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Scrabble contest


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We have the basic "guidelines" for a Scrabble contest ready for your perusal and suggestions/questions.

 

Use the letters and "letter scoring" from Scrabble. (see the table below)

Words will need to be from 4 letters minimum up to 7 letters maximum.

Use monumentation codes and/or designations (first letter only), designations with numbers only would qualify as the 2 blanks (as in 7859.37).

You need to make 3 words using only the number of letters in a scrabble set (E=12, A=9, K=1, Z=1, etc), then you can start over with a full set of tiles.

Maximum sized word of 7 letters gets a bonus. (undetermined at this time)

Using letters from the monumentation list will be scored as "double letters", if all the letters are from the monumentation list then the word is doubled.

To use the monumentation code letter you need to find a mark that meets the monumentation "type", as in chiseled square, traverse disk, drill hole, reference disk,etc.

Bonus for finding a mark where the last log is a DNF or Destroyed. (also undetermined at this time)

 

You can use the designation's first letter as the letter in your word. As in H 11 = H, Q 487 = Q, TS 41 = T, 1837 AB = A.

If you choose, you can substitute the monumentation code and score double letter value as in "H" = drill hole. You would then need to find drill hole to be able to use the "H", "G" = glass bottle, so you would need to find a benchmark that is a glass bottle. Since the monumentation list has a series of "D?" where the "?" is the second letter, you may use the second letter in your words by finding the correct monumentation type of benchmark.

 

Sample words and their scores - 'bench' = 12 (unless some of the monumentation letters were used). If a benchmark that was a "B"olt was used the the double letter score would add an additional 3 points for a total of 15 points. 'Mark' = 10 (if a "R"ivet was found and "K" clay tile was found then the score would be 16).

  • 2 blank tiles (scoring 0 points)
  • 1 point: E ×12, A ×9, I ×9, O ×8, N ×6, R ×6, T ×6, L ×4, S ×4, U ×4
  • 2 points: D ×4, G ×3
  • 3 points: B ×2, C ×2, M ×2, P ×2
  • 4 points: F ×2, H ×2, V ×2, W ×2, Y ×2
  • 5 points: K ×1
  • 8 points: J ×1, X ×1
  • 10 points: Q ×1, Z ×1

Hope this isn't to complicated.

 

What do you all think?

 

John

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Er, that's more complicated that I had originally thought. I assume we were just adding up letters we found on the stations, so that if I found "LAST", for example, that would get me 1+1+1+1 = 4 points.

 

Trying to spell words from ONLY the first letter of all the stations we find may take a LOT more time before anyone has enough (useable) letters to get any points?

 

Just my $.03. :)

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Er, that's more complicated that I had originally thought. I assume we were just adding up letters we found on the stations, so that if I found "LAST", for example, that would get me 1+1+1+1 = 4 points.

 

Trying to spell words from ONLY the first letter of all the stations we find may take a LOT more time before anyone has enough (useable) letters to get any points?

 

Just my $.03. :)

 

That's where something like GSAK will help. You load several counties into it and see what is available before heading out to find them. GSAK should help in using the higher point letters.

 

John

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So, we go out for a number of weeks and collect benchmarks then at the end of the contest use that collection to make as many words as we can? Or, we find a group of benchmarks to make a word then go find another word ...??

 

If it were me, I'd look at the available marks in GSAK and see if there are any high-scoring letters that can be found. Since Scrabble has a specific number of letters (like 1 Z, or 1 Q) I would start there. I would try to make as many 7 letters words as possible from the allotted letters. See what marks are available and choose some alternates just in case 1 is missing and can't be found.

 

This will be the 'official' dictionary - TheFreeDictionary

 

Choose your words and then find them.

 

John

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Well, I don't GSAK benchmarks. But I think that contest would give me a headache. Thanks. I'll pass.

 

Oh say it isn't so, Mr. Dolphin. We will miss your Camaraderie on this one, if anyone is interested in participating still.

 

I thought it sounded like a lot of fun. But, I love Scrabble and it was my idea and I was the one who told John to put up on the forum so everyone could discuss the workings of the contest. If everyone else doesn't like my idea as well, we will not have a contest.......

 

So, discuss this scrabble idea or tell me to go away. I said that "3" do NOT a contest make.

 

If you like the idea and might try it, please tell me also.

 

Thanks~

 

Shirley~

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Hi,

 

I haven't been on here for a while and just tool a quick look at this discussion. I'd like another contest and would like to have time to look at the suggestion and discuss it. Like was said, don't want it too complicated but be nice to have another one to try.

 

Let me think on it and get back to you. Please don't give it up.

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You folks are making this much more difficult than need be.

The principle behind Scrabble is to make words and score points for the letters used. The contest has 3 ways to accomplish this.

 

First, just go find a whole bunch of benchmarks and then try to make words from the first letter in the designation.

 

Second, you look at the datasheets and choose the ones that have letters that have higher score for them (as in the "Z" & "Q") and then go try to find those benchmarks.

 

Third, you look at the datasheets and select the monumentation code that will work as a letter in your word and combine both monumentation code and designation letters to score the highest points. Remember that any letter you use from the monumentation code list will score double letter points.

 

Using GSAK will make searching for the best monumentation codes easier than doing a page by page search. Using GSAK is not required, but it will be an advantage is building the better word scores.

 

So you will need to find benchmarks that allow the best combinations since the scoring would be based on the letter scores and distribution used in Scrabble.

 

John

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Here is the monumentation code list.

 

Monumentation Code Definition

 

A Aluminum marker other than a disk included elsewhere in table

B Bolt

C Cap of cap-and-bolt pair

DA Astro pier disk

DB Bench mark disk

DD Survey disk (other agency)

DE Traverse station disk

DG Gravity station disk

DH Horizontal control disk

DJ Tidal station disk

DK Gravity reference mark disk

DM Magnetic station disk

DO Disk not specified (see description)

DP Base line pier disk

DQ Calibration base line disk

DR Reference mark disk

DS Triangulation station disk

DT Topographic station disk

DU Boundary marker

DV Vertical control disk

DW NOS hydrographic survey disk

DZ Azimuth mark disk

E Earthenware pot

F Flange-encased rod

G Glass bottle

H Drill hole

I Metal rod

J Earthenware jug

K Clay tile pipe

L Gravity plug

M Ammo shell casing

N Nail

O Chiseled circle

P Pipe cap

Q Chiseled square

R Rivet

S Spike

T Chiseled triangle

U Concrete post (without other marks)

V Stone monument

W Unmonumented

X Chiseled cross

Y Drill hole in brick

Z See description

 

You need to look at the datasheet to see the marker code.

 

You could substitute the code letter for the designation letter to score more points.

 

John

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You folks are making this much more difficult than need be.

The principle behind Scrabble is to make words and score points for the letters used. The contest has 3 ways to accomplish this.

 

First, just go find a whole bunch of benchmarks and then try to make words from the first letter in the designation.

 

Second, you look at the datasheets and choose the ones that have letters that have higher score for them (as in the "Z" & "Q") and then go try to find those benchmarks.

 

Third, you look at the datasheets and select the monumentation code that will work as a letter in your word and combine both monumentation code and designation letters to score the highest points. Remember that any letter you use from the monumentation code list will score double letter points.

 

Using GSAK will make searching for the best monumentation codes easier than doing a page by page search. Using GSAK is not required, but it will be an advantage is building the better word scores.

 

So you will need to find benchmarks that allow the best combinations since the scoring would be based on the letter scores and distribution used in Scrabble.

 

John

 

This makes a bit more sense. I've only found 2 so far, know where 2 more are in town. So many I've looked for in the past were covered by pavement or curbs. Can we use past finds?

More wine and I'll tackle GSAK

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Here is the monumentation code list.

 

Monumentation Code Definition

 

A Aluminum marker other than a disk included elsewhere in table

B Bolt

C Cap of cap-and-bolt pair

DA Astro pier disk

DB Bench mark disk

DD Survey disk (other agency)

DE Traverse station disk

DG Gravity station disk

DH Horizontal control disk

DJ Tidal station disk

DK Gravity reference mark disk

DM Magnetic station disk

DO Disk not specified (see description)

DP Base line pier disk

DQ Calibration base line disk

DR Reference mark disk

DS Triangulation station disk

DT Topographic station disk

DU Boundary marker

DV Vertical control disk

DW NOS hydrographic survey disk

DZ Azimuth mark disk

E Earthenware pot

F Flange-encased rod

G Glass bottle

H Drill hole

I Metal rod

J Earthenware jug

K Clay tile pipe

L Gravity plug

M Ammo shell casing

N Nail

O Chiseled circle

P Pipe cap

Q Chiseled square

R Rivet

S Spike

T Chiseled triangle

U Concrete post (without other marks)

V Stone monument

W Unmonumented

X Chiseled cross

Y Drill hole in brick

Z See description

 

You need to look at the datasheet to see the marker code.

 

You could substitute the code letter for the designation letter to score more points.

 

John

I found this one, see it every day. When I first looked at your list and from what I remember reading a while back I thought it would correspond with FA in this one. what am I looking at?

 

Details for Benchmark: FA3125

Start a New Search

 

N 35° 15.670 W 081° 10.829 (NAD 83)

Altitude: 0

 

Coordinates may not be exact. Altitude is UNKNOWN and location is ADJUSTED. (more info)

 

Location:

In GASTON county, NC View Original Datasheet

Designation:

GASTONIA BLACK WATER TANK

Marker Type:

elevated tank

Setting:

setting not listed - see description

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OK, It now seems a little more manageable. What will be the policy on previous finds? Further than a year back like I seem to remember the last contests being? Can we use, what are those called, the ones that are church steeples, etc?

 

Intersection stations work for us. Found more than a year ago also sounds good.

 

Here is the monumentation code list.

 

Monumentation Code Definition

 

A Aluminum marker other than a disk included elsewhere in table

B Bolt

C Cap of cap-and-bolt pair

DA Astro pier disk

DB Bench mark disk

DD Survey disk (other agency)

DE Traverse station disk

DG Gravity station disk

DH Horizontal control disk

DJ Tidal station disk

DK Gravity reference mark disk

DM Magnetic station disk

DO Disk not specified (see description)

DP Base line pier disk

DQ Calibration base line disk

DR Reference mark disk

DS Triangulation station disk

DT Topographic station disk

DU Boundary marker

DV Vertical control disk

DW NOS hydrographic survey disk

DZ Azimuth mark disk

E Earthenware pot

F Flange-encased rod

G Glass bottle

H Drill hole

I Metal rod

J Earthenware jug

K Clay tile pipe

L Gravity plug

M Ammo shell casing

N Nail

O Chiseled circle

P Pipe cap

Q Chiseled square

R Rivet

S Spike

T Chiseled triangle

U Concrete post (without other marks)

V Stone monument

W Unmonumented

X Chiseled cross

Y Drill hole in brick

Z See description

 

You need to look at the datasheet to see the marker code.

 

You could substitute the code letter for the designation letter to score more points.

 

John

I found this one, see it every day. When I first looked at your list and from what I remember reading a while back I thought it would correspond with FA in this one. what am I looking at?

 

Details for Benchmark: FA3125

Start a New Search

 

N 35° 15.670 W 081° 10.829 (NAD 83)

Altitude: 0

 

Coordinates may not be exact. Altitude is UNKNOWN and location is ADJUSTED. (more info)

 

Location:

In GASTON county, NC View Original Datasheet

Designation:

GASTONIA BLACK WATER TANK

Marker Type:

elevated tank

Setting:

setting not listed - see description

 

Since the datasheet does Not list a monumentaion code you would be limited to just the first letter of the designation on the datasheet - "G".

 

From a different datasheet -

HO0085

HO0085_MARKER: DB = BENCH MARK DISK

HO0085_SETTING: 36 = ABUTMENT

HO0085_STAMPING: M 137 1962

Marker: DB = Bench Mark Disk - DB is on the monumentation code list.

 

John

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Makes sense. So, ok, ya only need 11 more. I'm in for the limited time I have to devote to another contest. Will be talking to some local very experienced cachers next weekend and will to try to get some "converts" with possibility of a neat contest coming up. I've been trying to encourage benchmarking in this area anyway.

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If I get in on this I can procrastinate on doing NGS recoveries from my recent Heartland road-trip, Right?

 

What are the mechanics of filling in the Scrabble board squares - just a PID #, or the letter used followed by a PID? Could we see a sample?

 

kayakbird

 

We would need the PID# for each letter in the word you make. How else would we know when you found it, unless we check the GC page for your log/note/pictures.

 

John

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If I get in on this I can procrastinate on doing NGS recoveries from my recent Heartland road-trip, Right?

 

What are the mechanics of filling in the Scrabble board squares - just a PID #, or the letter used followed by a PID? Could we see a sample?

 

kayakbird

 

We would need the PID# for each letter in the word you make. How else would we know when you found it, unless we check the GC page for your log/note/pictures.

 

John

 

Also there will be no "board" to put your letters into. Just type the letter and place a link to the PID # where your picture and log will be for that letter. Where the double letter comes into play will be the Hippo List of monumentation codes and you will tell us that so we know it it is a double letter score. Simple.

 

Shirley~

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Let me make sure I'm understanding how the scoring system works.......

 

Let's say someone were to find PID FH0804, which is station A 295. It's a benchmark disk, so the monumentation code seen on the data sheet is "DB". If I'm understanding correctly, one could either count that as an "A" because that's the first letter of the designation, or one could count that as "B" because that's the second letter of the monumentation code. Counting it as an A would get you 1 point. Counting it as a B would get you 6 points (3 points for the letter, and a double letter score because you used the monumentation code).

 

You'll only be able to use each letter as many times as it appears in the game (there are twelve E's but only one Z). I'm assuming you can only use each benchmark once. You couldn't use FH0804 from earlier as both an A and a B...... right?

 

All seven letter words get some sort of bonus (the usual in Scrabble is a 50 point bonus if I remember correctly).

 

You mention the possibility of a bonus for finding a benchmark where the last log was a DNF or destroyed. Does that mean the last log from anyone or are you thinking from a government agency only? One isn't terribly difficult, the other is much more challenging. How about maybe a bonus for logging the first find since a mark was monumented?

 

How far back are we going to allow finds? Will only finds AFTER the start date count or are we going to establish a date sometime in the past as the start date for finds?

 

Oh, yeah...... I assume we're only going with marks that are in the geocaching.com database. Or is it possible to go with some that aren't in there? There's one on Holoscenes Triple Challenges list that I have a hunch about. I'm about to make an attempt at it, but if it were to get me extra credit in a contest I would adjust my timetable on that a bit...

 

How did I do?? Is that what everyone was thinking, or did I horribly misunderstand something??

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Let me make sure I'm understanding how the scoring system works.......

 

Let's say someone were to find PID FH0804, which is station A 295. It's a benchmark disk, so the monumentation code seen on the data sheet is "DB". If I'm understanding correctly, one could either count that as an "A" because that's the first letter of the designation, or one could count that as "B" because that's the second letter of the monumentation code. Counting it as an A would get you 1 point. Counting it as a B would get you 6 points (3 points for the letter, and a double letter score because you used the monumentation code).

 

You'll only be able to use each letter as many times as it appears in the game (there are twelve E's but only one Z). I'm assuming you can only use each benchmark once. You couldn't use FH0804 from earlier as both an A and a B...... right?

 

All seven letter words get some sort of bonus (the usual in Scrabble is a 50 point bonus if I remember correctly).

 

You mention the possibility of a bonus for finding a benchmark where the last log was a DNF or destroyed. Does that mean the last log from anyone or are you thinking from a government agency only? One isn't terribly difficult, the other is much more challenging. How about maybe a bonus for logging the first find since a mark was monumented?

 

 

How far back are we going to allow finds? Will only finds AFTER the start date count or are we going to establish a date sometime in the past as the start date for finds?

 

Oh, yeah...... I assume we're only going with marks that are in the geocaching.com database. Or is it possible to go with some that aren't in there? There's one on Holoscenes Triple Challenges list that I have a hunch about. I'm about to make an attempt at it, but if it were to get me extra credit in a contest I would adjust my timetable on that a bit...

 

How did I do?? Is that what everyone was thinking, or did I horribly misunderstand something??

 

I will answer only the first 2 paragraphs as John is at work right now and I think he should answer the other questions.

 

1st paragraph.

Let's say someone were to find PID FH0804, which is station A 295. It's a benchmark disk, so the monumentation code seen on the data sheet is "DB". If I'm understanding correctly, one could either count that as an "A" because that's the first letter of the designation, or one could count that as "B" because that's the second letter of the monumentation code. Counting it as an A would get you 1 point. Counting it as a B would get you 6 points (3 points for the letter, and a double letter score because you used the monumentation code).

Correct. Now you have the scoring down, simple.

 

2nd paragraph.

You'll only be able to use each letter as many times as it appears in the game (there are twelve E's but only one Z). I'm assuming you can only use each benchmark once. You couldn't use FH0804 from earlier as both an A and a B...... right?

Yes, you will only be able to use each letter as many times as it appears in the game *Only, for groups of "3 words", THEN, the all of the letters become available to you once more.

 

Also, you assume correctly that you can only use each benchmark once.

 

Note: There are only 5 people committed so far. We would like to see quite a few more join in before we take this upon ourselves. It is quite time consuming and at times demanding. The other contests were both. But, if enough people think it would be fun, we are willing to set it up and run one again. If not, maybe it would be better if we just drop it? If we go forward with the contest, the other question is when to start and for how long.......

 

I will have John answer your other questions tonight when he gets off work.

 

Shirley~

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Edited by 2oldfarts (the rockhounders)
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Let me make sure I'm understanding how the scoring system works.......

 

Let's say someone were to find PID FH0804, which is station A 295. It's a benchmark disk, so the monumentation code seen on the data sheet is "DB". If I'm understanding correctly, one could either count that as an "A" because that's the first letter of the designation, or one could count that as "B" because that's the second letter of the monumentation code. Counting it as an A would get you 1 point. Counting it as a B would get you 6 points (3 points for the letter, and a double letter score because you used the monumentation code).

 

You'll only be able to use each letter as many times as it appears in the game (there are twelve E's but only one Z). I'm assuming you can only use each benchmark once. You couldn't use FH0804 from earlier as both an A and a B...... right?

 

All seven letter words get some sort of bonus (the usual in Scrabble is a 50 point bonus if I remember correctly).

 

You mention the possibility of a bonus for finding a benchmark where the last log was a DNF or destroyed. Does that mean the last log from anyone or are you thinking from a government agency only? One isn't terribly difficult, the other is much more challenging. How about maybe a bonus for logging the first find since a mark was monumented?

 

How far back are we going to allow finds? Will only finds AFTER the start date count or are we going to establish a date sometime in the past as the start date for finds?

 

Oh, yeah...... I assume we're only going with marks that are in the geocaching.com database. Or is it possible to go with some that aren't in there? There's one on Holoscenes Triple Challenges list that I have a hunch about. I'm about to make an attempt at it, but if it were to get me extra credit in a contest I would adjust my timetable on that a bit...

 

How did I do?? Is that what everyone was thinking, or did I horribly misunderstand something??

O. K. John got home and we talked - he answered the remaining questions - I will type them since he is tuckered out.

 

All seven letter words get some sort of bonus

Yes, but the amount is unknown at this time.

 

You mention the possibility of a bonus for finding a benchmark where the last log was a DNF or destroyed. Does that mean the last log from anyone or are you thinking from a government agency only? One isn't terribly difficult, the other is much more challenging. How about maybe a bonus for logging the first find since a mark was monumented?

 

The bonus would be as in other contests - DNF of anyone. *The Last log has to be the Did Not Find/destroyed.*

In our previous contests we sometimes have come up with a "Special Bonus" when all the rules are finalized and posted at the start of the contest. Like - find one the 2oldfarts couldn't find and get a 100 pt. bonus and a triple word score.:ph34r: But, you just never know up front what it will be until the actual start of the contest.

 

How far back are we going to allow finds? Will only finds AFTER the start date count or are we going to establish a date sometime in the past as the start date for finds?

 

Only the finds AFTER the contest starts will count. The criteria for the NGS logging = no log unless it has been over a year since the last recovery. So, this means that if you have logged it in the last 12 months, it is off limits. But, anything that you have logged on GC longer ago than the 12 months are fair game. You must revisit them and post "New" pictures with your recovery report.

 

Oh, yeah...... I assume we're only going with marks that are in the geocaching.com database. Or is it possible to go with some that aren't in there? There's one on Holoscenes Triple Challenges list that I have a hunch about. I'm about to make an attempt at it, but if it were to get me extra credit in a contest I would adjust my timetable on that a bit...

 

If it is not part of GC database but, in the NGS database, should we allow the NGS Datasheet to be used only if you are going to log with them? Hmmmm.

In the last contest, a link to the NGS Datasheet was allowed in place of the GC page.

 

One last answer to WVHillbilly. Our contests have always been on the honor system. Friendly contests. If it is an intersection station, we will require a clear picture of said station and one of the station with the GPS (in focus) showing readable coordinates.

 

I hope this helps and builds some interest.

 

Shirley and John~

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Edited by 2oldfarts (the rockhounders)
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All right, as I take a tally - I will first list those that I know have stated since the discussion started that they want to be in the contest.

 

wvhillbilly

secondgunman

foxtrot_xray

TillaMurphs

kayakbird

The Fossillady

 

If any of this is incorrect - let me know.

 

And these that I do not know for sure if they are in or not. So, the people in the next group, please say yea or nay.

 

Butano

TheBeanTeam

Scrabblers

billwallace

 

Thank you all.

 

Shirley~

Edited by 2oldfarts (the rockhounders)
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Shirly -

Question - what if the datasheet has been updated, and the designation and/or monumentation code has changed? Which one is the one that's followed? Or allowed?

 

We will take those on a case by case happening. I do not think there are that many. We like to confer with our contestants by either PM or E-mail on those type of situations or other problems as they come up. On the last contest, something along those lines happened only once and it was handled by E-mail to the satisfaction of both parties. That is why we have repeat contestants.

 

Shirley~

 

--------------------------

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So, we go out for a number of weeks and collect benchmarks then at the end of the contest use that collection to make as many words as we can? Or, we find a group of benchmarks to make a word then go find another word ...??

 

If it were me, I'd look at the available marks in GSAK and see if there are any high-scoring letters that can be found. Since Scrabble has a specific number of letters (like 1 Z, or 1 Q) I would start there. I would try to make as many 7 letters words as possible from the allotted letters. See what marks are available and choose some alternates just in case 1 is missing and can't be found.

 

This will be the 'official' dictionary - TheFreeDictionary

 

Choose your words and then find them.

 

John

 

We also need to decide which word list/dictionary we're going to use.

 

:D

 

John

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All right, currently there are now 10 people in the contest.

 

wvhillbilly

secondgunman

foxtrot_xray

TillaMurphs

kayakbird

The Fossillady

Butano

TheBeanTeam

Scrabblers

billwallace

 

We have a good start. So, now we would like at least a couple more people for a fun contest.

 

Is there anyone else who would like to throw their hat in and take a leap that just might be a lot of fun?

 

Shirley~

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All right, currently there are now 10 people in the contest.

 

wvhillbilly

secondgunman

foxtrot_xray

TillaMurphs

kayakbird

The Fossillady

Butano

TheBeanTeam

Scrabblers

billwallace

 

We have a good start. So, now we would like at least a couple more people for a fun contest.

 

Is there anyone else who would like to throw their hat in and take a leap that just might be a lot of fun?

 

Shirley~

 

Today I found out about a family situation that will take up any time I had to devote to this so I need to withdraw. I only know of 4 that would be easy to use, finding others would be the issue. I do want to follow the progress.

Good luck everyone!

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Due to the amount of effort required to get the scoring database set up and acquiring the prizes for a contest, there just isn't enough interest, so we will drop the whole idea at this point. If someone else want to run a contest, we will be glad to offer tips based on our previous contests.

 

Sorry, folks, but there just are not enough interested people at this time.

 

John

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