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The APE Cache in Brazil


Mitragorz

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I was under the impression the ape caches couldn't be adopted

Since the FOX studios were no longer involved maintaining the APE-caches, this cache was already adopted from the original owner.

It would be logical that this cache was owned by someone who is capable of maintaining it.

 

Perhaps, but the guidelines don't require that a cache owner must be able to maintain it themselves, as long as a viable maintenance plan exists. As the cache has been found a few times in the last month it doesn't look to me that it's not being maintained. In fact, it looks like Mr_Gehringer has visited it a few times and has had concerns about the location being too visible, and someone else (who it appears has never visited the location) posted a NM because it's not in it's "original location".

There is no current maintenance plan. The CO is totally dependent of the help of the locals. Many local (and not local, including me) geocachers are very concerned about the cache, the hide and the maintenance. Most people want that this cache would last long, well hidden and well maintained.

At the moment, the cache is alive and well, in a good spot and fun to find. I sincerely hope it would stay this way.

 

From what I have seen, a cache totally maintained by locals *is* considered a viable maintenance plan as long as there has been someone specifically identified that will take care of the cache if there are issues. In fact, there are many caches which are maintained by non-geocachers. I realize that there is a "no-precedent" clause in the guidelines, but as long as there is someone local that will step up and say "I will physically maintain the cache if there are any issues" I would hope that the local reviewer and Groundspeak will allow it to remain active.

 

I know that there have been instances of vacation caches placed by someone that could not periodically visit the site and had someone local "watch over" the cache, then that person was no longer available, resulting in the cache not being maintained, but it doesn't sound like this is an issue in this case.

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I was under the impression the ape caches couldn't be adopted

Since the FOX studios were no longer involved maintaining the APE-caches, this cache was already adopted from the original owner.

It would be logical that this cache was owned by someone who is capable of maintaining it.

 

Perhaps, but the guidelines don't require that a cache owner must be able to maintain it themselves, as long as a viable maintenance plan exists. As the cache has been found a few times in the last month it doesn't look to me that it's not being maintained. In fact, it looks like Mr_Gehringer has visited it a few times and has had concerns about the location being too visible, and someone else (who it appears has never visited the location) posted a NM because it's not in it's "original location".

There is no current maintenance plan. The CO is totally dependent of the help of the locals. Many local (and not local, including me) geocachers are very concerned about the cache, the hide and the maintenance. Most people want that this cache would last long, well hidden and well maintained.

At the moment, the cache is alive and well, in a good spot and fun to find. I sincerely hope it would stay this way.

 

From what I have seen, a cache totally maintained by locals *is* considered a viable maintenance plan as long as there has been someone specifically identified that will take care of the cache if there are issues. In fact, there are many caches which are maintained by non-geocachers. I realize that there is a "no-precedent" clause in the guidelines, but as long as there is someone local that will step up and say "I will physically maintain the cache if there are any issues" I would hope that the local reviewer and Groundspeak will allow it to remain active.

 

I know that there have been instances of vacation caches placed by someone that could not periodically visit the site and had someone local "watch over" the cache, then that person was no longer available, resulting in the cache not being maintained, but it doesn't sound like this is an issue in this case.

A viable maintenance plan can and should be made. To get there, there should be some co-operation between the CO and the local geocachers. Why not co-operate with local geocachers who have been there 2-3 times, who speak English and care about the value of this geocache?

The CO wants to send money to Brazil. As far I know, nobody has asked any money for maintaining the cache. I think that nobody needs any money involved at all. I just wonder, to who he wants to pay and for what? Geocaching is a hobby which is based on volunteerism and there is a growing community of Brazilian geocachers, who are willing to help maintaining the cache, for free of course.

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I scheduled a trip to Seattle to go find Mission 9 and then literally 1 week before my flight, the cache was stolen and archived. That sucked... but it happens.

 

I'm planning a trip to Brazil again at the end of February (I go a few times a year). This time, I want to go get the last APE cache. I really hope that all of these "lets move the cache around" actions don't inadvertently cause this one to get archived also. At least not until AFTER I go. :)

 

*crossing fingers*

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Caches that aren't maintained, including the cache page get archived and locked. Maybe the locals should look into adopting the cache, then they could update the page and preform the maintenance the cache needs.

 

 

I don't know how this could be done.

But for sure it wouldn't be a bad idea that the owner could visit his cache every now and then and do the maintenance needed. Maybe the owner is not willing to give his cache to others, for whatever reasons.

Let's see what will be the owner's wish for the next location, since he is not happy with the current location. Maybe he has a better idea.

 

I found it interesting that one of the reasons cited for the Needs Maintenance log that was posted was "If it has indeed been moved closer to where those in charge of the park can profit from it, then that's a bad thing. This was not what it was intended to be used for." And a previous note log states: "The way I read this it's being used for commercial gain being advertized as only remaining ape cache."

 

So, someone explain to me why this is different from all those that praise the E.T. power trail because of the economic impact that the trail is creating for the Little Ale' Inn in Rachel, NV.

 

I also don't understand why the CO (JoGPS) posted an Owner Maintenance log (today) with new coordinates for the container but didn't post an Update Coordinates log (or have the reviewer change them if it's beyond the allowed distance).

 

One thing to keep in mind during all this is that this is a cache guided by rules that NO other cache is governed by. Mission 9's archiving would never have happened with any other cache that the CO was willing to replace. I don't know what Jeremy's/Groundspeaks rule is towards moving the location. All this discussion about vacation caches etc is somewhat besides the point as this cache is truly in a category of it's own and will live or die at the whim of Groundspeak, as did Mission 9. That'd why I hope that JoGPS will e-mail Groundspeak (If he already hasn't) and make sure this is all kosher.

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Hello Everyone

 

Yes there is a maintenance plan,( always has been ) just lost my local translator that also took care of my permit and guide fees, but every thing is working out and yes I do know the special guidelines towards Ape caches

 

It is being moved again and no need to up date the coordinates until then. This is a cache that takes special planning just to get there, and NO ONE that has really went after it, after myself has never come up empty handed, it has always been findable and hopefully after this last move it will be there for EVER, we are taking our time with the park officials to get this placement right, and yes they know the dollars it brings to the park from folks from other countries., They think its Tooooooooooo COOL.

 

ya'll can stop looking over my shoulder any time now

 

Joe // JoGPS

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As one of the lucky few that have found this special cache in it's original location, I would like to thank JoeGPS for his time and effort to keep this one alive. We certainly need to work with the park to find a safe location for this cache.

 

Brazilians are amazing people, so warm, friendly and caring. We did not feel any pressure from anyone in the park to use a guide to find the cache. We had enquired at the office about Luis's availability, but it was his day off. We decided to give it a go by ourselves and were fortunate to find it in short order. Sure a machete swinging guide would have made the journey easier, but we had quite a story to tell when we got home to Canada. For sure, the front office should know that you are out there looking for it. You have to be cognizant of dangers you may face in a tropical locale.

 

I truely do not think that the park folks look on this as a cash grab. It is an amazing park with lots to offer visiters. I only regret that we only had the one day to venture down that way and did not spend more time enjoying the park features and wildlife.

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The park with the wildlife and nice people is amazing!

It is good that there is also a nice attraction for geocachers.

I had a great weekend in a park.

So thanks for everyone who could offer this great time in Intervales Park, including all the people who maintain the cache!

Good that everything about keeping the cache alive will be done.

Thank you!

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Looks like I'll be having a guide/interpreter while I'm down there. It'll be nice since I'll be doing it alone, and he's charging a VERY reasonable amount. I can't wait to get down to the park! I went last week to get my Inter-American Driver's Permit, and I'm going back into Manhattan tomorrow afternoon to pick up my Visa.

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Looks like I'll be having a guide/interpreter while I'm down there. It'll be nice since I'll be doing it alone, and he's charging a VERY reasonable amount. I can't wait to get down to the park! I went last week to get my Inter-American Driver's Permit, and I'm going back into Manhattan tomorrow afternoon to pick up my Visa.

 

Sounds great. Looking forward to seeing a trip report.

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Looks like I'll be having a guide/interpreter while I'm down there. It'll be nice since I'll be doing it alone, and he's charging a VERY reasonable amount. I can't wait to get down to the park! I went last week to get my Inter-American Driver's Permit, and I'm going back into Manhattan tomorrow afternoon to pick up my Visa.

 

Safe travels! Don't forget to visit a Brazilian BBQ joint afterwards to celebrate. :laughing:

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Looks like I'll be having a guide/interpreter while I'm down there. It'll be nice since I'll be doing it alone, and he's charging a VERY reasonable amount. I can't wait to get down to the park! I went last week to get my Inter-American Driver's Permit, and I'm going back into Manhattan tomorrow afternoon to pick up my Visa.

 

Safe travels! Don't forget to visit a Brazilian BBQ joint afterwards to celebrate. :laughing:

 

And drink a caipirinha. I prefer the red fruit variety -vs- traditional. :)

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Safe travels! Don't forget to visit a Brazilian BBQ joint afterwards to celebrate. :laughing:

 

Mmmmmmm.....BBQ! Whenever we do caching road trips, we make sure food is on the agenda as well. BBQ is defintiely a favorite - we've had BBQ in the Carolinas, Texas, Chicago, Mississippi, Kansas City (x2), and Syracuse (yes, Syracuse!).

 

And Brazilian BBQ is wonderful!

 

Never had Brazilian BBQ but I've been to the Dinosaur BBQ in Syracuse several times as well as the one in downtown Rochester and have driven by the one in Manhattan. It's good BBQ and has a really fun atmosphere.

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Oh man, what a trip!

 

It started out with me showing up to Newark at 9pm to catch a 10:50 flight with no reservation. After bribing the gate agent and the flight attendants with Ghirardelli chocolates I wound up getting first class for the almost 10 hour flight to Sao Paulo. Chef salad with chopped lobster for an appetizer, then some kind of fish, with lobster tail and rice pilaf for dinner... man, it must be nice to afford to pay for this kind of service! Me, I have to resort to bribery!

 

After I landed, my guide Fernando met me in the terminal with a geocaching sign. I changed out of my monkey suit and into normal clothes and we headed out to the park... a 4 or 5 hour drive. I don't remember, bc I was taking in the scenery. It was beautiful when we left Sao Paulo, but as we approached Parque Intervales the weather turned south.

 

The rain let up, but it was still drizzling when we left the lodge to find the cache. In the middle of an easy twisting trail, we found a fork; A flat trail or a trail up the mountain. We chose the trail up the mountain bc that's the way the arrow on the GPS was pointing. After a few dozen switch backs (and after seeing a frog the size of a dinner plate) we reached the top of the trail. No cache. We were still half a mile away or so. Though the sign at the top of the hill said the trail had ended, the trail continued. So we thought the cache must be down this further trail.

 

After making our way down the other side of the mountain, we get to another fork. "Left" we say. In the direction of the arrow. After a good bit of hiking we found ourselves again .5 miles from the cache, headed in the wrong direction. I wanted to turn back and head back to the lodge, to try again tomorrow, but Fernando said "No, let's keep going. Maybe the trail turns back." Well good thing we followed his advice, because the trail DID turn back and I found a bush full of some of the most delicious berries I had ever tasted. We continued on the trail, up a few dozen more switch backs and found ourselves at the peak of ANOTHER mountain... And no cache in sight. We were .7 miles away or so now. At the top of this mountain were some antennae. We later found out that this is where the park's internet comes in. Unfortunately the weather was very rainy and there was nothing to see from the top of the mountain. In hindsight, I should've taken pictures anyway, but I was so exhausted (and disappointed) I didn't even want to get my camera out.

 

We must've taken a wrong turn somewhere. We decided to head back to the lodge and try again tomorrow, and on the way back, try to pick out our mistake. It gets dark really quick in the forests of Brazil. we got back to the lodge and drank beer and had a good time.

 

The next morning we got up early and went to the restaurant for breakfast. After eating, we went out to find the cache again. I wanted to follow a different road from the beginning, but Fernando wanted to go to the top of the mountain again, thinking there had been some trail at the top that we missed. So we started our way back to the top of the mountain.

 

After a few hundred yards, we got to a switch back that we had passed the day before. At the corner of this switch back was a trail... or what seemed like a trail. We had noticed it the day before, but we gave it no attention... It looked like it stopped a few feet into the forest, like it was a run-off or something. Well today we stopped. I asked Fernando (who had a topo map of the peak) how high we were in relation to the cache. He said that we were at the same elevation. We decided to explore this trail a little.

 

The trail, once getting away from the main trail, was very navigable. We followed it for a long time, and all the while getting closer to the cache. We followed the trail until my GPS read about 9ft from GZ.

 

We searched for a good 20-25 minutes or so and I finally got to shout "Over here, I found it!" Fernando had found this cache before, but not in this spot. I opened it up, looked at all the TBs and the logs... Had a few pictures taken... It was a good feeling to finally get to the cache, after a month or so of planning.

 

After finding the cache, we made our way back to the restaurant for lunch. After eating, we made our way back to Sao Paulo. We were supposed to go to this other city, northeast of Sao Paulo, to take some photos of some nice churches. I'm not a very religious guy, but churches have some of the most beautiful architecture in the world. Well, our plans wound up falling through and I spent the night in Sao Paulo. I flew out the next evening, but not before finding a few caches in Sao Paulo.

 

I think this is what geocaching is all about. I'd have loved to visit Brazil eventually, but without this cache being there I probably would never have made the move. I need to give a special thanks to Fernando (nandonavigator) for being my guide. I had no idea how hard it would've been to get around without speaking the language. Having him as my guide and translator was priceless.

 

I've got soooooo many pictures from the trip, so bear with me while I sift through them and find the best. I may not get to posting them for a day or so but they'll be up here soon.

 

It really was a fantastic trip. Fortunately, I get to fly for free... But if you can afford to go, do it. And if you need a good guide... Well, I know a guy.

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I think this is what geocaching is all about.

 

Awesome (that whatever has previously transpired with this cache), it sound like it was a true Geocaching adventure, and not something bastardized by the locals to make a few real off the 'Geocaching Gringos'. B)

 

The only Reals they made off me was what they charged for the delicious meals in the restaurant!

 

There had been talks about actually placing this cache in the gift shop... A placement that I had told the CO that I was very much against. Somehow it wound up where it is now, and hopefully it stays there. It's in a perfect place. It's not too bad of a hike and the scenery is beautiful. There's no commercial tie to this cache at all. I'd love to go back to this park to hike all the trail it has to offer. It really is a gorgeous place. It's not a rainforest with toucans and parrots (in fact, some parts reminded me of hiking back home) but it is a nice place to be. The air is crisp and clean, the sounds you hear at night in the lodge with the windows open... It's just a nice place to be.

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I think this is what geocaching is all about.

 

Awesome (that whatever has previously transpired with this cache), it sound like it was a true Geocaching adventure, and not something bastardized by the locals to make a few real off the 'Geocaching Gringos'. B)

 

The only Reals they made off me was what they charged for the delicious meals in the restaurant!

 

There had been talks about actually placing this cache in the gift shop... A placement that I had told the CO that I was very much against. Somehow it wound up where it is now, and hopefully it stays there. It's in a perfect place. It's not too bad of a hike and the scenery is beautiful. There's no commercial tie to this cache at all. I'd love to go back to this park to hike all the trail it has to offer. It really is a gorgeous place. It's not a rainforest with toucans and parrots (in fact, some parts reminded me of hiking back home) but it is a nice place to be. The air is crisp and clean, the sounds you hear at night in the lodge with the windows open... It's just a nice place to be.

That alone will get the cache archived! The CO better not do it!! GS wont take that matter very lightly. :ph34r::ph34r::ph34r:

 

Another problem is, the cache container is getting rusty bad and it will be a matter of time that it will make holes in the container. My advice that the CO get someone over there and sandblast it and repaint it. There is a special rule of the APE cache, once the container is a goner, you cant replace it...so its best to take care of it if you want a long life.

 

I love all the pictures you posted in here. TY!!

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dsc6350hdr.jpg

 

A few questions...

 

What kind of filter or post processing did you use on this and some of the other photos? This one looks like a painting rather than a photo.

 

If Fernando had found the cache before, but not in that place, how did you manage to get so lost on the first day looking for it? Were you paying him by the day?

 

Have any plans for your next remote cache. Might I suggest Erta Ale Volcano?

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dsc6350hdr.jpg

 

A few questions...

 

What kind of filter or post processing did you use on this and some of the other photos? This one looks like a painting rather than a photo.

 

I was wondering the same thing. What kind of camera do you use? Those are some beautiful pictures, thanks for posting them.

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If Fernando had found the cache before, but not in that place, how did you manage to get so lost on the first day looking for it? Were you paying him by the day?

 

Nope, he only charged a flat rate! :D He had found the cache before, but it was before it was moved to this new location. So, neither of us had any idea where it was. He had never been down any of the trails we took, so we were just following our (poor) intuition.

 

I was wondering the same thing. What kind of camera do you use? Those are some beautiful pictures, thanks for posting them.

 

I shoot a Nikon D90, and I always shoot (unless I'm photographing people) with the colors and saturation cranked way up. I like the little extra pop.

 

As for the few really out there pics, I used Photoshop to add "HDR Toning." I didn't bracket any of the shots to make real HDR photos, so I fooled around with that a little bit. I like the looks of photos that have a surrealistic look to them.

 

And I'll have to check out that volcano. Looks pretty interesting!

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If Fernando had found the cache before, but not in that place, how did you manage to get so lost on the first day looking for it? Were you paying him by the day?

 

Nope, he only charged a flat rate! :D He had found the cache before, but it was before it was moved to this new location. So, neither of us had any idea where it was. He had never been down any of the trails we took, so we were just following our (poor) intuition.

 

I had heard that the cache had moved but I didn't realize that it had move about a mile and a half until I looked at the most recent coordinate change log. Now I understand why Fernando couldn't find it.

 

 

I was wondering the same thing. What kind of camera do you use? Those are some beautiful pictures, thanks for posting them.

 

I shoot a Nikon D90, and I always shoot (unless I'm photographing people) with the colors and saturation cranked way up. I like the little extra pop.

 

As for the few really out there pics, I used Photoshop to add "HDR Toning." I didn't bracket any of the shots to make real HDR photos, so I fooled around with that a little bit. I like the looks of photos that have a surrealistic look to them.

 

 

Thanks...unfortunately I don't have that version of Photoshop or I'd play with that myself.

 

 

And I'll have to check out that volcano. Looks pretty interesting!

 

I was in Addis Ababa a couple of years ago when there were only 4 caches in Ethiopia so the Erta Ale Volcano cache has been on my radar for awhile. From the recent logs it appears that it's become much more accessible (and safer) and even organized tourist tours available to get to the area, but it's still over 10 hours by road (then a significant hike) from Addis.

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