Groundspeak shuts down my little geocaching store

[+red07ss]

So ya, like the title says, here's the story, its a good one.

 

I'm a small distributor catering to a local area, (Cache Me If You Can in Canada) and I went to place another Groundspeak merchandise order recently. On check-out I noticed that the option for USPS was no longer there, I could only ship via UPS. I thought it was a glitch

 

E-mailed Groundspeak, and they told me:

I'm afraid that it's not a glitch and we did remove the USPS shipping options. 
Over the years we have encountered countless issues with this shipping type including lost orders with little to no valid tracking capabilities provided by the United States Postal Service.  
This shipping type is time consuming for our shipping office which has often caused delays in getting orders out.  
The United States Postal Service has been making a lot of changes recently including closing facilities and increasing rates that keep us from offering cost effective and efficient shipping with them. 
We have great shipping rates with UPS and feel they have continued to offer better overall service.  This change went into effect on Friday March 30th.  
I do apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.

 

I then informed them that here in Canada, and everywhere else in the world (you know, outside the US) that when using UPS to ship items in from the US, I get hit with major fees.

1. The actual shipping cost from Groundspeak (about $20 for a $150 order)

2. Taxes when the package crosses the border (around $15 for $150 order)

3. Duty and Brokerage (For an order of $100 to $200 USD its $60, and goes up as the USD total of the order goes up)

 

So to ship in a $150 order it will cost me $80 to $90 just to get it to my door. Now I have to recover shipping costs via the prices of my items, which is impossible. Noone will pay $10 for a cache tag or $20+ for a micro geocoin or $20+ for a 3" vehicle travel bug. So I end up PAYING to sell Groundspeak items, now I like to support geocaching, but not that much.

 

Groundspeaks response to that:

Evan,

I do understand that this move will have a negative affect on some of our users and I do apologize for that.  I'm afraid that we don't have the ability to make exceptions on this at this time.  
The only suggestion I have if there's not a shipping broker that can help lower these fees, would be to consider placing larger orders more infrequently as this can likely help with shipping costs.

Most of our international distributors make very little, or break even off the official merchandise they carry, but find that carrying products they manufacture themselves or otherwise source help defer the costs.  Having the official merchandise gives them the exposure to bring geocachers to their shop sites.

 

Okay, so let me get this straight. Distributors are NOT suppose to make money off Groundspeak merchandise, and we are only suppose to break even. So after all the effort I take to advertise my business and their Groundspeak merchandise, website costs, and event sponsorship costs, I'm not suppose to benefit. I guess I should be happy that the mighty Groundspeak has even considered me as a distributor.

 

And bigger orders are not an option because I will just end up paying more in Duty, Brokerage, and Tax.

 

AWESOME, I will no longer be offering "official Groundspeak" merchandise in my store. Thanks Groundspeak for not caring, and forcing me into closing my store!!!!

[+Max and 99]

So ya, like the title says, here's the story, its a good one.

 

I'm a small distributor catering to a local area, (Cache Me If You Can in Canada) and I went to place another Groundspeak merchandise order recently. On check-out I noticed that the option for USPS was no longer there, I could only ship via UPS. I thought it was a glitch

 

E-mailed Groundspeak, and they told me:

I'm afraid that it's not a glitch and we did remove the USPS shipping options. 
Over the years we have encountered countless issues with this shipping type including lost orders with little to no valid tracking capabilities provided by the United States Postal Service.  
This shipping type is time consuming for our shipping office which has often caused delays in getting orders out.  
The United States Postal Service has been making a lot of changes recently including closing facilities and increasing rates that keep us from offering cost effective and efficient shipping with them. 
We have great shipping rates with UPS and feel they have continued to offer better overall service.  This change went into effect on Friday March 30th.  
I do apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.

 

I then informed them that here in Canada, and everywhere else in the world (you know, outside the US) that when using UPS to ship items in from the US, I get hit with major fees.

1. The actual shipping cost from Groundspeak (about $20 for a $150 order)

2. Taxes when the package crosses the border (around $15 for $150 order)

3. Duty and Brokerage (For an order of $100 to $200 USD its $60, and goes up as the USD total of the order goes up)

 

So to ship in a $150 order it will cost me $80 to $90 just to get it to my door. Now I have to recover shipping costs via the prices of my items, which is impossible. Noone will pay $10 for a cache tag or $20+ for a micro geocoin or $20+ for a 3" vehicle travel bug. So I end up PAYING to sell Groundspeak items, now I like to support geocaching, but not that much.

 

Groundspeaks response to that:

Evan,

I do understand that this move will have a negative affect on some of our users and I do apologize for that.  I'm afraid that we don't have the ability to make exceptions on this at this time.  
The only suggestion I have if there's not a shipping broker that can help lower these fees, would be to consider placing larger orders more infrequently as this can likely help with shipping costs.

Most of our international distributors make very little, or break even off the official merchandise they carry, but find that carrying products they manufacture themselves or otherwise source help defer the costs.  Having the official merchandise gives them the exposure to bring geocachers to their shop sites.

 

Okay, so let me get this straight. Distributors are NOT suppose to make money off Groundspeak merchandise, and we are only suppose to break even. So after all the effort I take to advertise my business and their Groundspeak merchandise, website costs, and event sponsorship costs, I'm not suppose to benefit. I guess I should be happy that the mighty Groundspeak has even considered me as a distributor.

 

And bigger orders are not an option because I will just end up paying more in Duty, Brokerage, and Tax.

 

AWESOME, I will no longer be offering "official Groundspeak" merchandise in my store. Thanks Groundspeak for not caring, and forcing me into closing my store!!!!

 

Wow, I had no idea how expensive it could be. Learned something new!

[+The_Incredibles_]

As a very small business, I understand your pain.

 

I once accidently had something sent by UPS and the brokerage fees were horrendous. Basically on that shipment, I made no money. If it was all like that, I would have to shut down.

 

Refusing to send by USPS is total b.s.

 

I order from Rite in the Rain and always get things sent by USPS, never had any problems.

 

If it's true that small businesses don't make money from selling Groundspeak products, I would be royally annoyed. So, what, people are supposed to work for free??????

Edited April 16, 2012 by The_Incredibles_

[+Glenn]

US Military stationed outside the of the US are also cut off if USPS is no longer an option.

 

Maybe Groundspeak can change their policy to using UPS or FedEx for orders inside the US and USPS for orders shipping to international and military zipcodes.

[+Donsfamilyofgirls]

This is so disappointing. Many of us in this community in Ontario, are too. I hope you can figure out a way around this.

[+Walts Hunting]

US Military stationed outside the of the US are also cut off if USPS is no longer an option.

 

Maybe Groundspeak can change their policy to using UPS or FedEx for orders inside the US and USPS for orders shipping to international and military zipcodes.

 

Not so sure about that. Military mail is sent to a us apo location after which the military takes over.

[+Turtle_Sask]

I would like to order (Geocaching items and non geocaching items) from the USA but I already know, just like you about all the fees which defeats the purpose of buying in the first place if your going to end up paying double the price to get it to your door. I really wish they offered a better way to ship to Canada, those border fees and duty fees are just ridiculous!

[AZcachemeister]

I see, it's all about what is most convenient for Groundspeak, and the customers be damned.

[Mr.Yuck]

This is very interesting, as well as very disappointing for Canada. You did get a nice personal response from Groundspeak, I'll give them that. You want this guy who lives about 5 miles from Canada as the crow flies, and about 12 miles from the nearest bridge, to smuggle some merchandise over? Just kidding, I didn't say that. Best of luck in getting this resolved.

[+The_Incredibles_]

This is very interesting, as well as very disappointing for Canada. You did get a nice personal response from Groundspeak, I'll give them that. You want this guy who lives about 5 miles from Canada as the crow flies, and about 12 miles from the nearest bridge, to smuggle some merchandise over? Just kidding, I didn't say that. Best of luck in getting this resolved.

 

Mr Yuck, we would be most interested.

[+The_Incredibles_]

OK, nevermind, I see you're in New York.

[+Glenn]

US Military stationed outside the of the US are also cut off if USPS is no longer an option.

 

Maybe Groundspeak can change their policy to using UPS or FedEx for orders inside the US and USPS for orders shipping to international and military zipcodes.

 

Not so sure about that. Military mail is sent to a us apo location after which the military takes over.

 

Exactly but last time I was overseas the apo location in the US only took mail from the USPS. It didn't accept anything from private carries like UPS or FedEx. Has this changed?

[jholly]

US Military stationed outside the of the US are also cut off if USPS is no longer an option.

 

Maybe Groundspeak can change their policy to using UPS or FedEx for orders inside the US and USPS for orders shipping to international and military zipcodes.

 

Not so sure about that. Military mail is sent to a us apo location after which the military takes over.

The OP's point is that GS will no longer ship USPS so that essentially shuts down mail via APO or FPO. Unless it changed APO and FPO do not accept UPS and FedEx.

[+JesandTodd]

I see, it's all about what is most convenient for Groundspeak, and the customers be damned.

 

How uncharacteristic of them...

[+ZeeCaching]

US Military stationed outside the of the US are also cut off if USPS is no longer an option.

 

Maybe Groundspeak can change their policy to using UPS or FedEx for orders inside the US and USPS for orders shipping to international and military zipcodes.

 

Yup! I' in Japan. If something isn't sent priority it takes 6+ weeks. Especially through FedEx for their "speedy" service

[+Olddffart]

Something that might work for you -

In this area most US border town have several businesses whose sole function is to receive and hold shipments (both mail & freight) for Canadian customers. Their charges are usually quite reasonable, in the order of $5 per parcel.

A lot of local businesses use this service , making a trip once a week or so to pick up and bring everything back through customs themselves. Much lower shipping costs as it is to a US address, and no brokerage fees! And depending on the total value and mood of the customs person, sometimes not even any taxes.!!

If you are within a reasonable driving distance of a US border town it's worth investigating.

.

[GOF and Bacall]

Something that might work for you -

In this area most US border town have several businesses whose sole function is to receive and hold shipments (both mail & freight) for Canadian customers. Their charges are usually quite reasonable, in the order of $5 per parcel.

A lot of local businesses use this service , making a trip once a week or so to pick up and bring everything back through customs themselves. Much lower shipping costs as it is to a US address, and no brokerage fees! And depending on the total value and mood of the customs person, sometimes not even any taxes.!!

If you are within a reasonable driving distance of a US border town it's worth investigating.

.

 

Some will even receive packages from UPS, FEDEX, whatever, and mail them to you. Do some research.

[+red07ss]

Thanks for all the replies everyone

 

Ya Groundspeak is just hurting themselves here.

 

Really sucks though, for all international distributors and even the individual customers ordering off the Groundspeak site.

[Mr.Yuck]

Something that might work for you -

In this area most US border town have several businesses whose sole function is to receive and hold shipments (both mail & freight) for Canadian customers. Their charges are usually quite reasonable, in the order of $5 per parcel.

A lot of local businesses use this service , making a trip once a week or so to pick up and bring everything back through customs themselves. Much lower shipping costs as it is to a US address, and no brokerage fees! And depending on the total value and mood of the customs person, sometimes not even any taxes.!!

If you are within a reasonable driving distance of a US border town it's worth investigating.

.

 

Some will even receive packages from UPS, FEDEX, whatever, and mail them to you. Do some research.

 

Cool. Ya' would think a guy who lives in a Border City like myself would have known that. Are you going to check this out Red? I looked, and you list your City in your profile. Alexandria Bay is pretty small, but I'll bet you Watertown has some of these businesses.

[+bflentje]

Something that might work for you -

In this area most US border town have several businesses whose sole function is to receive and hold shipments (both mail & freight) for Canadian customers. Their charges are usually quite reasonable, in the order of $5 per parcel.

A lot of local businesses use this service , making a trip once a week or so to pick up and bring everything back through customs themselves. Much lower shipping costs as it is to a US address, and no brokerage fees! And depending on the total value and mood of the customs person, sometimes not even any taxes.!!

If you are within a reasonable driving distance of a US border town it's worth investigating.

.

 

Yep.. I was going to suggest finding a reputable liaison to act as a go between.

[+dprovan]

2. Taxes when the package crosses the border (around $15 for $150 order)

3. Duty and Brokerage (For an order of $100 to $200 USD its $60, and goes up as the USD total of the order goes up)

Just out of curiousity: Why doesn't the USPS have to charge you for taxes and duty? Is it because if you use the USPS, you're supposed to pay them yourself?

[+thebruce0]

Interesting... not geocaching related, but I was very bothered and upset a few times in the recent past to be hit by additional fees when receiving just a general online store purchase, for which shipping costs were already included (not knowing I'd be hit up for more fees, on delivery, having chosen UPS delivery). Oh by the way, here's your delivery bill! umm... what? I already paid for shipping!

 

UPS is stupid. Avoid them. Groundspeak should know this and provide other courier options for international delivery.

Edited April 16, 2012 by thebruce0

[+The A-Team]

UPS is stupid. Avoid them. Groundspeak should know this and provide other courier options for international delivery.

Not to mention the frequent stories of their suspect handling practices. From what I've heard, they're well-known for making round packages square, and square packages round.

[+SurveyContactTeam]

Stories like this make me wonder what that whole "Free Trade" thing was about, anyway. *sigh*

 

I might have said Groundspeak is trying to get customers to order directly from them so they can make more money on their products (which would be fair), but near as I can tell Groundspeak won't ship anyone outside the US, let alone Canadians. We're supposed to order from our local retailers... who I guess also won't be ordering from Groundspeak anymore. Huh. Are they going to be changing their policy anytime soon?

 

This won't solve the OP's problem, but for what it's worth, I believe that if you're Canadian and mail ordering something from the States, you should be able to avoid duty and brokerage fees if your total order is less than $20 in value. It's often not worth the regular shipping charge to place such a small order ($20 item, $10 in shipping to Canada, ugh), but occasionally it works out.

[+ArcherDragoon]

So ya, like the title says, here's the story, its a good one.

 

I'm a small distributor catering to a local area, (Cache Me If You Can in Canada) and I went to place another Groundspeak merchandise order recently. On check-out I noticed that the option for USPS was no longer there, I could only ship via UPS. I thought it was a glitch

 

E-mailed Groundspeak, and they told me:

I'm afraid that it's not a glitch and we did remove the USPS shipping options. 
Over the years we have encountered countless issues with this shipping type including lost orders with little to no valid tracking capabilities provided by the United States Postal Service.  
This shipping type is time consuming for our shipping office which has often caused delays in getting orders out.  
The United States Postal Service has been making a lot of changes recently including closing facilities and increasing rates that keep us from offering cost effective and efficient shipping with them. 
We have great shipping rates with UPS and feel they have continued to offer better overall service.  This change went into effect on Friday March 30th.  
I do apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.

 

I then informed them that here in Canada, and everywhere else in the world (you know, outside the US) that when using UPS to ship items in from the US, I get hit with major fees.

1. The actual shipping cost from Groundspeak (about $20 for a $150 order)

2. Taxes when the package crosses the border (around $15 for $150 order)

3. Duty and Brokerage (For an order of $100 to $200 USD its $60, and goes up as the USD total of the order goes up)

 

So to ship in a $150 order it will cost me $80 to $90 just to get it to my door. Now I have to recover shipping costs via the prices of my items, which is impossible. Noone will pay $10 for a cache tag or $20+ for a micro geocoin or $20+ for a 3" vehicle travel bug. So I end up PAYING to sell Groundspeak items, now I like to support geocaching, but not that much.

 

Groundspeaks response to that:

Evan,

I do understand that this move will have a negative affect on some of our users and I do apologize for that.  I'm afraid that we don't have the ability to make exceptions on this at this time.  
The only suggestion I have if there's not a shipping broker that can help lower these fees, would be to consider placing larger orders more infrequently as this can likely help with shipping costs.

Most of our international distributors make very little, or break even off the official merchandise they carry, but find that carrying products they manufacture themselves or otherwise source help defer the costs.  Having the official merchandise gives them the exposure to bring geocachers to their shop sites.

 

Okay, so let me get this straight. Distributors are NOT suppose to make money off Groundspeak merchandise, and we are only suppose to break even. So after all the effort I take to advertise my business and their Groundspeak merchandise, website costs, and event sponsorship costs, I'm not suppose to benefit. I guess I should be happy that the mighty Groundspeak has even considered me as a distributor.

 

And bigger orders are not an option because I will just end up paying more in Duty, Brokerage, and Tax.

 

AWESOME, I will no longer be offering "official Groundspeak" merchandise in my store. Thanks Groundspeak for not caring, and forcing me into closing my store!!!!

The ironic part...UPS pays USPS to ship out their boxes to rural address frequently...

[+red07ss]

I would love to have a contact in the US that I can ship things to then pick up at some point. But the bridge is past Kingston, and it's about a 2 hour trip one way, once I put gas in the car, have lunch in Wayertown, and make my way back I would have wasted a day and not saved a whole lot. I would have to have another reason to go

other then to just pick up a shipment.

 

I don't know why UPS charges so much, but they list their charges clearly on their website.

[+Donsfamilyofgirls]

I wonder how or what the other Canadian distributors are doing? Since this is a recent change, some may not even realize it yet. Maybe you can all band together and petition Groundspeak.

[jholly]

.

Edited April 16, 2012 by jholly

[+DragonsWest]

So bizarre. I just placed an order with Groundsqueak, using their limited offer of Free Shipping and it went USPS with a tracking number, yet. Received it in a couple days and everything was smooth.

 

On the other hand, I've had trouble with United Parcel Service - claimed I signed for a parcel, which I couldn't have as I was at work, and the parcel had gone missing. Not once, but twice. This means my packages are always picked up Will Call from the UPS distro center near home. I have to pick up the orange slip, dodge their crummy phone menu to get CUSTOMER SERVICE and then mooch around somewhere until they call me back and tell me I can pick it up (sometimes they can't locate it and I have to return the next day.) YMMV

[+slukster]

UPS is stupid. Avoid them. Groundspeak should know this and provide other courier options for international delivery.

Not to mention the frequent stories of their suspect handling practices. From what I've heard, they're well-known for making round packages square, and square packages round.

 

You mean like this?

 

 

[+red07ss]

UPS is stupid. Avoid them. Groundspeak should know this and provide other courier options for international delivery.

Not to mention the frequent stories of their suspect handling practices. From what I've heard, they're well-known for making round packages square, and square packages round.

 

You mean like this?

 

 

 

Awesome Vids lol

[+Glenn]

UPS stories:

My Grandparents were visiting from out of state. The UPS driver decided that my Grandparents van would be the best place to leave my package. You know, instead of leaving it at the door and ringing the bell because we were, after all, at home. My Grandparents were two states away when they discovered a mysterious package addressed to me in their van. Thanks UPS!

 

No one was home at my parents house. So the UPS driver delivered my Dad's package two houses down. When my called to find out where his package was UPS claimed it was delivered a couple of days ago. When he went to make an insurance claim on the on it the driver fessed up to knowingly delivering it to another address. But then UPS wanted my Dad to go get the package from the mis-delivered address. Long story short, dirt bag neighbor claimed to have no knowledge of getting a package handed to him from the UPS driver with instructions to give it to my Dad when he got home. Because of all the finger pointing it took about 5 months for the insurance to pay up.

 

FedEx story:

Completely the opposite of UPS. FedEx refused to leave a package at my house because it was addressed to me and I wasn't there (I was at work). My wife was there but her name wasn't on the package. They attempted delivery again while I was at work. They left a notice with her that if they attempted another delivery and it failed that the package would be returned to sender. One option was to go to the FedEx office in person and pick up the package but their business hours and my working hours were the same. So I had to take a couple of hours off work to drive to the next town over to get my package. Although that policy was a pain my butt at least they weren't leaving my package in random cars or giving it away to my neighbors.

[+Montana CPR Guy]

Sorry about that situation.... that sucks!!!! I live 60 miles from the border, and if i can, we can work something out to get you your geocaching

Packages. Contact me .....

[I!]

So after all the effort I take to advertise my business and their Groundspeak merchandise, website costs, and event sponsorship costs, ...

You did all that and only then did you check supply costs?

[+ScooterDawg]

UPS is stupid. Avoid them. Groundspeak should know this and provide other courier options for international delivery.

Not to mention the frequent stories of their suspect handling practices. From what I've heard, they're well-known for making round packages square, and square packages round.

 

Hey, now! When I was in college I worked for UPS as a loader, unloader and sorter. I really have to say that I resent what you...

 

Ok, yeah, we did that. Nevermind.

[GOF and Bacall]

Just one of the many services available to forward packages.

[+A & J Tooling]

There are several firms out there with the sole intent, to get your material through customs as quick as possible. Find one and pay for their services. I do. My stuff passes through customs and the truck slows down just enough to be scanned and it is done. A few extra dollars a month and it saves me a ton of hassle. The big businesses use them, why don't you?

[+red07ss]

Just one of the many services available to forward packages.

 

There are several firms out there with the sole intent, to get your material through customs as quick as possible. Find one and pay for their services. I do. My stuff passes through customs and the truck slows down just enough to be scanned and it is done. A few extra dollars a month and it saves me a ton of hassle. The big businesses use them, why don't you?

 

Thanks for the links, but I have looked into these. They charge a monthly fee on top of a set up fee, then you have to pay (x) amount per pound of parcel or mail. Might as well just ship UPS because it will end up costing me anywhere between $120 to $200 a year just to have the account, then you have to pay more to ship your packages.

Edited April 17, 2012 by red07ss

[+red07ss]

Sorry about that situation.... that sucks!!!! I live 60 miles from the border, and if i can, we can work something out to get you your geocaching

Packages. Contact me .....

 

Thanks for the offer, but I'm gonna have to pass. This kind of situation can get complicated and time consuming. I work full time and do this on the side, I can afford it to get any more complicated or I'll just piss off customers. Late orders, no stock, etc.

 

But Thank You Montana CPR Guy