Owner wiped out all logs for geocoin

[+keewee]

I posted in this thread previously, but perhaps some users did not see the post. A geocoin is owned by the owner, and that owner can set the mission as they see fit, and can manage the coin's page as they choose. If a coin changes hands, then the new owner makes these types of decisions.

 

This thread has derailed and now there are actions happening outside the forums which are affecting cachers who have posted in these forums.

 

A reminder that all behavior in these forums and on Geocaching.com is answerable to the conditions established in the Terms of Use. All content in these forums is overseen by the forum guidelines.

 

Any additional inappropriate content in this thread will mean that it is closed. We would like to keep the discussion open, and most users are honoring our ToU and the guidelines, so please be very mindful of what is posted here.

So are you saying that having this discussion is useless, because GS is not willing to see that there may be an issue worth looking into here? We understand that the owner of a coin controls the coins mission and the coin page, but what is up for discussion is whether or not they should have the ability to delete accurate and honest logs of discovery "just because", whether they are the first owner of the coin or the 10th. I guess since we also control our cache pages, we should just start to delete true and honest logs "just because". We have had coin logs deleted as well, but never said anything about it.....but after reading this, it looks like it is becoming more commonplace than we originally thought.

 

The current owner can delete previous logs, yes. It is not behavior that we encourage, but it is the coin owner's property. It is their decision. Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice.

 

Hi Sandy,

 

Can you please clarify, as by what you have said above it sounds like Groundspeak have decided that the Status Quo is to remain and that the concerns being aired here are going to be ignored. I sincerely hope I am wrong. (That, by your wording, Groundspeak are not going to look at the guidelines/rulea around this)

 

ETA - as thebruce0 commented, your statement sounds like a final word on the matter. If this was not the intention of your post, can I suggest you very quickly edit it before it alone causes this thread to spiral out of control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Edited February 9, 2012 by keewee

[+keewee]

It really, really saddens me, because on one hand we're told Groundspeak take our views seriously and have the feedback forum (and previously the UserVoice system) to get feedback and suggestions (and we were told that this thread, even though no in the feedback section, was being watch by Groundspeak personal for that purpose), and now on the other hand we are quickly being told that there won't be any consideration of a change to the rules or how geocoin logs work! Boo Groundspeak, Boo!

[+the4dirtydogs]

It really, really saddens me, because on one hand we're told Groundspeak take our views seriously and have the feedback forum (and previously the UserVoice system) to get feedback and suggestions (and we were told that this thread, even though no in the feedback section, was being watch by Groundspeak personal for that purpose), and now on the other hand we are quickly being told that there won't be any consideration of a change to the rules or how geocoin logs work! Boo Groundspeak, Boo!

Same sentiment here........why have geocoins and trackables be a part of the game then since it looks like we are being told that the logs are essentially meaningless?

[random_incoherencies]

So much for a geocoin being like a cache.

Nobody ever said that geocoin logs and cache logs were the same. They are not the same.

[+thebruce0]

So much for a geocoin being like a cache.

Nobody ever said that geocoin logs and cache logs were the same. They are not the same.

Yay! We agree! But still not the point being discussed, anyway

[random_incoherencies]

I posted in this thread previously, but perhaps some users did not see the post. A geocoin is owned by the owner, and that owner can set the mission as they see fit, and can manage the coin's page as they choose. If a coin changes hands, then the new owner makes these types of decisions.

 

This thread has derailed and now there are actions happening outside the forums which are affecting cachers who have posted in these forums.

 

A reminder that all behavior in these forums and on Geocaching.com is answerable to the conditions established in the Terms of Use. All content in these forums is overseen by the forum guidelines.

 

Any additional inappropriate content in this thread will mean that it is closed. We would like to keep the discussion open, and most users are honoring our ToU and the guidelines, so please be very mindful of what is posted here.

So are you saying that having this discussion is useless, because GS is not willing to see that there may be an issue worth looking into here? We understand that the owner of a coin controls the coins mission and the coin page, but what is up for discussion is whether or not they should have the ability to delete accurate and honest logs of discovery "just because", whether they are the first owner of the coin or the 10th. I guess since we also control our cache pages, we should just start to delete true and honest logs "just because". We have had coin logs deleted as well, but never said anything about it.....but after reading this, it looks like it is becoming more commonplace than we originally thought.

 

The current owner can delete previous logs, yes. It is not behavior that we encourage, but it is the coin owner's property. It is their decision. Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice.

 

Hi Sandy,

 

Can you please clarify, as by what you have said above it sounds like Groundspeak have decided that the Status Quo is to remain and that the concerns being aired here are going to be ignored. I sincerely hope I am wrong. (That, by your wording, Groundspeak are not going to look at the guidelines/rulea around this)

 

ETA - as thebruce0 commented, your statement sounds like a final word on the matter. If this was not the intention of your post, can I suggest you very quickly edit it before it alone causes this thread to spiral out of control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't what you want clarified, the statement 'Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice' seems pretty clear to me. And I for one agree with it.

[+the4dirtydogs]

I posted in this thread previously, but perhaps some users did not see the post. A geocoin is owned by the owner, and that owner can set the mission as they see fit, and can manage the coin's page as they choose. If a coin changes hands, then the new owner makes these types of decisions.

 

This thread has derailed and now there are actions happening outside the forums which are affecting cachers who have posted in these forums.

 

A reminder that all behavior in these forums and on Geocaching.com is answerable to the conditions established in the Terms of Use. All content in these forums is overseen by the forum guidelines.

 

Any additional inappropriate content in this thread will mean that it is closed. We would like to keep the discussion open, and most users are honoring our ToU and the guidelines, so please be very mindful of what is posted here.

So are you saying that having this discussion is useless, because GS is not willing to see that there may be an issue worth looking into here? We understand that the owner of a coin controls the coins mission and the coin page, but what is up for discussion is whether or not they should have the ability to delete accurate and honest logs of discovery "just because", whether they are the first owner of the coin or the 10th. I guess since we also control our cache pages, we should just start to delete true and honest logs "just because". We have had coin logs deleted as well, but never said anything about it.....but after reading this, it looks like it is becoming more commonplace than we originally thought.

 

The current owner can delete previous logs, yes. It is not behavior that we encourage, but it is the coin owner's property. It is their decision. Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice.

 

Hi Sandy,

 

Can you please clarify, as by what you have said above it sounds like Groundspeak have decided that the Status Quo is to remain and that the concerns being aired here are going to be ignored. I sincerely hope I am wrong. (That, by your wording, Groundspeak are not going to look at the guidelines/rulea around this)

 

ETA - as thebruce0 commented, your statement sounds like a final word on the matter. If this was not the intention of your post, can I suggest you very quickly edit it before it alone causes this thread to spiral out of control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't what you want clarified, the statement 'Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice' seems pretty clear to me. And I for one agree with it.

It needs to be clarified because if that is the stance GS is going to take on coins and trackables, then it should be the same on caches. All items fall under the umbrella of the GEOCACHING game. GS should not have different sets of guidelines for items which can be logged through their website, be it a cache, TB or coin. We own our caches too and GS does not express the same "hands off" approach to those logs. So they are contradicting themselves. Sandy also needs to address her response which indicates that GS is basically going to ignore our inquiries, suggestions and questions regarding the matter at hand.

[random_incoherencies]

I posted in this thread previously, but perhaps some users did not see the post. A geocoin is owned by the owner, and that owner can set the mission as they see fit, and can manage the coin's page as they choose. If a coin changes hands, then the new owner makes these types of decisions.

 

This thread has derailed and now there are actions happening outside the forums which are affecting cachers who have posted in these forums.

 

A reminder that all behavior in these forums and on Geocaching.com is answerable to the conditions established in the Terms of Use. All content in these forums is overseen by the forum guidelines.

 

Any additional inappropriate content in this thread will mean that it is closed. We would like to keep the discussion open, and most users are honoring our ToU and the guidelines, so please be very mindful of what is posted here.

So are you saying that having this discussion is useless, because GS is not willing to see that there may be an issue worth looking into here? We understand that the owner of a coin controls the coins mission and the coin page, but what is up for discussion is whether or not they should have the ability to delete accurate and honest logs of discovery "just because", whether they are the first owner of the coin or the 10th. I guess since we also control our cache pages, we should just start to delete true and honest logs "just because". We have had coin logs deleted as well, but never said anything about it.....but after reading this, it looks like it is becoming more commonplace than we originally thought.

 

The current owner can delete previous logs, yes. It is not behavior that we encourage, but it is the coin owner's property. It is their decision. Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice.

 

Hi Sandy,

 

Can you please clarify, as by what you have said above it sounds like Groundspeak have decided that the Status Quo is to remain and that the concerns being aired here are going to be ignored. I sincerely hope I am wrong. (That, by your wording, Groundspeak are not going to look at the guidelines/rulea around this)

 

ETA - as thebruce0 commented, your statement sounds like a final word on the matter. If this was not the intention of your post, can I suggest you very quickly edit it before it alone causes this thread to spiral out of control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't what you want clarified, the statement 'Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice' seems pretty clear to me. And I for one agree with it.

It needs to be clarified because if that is the stance GS is going to take on coins and trackables, then it should be the same on caches. All items fall under the umbrella of the GEOCACHING game. GS should not have different sets of guidelines for items which can be logged through their website, be it a cache, TB or coin. We own our caches too and GS does not express the same "hands off" approach to those logs. So they are contradicting themselves. Sandy also needs to address her response which indicates that GS is basically going to ignore our inquiries, suggestions and questions regarding the matter at hand.

With a Geocache you have to go to the site and write on a log in the cache. Then submit your log on-line. There is no such thing with a coin. They are NOT the same.... They are not ignoring your inquiries, it sounds to me that they made a decision..

[+the4dirtydogs]

I posted in this thread previously, but perhaps some users did not see the post. A geocoin is owned by the owner, and that owner can set the mission as they see fit, and can manage the coin's page as they choose. If a coin changes hands, then the new owner makes these types of decisions.

 

This thread has derailed and now there are actions happening outside the forums which are affecting cachers who have posted in these forums.

 

A reminder that all behavior in these forums and on Geocaching.com is answerable to the conditions established in the Terms of Use. All content in these forums is overseen by the forum guidelines.

 

Any additional inappropriate content in this thread will mean that it is closed. We would like to keep the discussion open, and most users are honoring our ToU and the guidelines, so please be very mindful of what is posted here.

So are you saying that having this discussion is useless, because GS is not willing to see that there may be an issue worth looking into here? We understand that the owner of a coin controls the coins mission and the coin page, but what is up for discussion is whether or not they should have the ability to delete accurate and honest logs of discovery "just because", whether they are the first owner of the coin or the 10th. I guess since we also control our cache pages, we should just start to delete true and honest logs "just because". We have had coin logs deleted as well, but never said anything about it.....but after reading this, it looks like it is becoming more commonplace than we originally thought.

 

The current owner can delete previous logs, yes. It is not behavior that we encourage, but it is the coin owner's property. It is their decision. Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice.

 

Hi Sandy,

 

Can you please clarify, as by what you have said above it sounds like Groundspeak have decided that the Status Quo is to remain and that the concerns being aired here are going to be ignored. I sincerely hope I am wrong. (That, by your wording, Groundspeak are not going to look at the guidelines/rulea around this)

 

ETA - as thebruce0 commented, your statement sounds like a final word on the matter. If this was not the intention of your post, can I suggest you very quickly edit it before it alone causes this thread to spiral out of control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't what you want clarified, the statement 'Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice' seems pretty clear to me. And I for one agree with it.

It needs to be clarified because if that is the stance GS is going to take on coins and trackables, then it should be the same on caches. All items fall under the umbrella of the GEOCACHING game. GS should not have different sets of guidelines for items which can be logged through their website, be it a cache, TB or coin. We own our caches too and GS does not express the same "hands off" approach to those logs. So they are contradicting themselves. Sandy also needs to address her response which indicates that GS is basically going to ignore our inquiries, suggestions and questions regarding the matter at hand.

With a Geocache you have to go to the site and write on a log in the cache. Then submit your log on-line. There is no such thing with a coin. They are NOT the same.... They are not ignoring your inquiries, it sounds to me that they made a decision..

They are the same, with a coin or trackable you go to a cache, get the tracking #, go online and write a log on the Groundspeak website. Sandy did not express that this was a final decision and that NO opinions regarding the matter would be taken into consideration, this is what I am questioning.

[random_incoherencies]

 

With a Geocache you have to go to the site and write on a log in the cache. Then submit your log on-line. There is no such thing with a coin. They are NOT the same.... They are not ignoring your inquiries, it sounds to me that they made a decision..

They are the same, with a coin or trackable you go to a cache, get the tracking #, go online and write a log on the Groundspeak website. Sandy did not express that this was a final decision and that NO opinions regarding the matter would be taken into consideration, this is what I am questioning.

Well apparently They ARE NOT THE SAME, Geocoins are personal property - and the rules regarding geocaches do not apply to trackables. Just cause this decision did not go your way, does not mean it isn't final. Seems final to me.

[+thebruce0]

*sigh*

[+keewee]

I posted in this thread previously, but perhaps some users did not see the post. A geocoin is owned by the owner, and that owner can set the mission as they see fit, and can manage the coin's page as they choose. If a coin changes hands, then the new owner makes these types of decisions.

 

This thread has derailed and now there are actions happening outside the forums which are affecting cachers who have posted in these forums.

 

A reminder that all behavior in these forums and on Geocaching.com is answerable to the conditions established in the Terms of Use. All content in these forums is overseen by the forum guidelines.

 

Any additional inappropriate content in this thread will mean that it is closed. We would like to keep the discussion open, and most users are honoring our ToU and the guidelines, so please be very mindful of what is posted here.

So are you saying that having this discussion is useless, because GS is not willing to see that there may be an issue worth looking into here? We understand that the owner of a coin controls the coins mission and the coin page, but what is up for discussion is whether or not they should have the ability to delete accurate and honest logs of discovery "just because", whether they are the first owner of the coin or the 10th. I guess since we also control our cache pages, we should just start to delete true and honest logs "just because". We have had coin logs deleted as well, but never said anything about it.....but after reading this, it looks like it is becoming more commonplace than we originally thought.

 

The current owner can delete previous logs, yes. It is not behavior that we encourage, but it is the coin owner's property. It is their decision. Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice.

 

Hi Sandy,

 

Can you please clarify, as by what you have said above it sounds like Groundspeak have decided that the Status Quo is to remain and that the concerns being aired here are going to be ignored. I sincerely hope I am wrong. (That, by your wording, Groundspeak are not going to look at the guidelines/rulea around this)

 

ETA - as thebruce0 commented, your statement sounds like a final word on the matter. If this was not the intention of your post, can I suggest you very quickly edit it before it alone causes this thread to spiral out of control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't what you want clarified, the statement 'Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice' seems pretty clear to me. And I for one agree with it.

It needs to be clarified because if that is the stance GS is going to take on coins and trackables, then it should be the same on caches. All items fall under the umbrella of the GEOCACHING game. GS should not have different sets of guidelines for items which can be logged through their website, be it a cache, TB or coin. We own our caches too and GS does not express the same "hands off" approach to those logs. So they are contradicting themselves. Sandy also needs to address her response which indicates that GS is basically going to ignore our inquiries, suggestions and questions regarding the matter at hand.

With a Geocache you have to go to the site and write on a log in the cache. Then submit your log on-line. There is no such thing with a coin. They are NOT the same.... They are not ignoring your inquiries, it sounds to me that they made a decision..

 

[NOTE - this is my opionion only, I don't know this as fact but am basing it on what I have seen in here other times when Groundspeak make a ruling, and this from Sandy is nothing like any of those other times]

 

No - it sounds to me like someone at Groundspeak has made a comment without thinking of the implications of the comment they have made. It sounds like a comment made out of frustration, or annoyance at what has been happening outside of the forums (what ever it was). I could be wrong.

 

If it was offical Groundspeak decision it would have worded and phrased very, very different to how Sandy worded it.

 

Well apparently They ARE NOT THE SAME, Geocoins are personal property - and the rules regarding geocaches do not apply to trackables. Just cause this decision did not go your way, does not mean it isn't final. Seems final to me.

 

I think you will find that the final decision has not been made - see my comments above.

[+keewee]

I have emailed Sandy informing her what has been happening in here since her comments and asking her to come back and explain her comments - is it the official line, the final answer, a ruling?...

[random_incoherencies]

I posted in this thread previously, but perhaps some users did not see the post. A geocoin is owned by the owner, and that owner can set the mission as they see fit, and can manage the coin's page as they choose. If a coin changes hands, then the new owner makes these types of decisions.

 

This thread has derailed and now there are actions happening outside the forums which are affecting cachers who have posted in these forums.

 

A reminder that all behavior in these forums and on Geocaching.com is answerable to the conditions established in the Terms of Use. All content in these forums is overseen by the forum guidelines.

 

Any additional inappropriate content in this thread will mean that it is closed. We would like to keep the discussion open, and most users are honoring our ToU and the guidelines, so please be very mindful of what is posted here.

So are you saying that having this discussion is useless, because GS is not willing to see that there may be an issue worth looking into here? We understand that the owner of a coin controls the coins mission and the coin page, but what is up for discussion is whether or not they should have the ability to delete accurate and honest logs of discovery "just because", whether they are the first owner of the coin or the 10th. I guess since we also control our cache pages, we should just start to delete true and honest logs "just because". We have had coin logs deleted as well, but never said anything about it.....but after reading this, it looks like it is becoming more commonplace than we originally thought.

 

The current owner can delete previous logs, yes. It is not behavior that we encourage, but it is the coin owner's property. It is their decision. Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice.

 

Hi Sandy,

 

Can you please clarify, as by what you have said above it sounds like Groundspeak have decided that the Status Quo is to remain and that the concerns being aired here are going to be ignored. I sincerely hope I am wrong. (That, by your wording, Groundspeak are not going to look at the guidelines/rulea around this)

 

ETA - as thebruce0 commented, your statement sounds like a final word on the matter. If this was not the intention of your post, can I suggest you very quickly edit it before it alone causes this thread to spiral out of control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't what you want clarified, the statement 'Groundspeak will not be forcing coin owners to retain previous logs if that is the coin owners choice' seems pretty clear to me. And I for one agree with it.

It needs to be clarified because if that is the stance GS is going to take on coins and trackables, then it should be the same on caches. All items fall under the umbrella of the GEOCACHING game. GS should not have different sets of guidelines for items which can be logged through their website, be it a cache, TB or coin. We own our caches too and GS does not express the same "hands off" approach to those logs. So they are contradicting themselves. Sandy also needs to address her response which indicates that GS is basically going to ignore our inquiries, suggestions and questions regarding the matter at hand.

With a Geocache you have to go to the site and write on a log in the cache. Then submit your log on-line. There is no such thing with a coin. They are NOT the same.... They are not ignoring your inquiries, it sounds to me that they made a decision..

 

[NOTE - this is my opionion only, I don't know this as fact but am basing it on what I have seen in here other times when Groundspeak make a ruling, and this from Sandy is nothing like any of those other times]

 

No - it sounds to me like someone at Groundspeak has made a comment without thinking of the implications of the comment they have made. It sounds like a comment made out of frustration, or annoyance at what has been happening outside of the forums (what ever it was). I could be wrong.

 

If it was offical Groundspeak decision it would have worded and phrased very, very different to how Sandy worded it.

 

Well apparently They ARE NOT THE SAME, Geocoins are personal property - and the rules regarding geocaches do not apply to trackables. Just cause this decision did not go your way, does not mean it isn't final. Seems final to me.

 

I think you will find that the final decision has not been made - see my comments above.

Go Ahead, believe what you want, but to me I believe it's been decided. No Change in the rules. Yay!

[Sandy]

I have been informed that some users have not understood our standpoint. Groundspeak will not be changing our view on this matter, despite our understanding that many people in this thread disagree. We do understand that some cachers will be highly disappointed to have a log deleted, but we will not force a coin owner who has purchased a coin from another player to honor the wishes of the former owner. As I said before, we do not encourage log deletion, but leave the decision to the coin owner.

 

We will be closing this thread as the topic has been well-debated, and the question answered by Groundspeak.