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I am going to be hiding the first power-trail in New Jersey!


Coldgears
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I have over 100 film cans, and have found the perfect stretch of road to put them on.

 

A pretty much unused road along various farmlands in NJ.

 

This road has pull off points along the entirety of the road. I am going to place a cache every 700 feet for about 11 miles. Just about 100 caches.

 

Here is a picture of the stretch of road.

 

powertrail.jpg

 

Wish me luck!

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I certainly hope you can demonstrate to your reviewer that you are capable of maintaining those caches. You have made more than a few posts in here complaining of lack of adequate transportation to support your caching hobby.

I can support them, I can check up on them once every two weeks if absolutely necessary. I think the community will do a good job replacing the film cans though. Worst comes to worst, I can take NJ transit can drop me off at the cache I need to replace.

 

I take public transportation to more than 75% of my caches as of late.

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Ya know, if'n you wanted a power trail that wouldn't require frequent maintenance by those who seek it, you could use a container that doesn't suck. That would really make your run stand out from all the other countless numbers runs. B)

 

Look up the power trail in McDonald, Pennsylvania. Various size containers, unique containers, various terrain ratings, various difficulties. I've done some of it, and can confirm the ratings are legit. A good measure of a fun pt, not a typical numbers run.

Edited by St.Matthew
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Ya know, if'n you wanted a power trail that wouldn't require frequent maintenance by those who seek it, you could use a container that doesn't suck. That would really make your run stand out from all the other countless numbers runs. B)

 

I started hiding caches in '03 and have used MANY different containers some that I made myself. A few years ago in this forum it became fashionable to bash film cans. I've used film cans over the years to very good effect in south LA. They may not be the BEST container but are vastly superior to any gum or mint tin , gladware, or tons of other stuff you run in to. On one hide the can was submerged for years held down by a rock.....EVERY film can I had out made it through hurricane Katrina. We get tons of rain and lots of heat and humidity and , again, they do quite well. I sand and paint mine so that helps ver ultraviolet.

I will say on a power trail application where the lid will be removed hundreds of times in a year the lid wears/cracks prematurely but mine have done fine on a trail for over 2 years. I'm guessing the cans I paid for were about $.30 where match holders cost about $.80 at Wallmart ( I buy all they have whenever I go )so cost is an issue when you're putting out a trail. IMO the film can does very well as a container in most environments.

 

To the OP your trail looks like a good one and will bring joy to hundreds.....go for it.

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Poor choice of road. It is reasonably busy and while it has shoulders, it does not have lots of "pull-offs" Many residences along this road and it leads to a popular town, Mt Holly. BTW, a New Jersey Transit bus is not going to be able to help you maintain any of those caches. There is no bus route that travels that part of Monmouth Rd.

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Poor choice of road. It is reasonably busy and while it has shoulders, it does not have lots of "pull-offs" Many residences along this road and it leads to a popular town, Mt Holly. BTW, a New Jersey Transit bus is not going to be able to help you maintain any of those caches. There is no bus route that travels that part of Monmouth Rd.

 

I don't know the area....but I can agree with you in terms of 'pull offs'. A pull off should be large enough to fit at least 2 - 3 cars in it and be 2 cars WIDE. Anything smaller or if it wasn't meant to be a pull off - is just dangerous.

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My I suggest you "take a ride" along the route (Rt 537 / Monmouth Rd) and check out potential spots first. I think you'll realize that 80% is private homes or farms. There are very few businesses and I don't see anything that looks like a "pull-off" every 700ft.

 

I'm sure it will be lots of fun to find the caches just north of Fort Dix too! Whoo-hoo!!!!

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Yes, this really seems like a bad idea. This isn't the first PT either. There was one along the White Horse Pike that had a mix of placements. Some were not good. Much prefer something like the Peace Train where you can take your time and not worry about traffic.

 

Well, I've been to Ft. Dix about 10 times, I've probably been on this road. But I've street viewed it in about 20 places, nothing rings a bell. :P No matter though, street view tells me this is way, way too busy of a road for a power trail. The shoulder's are not wide at all, and I don't see any of these alleged pull-offs. And by street viewing in 20 places, I mean moving along 1/2 mile in either direction of those 20 points too. Too be realistic, I don't think the whole teenager from Pennsylvania and public transit thing would ever fly in the first place. Especially when an adult from the area says there is no public transit on the road.

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Actually, I don't know of any 100+ cache power trail in the state of New York either.

 

How about BriGuyNY's OCATT? Starts at Croton Dam (http://www.coord.info/GC2R6Z1) and leads all the way to Van Cortlandt Park, along the old Croton Aqueduct right of way. Though I wouldn't call OCATT a power trail, because it takes hiking or biking, has quite diverse hides, and certainly isn't one of those drive-by-caching roadside suckathons that are so 'popular' over in Nevada . And are now coming to NJ, it seems... As for the original post: Film canisters along a busy road? Maintained via public transport that doesn't exist? I respect your ambition, but suspect that reality might turn out to be a tiny bit different.

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I have to say, kindly as I can: this is a very bad idea. I live very near the eastern end of your proposed trail, and County Route 537 is an extremely busy road with narrow shoulders where it has shoulders at all. I can think of nowhere, save the North Hanover Upper Elementary school that's not private property along the last eastern mile of your proposed route.

 

Please, please reconsider ... the average speed on this road is about 60 miles an hour, and visibility is very poor along at least 25% of the area you mark on the map.

 

Isn't there a nice park that could use a film can every 528'?

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Reasons this is a bad idea:

1) NJ has had several power trails. They have all been archived or are in the process of dying a slow death. All put out by cachers more able to maintain them.

2) The local cachers have stated flatly that this is not a good location. The road is too fast. The land is all private property. If there are pull-offs they are bus stops and I'm sure you know what kids do to caches they find when they are bored waiting for the bus.

3) We absolutely will NOT maintain your caches for you. If you didn't put any effort into the container we will not either. I don't care if that is how other people are doing their power trails. We are not those people.

4) You aren't going to make a name for yourself putting out power trails. There are too many cachers putting out excellent traditionals and short series of exquisite quality. Don't waste your time putting out a series just because you want to be the famous owner of a power trail. Trust me - you will be cursed more than applauded for your efforts. But, put out a quality short series along the same route - maybe 4 caches in GOOD LOCATIONS... and you'll garner favorite points.

5) Please take pride in your hides. Each and every one is direct reflection on yourself and the location in which you have placed it. If it isn't worth doing right, it's not worth doing in the first place. Just because you can... doesn't mean you should!

 

In conclusion: Learn from history. Listen to the locals. Tend your own flock. Quality > Quantity. TAKE PRIDE IN YOUR HIDE!

 

Seriously: Thanks for your enthusiasm... I wish I had as much energy for the game... but please don't get anyone killed (by cars, cattle or angry farmers)!

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144 film cans? Dude! That's pretty gross! :lol:

(OK, enough bad humor...) :P

 

A few years ago in this forum it became fashionable to bash film cans.

Bashing film cans is more than just fashionable. It's informative & educational! :lol:

 

They may not be the BEST container but...

Everything after the word "but" is justification for using an inferior container. Falling back to my personal and highly biased caching aesthetic, I honestly believe that the game, as a whole, would be improved if the community eschewed attitudes such as, "Well, they're not completely horrible", replacing those with an attitude of, "Let's use the best possible container we can". Not just for hides way back in the swamps, but for every hide. You are absolutely correct in your evaluation, saying film cans are not the crappiest containers on the planet. There are several that are worse. But, like it or not, they are our official Crappy Container Poster Child. They acquired that status because they do suck, almost universally. If you are storing film, in a drawer, inside a dwelling, film cans are great. If you are storing paper, in a swamp? Maybe not so much.

 

but mine have done fine on a trail for over 2 years.

We may be coming at this from two different angles. When I say a container is "fine", I refer to a container that has stood the test of time, in myriad environments. I know a power trail is hard to properly gauge, as most logs are going to be of the copy/paste Found It variety, regardless of what actual message they convey. In looking at your Hang Em High series, I didn't read every log. It was tough enough just scrolling past 144 copy/pasted cache pages. :P Instead, I just took a peek at the log type icons on each page, observing that 41 out of the 144 caches had NMs, maintenance conducted, temporarily disabled, or all of the above. Even if we assume that there aren't a whole bunch of Found It logs describing maintenance issues, that still gives us a pretty high failure rate. I know that any container can fail. That's a no-brainer. I recently had to replace an ammo can that had been resting in a highly acidic swamp. It only lasted 5 years. But with that kind of longevity, I'd still say ammo cans were "fine" for most applications. Your power trail would certainly seem to indicate that film cans were not "fine", for that geographic location.

 

cost is an issue when you're putting out a trail.

Of course it is. I know I'm not independently wealthy. No one expects every cache to be a Pelican military grade waterproof case. (though ya gotta admit, that would be kinda kewl!) But using economics as a justification for using knowingly inferior containers is a step backwards, in my opinion. Trying not to sound like Ye Olde Broken Record here, but the sentiment hasn't changed. If we, as a community, encourage folks to use the best container they can, we all win. You mention shelling out $0.30 a piece for your film cans. That's about $42 for the whole power trail. Assuming you were going to repeat the process, and opted for to use micros, the best container I've encountered to date, in that size category, is the soda bottle preform. I do some fairly brutal quality control testing before I'll hide a container, and those bad boys have withstood everything I've thrown at them, up to, and including, driving over them with my truck, on a concrete driveway. All that did was chip the paint. Ordering those in bulk from a school supply place such as Educational Innovations would run you about $0.60 a piece, or about $86 for the whole run. At most it would mean having to save up some $$$. The benefits to the community are high, as they no longer have to suffer wet, moldy logs. The benefits to you are high, as you'll be making less maintenance visits. Sounds like a win-win? B)

 

To the OP your trail looks like a good one

Looks like the locals disagree. :P

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I agree that it's a bad bad idea to place a power trail on that road. I know that road well also and see it as an accident going to happen. Just becuase there are grassy areas alongside the roadway doesn't mean that it's a good spot to pull off and most people who go after these power trails probably won't pull off the roadway enough to be out of the way of someone going 60 mph. Having someone pull off in a grassy area is going to make someone mad. That's someone's private property. There's too much traffic there for it to be safe. Also you may want to take a ride down that road at night and see how dark it is. Some cachers prefer to cache at night and I wouldn't want to come upon their car parked on the side of the road in the dark. It's bad enough trying not to hit a deer let alone parked cars that are still in the roadway. I would hate to see a township ban caching because of a trail like this causing people to possibly get hurt.

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There needs to be plenty of room for group caching. Power trails tend to attract big groups.

 

67e7a292-196c-4211-b2fd-08b20f9e31b8.jpg

 

On this day, I passed several (not just one) convoy of group caching along this roadside power trail.

 

Also be prepared for angry home owners. Even those that give you permission may not realize what they're getting into and confront cachers demanding that the cache go away.

 

I also ran into the unhappy landowner (when I tried to replace the cache), and I told him that I would pass along his wishes (that the cache be removed) to the CO and geocaching.com. He was happy that this would be done. M...50 had obtained his permission, but he did not expect so many geocachers coming by (and at such odd hours), so now he wants the cache gone. I am afraid that this one needs to be archived. I hope that it resurfaces in another location since it is such a nice cache.
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144 film cans? Dude! That's pretty gross! :lol:

(OK, enough bad humor...) :P

 

A few years ago in this forum it became fashionable to bash film cans.

Bashing film cans is more than just fashionable. It's informative & educational! :lol:

 

They may not be the BEST container but...

Everything after the word "but" is justification for using an inferior container. Falling back to my personal and highly biased caching aesthetic, I honestly believe that the game, as a whole, would be improved if the community eschewed attitudes such as, "Well, they're not completely horrible", replacing those with an attitude of, "Let's use the best possible container we can". Not just for hides way back in the swamps, but for every hide. You are absolutely correct in your evaluation, saying film cans are not the crappiest containers on the planet. There are several that are worse. But, like it or not, they are our official Crappy Container Poster Child. They acquired that status because they do suck, almost universally. If you are storing film, in a drawer, inside a dwelling, film cans are great. If you are storing paper, in a swamp? Maybe not so much.

 

but mine have done fine on a trail for over 2 years.

We may be coming at this from two different angles. When I say a container is "fine", I refer to a container that has stood the test of time, in myriad environments. I know a power trail is hard to properly gauge, as most logs are going to be of the copy/paste Found It variety, regardless of what actual message they convey. In looking at your Hang Em High series, I didn't read every log. It was tough enough just scrolling past 144 copy/pasted cache pages. :P Instead, I just took a peek at the log type icons on each page, observing that 41 out of the 144 caches had NMs, maintenance conducted, temporarily disabled, or all of the above. Even if we assume that there aren't a whole bunch of Found It logs describing maintenance issues, that still gives us a pretty high failure rate. I know that any container can fail. That's a no-brainer. I recently had to replace an ammo can that had been resting in a highly acidic swamp. It only lasted 5 years. But with that kind of longevity, I'd still say ammo cans were "fine" for most applications. Your power trail would certainly seem to indicate that film cans were not "fine", for that geographic location.

 

cost is an issue when you're putting out a trail.

Of course it is. I know I'm not independently wealthy. No one expects every cache to be a Pelican military grade waterproof case. (though ya gotta admit, that would be kinda kewl!) But using economics as a justification for using knowingly inferior containers is a step backwards, in my opinion. Trying not to sound like Ye Olde Broken Record here, but the sentiment hasn't changed. If we, as a community, encourage folks to use the best container they can, we all win. You mention shelling out $0.30 a piece for your film cans. That's about $42 for the whole power trail. Assuming you were going to repeat the process, and opted for to use micros, the best container I've encountered to date, in that size category, is the soda bottle preform. I do some fairly brutal quality control testing before I'll hide a container, and those bad boys have withstood everything I've thrown at them, up to, and including, driving over them with my truck, on a concrete driveway. All that did was chip the paint. Ordering those in bulk from a school supply place such as Educational Innovations would run you about $0.60 a piece, or about $86 for the whole run. At most it would mean having to save up some $$$. The benefits to the community are high, as they no longer have to suffer wet, moldy logs. The benefits to you are high, as you'll be making less maintenance visits. Sounds like a win-win? B)

 

 

I stand by my original post which essentially states that the film can does very well as a container in most environments ( I think I mentioned I had one submerged for years ). What puzzles me is how a container which I think is about an 80% becomes the poster boy for ridicule instead of something further down the food chain. :huh:

My ratings on micros ( the most common )would be :

1. BSB's

2. Match Safe ( close second....gasket can fail )

3. Film Can ( lid will fail after x hundred of openings, ultra-violet degradation )

4. Bison ( o-ring failure,log wear,inability to use zip lock )

5. Pill/Medicine Bottle ( no pretense of being water tight.)

6. Key Holder ( no pretense of being water tight, magnets are poor and break off as well )

7. Nano's ( o-ring will fail,no zip lock, big time log misery..often unreadable even when dry )

8. Tins Gum,Mint, ETC ( No pretense of being watertight and will rust closed)

 

I enjoy finding an assortment of containers so I hide an assortment. I ,too, buy BSB's by the box and lots of match safes. I have never hidden a 5,7,or 8 on the list above. I have hid a few #6's where I know the location is dry......really, most any container would do fine if its out of the weather.

 

Re the Hang'm High series only about 100 are mine ( 90% film cans and 10% bisons) the rest are all pill bottles. In over 2 years with 350+ finds each I've only replaced 2 or 3 damaged containers. Its important to know that many a group run has been made on the trail in the rain...bad news for logs. Road way clearing has claimed a few containers and on a recent visit to replace a cache I found two new ones in the area ( my original was a few feet away :) )

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Coldgears:

 

I urge you to carefully reconsider hiding this series.

 

Ericles and Ekitt10 have made excellent and factual points and I reiterate them for emphasis:

1) This most certainly would not be the first powertrail or even roadside powertrail in NJ

2) The locals (at least those who are very active in the area) have come out and said the trail is unwelcome on points of style, safety concern, as well as private property concerns.

3) Expecting community maintenance is grounds that if the reviewer ever found out that was your plan would have enough reason to not publish them. Don't expect the locals to do it for you they've made their feelings known.

4) You're likely to find your caches on many people's ignore lists should this come to fruition. You won't be receivng much praise.

5) I am of the theory that fun and interesting caches are much more doing than a series of caches thrown down at a regular distance. Have something unique or interesting or humor associated with them. This offers nothing more than an opportunity to stop every hundred feet on a dangerous road where I'm likely to not be welcomed by the adjacent property owners. Just because you can do it, doesn't mean you should.

6) County 537 is a dangerous road with limited shoulders and pull offs and IIRC - plenty of No Parking signs.

 

My own points:

I won't be shy that this has zero appeal to me. I know 537 quite well and it simply is a very poor fit for powertrail purposes. In full disclosure, I'm a known critic of powertrails, and as an example I only found 5 caches on the ET series in Nevada and mocked it entirely while doing so if my physical logs remained longer than a week in their respective caches, but in defense of the ET - it was far more suitable to a power trail than 537 is. And note in that case the many concerns the local jurisdictions had over the series that were required to be addressed.

 

With that in mind, I sincerely ask that you think about these questions I have (i.e. don't feel you need to respond):

1) Why do you think this is a good idea?

2) What is the "point" of this cache series? To highlight a nice part of NJ or to provide people an opportunity to run up numbers?

a) If the latter, there are much better places including a number of rail-trails and state forests that don't involve real safety and property concerns

3) Is this purely self-promotion?

4) Who is your target cacher?

5) Are you prepared for the social blowback that you likely might face from the locals who have not been shy in voicing their opposition?

6) Your video reveals some rather derrogatory views of NJ. Is this just an expression of those feelings?

If you find New Jersey is so boring, I'm sure your attitude may be adjusted if you attended one of the regular events in either Central, Northern, or Southern NJ or checked out the local GO groups websites/facebook pages you will find plenty of interesting and notable caches to do. I can think of a number of caches created by the locals above, as well as several regions, e.g. Watchung reservation and Wharton with some interesting and exciting caching opportunities.

7) What do you think (assuming you care) about the potential risk to the reputation of geocaching in the communities along this highway should an incident occur while someone pursues this series?

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To the OP.....my encouragement to hide this trail was in relation to trails in general, I like to see caches put out and I've never ascribed to the " less is more " philosophy. The locals who know the area have stated their issues and it is clear this location for a trail IS NOT A GOOD IDEA. Find a lonely area with nice big pull-offs.

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My ratings on micros ( the most common )would be :

1. BSB's

2. Match Safe ( close second....gasket can fail )

3. Film Can ( lid will fail after x hundred of openings, ultra-violet degradation )

4. Bison ( o-ring failure,log wear,inability to use zip lock )

5. Pill/Medicine Bottle ( no pretense of being water tight.)

6. Key Holder ( no pretense of being water tight, magnets are poor and break off as well )

7. Nano's ( o-ring will fail,no zip lock, big time log misery..often unreadable even when dry )

8. Tins Gum,Mint, ETC ( No pretense of being watertight and will rust closed)

 

What's a BSB? Not familiar with that term.

 

Where would you rank PET preforms on your list? They're my preferred micro-size container by far.

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With that in mind, I sincerely ask that you think about these questions I have (i.e. don't feel you need to respond):

1) Why do you think this is a good idea?

2) What is the "point" of this cache series? To highlight a nice part of NJ or to provide people an opportunity to run up numbers?

a) If the latter, there are much better places including a number of rail-trails and state forests that don't involve real safety and property concerns

3) Is this purely self-promotion?

4) Who is your target cacher?

5) Are you prepared for the social blowback that you likely might face from the locals who have not been shy in voicing their opposition?

6) Your video reveals some rather derrogatory views of NJ. Is this just an expression of those feelings?

If you find New Jersey is so boring, I'm sure your attitude may be adjusted if you attended one of the regular events in either Central, Northern, or Southern NJ or checked out the local GO groups websites/facebook pages you will find plenty of interesting and notable caches to do. I can think of a number of caches created by the locals above, as well as several regions, e.g. Watchung reservation and Wharton with some interesting and exciting caching opportunities.

7) What do you think (assuming you care) about the potential risk to the reputation of geocaching in the communities along this highway should an incident occur while someone pursues this series?

1. I never thought it was a good idea? I didn't think it was a bad one either.

2. To run up numbers, I think NJ has plenty of caches made for showing off it's beuty.

3. Yes.

4. The number runners.

5. Yes.

6. The video is actually a joke.

 

I advise you to watch this video (skip to 2:02 mark) After you watch it, it will become painfully obvious that I was referencing that video, and playing along with an established joke, rather than just spew hate on NJ for no reason.

 

7. Of course I care, the reputation would probably be pretty crappy.

 

Before you guys break out the tin foil hats, I actually *love*, ask anyone, I always thought it was the second best state. (I believe California is the best). And out of all the states I have visited (Pennsylvania, New Jersey, Maryland, Delaware, New York, Virginia.) It is the best state. In fact, I have spent nearly 20,000 hours in the state... That is *just* time spent in NJ while I had rented a hotel for a couple days to a week. That is not counting all the time I spent doing various other activities, such as camping, visiting the Aquarium in Camden, wishing I could gamble in Atlantic City, geocaching (obviously), and even just spending time with my family. Yes, I have family in NJ, not surprising, considering I live about 3 MILES from the border. Well, less than a mile if my car could fly over the river. :P

 

Actually, one third (exactly!) of all my events I have visited have been in New Jersey. I think that's pretty reasonable for doing events in New Jersey. Two of them in Central Jersey, one of them was in South Jersey. I plan on going to a North Jersey event soon. Though my opinion of North Jersey is not nearly as high as South and Central Jersey. Maybe West-North Jersey is good, with it's beautiful forests, but i'm not a huge fan of poor urban area's, especially when there is the largest city in america less than a couple miles away. <_<

 

I also plan on finding a cache in all the counties in NJ, and plan on doing it one county at a time, taking in the best each county has to offer. Why short myself when no county is farther than 120 miles?

 

Yes, I'm not planning on going through with this now. No, I don't hate New jersey.

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Though my opinion of North Jersey is not nearly as high as South and Central Jersey. Maybe West-North Jersey is good, with it's beautiful forests, but i'm not a huge fan of poor urban area's, especially when there is the largest city in america less than a couple miles away. <_<

 

 

3155737019_28b7050fdb.jpg

 

Yup, nothing nice to be seen in that part of Northern New Jersey (West Orange, Eagle Rock Mtn)

 

Besides that thank you for thinking about the power trail again and deciding to not go through with it.

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Though my opinion of North Jersey is not nearly as high as South and Central Jersey. Maybe West-North Jersey is good, with it's beautiful forests, but i'm not a huge fan of poor urban area's, especially when there is the largest city in america less than a couple miles away. <_<

 

 

3155737019_28b7050fdb.jpg

 

Yup, nothing nice to be seen in that part of Northern New Jersey (West Orange, Eagle Rock Mtn)

 

Besides that thank you for thinking about the power trail again and deciding to not go through with it.

I was specifically referring the very poor urban area's directly to the west of New York. There are some really nice urban area's in that part of New Jersey which I plan on visiting, time, and time again. And there are many really nice forests in North Jersey.

 

I think you missed the part where I said, "Not a huge fan of poor urban areas" and when I said, "West-North jersey is good, with it's beautiful forests".

 

Oh, and I still do like poor urban areas, I actually just hid a cache in one in Philadelphia. Just don't like them as much as the farm land and forests.

Edited by Coldgears
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I was specifically referring the very poor urban area's directly to the west of New York. There are some really nice urban area's in that part of New Jersey which I plan on visiting, time, and time again. And there are many really nice forests in North Jersey.

 

I think you missed the part where I said, "Not a huge fan of poor urban areas" and when I said, "West-North jersey is good, with it's beautiful forests".

 

Oh, and I still do like poor urban areas, I actually just hid a cache in one in Philadelphia. Just don't like them as much as the farm land and forests.

 

Its all good, just pointing out that theres a lot of cool places nestled in this tiny state than meets the eye. That view/park is actually close to the city and still preserved which is great. Glad to hear you're enjoying the state--I need to do some more exploring of PA, and not just around Easton. I'm sure I'll grab a few of yours when I finally get around to it.

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My I suggest you "take a ride" along the route (Rt 537 / Monmouth Rd) and check out potential spots first.

DONE!

 

This joke ... it is poorly executed and not funny.

 

Are we all done letting ColdGears troll us now?

Internet-Troll.jpg

Your the one trolling me! I have 1600 posts and I am not banned. You have two... And one was to insult me... Who's the troll?

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What could easily qualify as a NJ Power Trail is the Paulinskill Valley Rail Trail. Populated by a number of cachers with a range of styles, it is especially kind to those who cache from bicycles. Oft overlooked , it really is worth your while.

 

That's the kind of power trail I like. One that grows organically over time, populated by a variety of cachers with different hide styles, cache-type styles and water-tight container styles.

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Though my opinion of North Jersey is not nearly as high as South and Central Jersey. Maybe West-North Jersey is good, with it's beautiful forests, but i'm not a huge fan of poor urban area's, especially when there is the largest city in america less than a couple miles away. <_<

 

Yup, nothing nice to be seen in that part of Northern New Jersey (West Orange, Eagle Rock Mtn)

 

Besides that thank you for thinking about the power trail again and deciding to not go through with it.

I was specifically referring the very poor urban area's directly to the west of New York. There are some really nice urban area's in that part of New Jersey which I plan on visiting, time, and time again. And there are many really nice forests in North Jersey.

 

I think you missed the part where I said, "Not a huge fan of poor urban areas" and when I said, "West-North jersey is good, with it's beautiful forests".

 

Oh, and I still do like poor urban areas, I actually just hid a cache in one in Philadelphia. Just don't like them as much as the farm land and forests.

 

Oh, dear. That isn't prejudice that I'm hearing? Is it? Want a million dollar condo with a view across the river to that big city, from atop the Palisades? Want to find a cache with a million dollar view of The City? Then try one of those 'poor urban areas.' There are many places in New York where I feel less safe.

Let's see: You don't like bears? You don't like 'poor urban areas'. Guess you're not going to find many of my caches. Oh, well. Each to his own.

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Though my opinion of North Jersey is not nearly as high as South and Central Jersey. Maybe West-North Jersey is good, with it's beautiful forests, but i'm not a huge fan of poor urban area's, especially when there is the largest city in america less than a couple miles away. <_<

 

Yup, nothing nice to be seen in that part of Northern New Jersey (West Orange, Eagle Rock Mtn)

 

Besides that thank you for thinking about the power trail again and deciding to not go through with it.

I was specifically referring the very poor urban area's directly to the west of New York. There are some really nice urban area's in that part of New Jersey which I plan on visiting, time, and time again. And there are many really nice forests in North Jersey.

 

I think you missed the part where I said, "Not a huge fan of poor urban areas" and when I said, "West-North jersey is good, with it's beautiful forests".

 

Oh, and I still do like poor urban areas, I actually just hid a cache in one in Philadelphia. Just don't like them as much as the farm land and forests.

 

Oh, dear. That isn't prejudice that I'm hearing? Is it? Want a million dollar condo with a view across the river to that big city, from atop the Palisades? Want to find a cache with a million dollar view of The City? Then try one of those 'poor urban areas.' There are many places in New York where I feel less safe.

Let's see: You don't like bears? You don't like 'poor urban areas'. Guess you're not going to find many of my caches. Oh, well. Each to his own.

Sometimes I make up bull crap. I actually really like poor urban area's. I actually just hid a cache in one.

 

Unless of course you consider this a rich area. (This is where I hid the cache).

thearea.jpg

 

I also like area's with bears, and have even slept in Wharton Forest.

Edited by Coldgears
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