electronic compass or not ?

[Bayliss Family]

Hi

 

I am looking at purchasing our first gps and have had views from a couple of people but still cannot decide. It will be used for geocaching and walking with children & dogs in all different areas.

 

Have been told best to get one with electronic compass ? Other reviews I have read have said not really necessary ?

 

Also the Garmin etrex vista hcx keeps coming up but some reviews rate the Garmin etrex legend hcx higher - now very similar from what I read but the compass calls it again !

 

Would like an easy option for downloading maps so then turn to an sd card unit - but are these any better than the lead downloads or am I not thinking right?

 

Please help - any input from you good people must be able to finally help me decide

 

Thanks

 

Sam

[+eusty]

An electronic compass isn't a must, but it makes life easier Look for a 3 axis one otherwise you will have to hold the GPSr level which is a bit of a pain sometimes.

[Bayliss Family]

An electronic compass isn't a must, but it makes life easier Look for a 3 axis one otherwise you will have to hold the GPSr level which is a bit of a pain sometimes.

Thanks I was thinking compass around neck gps in hand - but got sniffed at perhaps too old fashioned !!

[+mpilchfamily]

I use to cache with a compass on hand. It does help when your unit doesn't have an electronic compass built in. It was especially useful back when i only had a Garmin Nuvi 1300 to cache with. I still don't have a GPSr with an electronic compass but i now have a Casio Watch that has an electronic compass. Its a little more convenient then the old style magnetic compass. Your unit will still point to the cache as far as direction of the compass goes. It just won't know which way your facing till you start moving. So a compass is handy so you start walking in the right direction first. Otherwise you start walking only to have your unit point you in the opposite direction.

[+DonB]

I wouldn't buy a GPS without the electronic compass. Holding the single axis level isn't a problem.

[+ecanderson]

An electronic compass isn't a must, but it makes life easier Look for a 3 axis one otherwise you will have to hold the GPSr level which is a bit of a pain sometimes.

Thanks I was thinking compass around neck gps in hand - but got sniffed at perhaps too old fashioned !!

Not at all, but this misses the point. The objective isn't typically (but can be) to use it as a compass. If a GPS unit incorporates an electronic compass, it knows the orientation of the unit in your hand, and you can use it to shoot a bearing to the cache while you're standing still or moving very slowly. In other words, the arrow on the compass page can be used to point you to the cache. Units that do not have this feature require that you be moving, using sensed position to determine your direction of travel, in order to try to point towards the cache.

 

Like others, I've used units with both 2 axis and 3 axis chips, and the 3 axis units are much easier to use.

[+ventura_kids]

I was one of those "I don't need a compass" votes.

Now, I have a newer unit which has a compass built in.

So...now I am getting used to having it on.

 

Each time you change the batteries, you need to re-calibrate the compass.

You don't really need the compass to get to the geocache, nor to navigate, because the arrow points to the cache...and you really don't care what direction you are travelling.

[+BAMBOOZLE]

I would not buy a unit without an electronic compass.

[+michaelnel]

I would not buy a unit without an electronic compass.

 

Neither would I. Fortunately most recent smartphones have one built-in.

[+myotis]

I was one of those "I don't need a compass" votes.

Now, I have a newer unit which has a compass built in.

So...now I am getting used to having it on.

 

Each time you change the batteries, you need to re-calibrate the compass.

You don't really need the compass to get to the geocache, nor to navigate, because the arrow points to the cache...and you really don't care what direction you are travelling.

 

I agree wqith you on not needing it, but liking it. However, it depends on your GPS if you need to recalibrate. My OR 550T never needs calibration and is always within a degree of my Silva Compass.

[+ecanderson]

 

I agree wqith you on not needing it, but liking it. However, it depends on your GPS if you need to recalibrate. My OR 550T never needs calibration and is always within a degree of my Silva Compass.

What kind of cell chemistry are you using, and when are you changing out cells (per the 'gas gauge')?

[+TheAlabamaRambler]

Just got a Garmin GPSMap 62st with the 3-axis electronic compass.

 

Nowhere near as good as was the compass on my GPSMap 60CSx.

 

At slow walking speeds or standing still it is in fact beyond misguiding, it is useless.

[+ecanderson]

At slow walking speeds or standing still it is in fact beyond misguiding, it is useless.

Haven't seen what the 62 firmware looks like for setup, but as you know, there was an option on your 60 as well to determine when and how the compass was to kick in vs. using the GPS data for directional info, and slow walking with the 60 in GPS compass mode was also useless. Check your Setup / Heading / Compass to see if it's set to Auto or Off. Off would present a problem for you.

 

My Oregon works just like the older units - just that it's more stable when it's not dead flat in my hand.

[+Walts Hunting]

It just won't know which way your facing till you start moving. So a compass is handy so you start walking in the right direction first. Otherwise you start walking only to have your unit point you in the opposite direction.

 

Most of newer(Colorado and up) have a compass that acts like a real compass. It will point in the correct direction while standing still.

[+myotis]

 

I agree wqith you on not needing it, but liking it. However, it depends on your GPS if you need to recalibrate. My OR 550T never needs calibration and is always within a degree of my Silva Compass.

What kind of cell chemistry are you using, and when are you changing out cells (per the 'gas gauge')?

 

NiMH Multiple Brands (Garmin, PowerX, energizer) and various states of discharge when I recharge. Its always accurate.

[Bayliss Family]

Thanks everyone - think I shall see what I can get with compass but not cry too hard if I don't succeed.

[+Walts Hunting]

Thanks everyone - think I shall see what I can get with compass but not cry too hard if I don't succeed.

 

If you get one without a compass it will generally point in the correct direction after you walk about 20 feet so it isn't a great problem. On the early ones with compasses they were erratic so many of us shut them off anyhow.

[+ecanderson]

 

NiMH Multiple Brands (Garmin, PowerX, energizer) and various states of discharge when I recharge. Its always accurate.

Interesting - I've always found that if I allow NiMH cell voltages to drop to the last bar or two, the compass starts producing significant errors unless I recal. That in turn causes a recal when I load in fresh ones, so if I happen to be using NiMH for any reason, I avoid letting them get down that far and just swap them sooner. For the most part of the last year and a quarter or so, I've been using NiZn to avoid the issue altogether - apart from the first minute or two after loading fresh ones (a bit 'hot', but things settle quickly).

[+dfx]

NiMH Multiple Brands (Garmin, PowerX, energizer) and various states of discharge when I recharge. Its always accurate.

Interesting - I've always found that if I allow NiMH cell voltages to drop to the last bar or two, the compass starts producing significant errors unless I recal. That in turn causes a recal when I load in fresh ones, so if I happen to be using NiMH for any reason, I avoid letting them get down that far and just swap them sooner. For the most part of the last year and a quarter or so, I've been using NiZn to avoid the issue altogether - apart from the first minute or two after loading fresh ones (a bit 'hot', but things settle quickly).

 

That's also what I'm seeing with my NiMHs. I always use them from full to warning red (and sometimes a bit beyond). Never had a problem with the compass.

[+CacheFreakTim]

While the electronics compass is not required, I find it to be very useful and personally would not buy one without the feature. The compass really helps out when you get down to that last couple hundred feet and are walking slowly. It really helps point you in the right direction.

 

As far as what unit to get personally I would wait couple weeks till the new eTrex line comes out. They will have paperless caching which is another really nice feature for Geocachers. The units will range in price from $119-$299. I would assume the Vista, Legend, etc... will be discontinued at that time.

[John E Cache]

The electronic "compass" is a very puzzling topic for me. Why some people like it a lot and some people don't like it all is a mystery to me. If you buy a GPS with a magnetic sensor, try this demo. "Go to" or "find" a cache. Put the GPS on a flat surface. Hold a pencil or straw above the arrow and sight along it. The pencil should be pointing to the cache you are "going to". Hold the pencil steady and rotate the GPS. The arrow should swing to line up with the pencil. Some will say the arrow turned "erratically" or say that "walking speed" affects the arrow, but I just say it's a beautiful thing and would not be without a magnetic sensor.

Edited August 23, 2011 by John E Cache

[+ollave]

Thanks everyone - think I shall see what I can get with compass but not cry too hard if I don't succeed.

You can always buy a nice magnetic compass; they may be old fashioned but they don't take batteries. That said, my GPSr doesn't have a compass and I seldom bother taking the compass with me unless I'm chasing one of the few caches that specify the need for one in the instructions. It's not too hard to check where north is before you stop moving, assuming you can't tell from the position of the sun. (No, doesn't work on the equator, and I have trouble reading maps in the northern hemisphere. The sun's in the wrong half of the sky.

[Bayliss Family]

I just read up on the etrex 10 etrex 20 and etrex 30 that are due out - interesting that only the etrex 30 has the electronic compass ! So I pay top money for etrex 30 £229.99 or I see what I can get a used etrex vista hcx for e.bay about £90 at moment & then buy maps and leads as needed - phew think I might try paper maps and old style compass

Edited August 23, 2011 by Bayliss Family

[+ecanderson]

You can always buy a nice magnetic compass; they may be old fashioned but they don't take batteries.

Unless you have a calculator and some time on your hands, that ordinary compass won't point to the cache, either.

 

I think a great many people who haven't used these devices don't understand that the internal compass chip is only occasionally used as a compass -- although I do use mine to include information in field notes (e.g., "the NW corner of the bridge").

 

The primary purpose for the electronic compass for most of us who cache is - and this will sound silly for a minute, so bear with me - so that the GPS knows the direction it is being held in your hand. (!?!)

 

Understand that with the electronic compass, when you are standing still or moving very slowly and trying to figure out how to find or approach a cache, it is only because of the internal electronic 'compass chip' that the arrow can point to the cache. The GPS, knowing what direction you are currently pointing it as you hold it, and knowing your current position, is able to take the cache coordinates and create a vector to the cache, and spin the arrow on the 'compass page' accordingly. Any GPS knows where you are, and where the cache is relative to your position, but unless it knows the orientation in which you are holding the GPS, it cannot point an arrow in the appropriate direction.

 

A GPS without an electronic compass makes assumptions when it draws the arrow. It senses your change in coordinates, and assumes that you are pointing the GPS straight ahead. However, it's not always convenient to move at a speed that provides an accurate reading. I recall yet another such experience last week in the western burbs of Kansas City where we were in surprisingly dense undergrowth in a 'forest' right in town, and it wasn't possible to keep moving at a speed that would have satisfied a GPS that wasn't equipped with the electronic compass. Once again, I was very glad to have it. I also like to be able to back away from a canyon wall or building or whatever where the signal is obstructed and stand and shoot a bearing from a couple of different directions to try to triangulate a cache. Not having to be moving all the time makes this a whole lot easier.

[+BAMBOOZLE]

Just got a Garmin GPSMap 62st with the 3-axis electronic compass.

 

Nowhere near as good as was the compass on my GPSMap 60CSx.

 

At slow walking speeds or standing still it is in fact beyond misguiding, it is useless.

 

Ed, its not just the 62 but the Oregons as well.....many times they are out-to-lunch. Its a software-firmware-ant.-chip-etc issue (the GPS unit).....happened several times to me again Sunday. I would not DREAM of going caching without either my 60 CSx or Magellan Platinum along to bail me out when the newer units are pointing 30' away. I wish Garmin could make a paperless unit that was actually great ( not fair ) at finding caches.

[+ecanderson]

.....happened several times to me again Sunday.

Can you describe what it is that happened? "Out-to-lunch" is something I only experience when my batteries are tired, and I just pop in a new pair to solve that.

[+BAMBOOZLE]

.....happened several times to me again Sunday.

Can you describe what it is that happened? "Out-to-lunch" is something I only experience when my batteries are tired, and I just pop in a new pair to solve that.

 

About 80%-90% of the time it works fine and will agree with the older units ( sometimes it may read a few feet closer)

1. At times , usually under canopy,it will stop counting down, say at 60', and you can continue walking in the direction last indicated for 60' + but the unit will still read 60' just as if you had never moved....it just sort of freezes up and becomes pretty much useless.

 

2. At other times, not necessarily under canopy , it just reads " off "......the older units are within 3' of the cache and the 450 is pointing 35' away...Sunday I stopped a search, put the cache in again and it still read 35' off.

 

I think I have the latest firmware and all the settings right but I'll try fresh batteries next time out. I've read these forums and its evident the newer units are not as good as some older ones when it comes to actually finding caches.

[+michaelnel]

My 450 used to do that too sometimes, and the Montana 600 did it all of the time when auto-routing was in use. Does it work right if you have it in direct routing?

[+ecanderson]

I think I have the latest firmware and all the settings right but I'll try fresh batteries next time out. I've read these forums and its evident the newer units are not as good as some older ones when it comes to actually finding caches.

What you are describing isn't a compass problem... it's a sensitivity problem (or perhaps firmware). The 'compass problem' as I prefer to segregate things refers strictly to accuracy of the pointing of the compass, and you're problem is much larger than that when you can't get the distance to the cache to come down any better than 60'. There was a time when the Oregon firmware did much what you describe .. you move, but nothing updates. For the same reason, the compass won't know how to create a vector to the cache (so it can point the correct direction), either.

 

However, if you have a sensitivity problem or are in seriously compromised 'sky', you will see the same thing because the unit is unable to accurately project a distance when it's not sure where you are with any great degree of certainty. What you are describing sounds a whole lot more like either a sensitivity problem or a firmware glitch, and the distance-to-target (cache, waypoint, whatever) is going to be an issue whether you're on the compass page or not - although that's where most of us watch the countdown in distance.

 

I've had some bad PDOP days in otherwise unobstructed places under wet canopy where my Oregon won't settle much below 30' either, but that's pretty rare. It produces results as good as my old Summit HC on most days, and that one was a real keeper.

[+BAMBOOZLE]

My 450 used to do that too sometimes, and the Montana 600 did it all of the time when auto-routing was in use. Does it work right if you have it in direct routing?

 

I'll check.......I use Nuvi's for driving and my handhelds for walking to the cache ( I have maps on all of them, though,as I like to see the streets when I'm getting close ) so I don't need auto-routing.

[+BAMBOOZLE]

I think I have the latest firmware and all the settings right but I'll try fresh batteries next time out. I've read these forums and its evident the newer units are not as good as some older ones when it comes to actually finding caches.

What you are describing isn't a compass problem... it's a sensitivity problem (or perhaps firmware). The 'compass problem' as I prefer to segregate things refers strictly to accuracy of the pointing of the compass, and you're problem is much larger than that when you can't get the distance to the cache to come down any better than 60'. There was a time when the Oregon firmware did much what you describe .. you move, but nothing updates. For the same reason, the compass won't know how to create a vector to the cache (so it can point the correct direction), either.

 

However, if you have a sensitivity problem or are in seriously compromised 'sky', you will see the same thing because the unit is unable to accurately project a distance when it's not sure where you are with any great degree of certainty. What you are describing sounds a whole lot more like either a sensitivity problem or a firmware glitch, and the distance-to-target (cache, waypoint, whatever) is going to be an issue whether you're on the compass page or not - although that's where most of us watch the countdown in distance.

 

I've had some bad PDOP days in otherwise unobstructed places under wet canopy where my Oregon won't settle much below 30' either, but that's pretty rare. It produces results as good as my old Summit HC on most days, and that one was a real keeper.

 

What you say sounds correct...I'll check the settings again. Its a real slick unit otherwise and its not a real problem as I'm always using a Platinum ( my wife gets all the new equipment but she gets bummed at times with the aforementioned behaviour and I haven't been able to get rid of it. )

 

Still, I don't recall one post from a cacher who used a 60 or Meridian for years who said the Oregons and 62's were as good at pinpointing caches as their older units. I've read quite a few which say the opposite.

[+ryanr69]

As I just passed my first year of caching, I upgraded myself from the Magellen eXplorist GC to the Oregon 450.

One of the 'requirements' was the electronic compass, which has GREATLY made things easier.

 

It is one of the better pieces of functionality of higher end devices.

[+ecanderson]

Still, I don't recall one post from a cacher who used a 60 or Meridian for years who said the Oregons and 62's were as good at pinpointing caches as their older units. I've read quite a few which say the opposite.

Early on, that was true to a degree. For numerous releases, Garmin couldn't get the firmware settled to where it would lock data from either of the WAAS satellites worth diddly, and we were losing some of the EPE quality to which we'd been accustomed on other units. Signals were good, but it was like they were suffering from framing errors, and would give up trying. That did finally get settled a while back, and with WAAS enabled again, I'm entirely happy with the accuracy performance.

[+BAMBOOZLE]

Still, I don't recall one post from a cacher who used a 60 or Meridian for years who said the Oregons and 62's were as good at pinpointing caches as their older units. I've read quite a few which say the opposite.

Early on, that was true to a degree. For numerous releases, Garmin couldn't get the firmware settled to where it would lock data from either of the WAAS satellites worth diddly, and we were losing some of the EPE quality to which we'd been accustomed on other units. Signals were good, but it was like they were suffering from framing errors, and would give up trying. That did finally get settled a while back, and with WAAS enabled again, I'm entirely happy with the accuracy performance.

 

I'm running Software Ver 4.50, GPS Software Ver 5.00

WAAS is enabled ( I get the little D's on the sat. bars) and Map Datum = WGS84.

Its set for off road, lock on road = no, off road transitions = auto

Somehow Sunday it got set to the recreational profile....no change on the above but the Calculate Route was set for Car/Motorcycle instead of Pedestrian which it is set for in the geocaching profile.

 

I'm not seeing an auturoute on / off feature.

[+myotis]

Still, I don't recall one post from a cacher who used a 60 or Meridian for years who said the Oregons and 62's were as good at pinpointing caches as their older units. I've read quite a few which say the opposite.

Early on, that was true to a degree. For numerous releases, Garmin couldn't get the firmware settled to where it would lock data from either of the WAAS satellites worth diddly, and we were losing some of the EPE quality to which we'd been accustomed on other units. Signals were good, but it was like they were suffering from framing errors, and would give up trying. That did finally get settled a while back, and with WAAS enabled again, I'm entirely happy with the accuracy performance.

 

I used the 60csx for years-I think my OR550T is significantly better than the 60csx at pointing to the cache. You also must remember that the cache cords can be off. To judge accuracy you need to use a known location. I have a waypoint in my packyard that I have averaged numerous times over several months. So I know the cords are right on. Whenever I put my GPS on the spot, it almost always is within 5 feet. Also thins topic is about the compass, the OR 50 series compass is 100 times better than the 60csx.

[+BAMBOOZLE]

Still, I don't recall one post from a cacher who used a 60 or Meridian for years who said the Oregons and 62's were as good at pinpointing caches as their older units. I've read quite a few which say the opposite.

Early on, that was true to a degree. For numerous releases, Garmin couldn't get the firmware settled to where it would lock data from either of the WAAS satellites worth diddly, and we were losing some of the EPE quality to which we'd been accustomed on other units. Signals were good, but it was like they were suffering from framing errors, and would give up trying. That did finally get settled a while back, and with WAAS enabled again, I'm entirely happy with the accuracy performance.

 

I used the 60csx for years-I think my OR550T is significantly better than the 60csx at pointing to the cache. You also must remember that the cache cords can be off. To judge accuracy you need to use a known location. I have a waypoint in my packyard that I have averaged numerous times over several months. So I know the cords are right on. Whenever I put my GPS on the spot, it almost always is within 5 feet. Also thins topic is about the compass, the OR 50 series compass is 100 times better than the 60csx.

 

You're the first I've heard say that about the CSx. I hear you re the cache co-ords but when two units ( CSx and Platinum) say the cache is within 3 feet of where the CO said he hid it and the Oregon says 30' its got to be the Oregon. I agree the 2 axis compass on the CSx could be quirky....at times it would suddenly aim in the opposite direction and you would have to calibrate it on the spot.

I suppose it could be MY Oregon 450 thats the problem but reading these forums I doubt it.

Edited August 23, 2011 by BAMBOOZLE

[+DanOCan]

Whenever I am asked about buying a unit with a compass my answer is the same:

 

"If you can afford it, then certainly get it as it is a nice-to-have feature. If money is an issue consider it one of the first features to skip."

[+elkein]

The only thing I'd add is the electronic compass on my Oregon 550t is flaky on my bike and in my car, from the "A" pillar and a brake cable respectively. When hiking/geocaching it's fine.

[+michaelnel]

I would gladly skip the barometric altimeter to save money before I'd skip the electronic compass. Unfortunately, usually to get one you have to buy both.

[sviking]

All of this electronic compass or not discussion can be solved with ONE easy task. Calibrate your "internal compass". Always know where North is and be able to instantly point to it without any external aid. Everything else will fall into place if you can do that. An electronic (or even magnetic) compass is not required if you can do this with your GPS map set to NORTH UP and have the required ability to ORIENT yourself and your GPS to NORTH. Proceed as required from the BEARING presented, which now correlates to the real world when you and your GPS unit are facing North...

 

In the US, the difference between True North and Magnetic North won't make a heap of difference in the relatively small distances involved on foot with geocaching.

[sviking]

Unless you have a calculator and some time on your hands, that ordinary compass won't point to the cache, either.

 

You're kidding, right?

 

A calculator? Seriously? You must not know how to spin the bearing on a magnetic compass that you pull right off your GPS. You don't even have to consider magnetic deviation if you set your NORTH UP reference to magnetic north on your GPS. Or, get a magnetic compass that allows you to dial in the correction for the area (can get this off the GPS, too) and set the GPS map up reference to True North. Then, when set on the orienteering dial, the "direction of travel" arrow (not the magnetic needle in the center) on a magnetic compass most definitely WILL point to your destination, i.e. cache. No calculator even remotely required...

Edited August 24, 2011 by sviking

[+ecanderson]

Unless you have a calculator and some time on your hands, that ordinary compass won't point to the cache, either.

 

You're kidding, right?

 

A calculator? Seriously? You must not know how to spin the bearing on a magnetic compass that you pull right off your GPS. You don't even have to consider magnetic deviation if you set your NORTH UP reference to magnetic north on your GPS. Or, get a magnetic compass that allows you to dial in the correction for the area (can get this off the GPS, too) and set the GPS map up reference to True North. Then, when set on the orienteering dial, the "direction of travel" arrow (not the magnetic needle in the center) on a magnetic compass most definitely WILL point to your destination, i.e. cache. No calculator even remotely required...

Ah, a familiar name again (sigh). You assume too much information is available.

 

Knowing only the following while holding that good old Silva:

 

1) Current position in latitude and longitude

2) Position of destination in latitude and longitude

 

Establish the distance and bearing from point 1 to point 2.

And the process for doing this is what, again?

 

Once again, the point of the magnetic compass chip in the GPS isn't only to act as a compass. It's to know the orientation of the device in your hand so that it can compute a correct vector to a destination.

[sviking]

Establish the distance and bearing from point 1 to point 2.

And the process for doing this is what, again?

 

My 60CSx does this automatically. Heck, even my old Magellan SporTrak and VERY old '90s era Lowrance Globalmap 100 do bearing computation, as well, so it's nothing new. Also, NO electronic compass on either of those... I have the BEARING set in a data field on the "compass rose" page. I suggest you read your instruction manual about the BEARING TO function. I also never said anything about using the mag compass alone without a GPS. I referenced this SAME bearing issue in my previous post.

 

Heading or direction you're facing have absolutely NO bearing (pun intended)on the computed BEARING. It's simply a line from where you are TO your destination. It ONLY changes as your position changes. Again, heading has nothing to do with it. NO electronic compass needed for a BEARING from present position to selected destination.

 

Then take the bearing from the GPS, spin it in on the mag compass dial, turn to put "red in the shed" and follow the direction of travel arrow (top of compass) to destination. Easy enough for ya? And, I don't use a Silva. I use a Brunton.

 

If I get no response from ya (like the last time you where schooled), I'll understand... It's okay...as long as you learned something...

Edited August 25, 2011 by sviking

[+ecanderson]

 

I have the BEARING set in a data field on the "compass rose" page. I suggest you read your instruction manual about the BEARING TO function. I also never said anything about using the mag compass alone without a GPS. I referenced this SAME bearing issue in my previous post.

 

Heading or direction you're facing have absolutely NO bearing (pun intended)on the computed BEARING. It's simply a line from where you are TO your destination. It ONLY changes as your position changes. Again, heading has nothing to do with it. NO electronic compass needed for a BEARING from present position to selected destination.

 

Then take the bearing from the GPS, spin it in on the mag compass dial, turn to put "red in the shed" and follow the direction of travel arrow (top of compass) to destination. Easy enough for ya? And, I don't use a Silva. I use a Brunton.

 

If I get no response from ya (like the last time you where schooled), I'll understand... It's okay...as long as you learned something...

You are the silk tongued devil, aren't you. Previously noted, your reputation precedes you. One could only hope for a similar outcome here.

 

As you appear to have correctly guessed, I believed you were suggesting that it was possible to accomplish the task with only a compass and coordinate data. It can be done - but painfully.

 

Your way is still a bit of a PITA in comparison to the automated approach provided by a GPS with an integrated magnetic sensor.

 

For the use of the GPS without additional tools, the device's knowledge of its orientation vs. true north when stationary has EVERYTHING to do with its ability to create a vector to the destination. The device is quite incapable of knowing where to point an arrow if its own orientation is also unknown. That would be the entire point of my previous posts.

[sviking]

As you appear to have correctly guessed, I believed you were suggesting that it was possible to accomplish the task with only a compass and coordinate data. It can be done - but painfully.

 

Yup, you were wrong. No "appearing to guess" about it.

 

Your way is still a bit of a PITA in comparison to the automated approach provided by a GPS with an integrated magnetic sensor.

 

Sorry spending two seconds spinning bearing on a compass dial is a PITA for you. I'd hate to see what happens next time you get a flat tire. Hello? AAA (or insert "rescue" roadside service of whatever flavor)?

[+ecanderson]

Sorry spending two seconds spinning bearing on a compass dial is a PITA for you. I'd hate to see what happens next time you get a flat tire. Hello? AAA (or insert "rescue" roadside service of whatever flavor)?

There's a fault in your process. You assume it will only need to be performed once. For many people who are unable to estimate distance accurately, or who cache where you can't SEE the target, that won't be the case.

 

With the integrated solution, I continue to simply follow the arrow as best I can, taking other factors into account as I go. This may include significant off-course deviations for terrain, brush, etc. Each time a course deviation is required, your solution would necessarily be applied again. It's not necessarily a "one shot" proposition. I much appreciate that the GPS continues to automatically 'plot a solution' as I attempt to approach the site.

 

Ditto with attempts to triangulate a cache. One would necessarily have to use the GPS to establish a bearing and dial it in on a compass each time. Again, unnecessary with the integrated solution.

 

For obvious reasons, I much prefer not to have to deal with an unnecessary multi-step solution on a repeated basis in the course of finding a cache. I suspect that's true for most cachers. I would imagine the substantial convenience offered is why the manufacturers include the chip in their units and charge accordingly.

 

You are certainly welcome to your process. For straight shot line-of-sight navigation, it wouldn't be burdensome. In the kinds of terrain where I frequently cache, it's just not convenient... any more than using a GPS that requires continual motion to accomplish the task using my direction of travel to compute the solution is convenient.

Edited August 25, 2011 by ecanderson

[sviking]

There's a fault in your process. You assume it will only need to be performed once. For many people who are unable to estimate distance accurately, or who cache where you can't SEE the target, that won't be the case.

 

Nope, no fault in my process. Where did I ever say it was a single step evolution? Nowhere... You said (post #24, I believe) that a mag compass would not point to a cache without a calculator. That is what I called you on and where you went wrong. This ENTIRE thread was about using an electronic compass with a GPS. Then, for some reason, you went off the reservation thinking discussion had somehow shifted to GPS-less mag compass use. WRONG.

[+dfx]

Ah, a familiar name again (sigh).

 

The forums provide a certain feature (I. L.) that's quite an effective remedy against such nuisances. Highly recommended.

[+ecanderson]

Nope, no fault in my process. Where did I ever say it was a single step evolution? Nowhere... You said (post #24, I believe) that a mag compass would not point to a cache without a calculator. That is what I called you on and where you went wrong. This ENTIRE thread was about using an electronic compass with a GPS. Then, for some reason, you went off the reservation thinking discussion had somehow shifted to GPS-less mag compass use. WRONG.

Life's tough. It happens. Sorry you had to waste so many characters explaining my error. I wouldn't have expected a civil discourse in getting that accomplished, and my expectations were met.

[+ecanderson]

Ah, a familiar name again (sigh).

 

The forums provide a certain feature (I. L.) that's quite an effective remedy against such nuisances. Highly recommended.

A person hates to make use of that feature when there's a 5% chance that useful information might be imparted in a civil fashion, but you know .. in this case, I think you've convinced me.

 

Nuts... feature not currently working. Some kind of 'database error'.

Edited August 25, 2011 by ecanderson