviewed, they will either archive it, or simply publish the other cache which would essentially block yours from being published in the future. Yes, you can do this to reserve a spot, but you have to be prepared to either use it or give it up if someone else tries to place a cache in the same proximity.

[+Don_J]

I thought reviewers could see ALL cache pages regardless of if you hit the submit button or not. They just got get notified until you hit the submit button. There are certain circumstances that can lead to a total disappearance from the website, but I believe that cache can't have any finds, and that you have to do something that would result in a banishment from the sight. other than that I've had caches sitting months with no problem. My reviewer will just change the hidden date if it's been sitting for more than a month before being published.

 

Why would your reviewer change the hidden, (placed), date? That really isn't their prerogative. I placed a cache and created the listing for a special occasion that got postponed for six months. When I finally submitted it for review, I didn't change the placed date and I doubt that my reviewer even noticed, or cared.

[+Sharks-N-Beans]

If you hit the 'submit' page, you get a cache number. If you hit 'not ready for review', you have a cache occupying the spot (unless it interferes... see above.) If you do not hit 'submit', then the cache does not exist. You have no cache number. But I don't think it will save that anyway.

 

Maybe I'm not understanding the above, but unsubmitted caches do indeed have a cache number.

[+Sharks-N-Beans]

I thought reviewers could see ALL cache pages regardless of if you hit the submit button or not. They just got get notified until you hit the submit button. There are certain circumstances that can lead to a total disappearance from the website, but I believe that cache can't have any finds, and that you have to do something that would result in a banishment from the sight. other than that I've had caches sitting months with no problem. My reviewer will just change the hidden date if it's been sitting for more than a month before being published.

 

Why would your reviewer change the hidden, (placed), date? That really isn't their prerogative. I placed a cache and created the listing for a special occasion that got postponed for six months. When I finally submitted it for review, I didn't change the placed date and I doubt that my reviewer even noticed, or cared.

 

Ya I don't get that either. It's hidden when hidden. Published is a different thing. Either the reviewer is mistakenly trying to be extra helpful or covering slow publishing. I can see why they may think it's helpful. Many times I come home, pull-up a radius of 25 miles and sort on date hidden to see the new stuff. A newly published cache that was hidden awhile back will not be on top.

[+CanadianRockies]

Yes, you can do this to reserve a spot, but you have to be prepared to either use it or give it up if someone else tries to place a cache in the same proximity.

One useful purpose of reserving a spot is when an inactive geocacher's cache goes missing and you want to place a cache in that location. You can create a cache listing page with those coordinates and wait for the cache to get archived. It could take several months for this to happen, but nobody else is going to try to place a cache in that location (unless they, too, want to try to reserve that spot).

[+Sharks-N-Beans]

If you enter meaningful coordinates, the unpublished cache might keep showing up in front of the reviewer, much like a bug on the windshield. They know they need to ignore it, but keep seeing it there every time. So some reviewers ask whether you're planning to do something about it.

 

If you leave the coords in the middle of an ocean (eg, N0 W0), no reviewer should notice, and it shouldn't bother anybody. You can change coords freely before submitting.

What do you mean "keep showing up"? It's not in a que for publishing.

[+Mike & Jess]

I have sent one of our local reviewers a quick message asking if they can see draft cache pages and if it would act as a kind of place holder with valid cords.

 

If this is the case, it would be a side effect I was not aware of, but a welcome one for the caches I'm doing this for. I'll update the thread as soon as I hear something.

[+Sharks-N-Beans]

I have sent one of our local reviewers a quick message asking if they can see draft cache pages and if it would act as a kind of place holder with valid cords.

 

If this is the case, it would be a side effect I was not aware of, but a welcome one for the caches I'm doing this for. I'll update the thread as soon as I hear something.

They are a placeholder. You will be asked to get published if a proximity issue arises.

[+Ma & Pa]

I sometimes have a large number of cache pages completed and submitted but not sent to reviewers. I create a lot of puzzle caches. Once I have a puzzle in mind, I create the cache page before I even figure out where I am going to hide the cache. I use coordinates out in the ocean near here. I sometimes accumulate 20 puzzle caches or more. I then pick an area and go hide all the caches in that area. I then amend the cache pages to reflect the coordinates.

 

I have never had a problem with even the older caches in inventory. I also have a cache in inventory where I keep our trackables. Of course, I could use one of our archived caches for that purpose.

Edited September 20, 2012 by Ma & Pa

[+Crow-T-Robot]

AFAIK, an unsubmitted cache will occupy the space until it gets in the way of someone wanting to hide a cache there. Then the reviewer will ask if you plan on hiding the cache. Don't know if they archive it for being in the way, or ask you to move it, or ignore it.

My archived caches are available for view on my list of owned caches. But I have not had any archived without a find. I shoudl think that they would be availble for view there. After all you do have a cache number.

The only ones I know of that are not available for view (if you look in the right place) are those that are retracted. I have found two that were later retracted. I can view my log, but not the cache page.

If you hit the 'submit' page, you get a cache number. If you hit 'not ready for review', you have a cache occupying the spot (unless it interferes... see above.) If you do not hit 'submit', then the cache does not exist. You have no cache number. But I don't think it will save that anyway.

 

If you hit the 'submit' page, you get a cache number. If you hit 'not ready for review', you have a cache occupying the spot (unless it interferes... see above.) If you do not hit 'submit', then the cache does not exist. You have no cache number. But I don't think it will save that anyway.

 

Maybe I'm not understanding the above, but unsubmitted caches do indeed have a cache number.

 

Yes, they do. I haven't toyed around with it enough, but I thought the only way to get a cache page where you can enter coordinates is to submit a new cache and once you submit it, the GC number is generated for that cache page. So, if there is a way to get a generic cache page without a GC number (or one that doesn't show up on any proximity checks), I'm not aware of it.

[+Mike & Jess]

I sometimes have a large number of cache pages completed and submitted but not sent to reviewers. I create a lot of puzzle caches. Once I have a puzzle in mind, I create the cache page before I even figure out where I am going to hide the cache. I use coordinates out in the ocean near here. I sometimes accumulate 20 puzzle caches or more. I then pick an area and go hide all the caches in that area. I then amend the cache pages to reflect the coordinates.

 

I have never had a problem with even the older caches in inventory. I also have a cache in inventory where I keep our trackables. Of course, I could use one of our archived caches for that purpose.

 

Guess I know who to ask if I want to do a good puzzle and can't think of anything.

[+Mike & Jess]

I have sent one of our local reviewers a quick message asking if they can see draft cache pages and if it would act as a kind of place holder with valid cords.

 

If this is the case, it would be a side effect I was not aware of, but a welcome one for the caches I'm doing this for. I'll update the thread as soon as I hear something.

They are a placeholder. You will be asked to get published if a proximity issue arises.

 

I did receive confirmation from one of our local reviewers, and this is correct. I will act like a place holder for the specified location. Should another cacher try placing a cache within the ~161M of my draft cache cords, the reviewer will normally contact the draft cache owner and request action of some sort.

[+Ma & Pa]

I sometimes have a large number of cache pages completed and submitted but not sent to reviewers. I create a lot of puzzle caches. Once I have a puzzle in mind, I create the cache page before I even figure out where I am going to hide the cache. I use coordinates out in the ocean near here. I sometimes accumulate 20 puzzle caches or more. I then pick an area and go hide all the caches in that area. I then amend the cache pages to reflect the coordinates.

 

I have never had a problem with even the older caches in inventory. I also have a cache in inventory where I keep our trackables. Of course, I could use one of our archived caches for that purpose.

 

Guess I know who to ask if I want to do a good puzzle and can't think of anything.

LOL

 

I didnt say my puzzles were good. But I have a few right now if you need one

[+5 Caching Campers]

Back in 2009, I was going to create a puzzle cache using an MS Tag image (do those still exist?). To play around with the concept, I created a cache page with some bogus coords. Never ended up doing anything with it. We ended up taking a long break from Geocaching. It wasn't intentional, it just happened. We had a couple kids... had 33 months where we found a total of 21 caches... went 380 days without a find at all.

 

About three years later I decided I wanted to make a Wherigo. When I looked at my profile, I saw my old puzzle cache sitting there (GC1JBV7). I changed its cache type to Wherigo and started updating the rest of the info. A couple weeks ago I finally got it all set to go. I did have a minor hiccup in that my final location was only ~400ft from another cache ... but I made contact with that other cache's owner and he agreed to move it a little further up the trail .

 

So, they can definitely sit there for a long time while not being published. I did notice when I revisited the page that I had put a reviewer note on it stating the the coords were bogus, so maybe that helped it survive. At this point, I don't remember where the coords were pointing... probably someplace near my home coords... so it's also possible that it didn't interfere with anything and just stayed under the radar.

 

YMMV and all that jazz...

[+jellis]

My experience cause some reviewers do it differently is:

They can stay indifinetly until someone decides to put a cache there too. Then that cacher gets a message from the reviewer that there is an unpublished cache there. Then the reviewer will give that CO 30 days to submit it or they will archive it, unless they tell the reviewer that they are creating a difficult puzzle or waiting for a special container. Then they may give them more time.

Or a Lackey/Admin/reviewer/? comes along for I don't know what reason because they don't have to give you one, and Poof! it's gone. That happened to me. Not sure why other then I waited too long or maybe someone wants to put something there, who knows cause a cache never showed up on that spot so I don't know why they did it. I was working on putting something there but oh well. I could still cause no one else has but, I don't need the spot now.

[+jellis]

I also have placeholders but not to place a cache but because the landowners don't want caches near the spots. Example: One is at a private marina and I talked to the owner and asked about putting a cache there and he said No because it is for paying members only and don't want people wandering around. Knowing some cachers don't ask permission, I locked up the area with a note on the cache page why. If a cacher wishes to place a cache outside the marina, hopefully the reviewer will see the note and allow them to do it only outside.

Just like how some cachers don't want caches near their homes, they will lock up the spot. I know one cacher, if he finds out where you live, watch out! I found a cache in a tree not far from where I was living by him.

[+Mike & Jess]

My experience cause some reviewers do it differently is:

They can stay indifinetly until someone decides to put a cache there too. Then that cacher gets a message from the reviewer that there is an unpublished cache there. Then the reviewer will give that CO 30 days to submit it or they will archive it, unless they tell the reviewer that they are creating a difficult puzzle or waiting for a special container. Then they may give them more time.

Or a Lackey/Admin/reviewer/? comes along for I don't know what reason because they don't have to give you one, and Poof! it's gone. That happened to me. Not sure why other then I waited too long or maybe someone wants to put something there, who knows cause a cache never showed up on that spot so I don't know why they did it. I was working on putting something there but oh well. I could still cause no one else has but, I don't need the spot now.

What you described is pretty much the response I received from the reviewer. I didn't ask if I could publish what the reviewer wrote to me, so I didn't quote them word for word, but yes, you're pretty much saying the exact same thing I was told.

I was told however that each instance can be different, so they will address accordingly.

As for what GS or employees of GS do with regarding archived caches... I can not say anything about those.

 

I also have placeholders but not to place a cache but because the landowners don't want caches near the spots. Example: One is at a private marina and I talked to the owner and asked about putting a cache there and he said No because it is for paying members only and don't want people wandering around. Knowing some cachers don't ask permission, I locked up the area with a note on the cache page why. If a cacher wishes to place a cache outside the marina, hopefully the reviewer will see the note and allow them to do it only outside.

Just like how some cachers don't want caches near their homes, they will lock up the spot. I know one cacher, if he finds out where you live, watch out! I found a cache in a tree not far from where I was living by him.

This is actually a pretty smart idea, and a way to keep the game players and private property owners happy. If I happen to come across a similar situation, I will definately keep what you did in mind.

[+Mike & Jess]

Yes, you can do this to reserve a spot, but you have to be prepared to either use it or give it up if someone else tries to place a cache in the same proximity.

One useful purpose of reserving a spot is when an inactive geocacher's cache goes missing and you want to place a cache in that location. You can create a cache listing page with those coordinates and wait for the cache to get archived. It could take several months for this to happen, but nobody else is going to try to place a cache in that location (unless they, too, want to try to reserve that spot).

This is also a great use of this feature. I can't think of any caches locally I would use this for, but in higher populated areas, definately a great idea.

 

Going through this thread on an actual computer and not my phone shows I missed a few posts.

[+Mike & Jess]

Does this draft page (space reservation) apply to events?

[+Don_J]

Does this draft page (space reservation) apply to events?

 

What exactly would you be reserving? There are no proximity guidelines for events as far as other caches go. What they don't allow is "event stacking", which is usually done by the same individual or organization. In other words, you can't hold an hour long event, each hour for five hours at the same location, or in very close proximity to each other, and call it five events. They want you to make that a single event.

 

There was a complaint a year or so ago that a reviewer would not publish an event because there was already an event being held on the other side of town. They were by different people and were not related in any way. I don't remember how that shook out in the end, but it's not something that typically comes up.

[+Mike & Jess]

Does this draft page (space reservation) apply to events?

 

What exactly would you be reserving? There are no proximity guidelines for events as far as other caches go. What they don't allow is "event stacking", which is usually done by the same individual or organization. In other words, you can't hold an hour long event, each hour for five hours at the same location, or in very close proximity to each other, and call it five events. They want you to make that a single event.

 

There was a complaint a year or so ago that a reviewer would not publish an event because there was already an event being held on the other side of town. They were by different people and were not related in any way. I don't remember how that shook out in the end, but it's not something that typically comes up.

I was just wondering about it as I have a couple draft pages for events that will be going for review shortly. One in particular I started (cords and date) and now it looks like another cacher will host this event instead. If it does act like a normal cache draft, I'll have to kill mine. If not, I'll leave it and modify the date and time for another M&G event later on.

[+Ragnemalm]

Let me bring this thread to life. Obviously unpublished caches will be archived after some time, and I can prevent it to make comments to keep it alive, but what is the rule for how long I can leave it without having it archived?

 

In the past this has happened once, I think, and that came from Groundspeak and seemed automated, I think it was after six months. But I recently had a whole bunch of caches archived, and it seems the limit is now three months. I think it was much higher before. Is there an actual rule?

[+Isonzo Karst]

6.16. Unpublished geocaches may be archived

"....older than ten months may be automatically archived..."

[+Ragnemalm]

8 minutes ago, Isonzo Karst said:

6.16. Unpublished geocaches may be archived

"....older than ten months may be automatically archived..."

Thank you, that was what I was looking for!

[+palmetto]

https://www.geocaching.com/my/geocaches.aspx?archived=y

Link to  page where you can see unpublished archived caches in the right pane Title Strikethough for anyone who owns some.

 

@Ragnemalm  I looked at your unpublished archived back through 2017. Most were archived by you, a few by reviewers. There are 3 created in 2017 that were HQ 'bot archived 10 months later in 2018. 

Edited December 2, 2021 by palmetto

[+Ragnemalm]

18 minutes ago, palmetto said:

https://www.geocaching.com/my/geocaches.aspx?archived=y

Link to  page where you can see unpublished archived caches in the right pane Title Strikethough for anyone who owns some.

 

@Ragnemalm  I looked at your unpublished archived back through 2017. Most were archived by you, a few by reviewers. There are 3 created in 2017 that were HQ 'bot archived 10 months later in 2018. 

So all that was easily visible? Interesting.

 

The "few by reviewers" should be quite a few just the last two months. After that, I archived four myself just to avoid more irritation.