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Geocaching Chirp Transmitter

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Place the Garmin Chirp geocache transmitter in your geocache and let its broadcast help geocachers find it.

● Chirp utilizes ANT technology to broadcast a local signal with a typical range of 10m to compatible Garmin GPS units

● Chirp can be programmed to transmit your geocache name, hints, description, riddle and next-stage coordinates for multicaches

● PIN-protected use deters theft and reprogramming

● Garmin Chirp works with ANT-enabled versions of Garmin Oregon, Dakota and GPSMAP 62/78

● Replaceable lithium CR2032 battery has a typical life of more than 1 year

Imported.

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Anyone used this yet ?? Or know anything about it ???

This will change geocaching in a big way and it's only 20$

 

Chirps (wireless beacons) have been around for a while now. I've found one cache with a Chirp. My GPSr (60CSx) doesn't receive them, though, nor do non-Garmin units.

 

There is now a special attribute for wireless beacon caches, too: wirelessbeacon-yes.gif

 

I don't think they are taking off very well, though. Few people are willing to leave a $20 piece of electronics out in the environment.

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I'm thinking about getting 20 of them can make one he'll of a muti with thes of course I will make it where it will not leave like 20 ft up a tree I do see a lil more maintince with it

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Anyone used this yet ?? Or know anything about it ???

This will change geocaching in a big way and it's only 20$

 

Yea.. I've found a few.. They are OK I guess but I won't be placing any. Where they can be fun is at events where someone will have one on them advertising the coordinates to a yet unpublished cache. Kind of a 'door prize' so to speak.

 

The biggest problem I see with the chirps is that only specific Garmin GPSr's have the technology and from what I've seen, Groundspeak does not allow the corporate references to the product in a geocache description (may have changed?).

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The biggest problem I see with the chirps is that only specific Garmin GPSr's have the technology and from what I've seen, Groundspeak does not allow the corporate references to the product in a geocache description (may have changed?).

You can call them wireless beacons and use that attribute.

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Well I can see this picking up as people upgrade to the new garmins

 

Think I will do something with them not to big Kuz I know only newer garmins will be able to do it

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Its been around for a while. It hasn't done anything to change Geocaching. Since its a proprietary tech that only Garmin owns it won't get allot of traction. They may have it open for other GPSr manufactures to license but i doubt there is any interest in it. While Garmin may or may not have a majority of the market share in hand held GPSr its not enough to effect a change. Even if all the other manufactures jumped on-board i don't thing it would affect much. I doubt the smart phone makers would adopt it. Also not every Garmin unit supports it. Only the top of the line models have the Chirp feature.

 

There are quite a few chirp caches in my area. The president of the local caching club loves to use them. Basically the posted cords get you near enough to the cache that your chirp enabled unit will pick up the chirp's signal. Then you will receive the final cords from the chirp. So it acts like an electronic multi cache.

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I think the biggest thing to come from the chirp was the beginning of the alienation between Groundspeak and Garmin. If I recall correctly, the introduction of the chirp came as somewhat of a surprise to Groundspeak. And things have only seemed to go downhill from there.

 

Other than that, I think it will stay more of a fringe cache type unless you can use more than a small number of Garmin devices to find them.

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I think the biggest thing to come from the chirp was the beginning of the alienation between Groundspeak and Garmin. If I recall correctly, the introduction of the chirp came as somewhat of a surprise to Groundspeak. And things have only seemed to go downhill from there.

I don't think it was the beginning, but rather more like the final nail in the coffin.

 

I don't believe that Groundspeak knew nothing of the introduction, despite their claim otherwise, but rather Groundspeak couldn't figure out how to extract more money out of Garmin for the concept. Garmin did try to work with Groundspeak on the introduction of the chirp and had units in hand for testing before Garmin released them. Later Jeremy came out and even claimed the design, showing pics of some old usb memory stick or something, but an honest evaluation could only conclude it is indeed different from his idea, thus not Jeremy's design.

 

The dispute goes back much further, as can be shown by the Wherigo client/player on some of the Garmin receivers, they were introduced on the brand new Oregon in late 2008, early 2009 or somewhere in there, but have NEVER been updated. Groundspeak lays claim to a patent on the concept, so technically Garmin can't update the client without permission and input, which has never happened. By the way, Groundspeak currently gets some royalty $$ for every Oregon sold because of the Wherigo player. This is the reason that the player was not part of the Dakota or Montana series.

 

I look for Garmin to drop the Oregon this year, with the Dakota and Montana, the Oregon has just become a middle of the road unit, everyone either wants more (Montana) or less (Dakota), or even less (etrex 10, 20, 30), they've essentially dissolved the market for Oregon's, thus also dissolving groundspeaks lay to claim for $$ of each unit.

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The price of the chip makes this out of reach for most cachers. Seems like a lot of money to leave "out in the field", especially if you are making a multicache with it and need multiple chips.

 

A much better approach is simple version of Wherigo; make a simple version for android/iPhone so when you define your cache page, you define locations and messages to be emitted when you get to that location. Basically a virtual chirp. It costs $0, and runs on any android/iPhone device.

 

Could be incorporated into the existing phone clients:

- when you define waypoints, define them as stageOfAMulti/questionToAnswer/beaconWithMessage

- select beaconWithMessage, and enter your string (coordinates, clue, whatever ...) that gets displayed in the app when you get a certain distance away

 

No cost, can't be stolen, no batteries to wear out, no weather concerns, etc ...

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I merged together two duplicate threads, eliminated some redundant posts, and cleaned up the thread title.

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It seems most cachers don't even want to pony up a few bucks for a decent cache container. It's hard for me to imagine these being the wave of the future.

Edited by The_Hypnotoad

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Yeah seems like every one just wants to get a .50¢ nano and put it on a gaurd rail I wish it wasn't like that!

That is not what geocaching was based on or ment to be but that mostly what it has become That's why I don't have that meny finds

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● Garmin Chirp works with ANT-enabled versions of Garmin Oregon, Dakota and GPSMAP 62/78

 

And it works with the Colorado too after you update the software.

 

We have a chirp in our car which is a travel bug and occasionally during caching events someone will get our signal. With the limited range, however, we seldom get found because of the chirping.

 

We also have one at a two-stage multicache where the chirp gives the final coordinates and a hint so the chirp-enabled don't have to do the math to solve for the final stage. It is cool because the folks don't even have to hand enter the new coordinates.

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● Garmin Chirp works with ANT-enabled versions of Garmin Oregon, Dakota and GPSMAP 62/78

 

And it works with the Colorado too after you update the software.

 

We have a chirp in our car which is a travel bug and occasionally during caching events someone will get our signal. With the limited range, however, we seldom get found because of the chirping.

 

 

I have the same thing, and it's a HUGE hit at events. I usually take it in to the event with me if the parking is not right nearby though, so that way I get a few more hits than I would otherwise.

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They've been around about a year.

 

I've found two Chirp caches. Signal strength is modest. I don't know about battery life, but that's another component to fail.

 

I note that there are 10 caches with the beacon icon in the state of Florida, after one year; and 4 of those have an alternate way to find the cache - a physical stage for those who aren't Chirp enabled.

And I notice that none of the cache owners have placed a second ?Chirp cache. Seems like a rapidly fading niche to me. Too platform dependent...anything that can't be done on smart phone is probably doomed.

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● Garmin Chirp works with ANT-enabled versions of Garmin Oregon, Dakota and GPSMAP 62/78

 

And it works with the Colorado too after you update the software.

 

Problem is the ANT-enabled units are all the top of the line units for each model. While some might see the chip itself as cheat at $20. Most people don't find these higher end units affordable.

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I've read the logs on some Chirp caches and more often than not the cacher walks past the Chirp without getting a response causing him/her to go back and forth

trying to make the Chirp connection. kinda defeats the purpose if you spend more time looking for the Chirp than the cache. Sounds like they need more power.

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I own a Chirp Series and haven't had any complains about them not working. Most people log that they had no trouble. I agree that at $20 it's hard to imagine buying handfuls, but on the other hand, kudos to G-man for making them so inexpensive. Name some other waterproof, wireless device, with 1+ year worth of battery that sells for less. Still cool IMO.

 

For those stat. watchers, there are 300+ active Chirp caches in the states, and more than 800+ world wide. Growth is fairly steady with a few added every day.

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They have not changed Geocaching for me...other than to give me another class of cache to be ignored.

I understand that in some areas the owners have provided another means to get the co-ordinates encoded on the device, but the four in Arizona have no such consideration.

 

If I did manage to locate one, I would probably give it the 30lb rock test. :angry:

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And I notice that none of the cache owners have placed a second ?Chirp cache. Seems like a rapidly fading niche to me.

Probably miffed when their $20 gizmo gets plucked.

$20 can buy ammo box plus some swag

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Yeah seems like every one just wants to get a .50¢ nano and put it on a gaurd rail I wish it wasn't like that!

That is not what geocaching was based on or ment to be but that mostly what it has become That's why I don't have that meny finds

50¢ where?

 

I own a Chirp Series and haven't had any complains about them not working. Most people log that they had no trouble. I agree that at $20 it's hard to imagine buying handfuls, but on the other hand, kudos to G-man for making them so inexpensive. Name some other waterproof, wireless device, with 1+ year worth of battery that sells for less. Still cool IMO.

 

For those stat. watchers, there are 300+ active Chirp caches in the states, and more than 800+ world wide. Growth is fairly steady with a few added every day.

I have seen cheap part 15 transmitters that can easily be cobbled into a modified solar light.

Add a cheap MP3 player and another light to the mix and there ya go.

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Anyone used this yet ?? Or know anything about it ???

This will change geocaching in a big way and it's only 20$

 

Well, it will certainly make non-Garmin owners feel excluded, which is (of course) the idea. Tried before with Wherigo but it didn't work.

 

If Garmin doesn't have a reasonable second-party solution out in a few months I think they should be banned for commercial content.

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And I notice that none of the cache owners have placed a second ?Chirp cache. Seems like a rapidly fading niche to me.

Probably miffed when their $20 gizmo gets plucked.

$20 can buy ammo box plus some swag

You don't put it in the cache, you put it near where you want people to see the signal, they are small enough that you should be able to hide them pretty good.

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Anyone used this yet ?? Or know anything about it ???

This will change geocaching in a big way and it's only 20$

 

Well, it will certainly make non-Garmin owners feel excluded, which is (of course) the idea. Tried before with Wherigo but it didn't work.

 

If Garmin doesn't have a reasonable second-party solution out in a few months I think they should be banned for commercial content.

Why is that Garmin's responsibility, and why should that have any bearing on the future of these units?

 

The ANT protocol isn't Garmin's creation and sure isn't proprietary to them.

 

If the ANT protocol was built into devices like Androids, or those other fruit thingies, then I'm sure a chirp client would show up, be it by Garmin, or another party.

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Probably miffed when their $20 gizmo gets plucked.

 

This notion has come up in every thread on Chirp. I don't understand? these things are small. Obviously, they can be found and taken by random passers-by, but the odds are not that great.

 

Geocachers aren't going to take them.

 

Or, if you suppose that geocachers will take them because of their perceived value, then that argument should apply to ammo cans too...I believe only the original owner can reprogram them, so if you're hot to own one, and steal it, all you can do with the stolen Chirp is let it broadcast whatever the original owner set it to broadcast - for year or so, then it's a tiny little brick.

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Well, it will certainly make non-Garmin owners feel excluded, which is (of course) the idea. Tried before with Wherigo but it didn't work.

 

If Garmin doesn't have a reasonable second-party solution out in a few months I think they should be banned for commercial content.

GeoBeacon: Garmin Chirp – on an iPhone (or iPad)

 

While it's $1.99 for the app and $80 for the dongle it's a lot cheaper than a new Garmin GPSr.

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I think the biggest thing to come from the chirp was the beginning of the alienation between Groundspeak and Garmin. If I recall correctly, the introduction of the chirp came as somewhat of a surprise to Groundspeak. And things have only seemed to go downhill from there.

I don't think it was the beginning, but rather more like the final nail in the coffin.

 

I don't believe that Groundspeak knew nothing of the introduction, despite their claim otherwise, but rather Groundspeak couldn't figure out how to extract more money out of Garmin for the concept. Garmin did try to work with Groundspeak on the introduction of the chirp and had units in hand for testing before Garmin released them. Later Jeremy came out and even claimed the design, showing pics of some old usb memory stick or something, but an honest evaluation could only conclude it is indeed different from his idea, thus not Jeremy's design.

 

The dispute goes back much further, as can be shown by the Wherigo client/player on some of the Garmin receivers, they were introduced on the brand new Oregon in late 2008, early 2009 or somewhere in there, but have NEVER been updated. Groundspeak lays claim to a patent on the concept, so technically Garmin can't update the client without permission and input, which has never happened. By the way, Groundspeak currently gets some royalty $$ for every Oregon sold because of the Wherigo player. This is the reason that the player was not part of the Dakota or Montana series.

 

I look for Garmin to drop the Oregon this year, with the Dakota and Montana, the Oregon has just become a middle of the road unit, everyone either wants more (Montana) or less (Dakota), or even less (etrex 10, 20, 30), they've essentially dissolved the market for Oregon's, thus also dissolving groundspeaks lay to claim for $$ of each unit.

 

Informative, thank you.

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Yeah seems like every one just wants to get a .50¢ nano and put it on a gaurd rail I wish it wasn't like that!

That is not what geocaching was based on or ment to be but that mostly what it has become That's why I don't have that meny finds

 

Hahaha, I know what you mean... Of my small amount of finds so far 90% have been micro or nanos... its fustrating especially when I take the kids out to go caching with me and all we find are micro and smaller. So far I have found 3 of my 13 finds that have been large enough and have had "swag" in them. On all 3 occasions, the kids have not been with me, but i do plan on taking them back to those ones so they can find them and trade some items in them.

 

When I start hiding some caches, I plan on hiding any size that is not of the small variety.

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I think the biggest thing to come from the chirp was the beginning of the alienation between Groundspeak and Garmin. If I recall correctly, the introduction of the chirp came as somewhat of a surprise to Groundspeak. And things have only seemed to go downhill from there.

I don't think it was the beginning, but rather more like the final nail in the coffin.

 

I don't believe that Groundspeak knew nothing of the introduction, despite their claim otherwise, but rather Groundspeak couldn't figure out how to extract more money out of Garmin for the concept. Garmin did try to work with Groundspeak on the introduction of the chirp and had units in hand for testing before Garmin released them. Later Jeremy came out and even claimed the design, showing pics of some old usb memory stick or something, but an honest evaluation could only conclude it is indeed different from his idea, thus not Jeremy's design.

 

The dispute goes back much further, as can be shown by the Wherigo client/player on some of the Garmin receivers, they were introduced on the brand new Oregon in late 2008, early 2009 or somewhere in there, but have NEVER been updated. Groundspeak lays claim to a patent on the concept, so technically Garmin can't update the client without permission and input, which has never happened. By the way, Groundspeak currently gets some royalty $ for every Oregon sold because of the Wherigo player. This is the reason that the player was not part of the Dakota or Montana series.

 

I look for Garmin to drop the Oregon this year, with the Dakota and Montana, the Oregon has just become a middle of the road unit, everyone either wants more (Montana) or less (Dakota), or even less (etrex 10, 20, 30), they've essentially dissolved the market for Oregon's, thus also dissolving groundspeaks lay to claim for $ of each unit.

 

Informative, thank you.

 

Agreed, but what is the source of your information, Potato Finder? I've been around these forums since before the release of both Chirps and Wherigo, and I don't remember seeing anything here but a little speculation. Your information does sound much more authoritative than that.

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Yeah seems like every one just wants to get a .50¢ nano and put it on a gaurd rail I wish it wasn't like that!

That is not what geocaching was based on or ment to be but that mostly what it has become That's why I don't have that meny finds

 

Hahaha, I know what you mean... Of my small amount of finds so far 90% have been micro or nanos...

 

Try using PQs and just look for the larger caches your a premium member

use the benefits

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Agreed, but what is the source of your information, Potato Finder? I've been around these forums since before the release of both Chirps and Wherigo, and I don't remember seeing anything here but a little speculation. Your information does sound much more authoritative than that.

The only speculation is when I said "I look for Garmin to drop the Oregon", except for that, every bit of it is fact. What specifically are you having trouble with? You also need to remember, if you are ONLY using these forums for source, there is a lot of speculation, and on top of that, its well known that gs DOES filter and deletes threads and posts that don't put them in a good light.

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Agreed, but what is the source of your information, Potato Finder? I've been around these forums since before the release of both Chirps and Wherigo, and I don't remember seeing anything here but a little speculation. Your information does sound much more authoritative than that.

The only speculation is when I said "I look for Garmin to drop the Oregon", except for that, every bit of it is fact. What specifically are you having trouble with? You also need to remember, if you are ONLY using these forums for source, there is a lot of speculation, and on top of that, its well known that gs DOES filter and deletes threads and posts that don't put them in a good light.

Hey, settle down, OK? The only reason I ask is so if I quote you in conversation with somebody, that I can support what I am saying instead of saying that a Potato Finder told me.

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Agreed, but what is the source of your information, Potato Finder? I've been around these forums since before the release of both Chirps and Wherigo, and I don't remember seeing anything here but a little speculation. Your information does sound much more authoritative than that.

The only speculation is when I said "I look for Garmin to drop the Oregon", except for that, every bit of it is fact. What specifically are you having trouble with? You also need to remember, if you are ONLY using these forums for source, there is a lot of speculation, and on top of that, its well known that gs DOES filter and deletes threads and posts that don't put them in a good light.

Hey, settle down, OK? The only reason I ask is so if I quote you in conversation with somebody, that I can support what I am saying instead of saying that a Potato Finder told me.

Oh, I'm settled. I just wasn't sure which point you were asking about, the sources vary.

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Agreed, but what is the source of your information, Potato Finder? I've been around these forums since before the release of both Chirps and Wherigo, and I don't remember seeing anything here but a little speculation. Your information does sound much more authoritative than that.

The only speculation is when I said "I look for Garmin to drop the Oregon", except for that, every bit of it is fact. What specifically are you having trouble with? You also need to remember, if you are ONLY using these forums for source, there is a lot of speculation, and on top of that, its well known that gs DOES filter and deletes threads and posts that don't put them in a good light.

Hey, settle down, OK? The only reason I ask is so if I quote you in conversation with somebody, that I can support what I am saying instead of saying that a Potato Finder told me.

Oh, I'm settled. I just wasn't sure which point you were asking about, the sources vary.

 

This

I don't believe that Groundspeak knew nothing of the introduction, despite their claim otherwise, but rather Groundspeak couldn't figure out how to extract more money out of Garmin for the concept. Garmin did try to work with Groundspeak on the introduction of the chirp and had units in hand for testing before Garmin released them. Later Jeremy came out and even claimed the design, showing pics of some old usb memory stick or something, but an honest evaluation could only conclude it is indeed different from his idea, thus not Jeremy's design.

 

and this

The dispute goes back much further, as can be shown by the Wherigo client/player on some of the Garmin receivers, they were introduced on the brand new Oregon in late 2008, early 2009 or somewhere in there, but have NEVER been updated. Groundspeak lays claim to a patent on the concept, so technically Garmin can't update the client without permission and input, which has never happened. By the way, Groundspeak currently gets some royalty $ for every Oregon sold because of the Wherigo player. This is the reason that the player was not part of the Dakota or Montana series.

 

I'm curious about all of it, but especially the bolded parts. I've never heard any of that stuff.

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Agreed, but what is the source of your information, Potato Finder? I've been around these forums since before the release of both Chirps and Wherigo, and I don't remember seeing anything here but a little speculation. Your information does sound much more authoritative than that.

The only speculation is when I said "I look for Garmin to drop the Oregon", except for that, every bit of it is fact. What specifically are you having trouble with? You also need to remember, if you are ONLY using these forums for source, there is a lot of speculation, and on top of that, its well known that gs DOES filter and deletes threads and posts that don't put them in a good light.

Hey, settle down, OK? The only reason I ask is so if I quote you in conversation with somebody, that I can support what I am saying instead of saying that a Potato Finder told me.

Oh, I'm settled. I just wasn't sure which point you were asking about, the sources vary.

 

This

I don't believe that Groundspeak knew nothing of the introduction, despite their claim otherwise, but rather Groundspeak couldn't figure out how to extract more money out of Garmin for the concept. Garmin did try to work with Groundspeak on the introduction of the chirp and had units in hand for testing before Garmin released them. Later Jeremy came out and even claimed the design, showing pics of some old usb memory stick or something, but an honest evaluation could only conclude it is indeed different from his idea, thus not Jeremy's design.

 

and this

The dispute goes back much further, as can be shown by the Wherigo client/player on some of the Garmin receivers, they were introduced on the brand new Oregon in late 2008, early 2009 or somewhere in there, but have NEVER been updated. Groundspeak lays claim to a patent on the concept, so technically Garmin can't update the client without permission and input, which has never happened. By the way, Groundspeak currently gets some royalty $ for every Oregon sold because of the Wherigo player. This is the reason that the player was not part of the Dakota or Montana series.

 

I'm curious about all of it, but especially the bolded parts. I've never heard any of that stuff.

What the dog said. If we are to accept your statements we want to know where it came from. Saying that something is fact but you can't tell us how you know it to be fact costs you credibility.

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Agreed, but what is the source of your information, Potato Finder? I've been around these forums since before the release of both Chirps and Wherigo, and I don't remember seeing anything here but a little speculation. Your information does sound much more authoritative than that.

The only speculation is when I said "I look for Garmin to drop the Oregon", except for that, every bit of it is fact. What specifically are you having trouble with? You also need to remember, if you are ONLY using these forums for source, there is a lot of speculation, and on top of that, its well known that gs DOES filter and deletes threads and posts that don't put them in a good light.

Hey, settle down, OK? The only reason I ask is so if I quote you in conversation with somebody, that I can support what I am saying instead of saying that a Potato Finder told me.

Oh, I'm settled. I just wasn't sure which point you were asking about, the sources vary.

 

This

I don't believe that Groundspeak knew nothing of the introduction, despite their claim otherwise, but rather Groundspeak couldn't figure out how to extract more money out of Garmin for the concept. Garmin did try to work with Groundspeak on the introduction of the chirp and had units in hand for testing before Garmin released them. Later Jeremy came out and even claimed the design, showing pics of some old usb memory stick or something, but an honest evaluation could only conclude it is indeed different from his idea, thus not Jeremy's design.

 

and this

The dispute goes back much further, as can be shown by the Wherigo client/player on some of the Garmin receivers, they were introduced on the brand new Oregon in late 2008, early 2009 or somewhere in there, but have NEVER been updated. Groundspeak lays claim to a patent on the concept, so technically Garmin can't update the client without permission and input, which has never happened. By the way, Groundspeak currently gets some royalty $ for every Oregon sold because of the Wherigo player. This is the reason that the player was not part of the Dakota or Montana series.

 

I'm curious about all of it, but especially the bolded parts. I've never heard any of that stuff.

What the dog said. If we are to accept your statements we want to know where it came from. Saying that something is fact but you can't tell us how you know it to be fact costs you credibility.

Actually, the dog is more concerned with the dog's credibility when/if he repeats any of those statements to others. I don't need citations, but at least something like, "I read it in the Wall Street Journal" or, "saw it on Oprah".

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[i'm curious about all of it, but especially the bolded parts. I've never heard any of that stuff.

 

About the time that Garmin released the chirp, Jeremy did claim that Groundspeak floated an idea similar to chirp in 2006. Groundspeak does retain a patent on some of the ideas implemented in wherigos, but there is no surprise there. Jeremy has also said that Groundspeak would allow Garmin the use of Wherigo on the Montana for free, as they did in the past, so I do not believe that royalties were ever an issue.

 

As somewhat of an aside, before Groundspeak took over the Wherigo app for the iphone they asked the developer to change its name. But snce Wherigo uses the lua script, you could probably build an interpreter without running into too many difficulties with Groundspeak -- I have not heard that Groundspeak has enforced a patent issue or demanded royalties from any of the Wherigo players or builders that are on various platforms - some of which have added improvements to both aspects of the cartridge - so I question that part of the referenced post.

Edited by geodarts

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[i'm curious about all of it, but especially the bolded parts. I've never heard any of that stuff.

 

About the time that Garmin released the chirp, Jeremy did claim that Groundspeak floated an idea similar to chirp in 2006. Groundspeak does retain a patent on some of the ideas implemented in wherigos, but there is no surprise there. Jeremy has also said that Groundspeak would allow Garmin the use of Wherigo on the Montana for free, as they did in the past, so I do not believe that royalties were ever an issue.

 

As somewhat of an aside, before Groundspeak took over the Wherigo app for the iphone they asked the developer to change its name. But snce Wherigo uses the lua script, you could probably build an interpreter without running into too many difficulties with Groundspeak -- I have not heard that Groundspeak has enforced a patent issue or demanded royalties from any of the Wherigo players or builders that are on various platforms - some of which have added improvements to both aspects of the cartridge - so I question that part of the referenced post.

 

Thank you! I remember the post about the "Noodles", now that you remind me. I never made the connection between those and Chirps, though. Great info. I appreciate it.

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[i'm curious about all of it, but especially the bolded parts. I've never heard any of that stuff.

 

About the time that Garmin released the chirp, Jeremy did claim that Groundspeak floated an idea similar to chirp in 2006. Groundspeak does retain a patent on some of the ideas implemented in wherigos, but there is no surprise there. Jeremy has also said that Groundspeak would allow Garmin the use of Wherigo on the Montana for free, as they did in the past, so I do not believe that royalties were ever an issue.

 

As somewhat of an aside, before Groundspeak took over the Wherigo app for the iphone they asked the developer to change its name. But snce Wherigo uses the lua script, you could probably build an interpreter without running into too many difficulties with Groundspeak -- I have not heard that Groundspeak has enforced a patent issue or demanded royalties from any of the Wherigo players or builders that are on various platforms - some of which have added improvements to both aspects of the cartridge - so I question that part of the referenced post.

Thanks for gathering the info together, saved me some time.

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[i'm curious about all of it, but especially the bolded parts. I've never heard any of that stuff.

 

About the time that Garmin released the chirp, Jeremy did claim that Groundspeak floated an idea similar to chirp in 2006. Groundspeak does retain a patent on some of the ideas implemented in wherigos, but there is no surprise there. Jeremy has also said that Groundspeak would allow Garmin the use of Wherigo on the Montana for free, as they did in the past, so I do not believe that royalties were ever an issue.

 

As somewhat of an aside, before Groundspeak took over the Wherigo app for the iphone they asked the developer to change its name. But snce Wherigo uses the lua script, you could probably build an interpreter without running into too many difficulties with Groundspeak -- I have not heard that Groundspeak has enforced a patent issue or demanded royalties from any of the Wherigo players or builders that are on various platforms - some of which have added improvements to both aspects of the cartridge - so I question that part of the referenced post.

Thanks for gathering the info together, saved me some time.

 

The GPS forums and Latitude<whatever> blog would have been enough to satisfy me. As I said, I wasn't looking for something I could take to court. :lol:

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If Garmin doesn't have a reasonable second-party solution out in a few months I think they should be banned for commercial content.

Why is that Garmin's responsibility, and why should that have any bearing on the future of these units?

 

The ANT protocol isn't Garmin's creation and sure isn't proprietary to them.

 

BZZT. Wrong. ANT+, which is the protocol on top of the ANT protocol, is indeed proprietary to Garmin. Garmin bought it.

 

The dongle that works with the iPhone is expensive presumably because of the ANT+ licensing fee aid to Garmin.

 

Thanks for trying to play, though.

Edited by fizzymagic

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If Garmin doesn't have a reasonable second-party solution out in a few months I think they should be banned for commercial content.

Why is that Garmin's responsibility, and why should that have any bearing on the future of these units?

 

The ANT protocol isn't Garmin's creation and sure isn't proprietary to them.

 

BZZT. Wrong. ANT+, which is the protocol on top of the ANT protocol, is indeed proprietary to Garmin. Garmin bought it.

 

The dongle that works with the iPhone is expensive presumably because of the ANT+ licensing fee aid to Garmin.

 

Thanks for trying to play, though.

 

I did notice the proprietary comment in Jeremy's post about the ANT protocol, but why do you have to be so rude in how you mention it? Geeze! He "played" better than you did, in my opinion.

Edited by knowschad

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While its true that Garmin "owns" Dynastream (I actually forgot about this), they continue to operate on their own, they are a Canadian company, and the primary application of their technology is fitness related monitoring, such as heart rate monitors, pedometers, equipment for bicycles, and those type of devices.

 

If you are using any kind of wireless fitness equipment, its either ANT, or completely proprietary.

 

Most likely (and this is speculation) Garmin only bought them to avoid licensing (it was probably cheaper to buy the company than it would have been to license their technology). Don't forget, Garmin also makes a line of fitness monitoring equipment that uses many of these devices, and communicates to them via ANT. If it was anything more than that, Garmin would have most likely folded the operation into their Kansas City office.

 

The chirp, and xfering caches between gps units, are probably one of the most "far out" applications that use the ANT protocol.

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If you are using any kind of wireless fitness equipment, its either ANT, or completely proprietary.

 

The chirp, and xfering caches between gps units, are probably one of the most "far out" applications that use the ANT protocol.

 

ANT+ is a rather complex protocol built on top of ANT. Ordinary ANT devices cannot communicate via ANT+. Garmin owns the rights to ANT+. I expended some effort attempting to find any documentation for the ANT+ protocol; the answer I found is that you need to license it from Garmin.

 

Calling Chirp devices "ANT" devices is like calling a router an "Ethernet" device. There may be some literal truth in it, but it completely ignores the layers built above the protocol.

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