Boy Scout Caches that need Maintenance

[+The VanDucks]

We are former Cub Scout leaders, so we were happy to see that the Boy Scouts now have a merit badge for geocaching. Apparently the placement of a cache is part of the requirement for the badge. But we are wondering who oversees the caches?

 

We posted a DNF on a BSA cache in late December; this cache had been found easily for several months, but then had 2 DNFs for the last two months. I've checked from time to time to see if it's been archived, but there have been no CO visits or logs. I noticed on another BSA cache in our area that the owners have not visited or replaced the log after months of cachers posting that the log was wet.

 

Maybe someone active in Boy Scouts can comment on this? It seems to me that requiring the scouts to take care of their cache would be a good lesson in responsibility. If the boys involved, or their adult leaders, have left the organization, they should at least make sure someone will maintain the cache.

[+baloo&bd]

Not to be contrary (I too have an issue with that part of the requirements), however how many of those DNF's posted a NA log?

Edited January 29, 2012 by baloo&bd

[+Touchstone]

Wouldn't the Boy Scout that submitted the Listing be responsible for its maintanence?

[+Gitchee-Gummee]

I do so hate to be this way... but this is precisely the reason why I don't believe that "group" geocaches should be allowed.

It just plain seems that there is rarely anyone single person that will step forward and take any responsibility.

 

Granted there are pack leaders and group leaders that do, but even at that, they eventually move on, so the root problem is again at issue.

 

Some do maintain their caches, and do so very well. It's just those few...

 

If I were in your position I would consider a NA log, but probably not solely based on two DNF logs over a two-month period.

[+J the Goat]

Wouldn't the Boy Scout that submitted the Listing be responsible for its maintanence?

 

This

[+bladesedge]

They SHOULD be responsible for their own cache, but isn't there badge for keeping your room clean for a week??? There was when I was a Girl Guide - room was tidy for a week, and that was it!

 

The badges I guess are good for kids who're really into it with their families and for those it's a long term thing, but I can't see putting out a cache as being a sensible requirement. That does require ongoing maintenance for years to come.

 

I have to say I did meet one young man last year - all of about 9 or 10, absolutely enthused about geocaching! He was out checking on a cache while his parents were visiting a local market day. He liked to check on caches he'd previously logged to see who'd been there since!

[+SCOUT98]

I am a merit badge counselor for geocaching. The scout does not have to place a cache to earn the badge. It is one option that they can do. I encourage them not to place a cache and to do one of the other options.

[+edscott]

The answer to the original question is "it depends". Just like people, different kids and different troops operate on different value systems. We have several scout caches in this area and their maintenance record is on a par with the general population.

[+Road Rabbit]

I am a merit badge counselor for geocaching. The scout does not have to place a cache to earn the badge. It is one option that they can do. I encourage them not to place a cache and to do one of the other options.

 

To be more precise, there are four options under requirement #8 of the Geocaching merit badge:

- Visit at least three caches in a "Cache to Eagle" series if there is one in your council, OR

- Create a Scout themed travel bug that promotes one of the values of Scouting, OR

- Set up and hide a geocache, OR

- Descibe to the counselor how you have practiced CITO while geocaching and either create CITO containers to leave at caches or host a CITO event for the unit or the public.

 

The geocache hiding option requires the Scout to produce and share with the counselor a six month maintenance plan for the cache where the Scout is personably responsible for the first three months. This has to shared with the counselor BEFORE the cache is hidden. Even so, I normally encourage the Scouts to use the travel bug or CITO option.

 

How many other cachers set up a six month maintenace plan?

[Pup Patrol]

Boy Scout caching is discussed in this forum:

 

http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showforum=108

[+Manville Possum]

Wouldn't the Boy Scout that submitted the Listing be responsible for its maintanence?

That's the way I think it should work, but just like other Club caches it's just another way to pass the blame on down the line.

[+SwineFlew]

This is why I am against any scouts caches. If I find the cache before and see a long list of DNF logs, I will check to see if its still there and post a Nm log if I didnt find it and if they dont anything within 4 to 8 weeks (I am pretty flexible), I will post a NA log.

 

I feel scouts are taking the easiest way to get the merit badge which is to place a cache and forget about it. I got nothing against scouts as a whole but the easiest way to get the badge really bug me because they tend not to maintenance their caches and the rest of us are stuck with it. Scouts are against littering as a whole but it seem to be "ok" to geo litter. Some might start hating scouts because of this. Yes, in other words, scouts are giving themselves a bad name due to non-maintain caches and geo-litters.

 

Hosting a CITO is harder to do, but it build a better relationship with us geocachers and the community as a whole. If they host one here, I will help out and plus, yes donate money to their unit. (yes, an idea for those scout leaders out there )

 

Another way to solve the problem is that their caches are automatic archived after 6 months to a year but the geo litter will be a problem.

Edited January 29, 2012 by SwineFlew

[+edscott]

I'd still like to see real statistical data that supports the hypothesis that scout placed caches are maintained at a lesser level than the those placed by the general geocaching population.

Edited January 29, 2012 by edscott

[+palmetto]

I can't provide stats, but I bookmark scout placed cache as I publish them. Because my experience is that the physical maintenance isn't going to be done, and the listing maintenance will be done by me.

 

The only exception to this came from a Miami scout pack, whose leader emailed me with some questions. I encouraged him to have the scouts place caches that they could maintain - ie, in their neighborhoods, and not caches placed while out in some forest area hiking. They did, and they kept them up okay too. These were urban micro caches.

 

I can tell you that 100% of the scout placed caches that I have reviewed that needed something to happen before they could published, such as explicit permission (state parks) or permits (state forests,)or to move to avoid being too near an existing cache, have never responded. I have archived those listings. I'd guess that containers were left in place.

 

Caches placed by scout leaders do okay, ie, about like caches in general. The Cache to Eagle caches I've published have been placed by adults, and seem to do fine.

[+Manville Possum]

I can't provide stats, but I bookmark scout placed cache as I publish them. Because my experience is that the physical maintenance isn't going to be done, and the listing maintenance will be done by me.

 

I can tell you that 100% of the scout placed caches that I have reviewed that needed something to happen before they could published, such as explicit permission (state parks) or permits (state forests,)or to move to avoid being too near an existing cache, have never responded. I have archived those listings. I'd guess that containers were left in place.

 

Sounds like a great idea for Scouts to do so some CITO and pick up their own geolitter.

[+popokiiti]

The Boy Scout caches here have been placed by a geocaching leader and are all OK, just needing the routine maintenance all caches require from time to time.

[+L0ne.R]

I am a merit badge counselor for geocaching. The scout does not have to place a cache to earn the badge. It is one option that they can do. I encourage them not to place a cache and to do one of the other options.

 

To be more precise, there are four options under requirement #8 of the Geocaching merit badge:

- Visit at least three caches in a "Cache to Eagle" series if there is one in your council, OR

- Create a Scout themed travel bug that promotes one of the values of Scouting, OR

- Set up and hide a geocache, OR

- Descibe to the counselor how you have practiced CITO while geocaching and either create CITO containers to leave at caches or host a CITO event for the unit or the public.

 

The geocache hiding option requires the Scout to produce and share with the counselor a six month maintenance plan for the cache where the Scout is personably responsible for the first three months. This has to shared with the counselor BEFORE the cache is hidden. Even so, I normally encourage the Scouts to use the travel bug or CITO option.

 

How many other cachers set up a six month maintenace plan?

 

Do the boyscouts realize that the Terms of Use say:

By using the Site, you represent and warrant that you are 18 years of age or older, or under the supervision of your parent or legal guardian.

Regarding planting and submitting a cache, do they expect the child (under 18) to create an account on geocaching.com? It's not clear from the above, who is supposed to submit the cache for publication. Would the child submit under their parents' or leaders' GC account?

[knowschad]

Boy Scout caching is discussed in this forum:

 

http://forums.Ground...p?showforum=108

 

And in this thread of this forum: http://forums.Groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=241532&hl=boy%20scout&st=0

[+Road Rabbit]

I am a merit badge counselor for geocaching. The scout does not have to place a cache to earn the badge. It is one option that they can do. I encourage them not to place a cache and to do one of the other options.

 

To be more precise, there are four options under requirement #8 of the Geocaching merit badge:

- Visit at least three caches in a "Cache to Eagle" series if there is one in your council, OR

- Create a Scout themed travel bug that promotes one of the values of Scouting, OR

- Set up and hide a geocache, OR

- Descibe to the counselor how you have practiced CITO while geocaching and either create CITO containers to leave at caches or host a CITO event for the unit or the public.

 

The geocache hiding option requires the Scout to produce and share with the counselor a six month maintenance plan for the cache where the Scout is personably responsible for the first three months. This has to shared with the counselor BEFORE the cache is hidden. Even so, I normally encourage the Scouts to use the travel bug or CITO option.

 

How many other cachers set up a six month maintenace plan?

 

Do the boyscouts realize that the Terms of Use say:

By using the Site, you represent and warrant that you are 18 years of age or older, or under the supervision of your parent or legal guardian.

Regarding planting and submitting a cache, do they expect the child (under 18) to create an account on geocaching.com? It's not clear from the above, who is supposed to submit the cache for publication. Would the child submit under their parents' or leaders' GC account?

Parent or guardian permission is explicity required (requirement #7)for the Scout to access and establish an account on Geocaching.com. AFAIK, the merit badge and requirements were developed with the cooperation of TPTB at Groundspeak.

[+Walts Hunting]

I'd still like to see real statistical data that supports the hypothesis that scout placed caches are maintained at a lesser level than the those placed by the general geocaching population.

 

I'm with this guy. Since Boy Scout caches are often labeled as such you notice them more. I run across many non Boy Scout caches that are not maintained. I did a NA log on one that had two dnf's and 3 nm logs that had never been addressed and I don't think SHE was a boy scout.

[+kennethb53]

I am a scout leader and active catcher. As others have said the hide a cache requirement includes a maintenance plan component. I do not agree with this requirement and wish that the mb had been developed differently ( but they did not ask me). I would rather see the scout required to find some number of caches (3-5 would be enough) in order to earn the merit badge. Perhaps even require a couple of different types of finds. Something like "of the five caches you find, one must be a mystery, multi-stage or puzzle cache".

[+bladesedge]

I am a scout leader and active catcher. As others have said the hide a cache requirement includes a maintenance plan component. I do not agree with this requirement and wish that the mb had been developed differently ( but they did not ask me). I would rather see the scout required to find some number of caches (3-5 would be enough) in order to earn the merit badge. Perhaps even require a couple of different types of finds. Something like "of the five caches you find, one must be a mystery, multi-stage or puzzle cache".

 

That sounds a lot better. Maybe find some of differing terrain/difficulty levels, one that involves a walk of an hour or more or something that is challenging physically as well as mentally.

[+Chokecherry]

I am a scout leader and active catcher. As others have said the hide a cache requirement includes a maintenance plan component. I do not agree with this requirement and wish that the mb had been developed differently ( but they did not ask me). I would rather see the scout required to find some number of caches (3-5 would be enough) in order to earn the merit badge. Perhaps even require a couple of different types of finds. Something like "of the five caches you find, one must be a mystery, multi-stage or puzzle cache".

 

That sounds a lot better. Maybe find some of differing terrain/difficulty levels, one that involves a walk of an hour or more or something that is challenging physically as well as mentally.

I wouldn't mandate differing terrain. Around here boyscouts takes in people of all sorts of physical ability and that may mean sOme physically limited people. I thInk different cache type would be adequate and if the troop leaders allow this as an optiOn they need to sign on to maintain them with the rest of their troop when the boys Peter out on this cache thing.