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Asking for favorites in the cache description


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This is a spin-off of another topic I recently posted here. I saw that someone had posted in their cache description a note asking people to give their cache a favorite if they liked it. I had never seen this before in any caches that i had found and wasn't sure what to think about it. Does it abuse the system by soliciting for favorites, or is it just a reminder that favorites can be awarded to great caches? I wouldn't include this in my own cache pages, even though I love getting favorites, but I'm not sure how I would feel about giving a favorite point to someone who asked for one in their cache description. What are your thoughts?

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> ... a note asking people to give their cache a favorite if they liked it.

 

Seems rather misguided. Most people will sensibly just ignore it. Some will allow themselves to be annoyed by the note and will probably rant about it here. Few, if any, will be persuaded to assign a favourite they would not otherwise have given.

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This is a spin-off of another topic I recently posted here. I saw that someone had posted in their cache description a note asking people to give their cache a favorite if they liked it. I had never seen this before in any caches that i had found and wasn't sure what to think about it. Does it abuse the system by soliciting for favorites, or is it just a reminder that favorites can be awarded to great caches? I wouldn't include this in my own cache pages, even though I love getting favorites, but I'm not sure how I would feel about giving a favorite point to someone who asked for one in their cache description. What are your thoughts?

 

Its tacky like another poster said, but I could see it if someone put a lot of time or effort in on the cache.

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Oh, I actually saw one on a pedestrian bridge between Cincinnati and Newport, KY last weekend. It didn't bother me at all. I actually couldn't look for it, because there was some kind of breast cancer wine tasting thing going on that blocked off that side of the walkway. Tacky? I suppose, but it I couldn't care less. It was indeed an awesome location. Not like I've ever seen someone beg for favorite points on a lame turd or anything. :lol:

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OK, so the cache you are talking about is one of mine. At the time I saw it as a gentle reminder and not a plea for points. I included it after seeing it on a few other cache pages in my area. Around that same time there had been a forum discussion about the purpose of fav points and how people forgetting to award them or just handing them out to their friend's hides kinda defeats the purpose of helping people filter caches.

 

I'm a guy who likes to read all or at least a good portion of the logs on every cache page I view. While reading that thread I thought about all the times I've seen someone mention that a particular cache was the "best ever" or their "favorite to date", but then didn't award a fav point :unsure: I've seen it on my own caches a couple of times. Always makes me wonder if they just forgot.

 

I'm a firm believer that the best way to improve the quality of caches in your area is to lead by example. When I hide a cache my goal is to do hides that represent what I think Geocaching should be about and that are something I'd like to find myself. My hope is that they inspire others to think about quality when they do their next hide. Acquiring a lot of fav points is the best way to bring quality caches to others attention.

 

In hindsight I guess it does seem a bit cheesy, but hey, we spend hundreds of dollars to run around finding tupperware and Mc Toys in the bushes, what could be more cheesy than that :lol: Did mentioning favs on the page cause anyone to leave a point that didn't want to, not likely. Did it remind anyone who was in the middle of logging 20 or 30 finds that they wanted to leave a point, perhaps, but who knows. What I do know is that a lot of people have really enjoyed this one and a few have mentioned that all the fav points is what brought them out to find it. A few people have contacted me about importing the idea into their area.

 

So in the end, if mentioning favs reminded a few people who might have forgotten to leave a point, and a lot of points brought a few people to find this specific cache, and my cache inspired a few to hide better quality in their own areas, then it's worth it, cheesy or not.

Edited by Mushroom finder
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It's a little tacky as others have said, very much like the table server asking for a tip.

I put a lot of thought and effort into providing the best caches I can and I think all of them deserve a favorite point each time it is found, but that has not happened nor was it expected, so be it.

If one is awarded a point, that's great, if not, that's OK too.

I consider favorite points much like tips, not a right but a bonus for a job well done.

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I think it kind of like a waitress asking for a tip. You know....."The bill's $29.95. Did you enjoy the meal? You can pay at the front, have a great day and be sure to leave me a tip!"

 

A pretty good metaphor there.

 

It's not like folks don't know about favorites points...considering that they are shoved in your face after every log you post. :mad:

 

Also (and correct me if I'm wrong) regular members can't 'favorite' a cache...so you are teasing them with something they can't do...even if they wanted to. :(

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As someone who has done some/most of your caches, I would prefer such reminders or requests are left out of the cache description, but that's me.

Not to worry, you'll never see this on any of my cache pages. I enjoy putting out caches that people like, but wouldn't consider soliciting for a favorite point.

 

However, I don't think the analogy of a waitress asking for a tip is quite right. I think that would be more along the lines of a CO emailing and asking for a favorite point. I think it's more akin to having a credit card bill given to you with a "suggested tip" listed on it. Of course, I am also annoyed by those too. :D

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However, I don't think the analogy of a waitress asking for a tip is quite right.

 

Of course it is.

The CO 'served up' the cache, and now they are blatantly soliciting a reward for doing so.

Do I need to be reminded that I can tip the waitress?

NO.

Do I need to be reminded that I can award a favorite point?

NO.

It might not be as tangible a reward as monetary compensation, but it could forward their ability to qualify for a challenge cache or two.

 

No matter how you do it (publicly on the cache page, or privately in an email) begging for favorites points is totally not appropriate.

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However, I don't think the analogy of a waitress asking for a tip is quite right.

 

Of course it is.

The CO 'served up' the cache, and now they are blatantly soliciting a reward for doing so.

Do I need to be reminded that I can tip the waitress?

NO.

Do I need to be reminded that I can award a favorite point?

NO.

It might not be as tangible a reward as monetary compensation, but it could forward their ability to qualify for a challenge cache or two.

 

No matter how you do it (publicly on the cache page, or privately in an email) begging for favorites points is totally not appropriate.

Woah, take it down a notch there hot rod! No reason to get worked up over my reply. While I tend to agree that either way isn't really appropriate, I just thought the analogy was a bit off. A cache page isn't addressing you personally, but rather every person gets the same text on the screen. In the same way that a "suggested tip" is printed on every person's bill that goes to an establishment that has that format. An email to a finder is a personal communication directed at an individual finder, in the same way that a waitress would address a diner personally when reminding them to not forget to tip her.

 

But as I stated, you won't find these type of reminders on any of my cache pages. When I pose a question like this in a forum, I generally have my own opinion formed but try to phrase my question as neutrally as possible. In this case I'm not fond of the practice, but it probably wouldn't stop me from leaving a favorite if I was going to already. It also would not sway me to give a point if I was on the fence.

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I think it kind of like a waitress asking for a tip. You know....."The bill's $29.95. Did you enjoy the meal? You can pay at the front, have a great day and be sure to leave me a tip!"

 

Funny that exact example popped into my mind when I read the OP.

 

Shameless is all I can say.

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I think it's a bit tacky but if people actually used the Favs faithfully, it shouldn't come to this. But the only thing worse than the tackiness of asking for a favorite is the mean spiritedness of those who won't award a favorite if asked, no matter how good the cache is. To me that is an unforgivable offense.

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Since I don't usually read the cache page, the request for a fav point really doesn't offend me. As to how I select caches to favor, after a caching run I return and log my finds from my field notes. If one of them is particularly memorable for a reason I can articulate it gets a point.

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This is a spin-off of another topic I recently posted here. I saw that someone had posted in their cache description a note asking people to give their cache a favorite if they liked it. I had never seen this before in any caches that i had found and wasn't sure what to think about it. Does it abuse the system by soliciting for favorites, or is it just a reminder that favorites can be awarded to great caches? I wouldn't include this in my own cache pages, even though I love getting favorites, but I'm not sure how I would feel about giving a favorite point to someone who asked for one in their cache description. What are your thoughts?

 

It's completely tacky, but not quite as tacky as a CO who emails finders to solicit favorite points. Yes, that happens.

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This is a spin-off of another topic I recently posted here. I saw that someone had posted in their cache description a note asking people to give their cache a favorite if they liked it. I had never seen this before in any caches that i had found and wasn't sure what to think about it. Does it abuse the system by soliciting for favorites, or is it just a reminder that favorites can be awarded to great caches? I wouldn't include this in my own cache pages, even though I love getting favorites, but I'm not sure how I would feel about giving a favorite point to someone who asked for one in their cache description. What are your thoughts?

 

It's completely tacky, but not quite as tacky as a CO who emails finders to solicit favorite points. Yes, that happens.

+1. I'm sure I have no idea what you're talking about. :ph34r:

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OK, so the cache you are talking about is one of mine. At the time I saw it as a gentle reminder and not a plea for points. I included it after seeing it on a few other cache pages in my area. Around that same time there had been a forum discussion about the purpose of fav points and how people forgetting to award them or just handing them out to their friend's hides kinda defeats the purpose of helping people filter caches.

 

I'm a guy who likes to read all or at least a good portion of the logs on every cache page I view. While reading that thread I thought about all the times I've seen someone mention that a particular cache was the "best ever" or their "favorite to date", but then didn't award a fav point :unsure: I've seen it on my own caches a couple of times. Always makes me wonder if they just forgot.

 

I'm a firm believer that the best way to improve the quality of caches in your area is to lead by example. When I hide a cache my goal is to do hides that represent what I think Geocaching should be about and that are something I'd like to find myself. My hope is that they inspire others to think about quality when they do their next hide. Acquiring a lot of fav points is the best way to bring quality caches to others attention.

 

I agree with mushroom finder's above quote to a large degree, especially the line I highlighted in bold. I think there are a lot of premium member cachers who don't bother to ever award favorite points to any caches they find. In light of this, a polite reminder that if they particularly enjoyed a cache that they can award one of their favorite points does not seem out of line. Note the bolded text. This makes it an unforced option. If the cache really had no special apeal to the cacher, a favorite point is not requested or expected.

 

Another thing that I'd like to point out is that often I am less concerned with the number of favorites than the percentage of favorites. That is because sometimes I cache in a high population area where caches have more chance to have a high number of favorites despite a low percentage favorites due to high number of time it has been found. If, however, I am caching in a less densely populated area or looking at a new cache where the cache had less favorite points because it had been found a relatively few number of times, I find the percentage of favorites a much better measure of the cache quality.

 

Here's something to think about for those premium members who never assign favorite points to caches they find....

 

If someone places a cache with 8 favorite points out of the 10 premium member finds, this cache has a favorites percentage of 80% (8/10).

 

Now, if the next 3 people finding the cache all award it favorite points, the percentage changes to 81.8% (9/11), 83.3% (10/12) and 84.6% (11/13) with increases of +1.8%, +1.5%, and +1.3%, respectively. This is a total increase of only +4.6% for the addition of 3 favorite point finds.

 

Now, if instead the next 3 people finding the cache all do not award it favorite points, the percentage changes to 72.7% (8/11), 66.6% (8/12), and 61.5% (8/13) with decreases of -7.3%, -6.1%, and -5.1%, respectively. This is a total decrease of -28.5% due to 3 finds not assigning favorite points.

 

This example shows that not granting a favorite point to a cache that deserves one has a MUCH greater reduction in percentage favorites than the increase in percentage favorites by granting a favorite point.

 

So please, premium members, use your favorite points when a cache deserves them. It makes determining high quality caches that I'm likely to enjoy more reliable.

Edited by medoug
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It's tacky and lame, and I also thought of the waitress analogy. I can't imagine soliciting for a favorite point on one of my caches.

 

Tip jars are fairly common at coffee houses and other restaurants where there really isn't a waitperson. There's a wonderful diner in Tybee Island, Georgia that has a jar next to cache register labeled "beer money" that patrons can use to tip the cooks. They're in full view just behind a sit down counter and work like a well oiled machine. Whenever someone drops a dollar or so in the jar the head cook rings a bell, another might ring some sort of noise maker, and they all shout "beer money...thank you" without missing a beat. In way that could be considered soliciting tips but in this case, I see it as a reminder that the cooks are really doing most of the work and it's probably not obvious to most patrons that tipping the cooks is even an option. Somehow it feels a lot different than soliciting for favorite points.

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Favorite is in the eye of the beholder.

I don't trust other people's favorites to be the same as my kind of favorite, so I don't even look to see if a cache has any points. But I don't mind getting them either. I wouldn't go soliciting favorite points. I wouldn't give one if I was asked to. And I don't use them to decide where to go. I use cache page, cache type, and terrain to determine if I want to go looking for a cache. And I've only given out a few. Even one to a cache that was archived in 2006.

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I think it's a bit tacky but if people actually used the Favs faithfully, it shouldn't come to this. But the only thing worse than the tackiness of asking for a favorite is the mean spiritedness of those who won't award a favorite if asked, no matter how good the cache is. To me that is an unforgivable offense.

 

Mean spirited? you've got to be kidding.

It is tacky to ask for a tip (or a favorite point), it is MY choice to award or not and ONLY my choice.

To ask for an award is bad manners and I'm not likely to encourage bad manners by giving an award.

Give me a break.

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I don't find it tacky at all, and I honestly would not care.

 

I guess I fall into this camp. It doesn't bother me in the least if someone reminds me, without any needless grovelling about it. Kind of a timely thread, as I completed two pretty spectacular caches this last weekend, and after getting done writing up the logs, it suddenly dawned on me that I should have given them favorites (which I eventually went back and did).

 

So nope, I don't see any issue with reminding people of it.

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I think it's a bit tacky but if people actually used the Favs faithfully, it shouldn't come to this. But the only thing worse than the tackiness of asking for a favorite is the mean spiritedness of those who won't award a favorite if asked, no matter how good the cache is. To me that is an unforgivable offense.

 

Mean spirited? you've got to be kidding.

It is tacky to ask for a tip (or a favorite point), it is MY choice to award or not and ONLY my choice.

To ask for an award is bad manners and I'm not likely to encourage bad manners by giving an award.

Give me a break.

 

If I feel that a cache deserves a favorite point, I'll award it despite my feelings about the CO or their manners. I would probably log something like, "This cache is good enough that the owner shouldn't need to beg for favorite points".

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To use the tip analogy, I see it more like the place that leaves a jar on the counter rather than the person that asks for tips. It is easy to ignore if you don't wish to leave one, but serves as a reminder for those who may decide to leave one.

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I don't find it tacky at all, and I honestly would not care.

 

I guess I fall into this camp. It doesn't bother me in the least if someone reminds me, without any needless grovelling about it. Kind of a timely thread, as I completed two pretty spectacular caches this last weekend, and after getting done writing up the logs, it suddenly dawned on me that I should have given them favorites (which I eventually went back and did).

 

So nope, I don't see any issue with reminding people of it.

 

I don't have a problem with someone reminding folks about favorite points on the cache page, either.

 

But some folks like to get their knickers in knots over all kinds of things.

 

 

B.

Edited by Pup Patrol
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'I did enjoy your cache, and I'll be happy to give your cache a favorite point...just as soon as I can give an un-favorite point to that cache just down the road, placed on the guardrail behind the strip-mall next to the dumpster.'

 

AZcachemeister,

 

That ain't gonna happen. The reason geocaching started the favorites system in leau of a rating system. It was decided as a way to recognize exceptional caches without assigning negative critiques to the poor ones.

 

If everyone actively applied their favorites points to caches, the favorite points of all but the worst caches would go up. Then there would only be a few lame caches with 0 favorite points. The mediocre caches would have a small to moderate number of favorites. And, the best caches would have a large number of favorites.

 

The favorites system can eventually become a type of rating system if everyone would assign their favorite points. AZcachemeiser, you're not helping the system get to this point without using your favorites.

Edited by medoug
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'I did enjoy your cache, and I'll be happy to give your cache a favorite point...just as soon as I can give an un-favorite point to that cache just down the road, placed on the guardrail behind the strip-mall next to the dumpster.'

 

AZcachemeister,

 

That ain't gonna happen. The reason geocaching started the favorites system in leau of a rating system. It was decided as a way to recognize exceptional caches without assigning negative critiques to the poor ones.

 

If everyone actively applied their favorites points to caches, the favorite points of all but the worst caches would go up. Then there would only be a few lame caches with 0 favorite points. The mediocre caches would have a small to moderate number of favorites. And, the best caches would have a large number of favorites.

 

The favorites system can eventually become a type of rating system if everyone would assign their favorite points. AZcachemeiser, you're not helping the system get to this point without using your favorites.

 

I suppose it could work that way, but I don't see it happening in my lifetime.

 

I really don't have the time to agonize over which of my 10 recent finds deserves a favorite point.

I do, however, have some time to reflect on the quality of each cache I find and rate it on a scale of 1-5 (or even 1-10).

 

Probably the better caches I have found are now archived, giving them a favorite would be pointless.

Weeding out archived caches from my various bookmark lists is tedious enough, I don't have time to retract favorite points off a bunch of archived listings.

 

I suppose my time would be better spent working on that rather than wasting time in here. :blink:

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I really don't have the time to agonize over which of my 10 recent finds deserves a favorite point.

I do, however, have some time to reflect on the quality of each cache I find and rate it on a scale of 1-5 (or even 1-10).

Interesting. I find it much easier to decide whether a cache was one of my favorites (without taking my 10 most recent finds into account at all) than to decide how to rate something on a 5-point scale (or even worse, a 10-point scale).
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by medoug

"So please, premium members, use your favorite points when a cache deserves them. It makes determining high quality caches that I'm likely to enjoy more reliable."

 

I don't know about other areas but, in my part of the world, favorite points are being awarded to caches that are convenient and easy to get to.

This is a cruise ship destination and many don't have the time except to go to the nearest Park&Grab.

now, before someone flames me, there is nothing wrong with these caches, they are fine, they are also close by and take little effort to find.

Favorite Points do not necessarily indicate a high quality cache.(in the eye of this beholder).

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by medoug

"So please, premium members, use your favorite points when a cache deserves them. It makes determining high quality caches that I'm likely to enjoy more reliable."

 

I don't know about other areas but, in my part of the world, favorite points are being awarded to caches that are convenient and easy to get to.

This is a cruise ship destination and many don't have the time except to go to the nearest Park&Grab.

now, before someone flames me, there is nothing wrong with these caches, they are fine, they are also close by and take little effort to find.

Favorite Points do not necessarily indicate a high quality cache.(in the eye of this beholder).

 

There are SOME abnormalities. For example, a newer cacher from my area is racking up the favorite points just because of their containers, and the caches are mainly roadside park-n-grabs. And the containers are generally nothing more than novelty mint tins, and the cache is named after the particular novelty (Pokeman character, Pac Man character, Angry birds etc...)

 

I've seen people favorite very ordinary caches just because they were FTF. I've seen people favorite caches just because their friend placed them.

 

But you know what? I love the favorite points system, I think it works great. Even better than I would have predicted when it came out 2 years ago (or whatever). Hey, after Waymarking, Wherigo, and challenges, they had to get something right. :laughing:

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