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How soon is too soon to start hiding caches?


CowtownJohn
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I'm probably going to get somebody wound up with this, but I have to ask... When should newer cachers start hiding? Now I'm in no way trying to discourage anyone; new hides keep this game going. But when I go after a hide with the coords way off, and the CO writes and says "thats what we came up with" or someone puts a cache somewhere that has a sign saying "City Property, No Trespassing", thats pretty annoying, besides that's trouble I don't need.

 

I think less experienced folks should have at least 75-100 finds. That gives them a good range to look at and see what makes a good hide or a bad one. I didn't do my first one until I had 150. The two CO's have a combined total of 13. One cache is disabled until the coords are fixed.

 

I realize this will probably get me bad looks and unkind words, but it's frustrating to put in time and effort for a lot of nothing.

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I'm probably going to get somebody wound up with this, but I have to ask... When should newer cachers start hiding? Now I'm in no way trying to discourage anyone; new hides keep this game going. But when I go after a hide with the coords way off, and the CO writes and says "thats what we came up with" or someone puts a cache somewhere that has a sign saying "City Property, No Trespassing", thats pretty annoying, besides that's trouble I don't need.

 

I think less experienced folks should have at least 75-100 finds. That gives them a good range to look at and see what makes a good hide or a bad one. I didn't do my first one until I had 150. The two CO's have a combined total of 13. One cache is disabled until the coords are fixed.

 

I realize this will probably get me bad looks and unkind words, but it's frustrating to put in time and effort for a lot of nothing.

 

At least 50 then allowed one. after 100 they can plant as many as they like.

 

The biggest problem I see with people that hide one after less than 20 hides is they leave the game forever.

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I think that you would get a much different answer has you been asking this question about yourself rather than about others.

 

While I suppose generalizations can be made, I know of crappy caches by cachers with more than enough experience to know better, and one of the best, most creative hiders that I have known hid his first cache when he had just one find.

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I'm probably going to get somebody wound up with this, but I have to ask... When should newer cachers start hiding? Now I'm in no way trying to discourage anyone; new hides keep this game going. But when I go after a hide with the coords way off, and the CO writes and says "thats what we came up with" or someone puts a cache somewhere that has a sign saying "City Property, No Trespassing", thats pretty annoying, besides that's trouble I don't need.

 

I think less experienced folks should have at least 75-100 finds. That gives them a good range to look at and see what makes a good hide or a bad one. I didn't do my first one until I had 150. The two CO's have a combined total of 13. One cache is disabled until the coords are fixed.

 

I realize this will probably get me bad looks and unkind words, but it's frustrating to put in time and effort for a lot of nothing.

 

At least 50 then allowed one. after 100 they can plant as many as they like.

 

The biggest problem I see with people that hide one after less than 20 hides is they leave the game forever.

 

+ 1000!! I especially like the "allowed one" part. Allow one, then wait 1 month before the gates are open and a CO can plant as many as they like. This should weed out the fly-by-nighters.

Edited by Ybar E
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I went for a FTF yesterday and met another cacher who had just pulled up ahead of me. The listed coordinates had us in one corner of the lot. The description said that it was behind a dumpster. The only dumpster in the area was on the other side of the lot, abut 50 yards away. Huh?

 

We then checked the hint. It said "In bushes behind a wall". No wall or bushes in the GZ or near the dumpster.

 

So, we have a GZ in one corner, bushes planted terraced behind a brick wall about 25 yards away, and a dumpster 50 yards away. WTH?

 

The CO has one find, and it was back in May. Finally found the cache behind the wall, well away from the GZ and dumpster.

 

Posted updated coordinates in the log and emailed the CO. Still no response or update on the cache listing.

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You can't teach smart. And that's the problem. Some people will never understand, no matter how many caches they've found.

New series nearby. The CO has 265 finds and 15 hides. The premise of the series was very intresting. The location of the two we tried fit the premise very well! Execution was terrible! The first had the coords 67 feet off, with a dollar store container hiden behind a planter, under leaves. Second one we did not find. Probably behind the planter outside the window of a restaurant. Container had already been destroyed, and replaced with a film canister by another cacher. Sorry. Not going to look for any more in the series. Sad thing is that it was a very intresting concept for a series. Oh, well.

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You can't teach smart. And that's the problem. Some people will never understand, no matter how many caches they've found.

 

+1

Some people get it right away (even before finding ANY caches), and others just never seem to quite get the hang of it.

And the rest of us who mostly do OK, but every once-in-a-while we put one out that doesn't quite work out as planned. :wacko:

 

This is (partly) why Groundspeak will probably never restrict the ability to hide caches based on 'experience'.

Mostly it is because Groundspeak is 'just a listing service', and has no control (or concern) with the quality of hidden caches.

 

If there were some sort of 'Approved Hider' status, then Groundspeak could bear some liability for caches their 'Approved Hider' placed.

 

I'd say they are wise to steer clear of those rocky shoals.

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Personally I waited until I'd found a few and felt like I'd learned how this is done. Always a hot topic but I still would encourage everyone to cache for awhile prior to hiding their own.

I agree with you. I'm not sure when I started hiding geocaches, but I had a few finds under my belt first. I already knew how to take good coordinates with a GPS unit before I started geocaching. They are great for hiking or hunting in the dark. Garmin even makes a great tracking collar for hunting hounds.

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...or someone puts a cache somewhere that has a sign saying "City Property, No Trespassing", thats pretty annoying, besides that's trouble I don't need.

 

This particular case is easily and quickly dispatched with a "Needs Archived" log, preferably with a photo of the No Trespassing sign attached. I have had to do this on a number of occasions, and the reviewers ALWAYS take trespassing issues seriously, and has resulted in the cache being archived so far 100% of the time. If we are aggressive about posting "N/A" in these situations, it will happen less often, and hiders will learn.

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Has this come up in the schedule again already?

 

I think after 100 finds.

 

After 100 finds I starting having a clue about what this game is about.

 

I just went after three 4 terrain caches in a row recently. They were really well done, but they could have been really bad.

One, especially, was in a really dangerous spot, but they were experienced thoughtful cachers who put them there, so they knew where to draw the line. They were still a little dangerous, but they were smart about how they did it, so no one would die at it. While I was searching I was praying they were experienced cachers who would do them well, and that was the case, I'm very happy to report.

They were tough, but smart caches.

I realized hanging on the side of that cliff that it could have been really bad had the cache owner been new.

 

Now I say, one needs to have 1000 caches found if you're going to hide a 4 terrain or higher.

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Frequently asked, difficult to answer - especially if you want a fixed number/timeframe.

 

Are you sure you're going to be sticking with geocaching for awhile and have time to maintain your cache(s)?

 

Do you have a reasonably accurate GPS device and are you aware of the accuracy and limitations of said device?

 

Have you found a range of different hides and containers?

 

Do you have an opinion of what makes a "good cache" and a "bad cache"? (I don't think it matters WHAT that opinion is, so long as you have one.)

 

Have you thought about placing a cache but weren't sure if you're ready? (Like making babies, those most qualified for it are usually the ones most worried IF they're qualified for it. The bad ones usually don't bother to consider if it's a good idea.)

 

If I had to give a number I say would at least 6 months of caching and at least 50 Finds.

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Interesting topic even the best cachers can make mistakes. I was visiting my mom over the Thanksgiving Holiday and went looking for a cache that was in a nearby park just to discover the cache was actually on my mom's farm. The reviewer archived the cache and the CO moved it 15 feet back onto public property and re-enabled it. So even seasoned cachers can make mistakes. As for hides I agree 100 would be a good number I waited till after 100 to hide one. This helps eliminate the people who find 20 hide one then leave the game. Tim

Edited by Tim2akaT2
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Frequently asked, difficult to answer - especially if you want a fixed number/timeframe.

 

Are you sure you're going to be sticking with geocaching for awhile and have time to maintain your cache(s)?

 

Do you have a reasonably accurate GPS device and are you aware of the accuracy and limitations of said device?

 

Have you found a range of different hides and containers?

 

Do you have an opinion of what makes a "good cache" and a "bad cache"? (I don't think it matters WHAT that opinion is, so long as you have one.)

 

Have you thought about placing a cache but weren't sure if you're ready? (Like making babies, those most qualified for it are usually the ones most worried IF they're qualified for it. The bad ones usually don't bother to consider if it's a good idea.)

 

If I had to give a number I say would at least 6 months of caching and at least 50 Finds.

+1 I would add that the guidelines have been read several times first.

 

All in all the number of caches and how long are the least important as someone else said you can't fix stupid. :blink:

 

Back when I started in 2002 I had found 3 caches and had about 2 months in the game when I hid my first. :yikes: It is still active.

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The number of finds matters a lot less than which caches have been found. Spending a day on a numbers run trail like the ET Highway will net hundreds of finds, and will demonstrate that "all" geocaches are film canisters hidden along a desert highway. Spending a day somewhere else may net only a dozen (or fewer) finds, but will probably demonstrate different geocache sizes, different geocache containers, different geocache hide/camouflage techniques, etc.

 

I recommend that new geocachers wait until they've found enough geocaches to know what kinds of containers work best, what kinds of geocaches they enjoy, what kinds of geocaches they would like to maintain for the long term, and what kinds of geocaches they would like to be known for among the local geocaching community.

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I agree and disagree at the same time. We started geocaching and my daughter wanted to hide one right away. We did our homework and placed some. They have all had good reviews so far and are still active. I think it depends on the person more then the number of caches found. Like they said you cant fix stupid. Someone could have had many finds and still place a cache that sux. I think sometimes the new members might have a original idea that could be fun that might burn out after finding many film cans in a lamp post. But I also agree that experience helps when placing. We are being more selective now of the caches we place and making them even funner if possible. But to limit people would make for less around and I like to have them around. If they are bad hides that will show up soon.

-WarNinjas

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The biggest problem I see with people that hide one after less than 20 hides is they leave the game forever.

 

I don't necessarily have a problem with these newbie hides. In our area, we've had a number of these pop up. Fortunately, all have had good coordinates. We find them, the CO or the cache disappers or both, a NA request, then the spot is opened up for another smilie, I mean cache. :D

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I agree and disagree at the same time. We started geocaching and my daughter wanted to hide one right away. We did our homework and placed some. They have all had good reviews so far and are still active. I think it depends on the person more then the number of caches found. Like they said you cant fix stupid. Someone could have had many finds and still place a cache that sux. I think sometimes the new members might have a original idea that could be fun that might burn out after finding many film cans in a lamp post. But I also agree that experience helps when placing. We are being more selective now of the caches we place and making them even funner if possible. But to limit people would make for less around and I like to have them around. If they are bad hides that will show up soon.

-WarNinjas

 

But your key phrase was: "We did our homework"

 

If you're a noob but did your homework, I would hardly classify you as someone who shouldn't be hiding.

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...or someone puts a cache somewhere that has a sign saying "City Property, No Trespassing", thats pretty annoying, besides that's trouble I don't need.

 

This particular case is easily and quickly dispatched with a "Needs Archived" log, preferably with a photo of the No Trespassing sign attached. I have had to do this on a number of occasions, and the reviewers ALWAYS take trespassing issues seriously, and has resulted in the cache being archived so far 100% of the time. If we are aggressive about posting "N/A" in these situations, it will happen less often, and hiders will learn.

 

+1. However, people seem to think their is a stigma associated with the NA log...of being labelled a "cache cop". I just drop the local reviewer a private email with the details. They then contatc the cache owner and poses a question to the CO ("Do you have permission for this to be behind a No Trespassing sign"). Much less angst.

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The number of finds matters a lot less than which caches have been found. Spending a day on a numbers run trail like the ET Highway will net hundreds of finds, and will demonstrate that "all" geocaches are film canisters hidden along a desert highway. Spending a day somewhere else may net only a dozen (or fewer) finds, but will probably demonstrate different geocache sizes, different geocache containers, different geocache hide/camouflage techniques, etc.

 

I recommend that new geocachers wait until they've found enough geocaches to know what kinds of containers work best, what kinds of geocaches they enjoy, what kinds of geocaches they would like to maintain for the long term, and what kinds of geocaches they would like to be known for among the local geocaching community.

 

+1

 

Having a "find" record of 20 or 50 or 100 single-stage, park-and-grab micros doesn't give the finder any more experience than finding 1 such cache.

 

Experience at finding a wide variety of cache types, good and bad containers, locations and difficulty ratings would be a much better yardstick.

Edited by Pup Patrol
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The number of finds matters a lot less than which caches have been found. Spending a day on a numbers run trail like the ET Highway will net hundreds of finds, and will demonstrate that "all" geocaches are film canisters hidden along a desert highway. Spending a day somewhere else may net only a dozen (or fewer) finds, but will probably demonstrate different geocache sizes, different geocache containers, different geocache hide/camouflage techniques, etc.

 

I recommend that new geocachers wait until they've found enough geocaches to know what kinds of containers work best, what kinds of geocaches they enjoy, what kinds of geocaches they would like to maintain for the long term, and what kinds of geocaches they would like to be known for among the local geocaching community.

 

+1

 

Having a "find" record of 20 or 50 or 100 single-stage, park-and-grab micros doesn't give the finder any more experience than finding 1 such cache.

 

Experience at finding a wide variety of cache types, good and bad containers, locations and difficulty ratings would be a much better yardstick.

I know! Maybe they should have to complete the Fizzy Challenge before they can hide any caches.:lol:

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The number of finds matters a lot less than which caches have been found. Spending a day on a numbers run trail like the ET Highway will net hundreds of finds, and will demonstrate that "all" geocaches are film canisters hidden along a desert highway. Spending a day somewhere else may net only a dozen (or fewer) finds, but will probably demonstrate different geocache sizes, different geocache containers, different geocache hide/camouflage techniques, etc.

 

I recommend that new geocachers wait until they've found enough geocaches to know what kinds of containers work best, what kinds of geocaches they enjoy, what kinds of geocaches they would like to maintain for the long term, and what kinds of geocaches they would like to be known for among the local geocaching community.

 

+1

 

Having a "find" record of 20 or 50 or 100 single-stage, park-and-grab micros doesn't give the finder any more experience than finding 1 such cache.

 

Experience at finding a wide variety of cache types, good and bad containers, locations and difficulty ratings would be a much better yardstick.

I know! Maybe they should have to complete the Fizzy Challenge before they can hide any caches.:lol:

 

HEY!!! You're not supposed to be posting over here!!!

Get back over in OT where you belong!!!!

 

Yeah, I'm hiding from OT right now too.

 

If everyone had to complete the Fizzy Challenge first, there wouldn't be enough people hiding caches for others to complete the challenge!! :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

 

How about, Definitely AFTER you buy (or borrow) a real GPS.

We've had trouble with coords on smart phone caches around here.

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I'm probably going to get somebody wound up with this, but I have to ask... When should newer cachers start hiding? Now I'm in no way trying to discourage anyone; new hides keep this game going. But when I go after a hide with the coords way off, and the CO writes and says "thats what we came up with" or someone puts a cache somewhere that has a sign saying "City Property, No Trespassing", thats pretty annoying, besides that's trouble I don't need.

 

I think less experienced folks should have at least 75-100 finds. That gives them a good range to look at and see what makes a good hide or a bad one. I didn't do my first one until I had 150. The two CO's have a combined total of 13. One cache is disabled until the coords are fixed.

 

I realize this will probably get me bad looks and unkind words, but it's frustrating to put in time and effort for a lot of nothing.

100 finds and AFTER you have a REAL GPS. [smartphones are not real gps's so do your potential seekers a favor by NOT taking coord readings with a phone!]

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I'm probably going to get somebody wound up with this, but I have to ask... When should newer cachers start hiding? Now I'm in no way trying to discourage anyone; new hides keep this game going. But when I go after a hide with the coords way off, and the CO writes and says "thats what we came up with" or someone puts a cache somewhere that has a sign saying "City Property, No Trespassing", thats pretty annoying, besides that's trouble I don't need.

 

I think less experienced folks should have at least 75-100 finds. That gives them a good range to look at and see what makes a good hide or a bad one. I didn't do my first one until I had 150. The two CO's have a combined total of 13. One cache is disabled until the coords are fixed.

 

I realize this will probably get me bad looks and unkind words, but it's frustrating to put in time and effort for a lot of nothing.

If i had a nickel for every cache placed beyond a no trespassing sign. . . . .

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100 finds and AFTER you have a REAL GPS. [smartphones are not real gps's so do your potential seekers a favor by NOT taking coord readings with a phone!]

 

You can hide a cache perfectly well with a phone, you just have to be a bit more careful and get an app to average coordinates. There is no need to run out and spend $100s on a dedicated device. I hid a bunch of caches with a phone before I got my GPS and they're just fine. On the flip side, I once hid a cache using my Garmin 62s that was almost 100 feet off (apparently it was cranky and hadn't warmed up yet).

 

Yes, smart phones have real GPS receivers in them now (this is a common misconception that just won't go away).

 

Better advice would have been "do your potential seekers a favor and average your coordinates over a 5-10 minute period, minimum, so that you obtain accurate coordinates!"

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I think it depends on the education of the person. For example I did my first hide after only having about 10 finds but none of my finds were easy P&G's for example. Also, I do ALOT of reading especially when I start a new hobby. I must have read the knowledge books beginning to end a couple times plus reading on the forums and observing other people logs. Would I recommend placing a hide after only 10 finds. No Probably not, and I might have been a bit premature but I feel it was a quality hide, albeit an easy find. I used a lock n lock, I averaged my coordinates, I picked a good location, and I keep an eye on it in case of any maintenance issues. Like I say, I think it depends on the individual. I'm a fast learner and I pick up on things quite easily, some people take a little longer to pick up on some things.

 

Bottom line is don't rush into hiding a cache just because you're excited to do so. Be sure you have a full understanding of the rules and the common practice do's and don't of placing a cache. Most importantly use a good container and plan on maintaining for the long haul!

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This should be a fun one to watch.

 

Bottom line is, you can hide a cache WHEN you know you're capable of hiding a cache that makes EVERYONE happy.

 

You’re not going to make everyone happy. There will always be someone that is not easy to please. For example if one were to hide a coffin in the woods as a cache, there may be a few critics.

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This should be a fun one to watch.

 

Bottom line is, you can hide a cache WHEN you know you're capable of hiding a cache that makes EVERYONE happy.

 

You're not going to make everyone happy. There will always be someone that is not easy to please. For example if one were to hide a coffin in the woods as a cache, there may be a few critics.

 

Zzzzzzzinggggggggggggg!!!!!!!!!!!

 

:lol:

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This has been debated a lot in my home area too. At this point, I believe that once a person is familiar with the rules of the game they are good to go. The local caching community will then decide the fate of the hide. For me, I wanted to experience as many hides as possible before hiding my own. I am now ready to contribute after one year and 1200 finds. We'll see how it works out.

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A minimum of one find of each size of cache should be required to understand sizes. And a min of 100 finds (not hard to do) to give u an idea dropping a coffee tin in the bushes beside a guardrail along the highway is NOT a fun cache. Also you should have 2 gps devices (ie a phone and a dedicated handheld or a handheld and a auto ) just so you can average out the coords. Maybe more learing "events" should be hel;d for new cachers around to teach newbies of TBs and hides etc.

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A minimum of one find of each size of cache should be required to understand sizes. And a min of 100 finds (not hard to do) to give u an idea dropping a coffee tin in the bushes beside a guardrail along the highway is NOT a fun cache. Also you should have 2 gps devices (ie a phone and a dedicated handheld or a handheld and a auto ) just so you can average out the coords. Maybe more learing "events" should be hel;d for new cachers around to teach newbies of TBs and hides etc.

 

You don't need two devices to average coordinates...I do mine by taking a waypiont then walking away and going to the cache from a different direction and take another waypoint. I do this 4 or 5 times and coordinates taken when the GPS was more accurate are weighted higher. Seems to work out pretty good so far!

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This should be a fun one to watch.

 

Bottom line is, you can hide a cache WHEN you know you're capable of hiding a cache that makes EVERYONE happy.

 

You’re not going to make everyone happy. There will always be someone that is not easy to please. For example if one were to hide a coffin in the woods as a cache, there may be a few critics.

 

Thank God the knuckleheads that found it weren't geocachers. They were just a bunch poor orienteers. They couldn't afford a real GPS OR a smart phone.

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This should be a fun one to watch.

 

Bottom line is, you can hide a cache WHEN you know you're capable of hiding a cache that makes EVERYONE happy.

 

You’re not going to make everyone happy. There will always be someone that is not easy to please. For example if one were to hide a coffin in the woods as a cache, there may be a few critics.

 

BTW, my comment highlighted above was a lame attempt at humor.

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A minimum of one find of each size of cache should be required to understand sizes.
Really? People have to find a rare large size cache before they can understand the difference between a micro size cache and a small size cache?

 

And a min of 100 finds (not hard to do)
For some people, 100 finds is a major milestone, involving a LOT of travel.

 

Also you should have 2 gps devices (ie a phone and a dedicated handheld or a handheld and a auto ) just so you can average out the coords.
I'd rather use coordinates from someone with one GPSr that they know how to use well than from someone with 2 or more devices that they barely know how to use. And coordinates on two separate days are better than coordinates from 2 devices on the same day.
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