I finally love my PN-40

[+achtung6]

So, after owning this unit since late 2009, I finally like it. Let me clarify, I began Geocaching then and my son was who was to be my sidekick was still too small. Also, at that time, loading GPX files on my Windows machine using the clumsy Topo software was not appealing. By the time I learned about GSAK, a couple of months had passed and I had store my GPSr due to lack of available time (I was going to grad school).

 

Fast forward to now, I use a Mac and with my Premium Membership, have tweaked my Pocket Queries just right. I've updated the firmware on the PN to the latest and have installed Cache Register which has since become free.

 

It's so easy now! All I have to do, is connect the PN to the mac and Cache Register updates/loads my PQ's. Granted, there is a small glitch that makes you have to run the sync twice if there is a new PQ to download but it's a very minor inconvenience.

 

I've discovered that the PN is actually very accurate and often, when it indicates 2ft. or less, I'm right on top of the cache location. I've tweaked the info fields and the order of the info pages to suit geocaching (I really don't like this thing for routing/driving to the cache area) and it's really nice!

 

My son has a Geomate Jr. which works out very well for him, but only because I have the PN and iPhone 4 with the GC app to give us lots of pertinent info that the Geomate does not deliver. It's a great little unit, not quite as accurate as the PN but awesome for little hands and the mishaps they seem to have often.

 

In any case, I have more free time now, my son is now 7 and I seem to have my GPSr issues sorted. I'm really excited to get back in the game and "get out there" far more often.

 

On that note, I'm also practicing CITO with my son who is very earth conscious (amazing how the teach this in school). When I was in 2nd grade many moons ago, NO ONE mentioned the earth or preserving it! Of course, we live in California now and it's ALL about that which I like as well.

 

It is a little depressing to find so much trash in the woods though. We're doing our part and taking a trash bag with us and that feels good!

 

Happy holidays to all and happy caching!

[+2Jeeps2Jacks]

You're gonna REALLY love the PN-60. We have had the PN-20, PN-30 Camo and now the PN-60.

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

[DBV2]

I like the Delorme's too - just testing one. Wishes would be that they would make a bigger screen and that it was easier to use on a Mac.

 

You're gonna REALLY love the PN-60. We have had the PN-20, PN-30 Camo and now the PN-60.

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

[+Cacheoholic]

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

 

WOW! Quite a claim. Have any data or could you point to any reviews to validate your claim?

[+The Yinnies]

I have owned a lot of Garmins and of course a PN-40 and 60. I really think they are very acurate. But then again so were some of the Garmins I owned. From what I understand it all depends on what was used to place the cache. I went benchmarking and found my -40 was right on as well as my Dakota 20. I just like the way everything is on the Delormes. My opinion, but some of the Garmins I owned are just as accurate as my Delormes.

Thanks

Merry Christmas

[+achtung6]

I like the Delorme's too - just testing one. Wishes would be that they would make a bigger screen and that it was easier to use on a Mac.

 

You're gonna REALLY love the PN-60. We have had the PN-20, PN-30 Camo and now the PN-60.

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

 

As far as I've discovered, it's very easy to use on a Mac. I'm using Cache Register w/ the PN-40, Premium Membership. I've got two Macs running OS X Lion. I no longer have to use (or think of using) any other software to get my caches on the PN. It's not perfect (for some reason, I have to sync the PN twice when there are new GPX files available for download....Cache Register seems to not want to download the GPX file for the first sync, but a subsequent sync which does download the file takes very little time).

 

It took me a bit to get it setup and syncing at the beginning because I did not have the latest firmware from DeLorme (the one that plays nice with OS X Lion) but all is well now!

 

My biggest gripe with the PN by far.......battery life. I have the LiOn pack that DeLorme sells and often, the battery level indicator reads 70% charged seconds after I've disconnected the charger. I don't know why this is. It seems like the battery level indicator is simply not progressive and scares you too early on that the battery voltage is lower than it really is.

 

In any case, none of my adventures to date have lasted more than a couple of hours and the battery has lasted sufficiently for those. I have the car charger as well. The battery, a screen protector, belt holster, 110v charger and 12v charger came with the accessory pack I bought shortly after ordering the PN.

[+achtung6]

You're gonna REALLY love the PN-60. We have had the PN-20, PN-30 Camo and now the PN-60.

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

 

What are the biggest differences in terms of "upgrades" that you've really liked about the 60?

[+Team CowboyPapa]

 

My biggest gripe with the PN by far.......battery life. I have the LiOn pack that DeLorme sells and often, the battery level indicator reads 70% charged seconds after I've disconnected the charger. I don't know why this is. It seems like the battery level indicator is simply not progressive and scares you too early on that the battery voltage is lower than it really is.

 

Check this:

http://www.rechargeable-lithium-batteries.com/

Many of us use this and it stores a significant more charge than the OEM. Note that it probably voids warranty; however, I don't think that a search of the DeLorme forums will reveal any complaints or failures.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Team CowboyPapa

[+Team CowboyPapa]

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

 

WOW! Quite a claim. Have any data or could you point to any reviews to validate your claim?

Excluding the word most as I have no quanitative data for any competitive models with which to compare, I can relate that which I observe with my DeLorme PN-60:

1. Using the downloaded Hi-Res City aerial photo imagery available in an unlimited quantity for a $30 annual subscription fee,

2. I stand in the middle of my driveway of which I know the width and length and is clearly discernable on the PN-60's screen at ZL 16,

3. I can then estimate the position of the green, triangular position indicator with respect to the center of my driveway,

4. A resultant distance between the center of the indicator and my position of 4 to 6 feet is typical.

 

Considering the possiblity of using my very recently aquired Samsung Skyrocket cellphone for geocaching, I performed the same test with a result of 8 feet of separation.

[+a2n]

 

My biggest gripe with the PN by far.......battery life. I have the LiOn pack that DeLorme sells and often, the battery level indicator reads 70% charged seconds after I've disconnected the charger. I don't know why this is. It seems like the battery level indicator is simply not progressive and scares you too early on that the battery voltage is lower than it really is.

 

Check this:

http://www.rechargeable-lithium-batteries.com/

Many of us use this and it stores a significant more charge than the OEM. Note that it probably voids warranty; however, I don't think that a search of the DeLorme forums will reveal any complaints or failures.

 

I put one of these in my Delorme and I love it..... really long battery life!

[+Team CowboyPapa]

You're gonna REALLY love the PN-60. We have had the PN-20, PN-30 Camo and now the PN-60.

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

 

What are the biggest differences in terms of "upgrades" that you've really liked about the 60?

In comparison to the earlier DeLorme models the -60s have lower current draw resulting in longer battery life and a faster CPU which speeds up redraws and scrolling across maps. Now those relate to earlier models. However, the wireless version of the PN-60, or PN-60w, can be used in conjunction with the DeLorme inReach device to send and receive messages via the Iridium satellite constellation when outside of cellular coverage:

http://shop.delorme.com/OA_HTML/DELibeCCtpSctDspRte.jsp?section=10820&minisite=10020/.

Could be quite the ticket if one encounters trouble looking for a geocache located such as this:

http://www.geocaching.com/seek/cache_details.aspx?guid=48702626-e4f0-4068-b8eb-a8d3707c3d17

[+myotis]

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

 

WOW! Quite a claim. Have any data or could you point to any reviews to validate your claim?

Excluding the word most as I have no quanitative data for any competitive models with which to compare, I can relate that which I observe with my DeLorme PN-60:

1. Using the downloaded Hi-Res City aerial photo imagery available in an unlimited quantity for a $30 annual subscription fee,

2. I stand in the middle of my driveway of which I know the width and length and is clearly discernable on the PN-60's screen at ZL 16,

3. I can then estimate the position of the green, triangular position indicator with respect to the center of my driveway,

4. A resultant distance between the center of the indicator and my position of 4 to 6 feet is typical.

 

Considering the possiblity of using my very recently aquired Samsung Skyrocket cellphone for geocaching, I performed the same test with a result of 8 feet of separation.

 

Obvioulsy the claim that its the most accurate GPS out there is not true. There is no way it could compete with a survey grade GPS. Also remember a broken clock is accurate twice a day.

 

You cannot judge accuracy with how close it shows to a cache or how accurate it shows in a sat photo. Both can have errors. To judge accuracy you have to compare disatnaces to a known correct location. So you need a point that has been surveyed or marked with a survey grade GPS.

 

Your next best option is to do as I have done. Get a newer Garmin with waypoint averaging. Find a spot in your backyard. Garmin's waypoint averaging does more than simply average, it analyizes the data and you can get better accuracy the more times you take readings. So take readings (it tells you when you have enough data) over a month or so. Then you know you have really accurate cordinates for the spot. Once you have a known location like this, then you can see how accutate the GPS is.

[+Team CowboyPapa]

....

Your next best option is to do as I have done. Get a newer Garmin with waypoint averaging. ......

...any DeLorme handheld GPSr (they all have waypoint averaging),,,,,

[+Woodstramp]

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

 

WOW! Quite a claim. Have any data or could you point to any reviews to validate your claim?

 

I have a good many cons (sucky battery life, little screen) with the Delorme GPS units, but accuracy is not one of those cons, IMO. My old PN-20 had good accuracy, but the PN-40 I borrowed from a freind was an amazing critter.

 

In my testing, it smokes my favorite 60csx. "Testing", meaning setting WP and then stepping off 100' and navigating back to the set point. Several times I set waypoints (didn't even average them) and the thing would say 2-8 feet when placing the GPS on the exact spot I set the WP. More often it would say 2-5 feet with a decent view of the sky. I even would take the GPS away 15' from the GZ and the unit would show distance to accordingly adjusted for the gap I'd added, +- that 2-5'. I even had a pic of that unit aquiring a heck of a lock inside our industrial plant (30' tall cinderblock walls and a fiberglass panel insulated roof.)

[+achtung6]

 

My biggest gripe with the PN by far.......battery life. I have the LiOn pack that DeLorme sells and often, the battery level indicator reads 70% charged seconds after I've disconnected the charger. I don't know why this is. It seems like the battery level indicator is simply not progressive and scares you too early on that the battery voltage is lower than it really is.

 

Check this:

http://www.rechargeable-lithium-batteries.com/

Many of us use this and it stores a significant more charge than the OEM. Note that it probably voids warranty; however, I don't think that a search of the DeLorme forums will reveal any complaints or failures.

 

Thanks Cowboy. Do you happen to know what the capacity (in mAh) is for this battery? The one DeLorme sells is 1400 mAh. I've seen some CRV3 packs rated as high as 2000 mAh. This would really change the effective duration of use of my PN-40!

[+Cacheoholic]

You're gonna REALLY love the PN-60. We have had the PN-20, PN-30 Camo and now the PN-60.

By far the most accurate GPS'r out there.

 

I’m not disputing if or if not the PN-60 is the most accurate consumer grade handheld GPS. I’m taking exception to the claim that it is “By far” the most accurate. That is a huge claim. What is “by far”? To me, “by far” would mean that it is consistently at least 10’ or 3 m closer to an adjusted bench mark (sub-inch or sub-cm known accuracy) under any atmospheric condition. In addition, it would have to have “by far” more accurate tracks. There have been many reviews and accuracy test comparing the PN-60 to other GPS’s and I have yet to see any saying that the PN-60 is “by far” or even noticeably consistently the most accurate GPS.

[+Team CowboyPapa]

 

Thanks Cowboy. Do you happen to know what the capacity (in mAh) is for this battery? The one DeLorme sells is 1400 mAh. I've seen some CRV3 packs rated as high as 2000 mAh. This would really change the effective duration of use of my PN-40!

There has been a lot of discussion in the DeLorme forums regarding this battery pack:

http://forum.delorme.com/viewtopic.php?f=131&t=16155

Unfortunately, I can't recall anything specific, but a Google in that forum in addition to the link above may lead to some specific data.

 

All that I can say is that I never leave home without mine.

[+myotis]

....

Your next best option is to do as I have done. Get a newer Garmin with waypoint averaging. ......

...any DeLorme handheld GPSr (they all have waypoint averaging),,,,,

 

Correct me if I am wrong, but does not the DeLorme (like the older Garmins) simply average the readings? The newer Garmin's waypoint averaging is more accurate than the early models like the 60CSX (and I suspect the DeLorme) because they analyize the readings and conditions and take that into account instead of just averaging all the readings. For example, when you start averaging, the GPS will tell you how confident it is in the position-when you have a good fix, it will tell you much sooner it has a 100 confidence level than when you don't have a real good fix. That's the reason why I specified a newer Garmin. I suspect other than a survey grade GPS, the newer Garmin waypoint avergaing over about a month will get you the most accurate reading. When I did the reading in my back yard, after a couple of weeks of averaging, it would mostly not do any more adjusting and if it did, it was only a foot. It appeared to me I pretty well had the maxium accuracy after 2 weeks.

[+Team CowboyPapa]

....Correct me if I am wrong, but does not the DeLorme .....

Actually, I am not aware of the specific algorithm implemented.

 

Similarly, I have no definitive, quantitave knowledge of the misregistration of the aerial photo imagery that I use.

OTOH, to suggest that the 6 feet discrepancy that I typically and uniformly see in widely dispersed locations (by hundreds of miles) is the result of my DeLorme having an error of 106' due east and all those aerial photo images misregistered by 100' due east is a contention that does not pass the giggle test.

Edited December 27, 2011 by Team CowboyPapa

[+myotis]

You know what they say, when in doubt read the GPS's direction (and it will tell you DeLorome just averages).

 

Aerial photos can be right on and they can be way off. But before anyone goes making scientifically valid claims about accuracy, you need to make sure you have a sound basis to make your claim. Its not that difficult. Even though the DeLorome does not have as good as waypoint averaging as the newer Garmins, if you go out to a spot once a day for a month and continue to average the spot, you will have something you can truly test accuracy with. You can even test the accuracy of aerial phots this way. If I take the cords I averaged for a month in my back yard and compare it to the Sept 2011 GoogleEarth aerial photos, It shows the photos off 1.5 feet. The April 2010 ahows 5 feet off. The next 3 dates do not have high enough resolution to tell. 2005 is about 10 feet off. 2002 is about 100 feet off and eveything older does not have high enough resolution to tell.

[+achtung6]

You know what they say, when in doubt read the GPS's direction (and it will tell you DeLorome just averages).

 

Aerial photos can be right on and they can be way off. But before anyone goes making scientifically valid claims about accuracy, you need to make sure you have a sound basis to make your claim. Its not that difficult. Even though the DeLorome does not have as good as waypoint averaging as the newer Garmins, if you go out to a spot once a day for a month and continue to average the spot, you will have something you can truly test accuracy with. You can even test the accuracy of aerial phots this way. If I take the cords I averaged for a month in my back yard and compare it to the Sept 2011 GoogleEarth aerial photos, It shows the photos off 1.5 feet. The April 2010 ahows 5 feet off. The next 3 dates do not have high enough resolution to tell. 2005 is about 10 feet off. 2002 is about 100 feet off and eveything older does not have high enough resolution to tell.

 

I'm just glad my DeLorme and other quality GPSr like the Garmin can take Geocachers right up to their chaches more often than not. Of course, many times, this is all dependent on the cache being placed and it's position recorded accurately. Even when it's off by a few feet, it all adds to the fun. All these units can get us there and bring us back home.

 

All this talk about averages is all fine and good. I can only say that having a device like this is the reason I partake in this hobby. There would not be as many participants if we were all on paper charts!

 

Get out there and hunt for some caches!

[+myotis]

I worry what will happen when the comsumer GPS get submeter accuracy. What fun will caching be if the GPS takes you exactly to the cache? What will be the challenge? It will be as difficult as doing the ET Trail or picking up lampposts. I for one think it was more fun back in the day before high sensitivity recievers and the numbetrs hounds takeover. Heck we had no paperless caching or even maps on GPSs. Back in the day, your GPS would normally get you in the right area (within 50 feet) and then you had to use your finding skills. So for lots of things, submeter accuracy will be great. I think it will be bad news for caching and make it even more a numbers game instead of about the hunt. When we get submeter commerical GPSs, perhaps gc.com could take the cords and randomly generate cords within 50 feet of the actual cache.

[+achtung6]

I worry what will happen when the comsumer GPS get submeter accuracy. What fun will caching be if the GPS takes you exactly to the cache? What will be the challenge? It will be as difficult as doing the ET Trail or picking up lampposts. I for one think it was more fun back in the day before high sensitivity recievers and the numbetrs hounds takeover. Heck we had no paperless caching or even maps on GPSs. Back in the day, your GPS would normally get you in the right area (within 50 feet) and then you had to use your finding skills. So for lots of things, submeter accuracy will be great. I think it will be bad news for caching and make it even more a numbers game instead of about the hunt. When we get submeter commerical GPSs, perhaps gc.com could take the cords and randomly generate cords within 50 feet of the actual cache.

 

I'll agree with that! As with any hobby though, you'll always have die hards who take it more seriously than the casual participant and the spoil sports that are in it for other reasons, i.e. the numbers competition you mention. I do feel that all the advancement and convenience we have now is because of the size of the following. For what it's worth, the equipment manufacturers as well as the gc.com people would not have done the awesome job they have if there were fewer participants. This would be good for the "purist" but bad for me! :-)

[+achtung6]

Today, the CR-V3 DeLorme battery gave out after about 3 hours of geochaching.... I see a CabBat in my future. This performance is unacceptable.

[+a2n]

CabBat is the way to go.

[+Team CowboyPapa]

Today, the CR-V3 DeLorme battery gave out after about 3 hours of geochaching.... I see a CabBat in my future. This performance is unacceptable.

I agree, you only got 7 caches today with that battery pack.

I went out last Friday with a CabBat in my PN and got 8!

[+Team CowboyPapa]

CabBat is the way to go.

Roger that, and with these gizmos, I'm never taking the back off and messing with AAs:

Quatro 12VDC to USB, 4 holer:

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/usb-4-port-car-adapter-2085

120VAC – USB, 2 holer:

http://www.eforcity.com/dappipodtc16.html?int=efsechtxtrigos-item

[+achtung6]

Today, the CR-V3 DeLorme battery gave out after about 3 hours of geochaching.... I see a CabBat in my future. This performance is unacceptable.

I agree, you only got 7 caches today with that battery pack.

I went out last Friday with a CabBat in my PN and got 8!

 

Good eye there Cowboy! I'd be willing to wager that your 8 finds did not leave you with a drained battery!

[39_Steps]

I found 8 Eneloop NiMH rechargeable AA cells w/bundled charger for the PN-40 one day, plus one geocache. I didn't log either event, as neither unscrewing two screws to take the back off to replace batteries once in a while nor logging geocaches is a big deal to me.