Brand New and trying to get started

[+Wolfiesden]

Howdy folks. I just signed up recently here (basic free membership) to see if this is something I want to continue to do. I am looking to geocache with my granddaughters as something to do this summer and perhaps continue with it in the future.

 

I work in Waukesha Wisconsin and live in Milwaukee so I have quite a few caches (according to searches here) to work with.

 

I have a Motorola Droid X2 Android phone and have downloaded a couple apps for geocaching on it. I was using "C:GEO" app. I also have the demo of "Nanogeo" but have not tried that one in the field.

 

So, I tried to find a couple near where I worked that should have been easy to find, the "Do Not Log or Find This Cache" (GC1ZATQ) and "Nike Site" (GCMPN3). I could find neither yet I see log entries of them being found.

 

If I can't find 1-1/2 to 2 star difficulty caches maybe I am doing something completely wrong here. Is the phone+app not suitable and do I really need an actual GPS unit?

 

Is there anyone in my area that could help me get started with some pretty easy rated cashes and help me figure out what I am doing wrong?

[+mpilchfamily]

Keep trying. Look at the hints and recent logs for the caches to find additional clues. Keep in min that your phone will only get you within about 10 feet of the posted coords and the person who placed the cache may have been 10 feet off from the actual location. So once your within about 20 or 30 feet of the cache its time to stop looking at your phone and start looking for possible hiding places. You will have many DNFs in the beginning. But over time you'll get use to looking for things that seem a bit out of place. You'll start noticing hiding spots you never noticed before and get use to the way people tend to hide cache. Then it will be easier to find the caches. So give it time and keep trying.

[+Gitchee-Gummee]

Your unit or the app have nothing to do with your finding or not finding the cache. They will only get you to the area of the cache. The rest is up to you.

 

The caches you listed look like fine starters, 'cept the clueless clue on one of them!

 

Practice will make you a better finder. 'Tis something you cannot learn by reading -- I think you know what I mean. There are lots of things to learn about geocaching, and reading is important, but it will not teach you how to "find". Ya gots to learn to walk afore you can run.

 

Best advice I have to offer: When your unit sends you one way, then switches you to another, and again back -- turn it off or put it away. It has taken you to the area and now you have to look for the cache, not AT your unit. That area size varies, usually about 20 - 30 ft. diameter. Too, remember that it takes you to the listed coordinates, not necessarily the cache proper. The cache was hidden by somebody using a GPSr (hopefully). Their 'accuracy' most likely will be a little different than yours.

 

Good luck and enjoy the wandering.

 

It is also a good idea (the method you are already using) to find a few BEFORE taking the little ones with you. Nothing is more aggravating than taking them for a good hunt and finding nothing. Practice before taking them with you.

[+Wolfiesden]

Trust me, I don't give up that easy. Two and done? No, not me. I am just looking for some pointers to get started.

 

I am a techie and do understand the whole GPS accuracy issue. I am pretty sure I was in the right area. Maybe I just need some help in what to look for. Are there any photos of cache containers or hiding places to look at (not these specific sites but something to start with I mean)?

 

I am not unfamiliar with orienteering. I spent 30+ years in the Boy Scouts and taught orienteering merit badge for a decade at summer camp. I am an avid sailor. I started but never finished my private pilot's license (job took me away from it). I fully know how to use a compass and topo map to calculate bearing and distance. Using a GPS enabled phone to do the same thing should be a piece of cake.

 

I have an aviation rated GPS unit. Its 20 years old and I would have to assume that the GPS receiver in my 1yr old android has to be as accurate or better than a 20 year old unit. I suppose I could dig it up and fire it up to do a test with the phone. I think the USCG station down at the lakefront has a location marker and known Lon/Lan coords I could test both phone and GPS at to verify accuracy.

 

So, I am left with two things...the coordinates are off on the caches (does this site fuzzy them unless you pay or are they accurate?), I don't have a clue what I am looking for and was probably standing right by the cache. I am betting on the latter.

[+Stargazer22]

Welcome to the fun!

 

Geocaching is a great way to spend time recreating outdoors with friends and family.

A couple of years ago I took a friend, his wife, and his girls out caching for the day. He had 3 girls aged between 3 and 12, and they all absolutely loved it! We took them out to the local forest not too far from their home and found about a half a dozen caches, while hiking about 3 miles or so. One of them was located where an old stagecoach stop used to be, which is forested land now. He explained to the kids about stagecoaches and how it used to be before we all had cars to drive. He had no idea that his girls would enjoy being out in the woods and was surprised to see how well they behaved and stayed together.

He took the opportunity to teach his girls a learning lesson in trading swag in the caches by being considerate of people to follow. Those kids had such a great time trading one little piece of swag for another and trading each other for the goodies they found, all the while with the older ones helping the younger ones to negotiate the terrain. It was a great bonding experience for all of them. He also had a nice quiet evening later with his wife as the kids were so tired they crashed out and slept through the night.

 

Sorry you seem to be having troubles finding your first few. Sometimes it can be a good idea to go find a few first to make sure they are there, what the terrain in the area is like, etc... before you take out youngsters, depending on their ages. Then take them out and let them work the GPS (or phone in your case) and watch how much fun they have. In the meantime, you will know where the caches are hidden and will be able to help them find them if they get too frustrated. Kids don't have the attention span that adults do and sometimes if they can't find any caches, they can easily become disenchanted with the whole idea. If you know the caches are there and where to look, it can help to insure them a successful outing and an enjoyable experience, especially their first time or two. They don't have to know that you have already found them.

 

You might want to start by looking for a few with low terrain and low difficulty ratings first as those should be easier to find. Be sure to look at the size of the cache on the cache page and try to stick with regular or small size caches at first. Micros can be incredibly difficult to find even for experienced cachers. They are also too small generally to hold any items of interest to kids, so even being successful at finding micros can be a big bore for children. Remember that your device will only get you to within about 20-30 feet of the cache, as the hider's device as well as yours has some error, which, when added together, means the cache may be some little distance away from where your device says it is. Most caches I have found were with 20 or 30 feet from where my GPSr indicates, but I have found them as far away as 100 feet.

 

You can check on the new caches page for your area to see if there are any caching events planned nearby. Attending some events and meeting other cachers is just about the fastest way to get quickly educated on the game. There will probably be others there that also use a phone and can give you a lot of good tips about how caches are generally hidden in your area. Most cachers I have met and know are very helpful and friendly and are glad to help show a new person some of the ropes. You might just meet other cachers in a similar situation to yours and make some new friends to go out caching with.

 

Good luck and most of all, have fun!!

[+Gitchee-Gummee]

Photos of hides, in place, are called 'spoilers' and it is pretty much a no-no to post them online -- especially in forums related to geocaching.

 

The Nike Site cache, states that the container is an ammo can. Well, you must find a place that will secrete an ammo can. Don't look for the can, look for the hiding spot.

 

The site (geocaching.com) does not "fuzzy" anything. Cache owners generally do not either, with exceptions that are usually frowned upon by others, anyway.

 

I would also bet that you were standing at the cache....

Remember, it is supposed to be hidden from casual passers-by. You must hunt for it. A cache left in the open generally doesn't stay very long.

Edited March 15, 2012 by Gitchee-Gummee

[+niraD]

Also, at least one of them may be rated with a low difficulty because it is a type of hide that has become very common, so experienced geocachers know to look for it. New geocachers often find such common hiding places much more challenging.

 

It may also help to look at some of the cache containers available online. For example, check out the cache containers sold by Groundspeak. Also, take a look at the Pictures - Cool Cache Containers (CCC's) thread in the forums.

[+Wolfiesden]

Thank you all for the tips and help so far! And yea, before someone posts, I am scanning through the forum here looking at other similar threads.

 

Just to be clear, I am doing this solo at first. The girls are not with me right now. Until I know what to look for, how on earth could I assist them? I can't. So I am going to do a few myself first and get some experience. I am also an avid photographer (Nikon D7000+ several lenses) and figured it would be a good opportunity to exercise that hobby at the same time

 

Gitchee-Gummee - I get not posting spoilers. But, posting some example photos certainly would help a noob get started. It doesn't have to say what cache it is, where it is, even what country its in, heck, it could be just a staged photo and isn't really a cache to find. Just something to get started with as to "it could look like this, or this, or this or something entirely different" sort of examples.

 

I do NOT want photos of caches I am looking for, that takes the fun out!

 

Am I looking for a 35mm film can, hollow stump, a plastic Easter egg, a stick with a hole in it, some secret device from Get Smart or a foot locker? Sure would help to know

 

As for the Nike site, thats one reason I chose it! How hard can it be to find an ammo can? Apparently hard enough I will head back there this evening on my way home. More light with the time change now and it was about dusk when I tried last.

 

So, how does one locate geocache events in my area or other geocachers willing to go out with a noob?

 

EDIT:

niraD - Brilliant! That is what I was looking for, well so to speak Now I can scan through those to get some idea of what I am looking for once I get to the coords! THANK YOU!

Edited March 15, 2012 by Wolfiesden

[+Team Batpony]

Trust me, I don't give up that easy. Two and done? No, not me. I am just looking for some pointers to get started.

 

I am a techie and do understand the whole GPS accuracy issue. I am pretty sure I was in the right area. Maybe I just need some help in what to look for. Are there any photos of cache containers or hiding places to look at (not these specific sites but something to start with I mean)?

 

I am not unfamiliar with orienteering. I spent 30+ years in the Boy Scouts and taught orienteering merit badge for a decade at summer camp. I am an avid sailor. I started but never finished my private pilot's license (job took me away from it). I fully know how to use a compass and topo map to calculate bearing and distance. Using a GPS enabled phone to do the same thing should be a piece of cake.

 

I have an aviation rated GPS unit. Its 20 years old and I would have to assume that the GPS receiver in my 1yr old android has to be as accurate or better than a 20 year old unit. I suppose I could dig it up and fire it up to do a test with the phone. I think the USCG station down at the lakefront has a location marker and known Lon/Lan coords I could test both phone and GPS at to verify accuracy.

 

So, I am left with two things...the coordinates are off on the caches (does this site fuzzy them unless you pay or are they accurate?), I don't have a clue what I am looking for and was probably standing right by the cache. I am betting on the latter.

 

I will bet you anything that the actual GPSr (the one that is 20 years old) will be much more accurate than the phone, UNLESS the phone contains an actual GPS chip. Look at your phone's specs. Some use an actual GPS, while others triangulate with cell towers, which is often highly inaccurate.

[+Wolfiesden]

I will bet you anything that the actual GPSr (the one that is 20 years old) will be much more accurate than the phone, UNLESS the phone contains an actual GPS chip. Look at your phone's specs. Some use an actual GPS, while others triangulate with cell towers, which is often highly inaccurate.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4483/motorola-droid-x2-review-a-droid-x-with-tegra-2/8

 

Quote from the site:

Finally we have GPS on the X2, which locks extremely quickly and shows similar performance to the original X. I’m not entirely certain, but it’s possible the X2 is using Qualcomm’s GPS on the MDM6600, or at least it would make a lot of sense to. Again, fixes happened extremely quickly on the device when given a good swath of visible sky. Even indoors, the X2 frequently was able to get a good 3D GPS fix, which is more than I can say for a number of other Android handsets.

 

From Verizon:

"GPS Location - Motorola DROID X2 MB870

 

Caution Satellite GPS requires more power and will have an effect on battery life. "

 

From the Manual for my phone:

"GPS & AGPS

Your mobile device can use Global Positioning System (GPS) signals for location-based

applications. GPS uses satellites controlled by the U.S. government that are subject to

changes implemented in accordance with the Department of Defense policy and the

Federal Radio Navigation Plan. These changes may affect the performance of location

technology on your mobile device.

Your mobile device can also use Assisted Global Positioning System (AGPS), which

obtains information from the cellular network to improve GPS performance. AGPS uses

your wireless service provider's network and therefore airtime, data charges, and/or

additional charges may apply in accordance with your service plan. Contact your wireless

service provider for details."

 

I can only deduce that it does indeed have and use satellite based GPS using a GPS receiver and antenna in the phone.

[+Team Batpony]

I will bet you anything that the actual GPSr (the one that is 20 years old) will be much more accurate than the phone, UNLESS the phone contains an actual GPS chip. Look at your phone's specs. Some use an actual GPS, while others triangulate with cell towers, which is often highly inaccurate.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4483/motorola-droid-x2-review-a-droid-x-with-tegra-2/8

 

Quote from the site:

Finally we have GPS on the X2, which locks extremely quickly and shows similar performance to the original X. I’m not entirely certain, but it’s possible the X2 is using Qualcomm’s GPS on the MDM6600, or at least it would make a lot of sense to. Again, fixes happened extremely quickly on the device when given a good swath of visible sky. Even indoors, the X2 frequently was able to get a good 3D GPS fix, which is more than I can say for a number of other Android handsets.

 

From Verizon:

"GPS Location - Motorola DROID X2 MB870

 

Caution Satellite GPS requires more power and will have an effect on battery life. "

 

From the Manual for my phone:

"GPS & AGPS

Your mobile device can use Global Positioning System (GPS) signals for location-based

applications. GPS uses satellites controlled by the U.S. government that are subject to

changes implemented in accordance with the Department of Defense policy and the

Federal Radio Navigation Plan. These changes may affect the performance of location

technology on your mobile device.

Your mobile device can also use Assisted Global Positioning System (AGPS), which

obtains information from the cellular network to improve GPS performance. AGPS uses

your wireless service provider's network and therefore airtime, data charges, and/or

additional charges may apply in accordance with your service plan. Contact your wireless

service provider for details."

 

I can only deduce that it does indeed have and use satellite based GPS using a GPS receiver and antenna in the phone.

 

I think you deduced right. You have one of the phones that are good better than most others I have seen for geocaching. I have found quite a few caches accurately with my ZTE phone, with an internal GPSr.

 

Edited for spelling and rephrasing.

Edited March 15, 2012 by Team Krammer

[+niraD]

As for the Nike site, thats one reason I chose it! How hard can it be to find an ammo can? Apparently hard enough

If it's any consolation, I've been known to trip over a regular-size cache that was sitting on the ground with no cover. Yes, the people I was with found it amusing. Fortunately, I didn't break anything.

[+Wolfiesden]

While perusing the shop here looking at the cache containers, I saw the UV flashlight. Why? Do many of the cache materials show under UV and are easier to find with it?

[+Team Batpony]

While perusing the shop here looking at the cache containers, I saw the UV flashlight. Why? Do many of the cache materials show under UV and are easier to find with it?

 

The reason for the UV lights are because some special types of multi and puzzle caches use coordinates to the next stage written in UV ink.

[+StarBrand]

Here are some general hints:

 

Look for caches with a difficulty of 2 or less for your fist few caches. Stick with regular sized caches for your first few. Micros can be quite hard to find sometimes. Stick to areas you are familiar with. Look for anything out of place or unusual. Look for unusual piles of sticks, grass, leaves, rocks, sand, etc. Feel where you cannot look. Think vertical, not all caches are on the ground. Look up or at eye level. Look for traces of previous searches to zero in on the spot. Think like the hider - where would you put a container in this location? Look for things too new, too old, too perfect, not like the others, too many, too few. Change your perspective - a shift in lighting can sometimes reveal a cache. Keep in mind that many micros are magnetic or attached to something (via string, wire etc). Slowly expand your search area to about 40 feet from where your GPS says ground zero is. Bring garden gloves and a flashlight - they help! Be prepared to not find the cache more often then you think.

 

Most of all - have fun!!

[+Wolfiesden]

Wow! After rummaging through about 40 pages of the CCC thread I have to say some of you are truly evil with your creative containers. I like it. I tell ya, some of you have some really creative juices flowing when designing some containers. I am kinda looking forward to getting to the experience level of actually finding some of these but I gotta get my routine down first. Baby steps

 

I think I got the itch to make a couple and have some ideas already. o_O

 

Oh, is there a post somewhere with all the abbreviations used in logs? Like TFTC which I guess to mean thanks for the cache. Others I got no clue on.

[+StarBrand]

 

Oh, is there a post somewhere with all the abbreviations used in logs? Like TFTC which I guess to mean thanks for the cache. Others I got no clue on.

See links in my Signature!!

 

[+Wolfiesden]

TY! Just what I wanted. Now some of the logs make more sense. Was wondering about TNLNSL.

 

BTW, http://www.geocreed.info/ seems dead?

[+StarBrand]

TY! Just what I wanted. Now some of the logs make more sense. Was wondering about TNLNSL.

 

BTW, http://www.geocreed.info/ seems dead?

hmmm - been awhile since I tried to visit - hopefully just a temporary glitch - still read it here: http://support.Groundspeak.com/index.php?pg=kb.page&id=46

[+TuuronTour]

-

Edited March 15, 2012 by TuuronTour

[+Wolfiesden]

Found the Nike site! Woot! My firs cache!

Here is the coin I took. Added a goodie from work in its place.

 

Thought the coin to be appropriate to my first cache

 

Thanks to everyone for helping me get started. Going now to find a couple near my house and see how that goes...ttfn

[+niraD]

Woot! Congratulations!

[+Wolfiesden]

Woot! Congratulations!

Ty Found 3 others tonight within walking distance of my home. Was a nice walk with 3 of the 4 granddaughters.

 

Seems C:GEO no longer has live maps. Any suggestions on a decent replacement? Nanogeo only does 3 per 24hrs so that sux. Has to be something better or as good as C:GEO for the Android platform.

Edited March 16, 2012 by Wolfiesden

[+popokiiti]

Hi Wolfiesden and welcome! You are doing the right thing in searching first, before taking the grandkids. But....they may well spot something you miss, so be ready for that down the line! I find a hiking pole is great for poking - the sound of a plastic container when contact is made is satisfying. Look also for unnatural piles of bark or stones, plastic flora, and the cachers' trail (flattened vegetation.) That won't help you in an urban environment, but it will in parks.

If you decide you want to stick with geocaching, Premium Membership is $30 US per year and you will be able to access more than 3 caches per 24 hours. When we were basic members, we printed out the cache pages - as many as we wanted! I now use a GPS that was cheap and gives all the info I need when I have loaded it from the site.

Edited March 16, 2012 by popokiiti

[+niraD]

Yeah, the c:geo app gets data by scraping the geocaching.com site, so it often breaks when the site is updated (in addition to violating the TOU). In the case of live maps, c:geo was scraping pages that no longer exist, so it isn't just that the page layout changed. It may be a while before they re-implement live maps.

 

As popokiiti indicated, the 3/day limit is an API limit on basic (free) members, and will go away if you become a premium (paid) member. Neongeo has an auto download feature that is similar to live maps. The next version will have actual live maps.

 

I'm probably the wrong person to discuss that feature though. I don't like the app automatically cluttering my map/DB with random caches that I happen to be near, so I disable the auto download feature, and will disable live maps too.

[+msrubble]

Hey, you found it! Good for you!

 

I have found both of those caches, and was going to offer some advice.

 

There are indeed a lot of caches near you. Some of them are pretty tough.

 

If you look for Newest geocaches in Wisconsin, upcoming events will show up at the top of the list. There are frequently events in the Waukesha area.

 

The Wisconsin Geocaching Association has a web site with a discussion forum.

 

Here on the Groundspeak geocaching forum, there is a Midwest forum, which includes Wisconsin.

 

If you'd like specific recommendations, send me feedback and I can suggest some I've found.

[+Crow-T-Robot]

Trust me, I don't give up that easy. Two and done? No, not me. I am just looking for some pointers to get started.

 

I am a techie and do understand the whole GPS accuracy issue. I am pretty sure I was in the right area. Maybe I just need some help in what to look for. Are there any photos of cache containers or hiding places to look at (not these specific sites but something to start with I mean)?

 

I am not unfamiliar with orienteering. I spent 30+ years in the Boy Scouts and taught orienteering merit badge for a decade at summer camp. I am an avid sailor. I started but never finished my private pilot's license (job took me away from it). I fully know how to use a compass and topo map to calculate bearing and distance. Using a GPS enabled phone to do the same thing should be a piece of cake.

 

I have an aviation rated GPS unit. Its 20 years old and I would have to assume that the GPS receiver in my 1yr old android has to be as accurate or better than a 20 year old unit. I suppose I could dig it up and fire it up to do a test with the phone. I think the USCG station down at the lakefront has a location marker and known Lon/Lan coords I could test both phone and GPS at to verify accuracy.

 

So, I am left with two things...the coordinates are off on the caches (does this site fuzzy them unless you pay or are they accurate?), I don't have a clue what I am looking for and was probably standing right by the cache. I am betting on the latter.

 

Jeepers, by those credentials, you're much more qualified to geocache than I am . Seriously, those skills will serve you well in this hobby.

 

As for smartphone caching, I like the aspect of having cache data right at your fingertips (assuming you have a signal) but I've never warmed to the phones compass navigation. I'd much rather use a dedicated GPSr. I guess I've just gotten too used to that comfy red arrow pointing the way.

[+Crow-T-Robot]

Since you live in Milwaukee, I highly recommend finding Covert Cache! Chances are you've been where the cache is hidden but it's always a great experience going there. If you haven't been there yet...you're in for a real treat.

[+Wolfiesden]

It seems to be working out so far. What I was missing, well other than the caches, was what to look for. And after finding the Nike site one, yea, I had been standing about 5' from the cache when I went there first time. The other one, I was within inches of it, I simply had no clue what/where to look for. Now that I saw how devious some of you are, that really helped. I have 7 finds now with no DNF. I even took the kids out around the house and found 3 with them and they are liking it too. Still not ready for the nanos yet but I will try them eventually.

 

What I have been doing is head to GZ then run an averaging app for a few seconds to get an average and adjust GZ if needed. I then head out 10 paces and mark a point. Go out from that point to 120 deg from GZ (trusty boyscout compass), mark it and then another 120 deg from GZ again. That forms a triangle surrounding GZ (0, 120, 240 deg corners). Then I have a reasonable search area to look in. I now have to learn to stop looking on the ground as 2 I found were NOT on the ground Devious COs Noob mistake I am sure.

 

Despite what folks think about cell phones, mine seems to take me within about 5-8' from the cache so far. Granted its a small sample of 7 and statistically insignificant, but so far its working for me.

 

I am considering picking up a GPS unit so I can let one of my GDs use my cell phone. Thinking about the GPSMAP 62ST. Would that be a good unit or is there another that would be better, or just as good and cheaper? I dug out my aviation Garmin 195. It fires up but takes ages to acquire the first set of readings (10min or more). I took it outside with my phone and 195 and they reported my position only about 2-5' different. There is a benchmark not too far from me near the corner of Milwaukee's Mitchel Field (MKE) airport. I found the coords here. I will take the phone and the 195 out to it and see which reports its position more accurately. Maybe the 195 is enough. God its huge though! And slow to get started.

[+Wolfiesden]

Since you live in Milwaukee, I highly recommend finding Covert Cache! Chances are you've been where the cache is hidden but it's always a great experience going there. If you haven't been there yet...you're in for a real treat.

 

Have heard about this particular establishment. Have never been to it though. I am simply not a bar patron so I never considered going. The cache sounds very cool. Will be a todo on my list