The New Forum "declutter"

[+nthacker66]

So when I tell my 7 year old daughter to clean her room or her playroom - her idea o cleaning is basically moving the clutter someplace else. I equate this latest move as moun10bike described ad "decluttlering" the forums - effectively taking all of the forums like The Hunt and Hiking/Backpacking and moving the threads into geocaching discussions - the same has how my daughter cleans. I fail to see how a thread about camping in sout dakota belongs in this forum. I fail to see how this "decluttering" of the froums page was anything more then aesthetics.

 

I personally found the additional forums discussing the hunt and backpacking and hiking (a forum VERY related to geocaching but not quite geocaching) extremely useful. ALl they really did was create a lot more chatter in this forum that will drown out specific discussions that were useful to a lot of people.

 

Not a job well done Groundspeak.

[+Chokecherry]

I found the hiking/backpacking area helpful as well. Wish it could have stuck around with ham radio. Also wish earth caches would someday be recognized as a geocaching and not a related activity someday.

 

But other wise I like a lot of the decluttering as there was a lot of confusing and redundant geocaching related threads in here which were really unnecessary.

[+nthacker66]

I found the hiking/backpacking area helpful as well. Wish it could have stuck around with ham radio. Also wish earth caches would someday be recognized as a geocaching and not a related activity someday.

 

But other wise I like a lot of the decluttering as there was a lot of confusing and redundant geocaching related threads in here which were really unnecessary.

 

If they really want to declutter you get rid of a lot of the regional and different language speaking forums - instead implement forums translation software so we are not segregating and seperating global discussions. And that way you can really delcutter a lot of the forums.

Edited February 1, 2012 by nthacker66

[+Chokecherry]

They did the right thing getting rid of the redundant areas that they implemented. Discussions with ground speak with a mirror area about discussions with others which in turn mirroed geocaching topics which also overlapped with hunt/unusual... it was getting a tad obnoxious there for a moment on where exactly do you put your geocaching related story, question or comment.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

I found the hiking/backpacking area helpful as well. Wish it could have stuck around with ham radio. Also wish earth caches would someday be recognized as a geocaching and not a related activity someday.

 

But other wise I like a lot of the decluttering as there was a lot of confusing and redundant geocaching related threads in here which were really unnecessary.

 

If they really want to declutter you get rid of a lot of the regional and different language speaking forums - instead implement forums translation software so we are not segregating and seperating global discussions. And that way you can really delcutter a lot of the forums.

 

Even though I rarely visit regional forums, to me the value of them is that they do *not* have global discussions, but instead focus on geocaching and related activities in the specific region. For some people discussions about geoaching in a specific region might be something to seek out (for example, if you're planning a visit to that region). Other people might want to specifically avoid discussion about something related to geocaching in a specific region (i.e. lots of posts about an event in Indiana is just clutter to those that have no intention on going to Indiana). The regional forums work for both of these scenarios.

[Dinoprophet]

I also wish the hiking/backpacking forum had stayed. I'm not sure we really want trail recipes and tent recommendations in the main forum.

 

Please, Groundspeak?

[+ngrrfan]

As I see it, using moun10bike's logic, all forums, with the exception of OT, should be combined as they are all geocaching related.

 

Once again, IMHO, needed things are passed over for things that aren't wanted.

[+nthacker66]

I found the hiking/backpacking area helpful as well. Wish it could have stuck around with ham radio. Also wish earth caches would someday be recognized as a geocaching and not a related activity someday.

 

But other wise I like a lot of the decluttering as there was a lot of confusing and redundant geocaching related threads in here which were really unnecessary.

 

If they really want to declutter you get rid of a lot of the regional and different language speaking forums - instead implement forums translation software so we are not segregating and seperating global discussions. And that way you can really delcutter a lot of the forums.

 

Even though I rarely visit regional forums, to me the value of them is that they do *not* have global discussions, but instead focus on geocaching and related activities in the specific region. For some people discussions about geoaching in a specific region might be something to seek out (for example, if you're planning a visit to that region). Other people might want to specifically avoid discussion about something related to geocaching in a specific region (i.e. lots of posts about an event in Indiana is just clutter to those that have no intention on going to Indiana). The regional forums work for both of these scenarios.

FIne, but why get rid of a well liked and popular forum like backpicking/hiking. Yet keep Ham Radio? AGain using Moun10bike's logic. I would like to know how Groundspeak came to the conclusions they did in which forums to nerf.

[Moun10Bike]

I also wish the hiking/backpacking forum had stayed. I'm not sure we really want trail recipes and tent recommendations in the main forum.

 

Please, Groundspeak?

 

I might lose my job , but I made an executive decision to add the Hiking and Backpacking forum back to the Related Topics section and just finished doing so.

 

As for the other changes, they were vetted out for several weeks among active cachers and moderators. Some decisions were made for reasons that may not be apparent to those unaware of a given topic's history, etc. We are aware that you cannot please everyone but strive to make changes that please the majority.

[+nthacker66]

I also wish the hiking/backpacking forum had stayed. I'm not sure we really want trail recipes and tent recommendations in the main forum.

 

Please, Groundspeak?

 

I might lose my job , but I made an executive decision to add the Hiking and Backpacking forum back to the Related Topics section and just finished doing so.

 

As for the other changes, they were vetted out for several weeks among active cachers and moderators. Some decisions were made for reasons that may not be apparent to those unaware of a given topic's history, etc. We are aware that you cannot please everyone but strive to make changes that please the majority.

 

Thank you for restoring that forum.

 

It would just be nice to make the process a bit more democratic since we are the consumers of the product. Not sure what the subjective definition of an "active cacher" is - someone with 10K+ finds maybe? Not sure about that. At any rate, thanks again for bringing the forum back and I applaud the good intention.

[Dinoprophet]

I also wish the hiking/backpacking forum had stayed. I'm not sure we really want trail recipes and tent recommendations in the main forum.

 

Please, Groundspeak?

 

I might lose my job , but I made an executive decision to add the Hiking and Backpacking forum back to the Related Topics section and just finished doing so.

 

As for the other changes, they were vetted out for several weeks among active cachers and moderators. Some decisions were made for reasons that may not be apparent to those unaware of a given topic's history, etc. We are aware that you cannot please everyone but strive to make changes that please the majority.

If you lose your job, we will protest just as loudly.

 

Thanks!

[+mtn-man]

It would just be nice to make the process a bit more democratic since we are the consumers of the product.

You just cannot do that with this large of a site. Hundreds of thousands of users yield hundreds of thousands of variables. At times a company has to just make the tough decisions themselves. They sought out opinions from a group of people and then took those thoughts and suggestions into the company internal discussion and made the management decisions you now see. You are not going to make everyone happy. Change is going to happen over time and I've seen several of the forum alignments happen. Some people will voice their disappointment and you are free to do that of course. Change is here I am ready to move forward with it -- again. It won't be the last one I'm sure as geocaching continues to grow.

[+tozainamboku]

It would just be nice to make the process a bit more democratic since we are the consumers of the product.

You just cannot do that with this large of a site. Hundreds of thousands of users yield hundreds of thousands of variables. At times a company has to just make the tough decisions themselves. They sought out opinions from a group of people and then took those thoughts and suggestions into the company internal discussion and made the management decisions you now see. You are not going to make everyone happy. Change is going to happen over time and I've seen several of the forum alignments happen. Some people will voice their disappointment and you are free to do that of course. Change is here I am ready to move forward with it -- again. It won't be the last one I'm sure as geocaching continues to grow.

I recall the debate when the EarthCaching section was added. Some felt that a separate section wasn't needed and EarthCaches could be discussed as a General Geocaching Topic (as it had been up to that time). There was a lot of noise made till Groundspeak gave in and created that section.

 

In recent months the forums have gotten lots of new sections. I believe what TPTB did was take a look at all the sections and decided which either weren't getting much use or could be combined with another existing section.

 

I liked The Hunt section, but it was confusing for many whether to post there or in the general section. So they got combined. I think the camping section was initially combined for the same reason. I never understood why a separate camping and backpacking section in a geocaching forum (or a HAM radio section for that matter). Why not a Jeep section or a photography section? There are tons of hobbies that people combine with geocaching and you aren't going to please everyone. Perhaps they should create a forum called related hobbies and put all the non-geocaching stuff there. Then we could discuss letterboxing, Where's George, and even the forbidden "M" game.

 

I'm most interested in how the Bug, Feature, and How To sections will work out. Will they serve the duel purpose of geocachers helping geocachers and providing feedback to Groundspeak on the website and mobile apps? Or will it still be confusing? I'm hopeful that the new organization will help keep things sorted out.

[+briansnat]

I also wish the hiking/backpacking forum had stayed. I'm not sure we really want trail recipes and tent recommendations in the main forum.

 

Please, Groundspeak?

 

I might lose my job , but I made an executive decision to add the Hiking and Backpacking forum back to the Related Topics section and just finished doing so.

 

As for the other changes, they were vetted out for several weeks among active cachers and moderators. Some decisions were made for reasons that may not be apparent to those unaware of a given topic's history, etc. We are aware that you cannot please everyone but strive to make changes that please the majority.

Bravo! My concern was that in a year some novice mod might start shutting down discussions of tents, trail recipes, etc as unrelated to geocaching.

Edited February 1, 2012 by briansnat

[+addisonbr]

I'm glad that the regional forums are segregated, for the reasons that NYPaddleCacher outlines.

[+DanOCan]

Even though I rarely visit regional forums, to me the value of them is that they do *not* have global discussions, but instead focus on geocaching and related activities in the specific region.

 

Some regions more specifically than others. One forum for all of Canada makes little sense as the caching experience can be quite different on the west coast than the prairies than central Canada than the Arctic, etc.

 

I fully understand that if it were too granular there wouldn't be the critical mass needed to make a fourm viable but a Canada forum isn't much more useful than a global forum.

[Sandy]

We will not be removing the regional and language-based forums.

 

The restructure may undergo some tweaking in the coming days, such as restoring Hiking and Backpacking to Related Topics. You have seen quite a lot of tweaking of the forum structure in the past few months as we hone our forums to better serve all of our community members.

 

We welcome feedback, and as always we ask that our community members give feedback appropriately and respectfully, as many contributors to this thread have done.

 

Thank you.

[+NYPaddleCacher]

Even though I rarely visit regional forums, to me the value of them is that they do *not* have global discussions, but instead focus on geocaching and related activities in the specific region.

 

Some regions more specifically than others. One forum for all of Canada makes little sense as the caching experience can be quite different on the west coast than the prairies than central Canada than the Arctic, etc.

 

I fully understand that if it were too granular there wouldn't be the critical mass needed to make a fourm viable but a Canada forum isn't much more useful than a global forum.

 

I agree, although I've never used the Canadian forum. I could see splitting it to at least several regions, though it might be hard to justify if you compare the number of topics/posts to the United Kingdom/Ireland forum which is, by far, the most active regional forum but hasn't been split into regions or specific countries. However, if you compare it to the forum for Luxembourg (which appears to be almost all in English) which only has one page of topics since 2008 there seems to be a justification for smaller, more focused regional forums.

[+nthacker66]

We will not be removing the regional and language-based forums.

 

The restructure may undergo some tweaking in the coming days, such as restoring Hiking and Backpacking to Related Topics. You have seen quite a lot of tweaking of the forum structure in the past few months as we hone our forums to better serve all of our community members.

 

We welcome feedback, and as always we ask that our community members give feedback appropriately and respectfully, as many contributors to this thread have done.

 

Thank you.

 

Oh, I didn't mean to imply to get rid of those forums - in fact the regional forums are where I go to keep up with events (rather then run pq's). I was just confused as to why certain forusm were taken out over others. I am quite satisfied that Hiking/Backpacking is restored. Nobody is perfect but it is a big plus in customer service for Groundspeak. Thanks.

[+cerberus1]

I also wish the hiking/backpacking forum had stayed. I'm not sure we really want trail recipes and tent recommendations in the main forum.

 

Please, Groundspeak?

 

I might lose my job , but I made an executive decision to add the Hiking and Backpacking forum back to the Related Topics section and just finished doing so.

Bravo! My concern was that in a year some novice mod might start shutting down discussions of tents, trail recipes, etc as unrelated to geocaching.

 

Many thanks for keeping the hiking/backpacking forum !

Those of us who actually hike (caching or not) appreciate it.

I also thought someone would eventually consider a related subject off-topic.

- and you'd never get any straight answers there.

[7rxc]

I'm glad that Hiking and Backpacking was restored as a forum...

But I notice that there is still a lot of threads that could be returned to it.

Not all would fit in with the new thinking of course, but there were a few that were one of the main reasons for using it.

 

I can find only 9 or so at present, despite opening up my filters to look.

 

Doug 7rxc

[Moun10Bike]

I did my best tying to identify which threads should be moved back. Please let me know of any that I missed.

[7rxc]

I did my best tying to identify which threads should be moved back. Please let me know of any that I missed.

Thanks again... I see what I can find while I browse later. I'm sure that some of the regulars there would have ideas on what they truly valued as well. They created most of them. Not all of them would not fit elsewhere either, some topics might be of general interest.

 

Doug 7rxc

[cezanne]

If they really want to declutter you get rid of a lot of the regional and different language speaking forums - instead implement forums translation software so we are not segregating and seperating global discussions. And that way you can really delcutter a lot of the forums.

 

Even though I rarely visit regional forums, to me the value of them is that they do *not* have global discussions, but instead focus on geocaching and related activities in the specific region. For some people discussions about geoaching in a specific region might be something to seek out (for example, if you're planning a visit to that region). Other people might want to specifically avoid discussion about something related to geocaching in a specific region (i.e. lots of posts about an event in Indiana is just clutter to those that have no intention on going to Indiana). The regional forums work for both of these scenarios.

 

It appears to me that you only focus on the regional forums for the US or other English speaking countries.

In the foreign language areas, most of the discussions are somehow global ones.

The suggestion by nthacker66 to use translation software will not work however. For example, I tried to understand a thread in the Hungarian section and there has been no chance at all.

 

I really would love to have a forum area where people from different countries would meet and have discussions in English, but the majority of non native speakers of English prefer to use forums in their native language. Unfortunately, the English speaking Groundspeak forums are mainly frequented by cachers from English speaking countries. Besides the language barrier there are also other cultural barriers.

What's regarded as disrespectful in different sections of this forum differs considerably. For example, there are statements that are perfectly ok in the German speaking subforum and lead to difficulties in some English speaking subsections and vice versa.

 

Cezanne

Edited February 3, 2012 by cezanne

[+Jeepergeo]

I also wish the hiking/backpacking forum had stayed. I'm not sure we really want trail recipes and tent recommendations in the main forum.

 

Please, Groundspeak?

 

I might lose my job , but I made an executive decision to add the Hiking and Backpacking forum back to the Related Topics section and just finished doing so.

 

As for the other changes, they were vetted out for several weeks among active cachers and moderators. Some decisions were made for reasons that may not be apparent to those unaware of a given topic's history, etc. We are aware that you cannot please everyone but strive to make changes that please the majority.

 

Thank you for restoring that forum.

 

It would just be nice to make the process a bit more democratic since we are the consumers of the product. Not sure what the subjective definition of an "active cacher" is - someone with 10K+ finds maybe? Not sure about that. At any rate, thanks again for bringing the forum back and I applaud the good intention.

 

I don't think this is something the Admins really needed to take a vote on. It seems like many if not most users viewed the forum as an important part of the Geocaching Community, and most folks in the Community do geocaching and other things, and the forum became a place to talk about many related things. The reorganization does not seem to have been accomplished with much awareness and/or appreciation of why folks come and many pay to be members. Imagine Starbucks coming in to their stores one day and saying that the only thing customers could talk about are strong coffee and clove cigarettes.

 

My membership just AutoRenewed, so I'm here for another 11 months, but that AutoRenew feature is being turned off because Geocaching dot com is on my watch list of items to cut out of the budget unless they can prove to me that they appreciate the geocaching community (and not just rabid geocachers).

[+Jeepergeo]

I'm glad that Hiking and Backpacking was restored as a forum...

But I notice that there is still a lot of threads that could be returned to it.

Not all would fit in with the new thinking of course, but there were a few that were one of the main reasons for using it.

 

I can find only 9 or so at present, despite opening up my filters to look.

 

Doug 7rxc

 

The search routine and filters don't seem to be working all that well, or maybe they work fine and some old thread have just vanished. It would seem that threads with a substantial number of views should be moved back automatically since the number of views suggests a level of community interest.

[+Jeepergeo]

It seems like the best way to find a thread is to go outside to Google and search for it there. I searched for a topic I had started using the forum tools and was not able to find it, but found it via Google in about 15 seconds.

 

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=220772

[7rxc]

It seems like the best way to find a thread is to go outside to Google and search for it there. I searched for a topic I had started using the forum tools and was not able to find it, but found it via Google in about 15 seconds.

 

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=220772

Thanks, I've been doing that as well and have recovered a few for Moun10Bike. I assume you have been to the new forum location and seen the topic there to get others to do that as well, he will move them back when located.

 

Edit: I see you did with two more! It's starting to move now.

 

Doug 7rxc

Edited February 4, 2012 by 7rxc

[Luckless]

They decluttered? Well you could have fooled me. More like exchanged maybe.

[+Jeepergeo]

It seems like the best way to find a thread is to go outside to Google and search for it there. I searched for a topic I had started using the forum tools and was not able to find it, but found it via Google in about 15 seconds.

 

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=220772

Thanks, I've been doing that as well and have recovered a few for Moun10Bike. I assume you have been to the new forum location and seen the topic there to get others to do that as well, he will move them back when located.

 

Edit: I see you did with two more! It's starting to move now.

 

Doug 7rxc

 

How do you move them back? Report to Admin with request, or is there a way for a member to move something back?

[Pup Patrol]

How do you move them back? Report to Admin with request, or is there a way for a member to move something back?

 

Moun10Bike posted previously:

 

I did my best tying to identify which threads should be moved back. Please let me know of any that I missed.

 

Or you could use the "report this post" button and post a comment to ask that the thread be moved.

 

Members can't do any moving of threads.

[7rxc]

It seems like the best way to find a thread is to go outside to Google and search for it there. I searched for a topic I had started using the forum tools and was not able to find it, but found it via Google in about 15 seconds.

 

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=220772

Thanks, I've been doing that as well and have recovered a few for Moun10Bike. I assume you have been to the new forum location and seen the topic there to get others to do that as well, he will move them back when located.

 

Edit: I see you did with two more! It's starting to move now.

 

Doug 7rxc

 

How do you move them back? Report to Admin with request, or is there a way for a member to move something back?

 

Actually, that topic I created in H&B is the semi official (Moun10Bike sort of likes it) is the path for that forum.

 

Just do what has been done, the topic name or header if you like and the topic number (showtopic=xxxxx) and Moun10Bike when he has time will monitor the topic and take care of it. No fuss... however you can PM the information if you insist. My thought was to make it neater and less demanding. He just has to click the link, and do whatever. He doesn't need to hunt for them if we help.

 

One of my problems has been finding them, but we have been sorting that out. There are many topics that might have been from there, but darned if I can be sure where I saw them... they might have always been in this one, or not.

 

If you do get one moved back, try to edit your list like I did to say BACK if you can... It makes things clearer at least to me.

I guess that any dupes will already be there, so it doesn't matter that much. So far Moun10Bike found the first 9 and I've suggested 6 and Jeepergeo added 3 yummy sounding ones.

 

Doug 7rxc

[+Hynz]

We will not be removing the regional and language-based forums.

 

The restructure may undergo some tweaking in the coming days, such as restoring Hiking and Backpacking to Related Topics. You have seen quite a lot of tweaking of the forum structure in the past few months as we hone our forums to better serve all of our community members.

 

We welcome feedback, and as always we ask that our community members give feedback appropriately and respectfully, as many contributors to this thread have done.

 

Thank you.

It occurred to me and others recently that all postings in the German-Speaking Forum prior to the forum restructuring (~Feb 2012) are gone.

I'm quite certain that during the first weeks after the restructuring those posting could be accessed.

 

I hope the removal of >10 years of history was not intentional and can be reinstated.

[+narcissa]

What makes it really frustrating is that it's time spent "fixing" things that don't really matter, when there are so many major functional problems with the forum that they won't address.