Fragmentation

[+drsolly]

I've been wondering about how come with the number of cachers growing so much, the number of posts to this forum is so much less than it used to be. I think the answer is fragmentation.

 

Once upon a time, there was this forum and GAGB. Now there's forums and message boards for most regions in the UK - any time now, I'm expecting a message board for people who live within three kilometers of Little Chalfont. And there's Facebook, that's another dozen forums. Diversity is sometimes good, but you get less discussion about topics that aren't purely local when there's 30 forums instead of two. So many posts now are "I went out caching yesterday and found four caches".

[+BCNorwich]

Hi,

I found five, , , Oh! and completely agree with all you say. How do we scupper Facebook, that really is the lowest of all trash.

 

Regards Bernard

[+The Blorenges]

I've been wondering about how come with the number of cachers growing so much, the number of posts to this forum is so much less than it used to be. I think the answer is fragmentation.

 

Once upon a time, there was this forum and GAGB. Now there's forums and message boards for most regions in the UK - any time now, I'm expecting a message board for people who live within three kilometers of Little Chalfont. And there's Facebook, that's another dozen forums. Diversity is sometimes good, but you get less discussion about topics that aren't purely local when there's 30 forums instead of two. So many posts now are "I went out caching yesterday and found four caches".

 

Where's the Like button?... Where's the Like button?... Oh... No... This isn't facebook... Wrong tab!

 

 

Activity on the UK regional geocaching forums has diminished considerably over the last year or so. Most of the "chat" seems to be on facebook.

 

MrsB

[+MartyBartfast]

 

Activity on the UK regional geocaching forums has diminished considerably over the last year or so. Most of the "chat" seems to be on facebook.

 

MrsB

 

I resisted Facebook until fairly recently when I signed up because all the discussion seems to have migrated there,but even then it's fragmented, I'm currently following 6 Geocaching groups, and often the same discussion ends up being posted in more than one.

 

Personally I preferred it when everything was on here , but then there were a couple of bust ups which I think led to people moving off these forums and starting the fragmentation.

Edited August 4, 2012 by MartyBartfast

[I!]

I was going to joke that the rot set in when geocachers moved off USENET ... but then I clicked around and found things have got pretty risqué over there. I typed "geocaching" into the first news searcher I could find and was presented with a "$10 per month special" advert for unlimited bandwidth with a rather attractive lady wearing not very much.

[+drsolly]

Hi,

I found five, , , Oh! and completely agree with all you say. How do we scupper Facebook, that really is the lowest of all trash.

 

Regards Bernard

 

I've found a way to deal with Facebook. Twitter also.

[+Griff Grof]

There are a few reasons why other sites may be much more appealing than over here. For a start, there are no boards; one forum, with all the threads, over all the topics mixed up. Secondly, only two pages of topics come up; with all the older ones vanished and censored for no one to see - this is not good at all; I like to see older threads for reference - I understand this is probably what Groundspeak does automatically, and not the leaders of this UK board, but still, I know it is something several people don't like. And lastly, of the people that do post over here, it is less likely they have much in common - they are all over the country. Whilst with regional forums, everyone has something in common - living in the area, with the same caches, and the same news and gossip. The one thing I do like about these forums is that you can keep in contact with the wider national community; but the GAGB forums are equally good for that too.

 

I'm the current administrator on the CacheWalkerforums - home to a caching group spread across Gloucestershire/Warwickshire/Worcestershire/Oxfordshire, and we keep our group going strong by holding pub events with a pre-event walk every 3-4 months; which always seem popular. Our group is 5 years old in September, but anyone can join our forum (it's not necessarily regional at all)and join in with the general Geocaching discussion - I have too noticed only a small fraction of members joining in recently; down from many who did use to post. But then again most of our members are elsewhere for Mega's etc. As you said drsolly, I blame this all on Facebook!

 

I don't do, and don't like Facebook for Geocaching groups; thus I have declined several offers to join some. Facebook is for connecting with friends, and although Geocaching groups on FB do that, forums can too and they are much better for the purpose in my view. I don't like the Facebook group interface at all, and so it will always be forums for Geocaching for me

[+The Blorenges]

Secondly, only two pages of topics come up; with all the older ones vanished and censored for no one to see - this is not good at all; I like to see older threads for reference - I understand this is probably what Groundspeak does automatically, and not the leaders of this UK board, but still, I know it is something several people don't like...

 

Just in case you haven't found it...

 

At the bottom of each and every Groundspeak forum you'll see a link "Click here to see filter options". *Click*. Select "Show all" from the drop down. Check "Remember filters". Click "Go".

 

Voila! 364 pages of UK Geocaching goodness going back to 2001.

 

MrsB

[+Griff Grof]

Ohhh - I didn't know that, thanks Mrs B

[team tisri]

Hi,

I found five, , , Oh! and completely agree with all you say. How do we scupper Facebook, that really is the lowest of all trash.

 

Regards Bernard

 

I've found a way to deal with Facebook. Twitter also.

 

Me too. Firefox has a lovely little X on the right hand side of the tab which I have found improves my experience of MyTwitFace immensely.

[+The Blorenges]

I think facebook geocaching groups are collecting a lot of cachers who have never used this, or any, Groundspeak forum. A few times I've referred to one of these forums, or given a link to a specific topic, only to have the reply, "Oooo, I've never look on there..." or similar.

 

MrsB

[+Griff Grof]

I agree completely Most people these days have Facebook, and go on it regularly, so for them it makes sense simply to join a group, when you can get a much better experience from using a forum, like this one

 

I'm not going to say which group or what blog, but it was debating whether a Facebook group of cachers was better than a forum; and they simply concluded that "You can reply to an any post on the go, from your phone using the Facebook app" - well, not everyone has smartphones that can do that, and those who do can log into any forum via 3G and most forums automatically are compatible with the Tapatalk app which is designed specifically for posting in forums on the go anyway.

Edited August 4, 2012 by Griff Grof

[+firestars]

Its well known on the 3 FB forums that I use that these message boards are mostly used by people you really would rather not spend time taking to.

[+Griff Grof]

I've heard from cachers who are members on both FB groups and forums that they find forums much more civilized than these FB groups...

Edited August 4, 2012 by Griff Grof

[+Amberel]

I've been wondering about how come with the number of cachers growing so much, the number of posts to this forum is so much less than it used to be. I think the answer is fragmentation.

 

Once upon a time, there was this forum and GAGB. Now there's forums and message boards for most regions in the UK - any time now, I'm expecting a message board for people who live within three kilometers of Little Chalfont. And there's Facebook, that's another dozen forums. Diversity is sometimes good, but you get less discussion about topics that aren't purely local when there's 30 forums instead of two. So many posts now are "I went out caching yesterday and found four caches".

It's a problem that has been growing over the last few years. I'm not sure that the regional forums are to blame - they have suffered from a drop in traffic at least as much as the national ones. As far as I can see it has pretty much all gone to facebook.

 

I have joined facebook and as a replacement for a forum it is abysmal. I have made the comment on facebook that it appears to be designed for chatter rather than discussion. It is difficult to follow threads, especially when they diversify, as inevitably they do. The interface is designed for single, short sentences and doesn't handle long posts at all well. In a busy group it is hard to locate anything that was written more than a few hours earlier. You get a huge amount of cross posting, and it seems to be encouraged.

 

And, as you rightly observe, there are participants who post complete trivia in a more or less continuous stream. And there is no way to filter this out.

 

BUT - it is an unfortunate fact that facebook is where most discussion now takes place. If we wish to take part in that discussion we have to put up with the downsides.

 

Incidentally, regarding the point others have made about facebook or the forums being the "more civilised" - I've not detected any difference in this aspect.

 

Rgds, Andy

[+drdick&vick]

Forums are easier to search for a specific item than FB. Forums are better for holding long term info such as the help sections as well.

Although I belong to about 4 FB caching groups I seldom post on there much preferring to use this forum and the GAGB one.

[+Griff Grof]

Well, let's ask this now:

 

Can anyone see any positives with FB caching groups at all?

 

All these replies seem to be concluding in the same way; Forums are better, but we have to put up with FB groups now. No one has found a positive with the groups, so can anyone reply with a specific positive on why FB groups are better; there must be a reason they're over taking forums in activity

 

[dodgydaved]

Well, let's ask this now:

 

Can anyone see any positives with FB caching groups at all?

 

All these replies seem to be concluding in the same way; Forums are better, but we have to put up with FB groups now. No one has found a positive with the groups, so can anyone reply with a specific positive on why FB groups are better; there must be a reason they're over taking forums in activity

 

 

Just my 2 pennorth:

 

One of the regional fora I belong to - which used to be exceptionally active - has not had a post since 24th June. The majority of postings on the GAGB forum appear to be in O/T or "fun" threads.

 

Perhaps the reason for the migration to FB is that there there is some greater flexibility.

 

You can "choose" who you talk/listen to; opinions seem to be more respected in FB groups, generally less ridiculing and flaming; they are not moderated - you can slip O/T with out getting a "slap".

 

As I said, just my 2pennorth :(

[+The Brat Pack]

I agree with most of the comments made here regarding Facebook. Although I am a member of the South Wales FB Group and the GAGB Group on Facebook I am not a regular Facebook user. Consequently I find that it is difficult to pick up on threads when you may only log on infrequently. It might work for those who spend most of their time on-line and check postings hourly (or so it seems) but these Forums (and the now defunct South Wales Forum) were idea for those of us that dip in infrequently.

[+Happy Humphrey]

I'm a regular Facebook user but not for geocaching-related stuff. A centralised forum like this is much better for discussion purposes.

 

But I was thinking about the decline of this forum only the other day and I think that it's been in gradual decline for some time now (years rather than months), not particularly related to Facebook. I think that part of the problem is that people want a forum for various different purposes and although it actually works for most of the time there are occasions when people are put off; possibly through misunderstanding the nature of such forums in general.

[+smstext]

i think the difference being fb forums post straight to your phone, where as a forum like this doesnt (unless ive missed a tool somewhere). also with more regional sites you tend to find out more things of use to you in your area not 100 miles away.

[team tisri]

I'm a regular Facebook user but not for geocaching-related stuff. A centralised forum like this is much better for discussion purposes.

 

But I was thinking about the decline of this forum only the other day and I think that it's been in gradual decline for some time now (years rather than months), not particularly related to Facebook. I think that part of the problem is that people want a forum for various different purposes and although it actually works for most of the time there are occasions when people are put off; possibly through misunderstanding the nature of such forums in general.

 

I can't help thinking part of the problem with forums (any forum, not just this one) is that after a while just about everything has been done to death. From the perspective of the new user they come to a group wanting to learn, wanting to ask questions, wanting to get some of the group wisdom and yet from the group's perspective here comes yet another user asking "which GPS is best", "how do I do .... with my .... GPS". So the new user gets a fairly short answer saying "need more information" or "RTFM" and it turns into a bicker-fest with some wanting to retype the same answer for the 143rd time to help the new user and others inviting them to put some thought into the question and maybe look at the answers the last 142 people with the same question were given.

 

Throw in the way some folks say things to a faceless avatar that they wouldn't say face-to-face, and the way the written word alone loses something like 93% of the communication of face-to-face speech (and the associated misunderstandings that can occur) and people start to take offence, regard the forum as an unfriendly place to be, and drift away.

[+Griff Grof]

i think the difference being fb forums post straight to your phone, where as a forum like this doesnt (unless ive missed a tool somewhere). also with more regional sites you tend to find out more things of use to you in your area not 100 miles away.

 

With regards to posting from your phone making FB groups better, on my previous reply I put: "well, not everyone has smartphones that can do that, and those who do can log into any forum via 3G and most forums automatically are compatible with the Tapatalk app which is designed specifically for posting in forums on the go anyway."

 

I'm a regular Facebook user but not for geocaching-related stuff. A centralised forum like this is much better for discussion purposes.

 

But I was thinking about the decline of this forum only the other day and I think that it's been in gradual decline for some time now (years rather than months), not particularly related to Facebook. I think that part of the problem is that people want a forum for various different purposes and although it actually works for most of the time there are occasions when people are put off; possibly through misunderstanding the nature of such forums in general.

 

I can't help thinking part of the problem with forums (any forum, not just this one) is that after a while just about everything has been done to death. From the perspective of the new user they come to a group wanting to learn, wanting to ask questions, wanting to get some of the group wisdom and yet from the group's perspective here comes yet another user asking "which GPS is best", "how do I do .... with my .... GPS". So the new user gets a fairly short answer saying "need more information" or "RTFM" and it turns into a bicker-fest with some wanting to retype the same answer for the 143rd time to help the new user and others inviting them to put some thought into the question and maybe look at the answers the last 142 people with the same question were given.

 

Throw in the way some folks say things to a faceless avatar that they wouldn't say face-to-face, and the way the written word alone loses something like 93% of the communication of face-to-face speech (and the associated misunderstandings that can occur) and people start to take offence, regard the forum as an unfriendly place to be, and drift away.

 

I think that applies for FB groups more than forums. With more space to reply, they're not going to get a short answer for anything. Why would someone be offended on a forum? You can say whatever you want on FB; on a forum you are in a controlled environment with word censors etc so you are less likely to take offence than on a FB group - REAL names show up, some you may not recognise, but you may recognise their caching name so they no longer seem like strangers. And "face to face" you cannot do that on Facebook either so the written word will still loose communication.

[+Us 4 and Jess]

I'm a regular Facebook user but not for geocaching-related stuff. A centralised forum like this is much better for discussion purposes.

 

I totally agree with HH

 

I live on FaceBook I am a Cafe World and FarmVille addict (yes I know it's sad but it keeps me out of trouble ) but I very rarely use FaceBook for anything to do with geocaching, I too think a single centralised forum which is made for the sole of talking about your chosen hobby/sport/addiction is best.

 

Although if anyone wants to set up a Durham Cachers Forum on FaceBook I am sure I would join

 

M

[+Us 4 and Jess]

Perhaps the reason for the migration to FB is that there there is some greater flexibility.

 

You can "choose" who you talk/listen to; opinions seem to be more respected in FB groups, generally less ridiculing and flaming; they are not moderated - you can slip O/T with out getting a "slap".

 

As I said, just my 2pennorth :(

 

I think the flexibility thing could be right....i think we have all had some slaps on here in our time over the years, some deserved more than others, I think a lot of the more weathered cachers hold back in this forum because they know what has happened in the past...and the Yanks will always have us by the short n curlies and you really have to think before you type in this forum.

 

Yes you can choose who you are friends with and who your not on FB, yes you can choose to read Fanny Adams threads but to ignore what Joe Bloggs writes about, but isn't that going to give your a biased answer to your questions ect, of course all of your friends are going to agree with you, doesn't this make the FB forums cliquey?

 

If I ask a question in here to people I know and don't know at least some will say yes thats a fab idea because....and others will say no thats a crap idea because...and at least I can weigh up the pros and cons!!

 

I left a regional forum lately because of the bad language, I don't need to read eff, peeing and blinding in geocaching forums, I always think my kids were 10 and 14 when we started caching and they started coming in here reading about this mad hobby/sport/addiction so there will be many kids on the forums reading the FB forums that are not moderated, also I think you have to be 13 to have a FB account? So that stops the younger kids, is that a good or bad thing? So maybe out moderated forum here is a good idea?

 

There are loads of pros and cons both ways I think, but myself personally I use FB for daft games and nattering to friends, family ect and I use this forum for geocaching.....Simples

 

M

Edited August 6, 2012 by Us 4 and Jess

[+Griff Grof]

Perhaps the reason for the migration to FB is that there there is some greater flexibility.

 

You can "choose" who you talk/listen to; opinions seem to be more respected in FB groups, generally less ridiculing and flaming; they are not moderated - you can slip O/T with out getting a "slap".

 

As I said, just my 2pennorth :(

 

I think the flexibility thing could be right....i think we have all had some slaps on here in our time over the years, some deserved more than others, I think a lot of the more weathered cachers hold back in this forum because they know what has happened in the past...and the Yanks will always have us by the short n curlies and you really have to think before you type in this forum.

 

Yes you can choose who you are friends with and who your not on FB, yes you can choose to read Fanny Adams threads but to ignore what Joe Bloggs writes about, but isn't that going to give your a biased answer to your questions ect, of course all of your friends are going to agree with you, doesn't this make the FB forums cliquey?

 

If I ask a question in here to people I know and don't know at least some will say yes thats a fab idea because....and others will say no thats a crap idea because...and at least I can weigh up the pros and cons!!

 

I left a regional forum lately because of the bad language, I don't need to read eff, peeing and blinding in geocaching forums, I always think my kids were 10 and 14 when we started caching and they started coming in here reading about this mad hobby/sport/addiction so there will be many kids on the forums reading the FB forums that are not moderated, also I think you have to be 13 to have a FB account? So that stops the younger kids, is that a good or bad thing? So maybe out moderated forum here is a good idea?

 

There are loads of pros and cons both ways I think, but myself personally I use FB for daft games and nattering to friends, family ect and I use this forum for geocaching.....Simples

 

M

 

Well said I agree completely with this; but you'd be surprised how many people ignore the Facebook 13 rule

[+ivanidea]

I think the only problem with the Groundspeak forum is it can be restrictive - we can't talk about fundraising for good causes for one.

 

It's only recently we got our localised for sale thread back.

[+keehotee]

Forums are easier to search for a specific item than FB. Forums are better for holding long term info such as the help sections as well.

 

You're ignoring the fact that Google (and other search engines) offers a far better search facility than this forum ever has - and will bring up posts on many more forums than this, FB and the GAGB.....

[+Griff Grof]

Facebook groups don't rank high on Google; partly because they don't have their own domain and site traffic to help them rank high. You might eventually find a FB group on something like page 10; all forums rank on page 1

Edited August 6, 2012 by Griff Grof

[+metal-bijou]

Well, let's ask this now:

 

Can anyone see any positives with FB caching groups at all?

 

All these replies seem to be concluding in the same way; Forums are better, but we have to put up with FB groups now. No one has found a positive with the groups, so can anyone reply with a specific positive on why FB groups are better; there must be a reason they're over taking forums in activity

 

 

Instand e-mails to notify you of new topics, why have to visit the forum to see what's new.

Automatically following a thread if you comment in it.

useful mobile apps

 

Generally the conversations are very different though and actually I just wish this forum had those features.

[+Griff Grof]

Which features would you like it to have?

[+metal-bijou]

Which features would you like it to have?

 

Instand e-mails to notify you of new topics, why have to visit the forum to see what's new.

Automatically following a thread if you comment in it.

[+abanazar]

Which features would you like it to have?

Instand e-mails to notify you of new topics, why have to visit the forum to see what's new.

Automatically following a thread if you comment in it.

1. 
    
   
2. Watch Topic button on the top of any given thread enables emails (I have used this occasionally and it works)
   
3. Watch Forum button on the top of the main UK forum page (I imagine this works in a similar way for new topics, but I haven't ever used it)
    
   

For (1) you still have to click the link in the email, which takes you to the new item in the thread, rather than seeing the new comment in the email, but it works OK.

[+Griff Grof]

Ahh... they are indeed good features :D I suppose one could try to build that into a forum

[+Griff Grof]

Ahh... they are indeed good features :D I suppose one could try to build that into a forum

[+MartyBartfast]

Ahh... they are indeed good features :D I suppose one could try to build that into a forum

 

Ahh... they are indeed good features :D I suppose one could try to build that into a forum

 

And you get two postings for the price of one on here, you dont get THAT sort of value on FaceSlap

[+Griff Grof]

:laughing:

[+metal-bijou]

2 Watch Forum [/i]button on the top of the main UK forum page (I imagine this works in a similar way for new topics, but I haven't ever used it)

 

For (1) you still have to click the link in the email, which takes you to the new item in the thread, rather than seeing the new comment in the email, but it works OK.

 

I'd never noticed that one. Will give it a go now, hopefully it won't just be a link like the watch thread.

[+metal-bijou]

- any time now, I'm expecting a message board for people who live within three kilometers of Little Chalfont.

 

I do believe that your "wish" has almost been granted with a facebook group for those living in Chesham.

[+drsolly]

- any time now, I'm expecting a message board for people who live within three kilometers of Little Chalfont.

 

I do believe that your "wish" has almost been granted with a facebook group for those living in Chesham.

 

Fortunately, I don't know about it.