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Jeep on Ebay

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I would say that is the ultimate TB prison. It looks similar to the: "Three W's Little Hill (ID)" Green Jeep Travel Bug Reference number TB1F7JD

Maybe there is a whole lot of those jeeps out there, and I never searched the whole TB data base. The items are identical though. I would just consider my TB lost and gone forever if it were mine.

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I would say that is the ultimate TB prison. It looks similar to the: "Three W's Little Hill (ID)" Green Jeep Travel Bug Reference number TB1F7JD

Maybe there is a whole lot of those jeeps out there, and I never searched the whole TB data base. The items are identical though. I would just consider my TB lost and gone forever if it were mine.

 

Or we can all flag it as stolen property on ebay

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Just saw this on Ebay, not sure, but pretty sure it is not allowed

 

Ebay item #221108543075

Technically this TB is owned by JEEP and so therefore cannot be owned by anyone else. Therefore the Seller does not have a right to sell it on EBay. For $20 no less! Report it on Ebay!

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Just saw this on Ebay, not sure, but pretty sure it is not allowed

 

Ebay item #221108543075

Technically this TB is owned by JEEP and so therefore cannot be owned by anyone else. Therefore the Seller does not have a right to sell it on EBay. For $20 no less! Report it on Ebay!

 

Reported.

 

 

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Just saw this on Ebay, not sure, but pretty sure it is not allowed

 

Ebay item #221108543075

Technically this TB is owned by JEEP and so therefore cannot be owned by anyone else. Therefore the Seller does not have a right to sell it on EBay. For $20 no less! Report it on Ebay!

 

Reported.

I contacted the seller, hoping they will either put it in a cache or arrange to pass it off to a cacher to be set5 free again. We'll see what happens next.

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I scrolled down the whole page. The seller came here to see what was going on. He even tracked the jeep TB to Geowoodstock IV. I doubt he will do anything other than sell it.

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Tell me again how much value there is to attaching a "Do Not Keep Me, place into a cache within 2 weeks" info tag to a Trackable. :ph34r:

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How do these ebay things tend to go? I'd think ebay would be onto this by now, if they considered it an issue (sooo.. they don't?). It's kind of obvious already that it's an active Trackable. So it's a lot he's like selling a "used wallet" that has the owner's driver's license still inside. Maybe he found it innocently, maybe someone will buy it. Maybe he doesn't know what to do (if he's a complete idiot), so he just decided to sell the wallet, and maybe that's even legal. But it isn't his to sell.

 

Being outside the game, his other option is to "just throw it away then!", which is where lost TBs often go. Yet if he gave it to a Geocacher, the TB could just disappear anyway.

Edited by kunarion

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Hes done enough research on it to know its a trackable, that it was seen at Geowoodstock IV, and so hes selling it as a collectible. That to me says he knows what he is doing. To use your analogy, it would be like me stealing your wallet, then putting it up for sale with your DL in it.

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To use your analogy, it would be like me stealing your wallet, then putting it up for sale with your DL in it.

Truth.

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Here is the reply that the seller posted on the listing:

 

"I've gotten a few questions about this jeep. They range from having me go to a local jeep dealer and turn these jeeps in to them???!!! To turning these jeeps over to a Geocacher (where ever that person may be). Obviously, no one really has a clear handle on this stuff. These jeeps were bought by me at a local thrift store and I really am confused about what to do with them. I'll either sell them herel or throw them in the garbage and that seems like a waste."

 

Make of it what you will.

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These jeeps were bought by me at a local thrift store and I really am confused

Confused is right! The story of how he got the item has changed since the ebay listing. Did I nail it or did I nail it on the "If I can't sell it, the only option is to throw it away"?

 

Some people will be perfect as a cranky old man when kids lose a frisbee over his fence.

Edited by kunarion

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The ebay person has updated the listing with info from the TB listing page. I hope that the bidders are cachers trying to rescue this jeep.

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The ebay person has updated the listing with info from the TB listing page. I hope that the bidders are cachers trying to rescue this jeep.

I've asked a direct question on ebay. The page still shows "No Questions Posted". I think questions (and the replies) need to be shown.

Edited by kunarion

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Makes you wonder if we might be setting up a situation where TB's are "kidnapped" from a cache and held for "ransom" on eBay.

That does seem to happen. But the theft extends way beyond ebay. But ebay's one place for blatant, well-documented theft.

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I bought a lot of geocoins and travel bugs off of ebay about a year ago, that someone said they had purchased the lot at a garage sale. While going thru the lot after receiving them, two of them were activated, drilled and wirelocked. They both had location as unknown, but had never been released. I tried several time to contact the owner, telling him how I got them, did he want them back or could I adopt him with now response. He had not been on Groundspeak for a 1 1/2 years at that time. I then contacted a gecocacher who had cached with the owner trying to get some more information, they sent me an email address and I tried to contact the owner again, with no luck.

 

What I did was set the two trackables free at GeoWoodstock this year and put notes on the trackable page explaining the situation. I am watching them move about. There seemed to be no point in hanging on to the coins after all my efforts in trying to locate the owner.

 

Unfortunately his story of finding them in a bag of Geocaching items at Goodwill could be very plausible. A geocacher passes away with a bunch of trackables he just picked up, family goes through his belongings (What the heck are these?) and donates them to Goodwill. NOT out of the question at all. Don't immediately list him as a muggle who stole from geocaches... Who out of us wouldn't have purchased it from Goodwill...maybe not to sell on ebay like he is but.....

 

It appears the person listed as the owner is not active anymore either? so if this was sold to a cacher, what will they be able to do with it that is any different than what I have done?

Edited by jobrerry

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The person listed is not active anymore either? so if this was so to a cacher, what will they be able to do with it that is any different than what I have done?

What you did is great. Release them to Geocaches. What I would NOT do is tell people that I will throw them away if I don't sell them. If the person is "confused" as he says, he needs to go back to the thrift store, get a refund, and tell the thrift store to contact Groundspeak when these items show up. The activity of the owner is irrelevant. There's no expiration for a Trackable, no point where it expired that gives you the right to take it and sell it.

 

Do we know which Jeep TB it is? I count ten Jeep TBs still listed in "Geowoodstock 4", some are green, but the logs don't seem right. They were retrieved from Geowoodstock in Texas, traveled cache-to-cache for a while, then were all logged into the possession of one cacher in California between 2006 & 2007, the same cacher who had dropped them into Geowoodstock 4! Then that cacher dropped them all BACK into Geowoodstock, EIGHT MONTHS after Geowoodstock happened. What's with the weird logs?

 

The Jeep TBs that are to be sold on ebay should get log notes typed, with the current info. People moved and logged these TBs, people are watching them. They all have an interest in these TBs, and for better or worse, the continuing story of the Trackables should be told.

 

Here are the Green Jeep TBs I see in Geowoodstock 4's inventory:

http://coord.info/TB12TQF

http://coord.info/TB12KY9

http://coord.info/TB12P80

http://coord.info/TB1307F

http://coord.info/TB13455

http://coord.info/TB13600

http://coord.info/TB138QA

 

Three or four of these have decent photos, none of which show the laminated tag that you see in the ebay listing. So it may be possible to narrow these down and figure out which TB it is.

Edited by kunarion

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his story of finding them in a bag of Geocaching items at Goodwill could be very plausible. A geocacher passes away with a bunch of trackables he just picked up, family goes through his belongings (What the heck are these?) and donates them to Goodwill. NOT out of the question at all.

Then these are the questions that can settle it:

 

1) When was the Jeep TB logged back into Geowoodstock 4, was that typed in 2007 or in 2012?

If the log was past-dated to "2007", but done recently, that means something's up. Something like: The current holder of the TBs is the same person selling them (there is no "thrift store"), and is the same person who changed the logs to prepare to sell the TB on ebay. REGARDLESS, there's NO WAY that the TBs were dropped again into "Geowoodstock 4" in 2007. Groundspeak needs to go fix that, the logs are wrong.

 

2) Is the currently listed TB holder dead?

If the currently listed holder passed away this year, then the TBs may have been donated by his next-of-kin, so the thrift store story is true. However, the TBs are not owned by the non-cacher who's selling them on ebay. They're owned by Jeep.

Edited by kunarion

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In reading the logs posted on this Event, it seems there was a thief that took off with several coins and bugs, perhaps the same person who is now trying to sell the jeep TB on Ebay

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In reading the logs posted on this Event, it seems there was a thief that took off with several coins and bugs, perhaps the same person who is now trying to sell the jeep TB on Ebay

Is there a list of these Jeeps? I only found seven green Jeep TBs (please, will someone else count them and let me know!) listed in Geowoodstock 4, all listed in possession of one cacher (who has "dropped" them into Geowoodstock 4, eight months after the Event was over, for some weird reason). AND that cacher seems like a real nice guy, based on what I've seen over in Geocaching.com. The ebay lister is a real... um, not so nice...

 

And, according to the ebay lister, the Jeep in question is currently in the Geowoodstock 4 inventory:

 

=========

On Aug-19-12 at 18:01:44 PDT, seller added the following information:

 

I was able to get this information from the geocaching site.:

Owner: Jeep4x4_2006

Released: Tuesday, August 01, 2006

Origin: Michigan, United States

Recently Spotted: In GeoWoodstock 4

The owner hasn't set their collectible preference.

=========

Edited by kunarion

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And, according to the ebay lister, the Jeep in question is currently in the Geowoodstock 4 inventory:

 

=========

On Aug-19-12 at 18:01:44 PDT, seller added the following information:

 

I was able to get this information from the geocaching site.:

Owner: Jeep4x4_2006

Released: Tuesday, August 01, 2006

Origin: Michigan, United States

Recently Spotted: In GeoWoodstock 4

The owner hasn't set their collectible preference.

=========

 

Well that pretty much makes it clear that this TB is not his but is owned by Jeep, so how can you sell something that does not officially belong to you? Regardless if he "bought it from a Thrift Store" excuse, once you are made aware that this item belongs to another, isn't it unethical to profit from it?

Edited by Untied_ShoeLaces

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once you are made aware that this item belongs to another, isn't it unethical to profit from it?

Yes. The seller has an avatar of [his daughter?]. What life lessons she's learning from him! The world didn't even need another one of that guy.

 

I'm thinking there's something real fishy about the whole deal. This may make the ebay sale turn out very badly, we'll have to wait and see.

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once you are made aware that this item belongs to another, isn't it unethical to profit from it?

Yes. The seller has an avatar of [his daughter?]. What life lessons she's learning from him! The world didn't even need another one of that guy.

 

I'm thinking there's something real fishy about the whole deal. This may make the ebay sale turn out very badly, we'll have to wait and see.

 

Well if Ebay fails to do anything and allows this sale to go on, then what is to stop others from profiting by selling other peoples TB's?

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Well if Ebay fails to do anything and allows this sale to go on, then what is to stop others from profiting by selling other peoples TB's?

Ebay allows this. Activated Trackables are sold frequently. Actually, there's no ID requirement for sales, so if I say "I'm the owner, whatever it says, that's me", no authority is checking on that. I guess it's "buyer beware", because unless they expect to sell it later the same way, or just keep it in a private collection, it's not much of a prize. Most activated TBs have the statement "and the Trackable will be adopted to the buyer upon payment", which of course this seller can't do.

Edited by kunarion

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The jeep sold for almost $43.

Would someone please reveal the history behind these TBs that are being collected and sold?

 

The "confused" seller had never heard of these Jeeps, merely bought them "in a bag at a thrift store", and had to look up the info. I asked why he's selling this item that has an obvious owner, and the seller had become an expert: "You don't understand the history behind these Jeeps". Yet no answers were posted in the listing.

 

The currently listed TB holder did some creative fiddling with the TB logs (unless I'm mistaken about which Jeeps these are, which is possible). Then they were "bought in a thrift store", and put up for sale on ebay. Parts of the story are missing.

 

AND there should be log notes on these Jeeps. "Sold on ebay" or something. These items have resurfaced -- but where's the info?

Edited by kunarion

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The jeep trackables were released as part of a promotional program between Jeep and Groundspeak in the US, over a 4 year (I think) period. They came in red, green, white and yellow for different years. If you found a jeep trackable it allowed you to enter a competition to win a jeep, or something like that. The jeep icons became very desirable at that time. I can remember doing a special early morning dash to a cache in England to get a white jeep and bring it back over the border to Wales - good fun at the time (even though UK cachers couldn't win a jeep we still had fun chasing the icons).

 

MrsB

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The jeep trackables were released as part of a promotional program between Jeep and Groundspeak in the US, over a 4 year (I think) period. They came in red, green, white and yellow for different years. If you found a jeep trackable it allowed you to enter a competition to win a jeep, or something like that. The jeep icons became very desirable at that time. I can remember doing a special early morning dash to a cache in England to get a white jeep and bring it back over the border to Wales - good fun at the time (even though UK cachers couldn't win a jeep we still had fun chasing the icons).

 

MrsB

People had to sign up to receive these Jeep TBs. There seems to have been a fee to receive one (in which case, there's the source of ownership confusion). They're somehow associated with Geowoodstock IV, but only a few were logged into that event, none by the owner.

Edited by kunarion

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The jeep trackables were released as part of a promotional program between Jeep and Groundspeak in the US, over a 4 year (I think) period. They came in red, green, white and yellow for different years. If you found a jeep trackable it allowed you to enter a competition to win a jeep, or something like that. The jeep icons became very desirable at that time. I can remember doing a special early morning dash to a cache in England to get a white jeep and bring it back over the border to Wales - good fun at the time (even though UK cachers couldn't win a jeep we still had fun chasing the icons).

 

MrsB

People had to sign up to receive these Jeep TBs. There seems to have been a fee to receive one (in which case, there's the source of ownership confusion). They're somehow associated with Geowoodstock IV, but only a few were logged into that event, none by the owner.

With all those that have reported to Ebay and Groundspeak, I was very surprised that the auction was allowed to continue. Thought one of those entities would have shut it down.

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Well that pretty much makes it clear that this TB is not his but is owned by Jeep, so how can you sell something that does not officially belong to you?

 

With all those that have reported to Ebay and Groundspeak, I was very surprised that the auction was allowed to continue. Thought one of those entities would have shut it down.

 

I think we, as geocachers, have a different perception of "ownership" when it comes to TB's than the general public does... not to mention the law. It would be interesting to see a court case where someone tried to prove ownership of a TB. Sure, you have an ID tag on it... but didn't you abandon it in a public place on purpose? It's a can of worms I'm betting eBay prefers to ignore.

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I see he now has a white jeep posted for sale... I looked into reporting the item, but the only violation that this fits in their given choices would be selling stolen property and apparently you have to be a law enforcement officer to report stolen property on eBay....

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I think we, as geocachers, have a different perception of "ownership" when it comes to TB's than the general public does... not to mention the law. It would be interesting to see a court case where someone tried to prove ownership of a TB. Sure, you have an ID tag on it... but didn't you abandon it in a public place on purpose? It's a can of worms I'm betting eBay prefers to ignore.

You're assuming that the premise is true, that it's not a Geocacher selling these. I'm not so sure. I also doubt that non-Geocachers would bid on such an item, when it only has some "value" within Geocaching itself. Ebay (and Groundspeak) ignores this at their peril. The can of worms has just begun to open.

 

You're also assuming that the general public is nothing but self-centered, dishonest thugs who have no comprehension of rights or ownership, who would sell an item on ebay when they know it's not their property to sell (you're right about that). "Geocachers" aren't immune to that.

 

The majority of my Trackables have a request for logs, regardless of the issue. I don't really care if you steal it, but do not leave me in the dark about it. I'm waiting for it to turn up, and if I knew it was gone for good, I could re-release a new copy today. I directly asked the guy to contact Groundspeak with the tracking numbers, so that logs could be done on the Jeep TBs, "sold on ebay" or whatever. He replied "Thanks for the input". Regardless of who thinks they own the TBs, proper logs should be made. Cachers need to know.

Edited by kunarion

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I see he now has a white jeep posted for sale...

I don't see that. Do you have a link?

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I see he now has a white jeep posted for sale...

I don't see that. Do you have a link?

 

It was a Buy It Now, sold for $40. - 221113764021

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I see he now has a white jeep posted for sale...

I don't see that. Do you have a link?

 

It was a Buy It Now, sold for $40. - 221113764021

 

Thank you, I thought I was going crazy when I tried to find it again this morning and couldn't

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I think we, as geocachers, have a different perception of "ownership" when it comes to TB's than the general public does.

Looks like we have a different perception of toy values, too.

Edited by kunarion

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I see he now has a white jeep posted for sale... I looked into reporting the item, but the only violation that this fits in their given choices would be selling stolen property and apparently you have to be a law enforcement officer to report stolen property on eBay....

 

I reported it a couple times on Ebay. I reported it as a "fraudulent" sale as the item did not belong to him and he had no right to profit from it!

It obviously made no difference to "the powers that be" at Ebay! They are only interested in collecting their fees!

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I reported it a couple times on Ebay. I reported it as a "fraudulent" sale as the item did not belong to him and he had no right to profit from it!

It obviously made no difference to "the powers that be" at Ebay! They are only interested in collecting their fees!

It's quite obviously fraudulent to any potential bidder. The 2nd listing still has the same preposterous story that the seller has no idea about Goecaking or whatever it's called oh well I looked it up and I guess it's rare cause I definitely did buy a bagful at some unnamed thrift store.

 

Well, let's see how this plays out. It seems to me that Ebay and other "powers that be" have a huge wake-up call coming.

Edited by kunarion

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I think we, as geocachers, have a different perception of "ownership" when it comes to TB's than the general public does... not to mention the law. It would be interesting to see a court case where someone tried to prove ownership of a TB. Sure, you have an ID tag on it... but didn't you abandon it in a public place on purpose? It's a can of worms I'm betting eBay prefers to ignore.

You're assuming that the premise is true, that it's not a Geocacher selling these. I'm not so sure. I also doubt that non-Geocachers would bid on such an item, when it only has some "value" within Geocaching itself. Ebay (and Groundspeak) ignores this at their peril. The can of worms has just begun to open.

 

You may be right about the seller. But here I was really referring to the various people who would be involved in an ownership dispute: law enforcement, judges, the entire eBay legal department, the viewers of that particular Judge Judy episode... :anitongue:

 

You're also assuming that the general public is nothing but self-centered, dishonest thugs who have no comprehension of rights or ownership, who would sell an item on ebay when they know it's not their property to sell (you're right about that). "Geocachers" aren't immune to that.

Okay, in this light I guess I was thinking of the seller, along with the general public. These old adages came to mind: "Finders, keepers" and "Possession is nine-tenths of the law." Self-centered dishonest thugs works too.

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he's got another green jeep on Ebay!

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-trackable-Green-Jeep-/221114031021?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item337b6c5bad#ht_500wt_949

 

Looks like we now know what happened to a number of the Travelers that disappeared from the Geowoodstock IV event!

 

.....and there goes another one that he has sold! He has now made $120 off of these TB's! Where's the justice?

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Looks like we now know what happened to a number of the Travelers that disappeared from the Geowoodstock IV event!

I only see a few that were actually logged into the Geowoodstock 4. The first one had its TB info shown, and it is currently in Geowoodstock 4's inventory. Check the list of just the Green Jeeps (post #20), there was some funny business with the logs before these turned up on ebay. Are these the same Jeeps?

Edited by kunarion

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.....and there goes another one that he has sold! He has now made $120 off of these TB's! Where's the justice?

Ask again in two weeks. :ph34r:

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Were any official Jeep TBs actually at Geowoodstock 4? Got links?

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Once again, he has posted another jeep on ebay - He is making a killing on these;

 

item #221115323094

 

He actually has 2 listed on Ebay right now :anibad:

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