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people log multiple DNFs on single caches

I list the total number of DNFs I've logged in my public profile. I don't consider them evidence of failure, they're simply part of the adventure of caching. The number is the same as I see in my (private) list of all DNFed caches. The DNF count includes caches I've subsequently found on a return visit, and includes caches that turned out to actually be missing, many of which were eventually archived.


And there are several caches I've DNFed multiple times. Every time I look for a cache and don't find it, it's a DNF. Pretty straightforward, really.



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people log multiple DNFs on single caches

And that would mean???


I like the DNF count because I can compute a geocaching average (like a batting average). Each attempt ends in either a Find or a DNF. The find count divided by the sum of the find count and DNF count gives your geocaching average. Of course if you never log a DNF your geocaching average is 1.000 ; and if you don't log a DNF every time you're inflating your geocaching average as well. But like baseball where not every batting appearance counts as an at bat in baseball (for example a sacrifice out doesn't count), there may be times when you look for a cache that you don't count as a DNF. Since there are no official scorers there is no official score. My geocaching average is 0.871

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Personally I am more for removing the counts all together unless you actively click through to that individuals geocaching stats. Barring that, if you're going to show the counts, you should show the DNF's also.


There is a downside. While it would not affect how we cache, many will stop logging DNF's because they mistakenly view the "F" part to mean FAIL.


Oops...wait...that would mean DID NOT FAIL, the same as found it. OK, I'm convinced, eliminate FOUND IT and use DNF sort of like they use Aloha to mean hello and goodbye in Hawaii. Somebody start a new thread.

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I completely disagree. First of all, it's not a number game. Then, this is going to be very likely discourage people to log DNFs. If you like to show off your Geocaching average, you can do so in your public profile.

Not necessarily, I think a reasonably high DNF ratio should be considered fairly normal. I am pleased to log DNFs. Either the cache is not there or more likely I have been outwitted by the owner. This also brings another point to mind, maybe it would be helpful to be able to see the DNF ratio of placed caches up front.

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I try to log all my DNFs including the multiples (of which I have multiple :rolleyes: ) I like the idea of the batting average and may try to put something together in my FSG stats. I keep a Bookmark list of all my DNFs and LTFs and try and keep the DNF list updated with when I returned to find the cache or if it was Archived/Verified missing by CO, or whatever...


(LTF - Last to Find. A list of all the Caches that were Archived when we were the last person to post a find log.)


That being said, I think if it was optional, then I think it would be nice to have. If you couldn't turn just that stat off, then I think it would further deter people from logging DNFs.



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I log my dnfs and generally try to determine if the cache was missing or not by watching it subsequently. If it turns out the cache was missing at the time, then a dnf is actually a wnt (was not there) and so far about half the time I've found a dnf is actually a wnt. Too bad you can't tell in real time, but in that way it's possible to get a better idea of your actual "batting average" over time.

In my experience as a CO, the majority of "not founds" are not reported. The "standard statistical package" doesn't display dnfs, you can't even see other folks' dnfs unless you look at a specific cache page, and there is no way to verify a dnf. People who want to know their "find batting average" or who want to alert the CO of a possible missing cache, have a positive reason to report dnfs and do so. For everyone else, there is no positive incentive to say "I didn't find it" and human nature takes over from there. In other words, to report a dnf requires some internal positive benefit for the reporter because the game doesn't provide them, while not reporting a dnf allows you to avoid a self reported "failure".

Which is to say, that tracking your batting average is likely to remain a personal statistic, not a comparative one.


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